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Ollie Pooch
In a perfect world, we'd all be homersexual
(06-21-2013, 02:39 AM)
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Originally Posted by RobbieNick

And you can't add that now because?......................

Haha, exactly.

Why didn't they speak about it? Their job was to sell these points. WTF.
Puppet Shadow
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:40 AM)
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Originally Posted by weekend_warrior

I can't wait to see what other MS policies come to light. XBL price tripling in order to support all those clouds will be next I'm guessing.

As someone mentioned previously, I bet they do something with Silver. Maybe a Press A to get your Gold! watermark that shows up when you play your games. :o
uncledonnie
Banned
(06-21-2013, 02:40 AM)
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Wow, if this is true what a disappointment. I just don't understand the thought process of this even being a thing. I mean it's not useless, but why wouldn't they just do this for every game, since the only point is to sell a copy? What is the point of a family plan and shared library around something like this?

I was more bummed about not being able to pick up disc-based games on the cheap and get a digital license, but this still takes some of the sting out of anything lost by the DRM switch.
Josť Mourinho
cocknose
(06-21-2013, 02:41 AM)
Well I was one of the people who thought family sharing sounded promising. Assuming this is legit, sounds like a shit feature. Oh well.
Dead Prince
Banned
(06-21-2013, 02:41 AM)
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Originally Posted by Puppet Shadow

As someone mentioned previously, I bet they do something with Silver. Maybe a Press A to get your Gold! watermark that shows up when you play your games. :o

or there's no such thing as silver anymore. everyone needs a sub.

i mean everyone pays monthly for cable, internet, phone, etc. why not.
Jake Tower
Banned
(06-21-2013, 02:42 AM)

Originally Posted by Wario64

branny
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:42 AM)
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Originally Posted by RobbieNick

And you can't add that now because?......................

Throwing the baby out with the bathwater, really.
fart town usa
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:43 AM)
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That was family sharing?

FlyFaster
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:43 AM)
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So everyone feeling the "loss" of the family plan and crying about it was doing all that for what amounts to a 60 min demo.

lol MS fanboys lol, you never fail to impress.

Honestly, what do they have to do to piss you guys off? It's like Stockholm syndrome I swear.
Aspiring
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:44 AM)
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Originally Posted by Hex

These are the people that some of you are trusting and that you are running back to like everything is better now.
It has been lie after lie, and bullshit after bullshit and the whole time treating the consumer and their customer base like idiots.
There will be more.

Exactly. This is the reason I will be switching from 360 to PS4. They have lied lie after lie and continue to do so. Even though the feature of 24 hour check has been lifted I have this feeling that they will push there magic cloud feature so that every game or close to it will require an Internet connection, even for games such that would once have worked offline (hello Forza). And if they do that it is a softer blow, but still enforcing their bullshit rules upon gamers.
Interceptor
Banned
(06-21-2013, 02:45 AM)
I don't get this whole family thing. So, let's say my brother could try my game for an hour before he has to buy it on his account? He just can use mine. lol

I don't get it.
baphomet
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:45 AM)
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Anyone who takes Arthur gies's word over any random person on a message board is laughable.

I'm absolutely serious.
SPE
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:45 AM)
The flip side to this news is that for the family plan to be a 'benefit', MS must then have planned to block demos for normal folks. No more guarantee that all XBLA games have demos. The only way to get a demo is to have someone you know by the full price game.

Yet another bow to publishers at the expense of end users.
pvpness
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:46 AM)
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Originally Posted by branny

Throwing the baby out with the bathwater, really.

Nah, it's lube. We'll see these features implemented down the line with future firmware that puts in place all the shit they're backing out of now.
GetemMa
Banned
(06-21-2013, 02:46 AM)

Originally Posted by FlyFaster

So everyone feeling the "loss" of the family plan and crying about it was doing all that for what amounts to a 60 min demo.

lol MS fanboys lol, you never fail to impress.

Honestly, what do they have to do to piss you guys off? It's like Stockholm syndrome I swear.

Being this wrong is tough on people. It is actually betrayal that they are feeling but they direct their anger at people who made the Xbone a better purchase for them.
StudioTan
Hold on, friend! I'd love to share with you some swell news about the Windows 8 Metro UI! Wait, where are you going?
(06-21-2013, 02:46 AM)
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Originally Posted by pvpness

The point is sharing was one of the features you were hinging your purchase on. A feature you actually knew nothing about. What research did you do, other than finding very little info and deciding "trust" was the way to go?

No, it wasn't a feature I was hinging my purchase on, it was a bonus feature. The research I've done is what has been available at the current time, just like many people had decided to buy a PS4 before they knew that they would put online multiplayer behind a paywall, some of whom even said they wouldn't buy the console if Sony did that, yet still are.

I don't really have to justify my purchase decisions to you but I'll just say that the consoles are not out for another 5 months so there was always time to change my purchase decisions. I could decide not to buy either and then change my mind a week later. Why do you care what I buy?
Jake Tower
Banned
(06-21-2013, 02:46 AM)
I can't stop laughing!

MS, please! Go back! Do another 180 and do everything you intended! I want to see it happen!

lolololololololololololol
B.O.O.M
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:46 AM)
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God this is so damn hilarious! :D It's even funnier considering the media outlets, few fanboys and others paraded this feature without even knowing what it actually is..just so they can justify their defense of a company..hilarious
shinobi602
Daddy Goggles Groupô
Member in good standing
(06-21-2013, 02:47 AM)
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Wow.
B.O.O.M
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:48 AM)
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This sounds like an extension of those PS+ game trials also btw ...plus being it's for all games and the negative being actually having limitations on the number of people
excaliburps
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:50 AM)
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Damn! Kinda wanted to see this happen just to see what would the reaction be...yeah, evil but wondering how far MS would've pushed everything.
Hellsing321
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:51 AM)
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I'm sitting here with a nice cold beer in my hands and laughing my ass off. Can you imagine the shitstorm that would have happened if Microsoft stayed the course when this little juicy nugget got out? I almost wished they did just for the hilarity.
Theonik
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:52 AM)
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Guys it makes sense. They give you a 10 person share.
Average game is about 10 hours so with 1 hour each they give you an extra copy of the game between family.

This sort of value is unprecedented.
SPE
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:53 AM)

Originally Posted by Theonik

Guys it makes sense. They give you a 10 person share.
Average game is about 10 hours so with 1 hour each they give you an extra copy of the game between family.

This sort of value is unprecedented.

Yes, they are over delivering on value.
POWERSPHERE
Banned
(06-21-2013, 02:54 AM)
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Arthur is as much of a turd as Microsoft, but they're a multinational corporation, I don't know what his deal is.

But yeah, this is hilarious. Never before has a console pre-launch been so terrible, pretty amazing.
fart town usa
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:55 AM)
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Originally Posted by baphomet 666

Anyone who takes Arthur gies's word over any random person on a message board is laughable.

I'm absolutely serious.

I'll take your word for it.

lol
Blueblur1
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:55 AM)
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Finally got a chance to browse GAF today just now. Jesus Christ. Regardless of yesterday's consumer-win Microsoft still looks like an anti-consumer juggernaut. They're only re-affirming my decision to stick with PC and Sony.
Sulik2
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:58 AM)
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Wow, so the best Microsoft could do to justify the DRM was an hour demo that lets you save your progress if you buy the game? Well I drank the koolaid on that one at first, glad Microsoft recanted that version of sharing.
WolvenOne
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:58 AM)
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....really?

Another glorified demo system?

Oiy...
IlludiumQ36
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:59 AM)
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It's amazing to me that people didn't see this coming. We have 2 established precedents already on Microsoft and their attitude towards digital sharing/DRM.

One of them goes all the way back to the Zune which "allowed" songs to be shared wireless from device to device. However, the song could only be shared 3 times and the recipient could listen to the song 3 times before it was locked and required purchase from the Zune store. This garbage was even in place on open-DRM files.

The second - any of you who owned Xbox Live arcade games and had their console red ring/replaced should know EXACTLY what happens to those arcade games - they become demos until you sign in with your profile. No one else could play them because the original console used to download them was no longer available (yes, I know they did eventually address that with a limited license transfer system).
Sera O
Banned
(06-21-2013, 02:59 AM)
Wow. I knew it the truth behind the sharing plan wouldn't be good. But I didn't think it would be a freakin' feature that already exists on PS+, where it has the added bonus of being available to all subscribers and not just the ten people the user elected to advertise to.

It's so sleazy I can barely believe it. Their damage control is potentially more damaging than if they just let people fall for DRM, stockholm syndrome style.

There were some naive/optimistic people who thought it would really be starting a game buying co-op or something, but I think most people realized that if MS was keeping something that good (and illogical given their stance on publisher protection), they would have been shouting it everywhere they could. You tell people every game is potentially 1/10 of the price and you automatically win.

But that scamspeak copy with so many loopholes above - I was thinking I might give them a chance later this gen if the price was right, but hell no, I want nothing to do with this. I can only imagine how crazy this would have gotten if they kept things intact and then whipped the real 'demo sharing' out like it would save them. Hahaha. Oh god.
pvpness
Member
(06-21-2013, 02:59 AM)
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Originally Posted by StudioTan

No, it wasn't a feature I was hinging my purchase on, it was a bonus feature. The research I've done is what has been available at the current time, just like many people had decided to buy a PS4 before they knew that they would put online multiplayer behind a paywall, some of whom even said they wouldn't buy the console if Sony did that, yet still are.

I don't really have to justify my purchase decisions to you but I'll just say that the consoles are not out for another 5 months so there was always time to change my purchase decisions. I could decide not to buy either and then change my mind a week later. Why do you care what I buy?

just like many people had decided to buy a PS4 before they knew that they would put online multiplayer behind a paywall

Which I think is stupid, but ultimately not my problem.

Man I don't care what you or anybody else buys but I do care about people trying to paint skepticism as cynicism. Being a vigilant consumer by remaining skeptical until all the facts are in, is an important roll in a capitalist environment where people will literally tell you anything to get you to purchase their product. Not as exception, but as policy.

If you ever "trust" someone who is trying to sell you something then you're doing it wrong.
PlayALLtheGames
Barber: Whatchu want?
Me: I've got $24
Barber: Say no more fam
(06-21-2013, 03:00 AM)
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I assume MS will have to confirm or deny this at some point. I'll wait until then.
famousmortimer
Banned
(06-21-2013, 03:01 AM)
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I think CBoaT and Gies were both right. It was planned as a 60 minute trial but after the blown reveal/E3 they realized they needed to make it more robust or Sony was going to eat their lunch. They tried - they reached out to publishers and did make some preliminary deals. But the vast majority of them said no and Microsoft was forced to reverse its policies.


This also explains why Major Nelson promised an explanation and never delivered it - they were trying to change it on the fly.
Ragnarok
Member
(06-21-2013, 03:01 AM)
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Originally Posted by PlayALLtheGames

I assume MS will have to confirm or deny this at some point. I'll wait until then.

why would they have to confirm or deny something about a feature that was scrapped? If we're lucky, we'll get a leak.
Neuromancer
The Mayuh of f'n Bawston
(06-21-2013, 03:02 AM)
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I'm in stage 1 denial. This is insane, how could they have willfully mislead people for so long?
D4Danger
Member
(06-21-2013, 03:02 AM)

Originally Posted by PlayALLtheGames

I assume MS will have to confirm or deny this at some point. I'll wait until then.

It's no longer a launch feature so I doubt they'll say anything. We'll just have to take the word of Arthur Giles as gospel on this one.
remnant
Banned
(06-21-2013, 03:03 AM)

Originally Posted by PlayALLtheGames

I assume MS will have to confirm or deny this at some point. I'll wait until then.

Why would MS do that. They will just deny deny deny.
Row
Banned
(06-21-2013, 03:04 AM)
MS has a history of trying to make demos seem like some premium perk. Remember how they made demo's available to gold members first, simply by just delaying when silver members could download them?
boredandlazy
Member
(06-21-2013, 03:05 AM)
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Originally Posted by D4Danger

We'll just have to take the word of Arthur Giles as gospel on this one.

Or not.
StudioTan
Hold on, friend! I'd love to share with you some swell news about the Windows 8 Metro UI! Wait, where are you going?
(06-21-2013, 03:06 AM)
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Originally Posted by pvpness

Which I think is stupid, but ultimately not my problem.

Man I don't care what you or anybody else buys but I do care about people trying to paint skepticism as cynicism. Being a vigilant consumer by remaining skeptical until all the facts are in, is an important roll in a capitalist environment where people will literally tell you anything to get you to purchase their product. Not as exception, but as policy.

If you ever "trust" someone who is trying to sell you something then you're doing it wrong.

That's completely false and it's cynicism and not skepticism, unless you don't understand what the word literally means.
Neuromancer
The Mayuh of f'n Bawston
(06-21-2013, 03:08 AM)
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I don't understand this part:

'We were toying around with a limit on the number of times members could access the shared game (as to discourage gamers from simply beating the game by doing multiple playthroughs).'

Any ideas? Are they saying once the 60 minutes or whatever were up the person could quit out, load up and keep playing?
0xCA2
Member
(06-21-2013, 03:09 AM)
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Originally Posted by Puppet Shadow

Damn, I'm back to being pissed off at MS. Check out the answer from Major Nelson (starts at 4:20). Completely misleading.

http://angryjoeshow.com/2013/06/xbox-one-aj-interview/

Major Nelson, in reference to "sharing" the new Halo with his off at college son

"[I can tell him] go ahead and download it if you wanna check it out"

lols
polyh3dron
Banned
(06-21-2013, 03:11 AM)
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I for one am shocked that Microsoft The Benevolent would have gimped such a system-selling feature.
Beautifully Shaped Monsters
Member
(06-21-2013, 03:11 AM)
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I know CBOAT confirmed, but if I had read pastebin thing on its own I would have completely dismissed it. It's hard to believe that anyone could be so delusional to believe 60 minute demos would make up for all the Online DRM crap, and think it's heart breaking to have to remove it.

Also, I completely don't get why they don't just enable this for all games going forward, but make it smarter, so that you only have to download the assets for that 1st hour, and then if you're hooked you can download the remaining stuff. Why hide it behind friend sharing and gold membership? It's a great feature that would help sell games.

They are being completely irrational, like the kid who would take his ball and go home if the other 20 kids didn't want to play his made up ball game that was 'totally more awesome than any other game.'
pvpness
Member
(06-21-2013, 03:12 AM)
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Originally Posted by StudioTan

That's completely false and it's cynicism and not skepticism, unless you don't understand what the word literally means.

You really don't understand that companies spend absurd amounts of money on things like finding out what triggers a shift between potentials and actuals? Even with the practice being entirely recognized and even celebrated? They will say and do anything they have to, to sell you. Profit motive demands it.

I think we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one StudioTan.
semiconscious
Member
(06-21-2013, 03:14 AM)
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Originally Posted by StudioTan

That's completely false and it's cynicism and not skepticism, unless you don't understand what the word literally means.



somewhere, your avatar is listening to you & just shaking his head :) ...
Meier
(06-21-2013, 03:15 AM)
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I have loved the Xbox systems for ages, but this is a company that gives us 25 cents on our birthday. Was anyone really silly enough to believe they would allow you to share full games with 10 different people with the only restriction likely being you couldn't play them at the same time? It didn't make any sense. They weren't going to allow us to re-sell our digital purchases either even though they now said it was definitely out. It's all about managed perceptions at this point.

For what it's worth, I have a feeling that the 1 hour limit meant you would have only downloaded a portion of the whole game as well. I can't imagine they'd have made people download a 25-30 GB file for that.
Y2Kev
TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
(06-21-2013, 03:15 AM)
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Originally Posted by Meier

I have loved the Xbox systems for ages, but this is a company that gives us 25 cents on our birthday. Was anyone really silly enough to believe they would allow you to share full games with 10 different people with the only restriction likely being you couldn't play them at the same time? It didn't make any sense.

They weren't going to allow us to re-sell our digital purchases either even though they now said it was definitely out. It's all about managed perceptions at this point.

Um, yes. Lots of people were.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=588871
read this thread
J10
Banned
(06-21-2013, 03:16 AM)
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Christ, I leave this place for a few hours...

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