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Pachter: PS5 to be a half step, release in 2019 with PS4 BC

Doesn't this fly in the face of what Cerny said? Didn't he say that the next gen system would not be compatible with the previous PlayStation?

He never said that. He fully believes in generations ie leaving the PS4(and presumable PS4 Pro) before behind in terms of game support. Backwards compatibility better there though. No legit excuses this time.
 

Instro

Member
All I hope is Devs PLEASE focus on 1080p 60fps FUCK more pixels it's unecesessary waste of system resources which that can be used to enhance visuals (better draw distance, better visuals settings etc)

If I do get PS5 I'm only buying 1080p 60fps games day 1 brand new support it

While games that don't reach this I'll buy it later cheaper and used.

Why would they go backwards on resolution...?
 
Well broken clocks and all that.
Surely you must be talking about the timing here I assume.

Cerny's take on what 4K truly requires seems to suggest a 10-12 TF machine and likely a much improved CPU. Nothing really half step about that, especially compared to base PS4.
 

FingerBang

Member
Sony (Shu?) said that real 4K would need 8 TFlops, so you could see that as a "half step" in 2019. After all, AMD Vega will hit 13 TFlops later this year. But yeah, to have a real generational leap (U4K/60fps/Ultra) we probably need 12-13 TFlops and I don't think we can expect a 400$ box with that kind of specs in just a couple of years.

So, true 4K@30fps (8tflops) at 399$ sounds feasible in 2019, but it would be kinda pointless now that PS4 Pro exists.
 
I think the thread title should be renamed because this is clearly stuff he thinks will happen, not an inside scoop. Even the article says this is his guess and not something definitive.
 
A 2019 console could have a potent CPU with a GPU as fast as or faster than Titan X Pascal with 16-24GB+ memory.

A Titan X Pascal is around 3-4x the PS4 Pro's GPU and 6-8x the PS4's.
This would be a significant improvement to offer a generational jump in GPU power.

A 6+ core Zen processor (first gen) clocked at 2.3GHz would offer CPU performance that is over 2x faster than the PS4's 1.6GHz Jaguar. This would be a huge boost in CPU performance!
 

kyser73

Member
Not a tech savvy, but considering how hard is to achieve 60fps on a console... 240 makes me think that the thing could cost well beyond the $399 virtual threshold.
Anyway, Im all for better framerate, if they do it right, for sure Ill be tempted to get one.

In all honesty I don't know where 240fps comes from in this discussion. I don't think Pachter was saying 'It will run games at 240fps'
 

NeOak

Member
I mean, best they can do is use a Ryzen based APU, cheaper version.

It could be 4 cores, 8 threads for backwards compatibility.

Technology hasn't advanced that fast.
 

HowZatOZ

Banned
But, why? I know a PS5 in a year or two wouldn't mean PS4 support is suddenly dropped, especially with BC but I just don't see any reason for a whole new gen iteration when developers are struggling as is to bring games out in a timely manner. The bigger studios are spending upwards of three to four years on one title, sometimes announcing it way too early in its development stage just so fans can be assured that they are actually working on something. Introducing another platform so soon seems kinda pointless and incredibly so if it does indeed to turn out to be a half step like Pachter is suggesting.

Would it be a bad thing? No, I doubt it. However, I feel like it could hamstring support for both PS4 and PS5 despite the idea of easily porting up. Porting still requires development time and effort, something devs don't have much of as we get into more intricate toolsets and games that demand so much more than previous generations.
 

kyser73

Member
10tflops at 16GB RAM and 600GB/s with an 8 core Zen CPU(the baseline minimum i expect from PS5) is no small jump from base PS4, it can absolutely give a next generation experience without a doubt



He said that Sony's interpretation of console generations is a clean break in how developers make games from the previous generation and the console hardware, nothing about compatibility of software

Surely you must be talking about the timing here I assume.

Cerny's take on what 4K truly requires seems to suggest a 10-12 TF machine and likely a much improved CPU. Nothing really half step about that, especially compared to base PS4.

This is the key point to all the discussions over step/half-step.

A 10-12TF PS5 is a huge jump in power, and assuming a Ryzen, CPU performance over the existing models, and one comparable to previous console gens (excluding memory ofc).

As a jump from Pro or X1X it obviously isn't as impressive, and would back up Pachter's 'half step from Pro' comment.

Worth bearing in mind a similar multiple jump for the Pro would be a 20TF machine...that ain't happening in 2019/220 for $399, or even $499.

So I'm going with:

Full step from Base
Half-step from Pro
 

Orayn

Member
It will likely be a "half-step" in the sense that the resolutions and framerates will wind up looking somewhat similar to the Xbox One X. Plenty of 4K30, some 4K60, some checkerboard, etc. Also a half-step in that it's coming after PS4 Pro, which itself is a sort of half-step.

BC is pretty much a lock unless Sony has completely and totally lost the plot. Hard to say exactly what chip they'll use but I'm having a hard time imagining they'll wipe the slate clean in both OS and architecture to the point where PS4 games won't be supported.
 
2020 at the earliest, I am guessing. Won't be a half step. Another "midjump 'refresh'" would make people lose there minds.
You also got to take into mind what PCs will be like in 2019/2020. 16gbs of ram is starting to become the norm, and I feel the PS5 will at least have 16gbs of RAM. The Xbox One X has 12 and that's a refresh!
PS5 will be a BEAST.
 

BizzyBum

Member
It would be the most disappointing thing ever if the power of a PlayStation 5 in 2019 is only a half step above PS4 Pro.
 

SgtCobra

Member
He's joking there right?

unpwr.gif
 

Mrbob

Member
Well it looks like Sony is going to have a beast of a console in PS5 now. Going to be nice to not be stuck with a netbook cpu. Ryzen based CPU plus typical GPU bump should actually be a nice sized jump.
 

katsais

Member
Nah, I don't agree.

PS5 a full step...likely in 2019. PS4 games BC, and PS4 Pro still being offered as an alternative.

Sort of what Apple does now with phones...iPhone 7 is the main product with alternative options in the 6S and 5se.
 
What I hope devs prioritise for next gen is checkerboarded 4K at 60fps. That has more value to me than native 4K at 30fps.

Butttt it's probably going to be checkerboard 4K at 30fps standard.
 

kyser73

Member
Nah, I don't agree.

PS5 a full step...likely in 2019. PS4 games BC, and PS4 Pro still being offered as an alternative.

Sort of what Apple does now with phones...iPhone 7 is the main product with alternative options in the 6S and 5se.

Full step from Base or Pro?
 

Head.spawn

Junior Member
I'd guess 10-12TF, 32GB.

Keep in mind the 2019 release would be 2 years and 4 months away if it were to release in Nov.

That's a long time for tech improvements.

32GB would be complete overkill. It's not like the thing would be rendering 8k with assets or something. Also, MS managed to squeeze in an extra 6GB after 4 years, leaping from 8GB to 32GB seems a bit unrealistic for 2019.

And Ryzen CPU.

As long as they're able to maintain compatibility, sounds cool to me.
 

NeOak

Member
Nah, I don't agree.

PS5 a full step...likely in 2019. PS4 games BC, and PS4 Pro still being offered as an alternative.

Sort of what Apple does now with phones...iPhone 7 is the main product with alternative options in the 6S and 5se.
Bro, it will be a full step from the base one.

And not even a big one. Performance jumps between iPhones have stagnated too.
 

jayu26

Member
I don't think Pachter has correctly predicted a single thing correctly about PlayStation this generation. I honestly don't.
 

Hawk269

Member
So if we assume it comes out holiday 2019, do you think they do a E3 2018 announcement? Or do they wait for early 2019 to announce and release later in the year?
 
I find this doubtful. 2020 at the earliest in my opinion, and it won't be a 'half-step'. They're going to want to market the PS5 as a beast, not a 'half-step', so that doesn't make any sense to me.

We're still relatively early in the gen, PS4 is still selling tons, there's no reason to rush into next gen especially since games take longer to develop nowadays. My guess is actually more like 2021-2023.

They're in the sweet spot right now, with tons of people still getting on board this gen. They have no interest in jumping gens anytime soon.

We are not getting an 8-10 year generation.

2019 at earliest, 2020 at latest.

This gen started in 2013 btw.
 

kyser73

Member
So if we assume it comes out holiday 2019, do you think they do a E3 2018 announcement? Or do they wait for early 2019 to announce and release later in the year?

Jan/Feb 2019 announcement, box and price reveal at E3, launch November.
 

Darklor01

Might need to stop sniffing glue
He never said that. He fully believes in generations ie leaving the PS4(and presumable PS4 Pro) before behind in terms of game support. Backwards compatibility better there though. No legit excuses this time.
Oh. I guess I misunderstood what he was saying.
 

ZOONAMI

Junior Member
2019 and 10tflops or so seems about right. 5x + more powerful than a base ps4 isn't really a half step imo
 

Fisty

Member
2020 at the earliest, I am guessing. Won't be a half step. Another "midjump 'refresh'" would make people lose there minds.
You also got to take into mind what PCs will be like in 2019/2020. 16gbs of ram is starting to become the norm, and I feel the PS5 will at least have 16gbs of RAM. The Xbox One X has 12 and that's a refresh!
PS5 will be a BEAST.

Yeah I have a feeling we'll get around 12tf with 32gb memory and a huge jump in CPU power, and hopefully SSHD with good support for an SSD if the user wants to do that on their own. That should be more than enough to get everything running at 4K with the processing power to really show you the next gen stuff. The tech is almost here, and I have a lot of confidence in what Sony can do for $400 in 2019. It will be interesting to see, that's for sure...

I hope more than just Sony first party support it with exclusives right out of the gate, but that PS4 userbase might be too good to pass up for 3rd parties. Then again, if devs aim for ~900p30 on base hardware, a PS4 game with a "PS5 patch" should be able to hit 4K60 relatively easy with plenty of room for other IQ improvements, which I wouldn't be too upset about for the first year or two
 

neptunes

Member
How much would a hypothetical console that is significantly more powerful than X/Pro cost? Significant being 15TF with with a better CPU.

$699?
 

Afrodium

Banned
He's saying the PS4 Pro to PS5 power gap would be similar to that of the PS4 Pro and the original PS4, which it probably will be. GAF seems to be convinced that the PS5 is going to deliver the generational leap we're used to but also release 2-3 years after the PS4 Pro.
 

ArtHands

Thinks buying more servers can fix a bad patch
Thats make sense. 2 half steps = 1 full step. Sony isnt wrong for saying about a full console leap for PS5, since its 1 full step over PS4
 
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