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This is the new MS Surface Pro

antyk

antyk

Member
I remember 'old' SP4 with i7 had a +10% increase in performance vs. the i5 model.

Anyone know, if the 'new' SP with i5, due to new architecture, can bridge this gap, i.e. be as fast as old i7? I was planning to get SP4 with i7, but might as well wait and get the new i5 if it's the same performance, but has the benefit of longer battery life, passive cooling and LTE.
 
B

boneyjangles

Member
TrueOutlook said:
That was disappointing, I was hoping for a new surface book announcement,
Click to expand...

Surface book barely sells apparently. Pro is much more popular (relatively), so will get more attention.

Despite that, also expect the new 'Surface' laptop that is pretty much just a laptop, and not trying to be everything to everybody, to outsell both.
 
Tathanen

Tathanen

Get Inside Her!
That MS won't let me increase RAM to 16 without also increasing HDD size is such a huge pain in my ass, on all these devices. Sell me 16/256 you fuckers, don't force me to spend on space I don't need to get the RAM I do.
 
Z

zeshakag

Member
Damn, really, 4 GB? Is this like the iPhone where the software is really integrated with the hardware, so it can do a lot with little RAM?

I work in IT and our minimum workstation and laptop specs have 8 GB of RAM, because 4 is just not enough these days.
 
DrDamn

DrDamn

Member
Looks nice and what I was looking for, but the deceptive way it's priced and done on their website really annoys. Pick the basic model and the picture of the product in your basket has a keyboard, mouse and pen all there. All of which are not included in what you are buying. Thing is, it would be a little bit clearer if they put these "extras" in the - suggested extras section when you buy it, but not one of them were there. An older type pen and a different surface mouse were. No type covers, no new pens and no colour coded arc mouse. Gah.
 
R

reKon

Banned
Very interested entirely because of the battery jump. I'll wait for the benchmarks and might make some moves in the summer. Will entirely depend on if Samsung fixes the battery issues on my Tab Pro S. I only paid $600 flat for that device 8 months ago.

Edit: I saw the pricing. Haven't changed there Microsoft. Fuck that. Would have to wait too long for price drops.
 
K

Kinan

Member
antyk said:
I remember 'old' SP4 with i7 had a +10% increase in performance vs. the i5 model.

Anyone know, if the 'new' SP with i5, due to new architecture, can bridge this gap, i.e. be as fast as old i7? I was planning to get SP4 with i7, but might as well wait and get the new i5 if it's the same performance, but has the benefit of longer battery life, passive cooling and LTE.
Click to expand...

Well, the new i5 should be ~5% faster than the old i7:

http://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i7-6650U-vs-Intel-Core-i5-7300U/m40238vsm223355
 
J

Jeffrey

Member
zeshakag said:
Damn, really, 4 GB? Is this like the iPhone where the software is really integrated with the hardware, so it can do a lot with little RAM?

I work in IT and our minimum workstation and laptop specs have 8 GB of RAM, because 4 is just not enough these days.
Click to expand...
Should be fine for most folks, but once you open eclipse. Rip
 
LordOfChaos

LordOfChaos

Member
zeshakag said:
Damn, really, 4 GB? Is this like the iPhone where the software is really integrated with the hardware, so it can do a lot with little RAM?

I work in IT and our minimum workstation and laptop specs have 8 GB of RAM, because 4 is just not enough these days.
Click to expand...

Apart from being free of bloatware others may add, Windows is Windows, it's not the S version so it's not particularly slimmer. Not comparable to iOS vs Android, which have different fundamental core reasons for RAM efficiency (not just OS footprint).

Even Chrome alone can be demanding on 4GB so yeah, that's kind of poopy, but I could see a 4GB option being fine for the most casual users...Just not at the price they're asking for 4GB.
 
G

gamz

Member
zeshakag said:
Damn, really, 4 GB? Is this like the iPhone where the software is really integrated with the hardware, so it can do a lot with little RAM?

I work in IT and our minimum workstation and laptop specs have 8 GB of RAM, because 4 is just not enough these days.
Click to expand...

I work in IT consulting a company now that only uses 4gigs standard. I laughed, but for what they do it works, and I was kinda surprised. I agree with you on 8GB for the baseline though...
 
C

CDX

Member
giga said:
Top two tiers shouldn't exist.

sx9x7Jn.png
Click to expand...

I hate soldered RAM for devices that run Windows so much.

Base model has only 4GB of RAM, and 16GB options are insanely priced.
 
T

Totakeke

Member
The 4GB models do eventually get heavily discounted and pop up for very good prices on slickdeals eventually so I don't know why you guys want to get rid of them. :p

But if you want everything to be $300-$500 cheaper that's another story.
 
G

gamz

Member
Interesting stat on Rubino's tweeter.

Only 30% of Pro owners use their pen. Thus, it's optional. Makes sense.
 
Z

Zaph

Member
DXbM5Wx.png


Yeah, the pricing/config on these seem really messed up. To get a reasonable amount of storage space to use as a daily driver laptop (400GB+ imo), I'd have to upgrade to the i7 which is a £900 bump? There really should be factory customisation options.
 
S

Shogmaster

Member
AliasGreed said:
https://www.google.com/amp/www.pcwo...-spectre-x360-13t-a-specs-comparison.amp.html

So between the surface line, MacBook air, Dell XPS 13, and HP Spectre there is 0 reason not to buy the HP Spectre x360 except for the fact it's sold out. (Lol)

i7, 16GB of Ram, 512GB for the same price plus convertible .
Click to expand...

Value wise Lenovo is the king.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/lenovo-...drive-platinum-silver/5722715.p?skuId=5722715

Also, uses Wacom instead of N-Trig of HP Spectre X360.
 
J

jstripes

Banned
That 4GB is a joke.

It's 2017. Unless it's a cheap $500 laptop, anything running a desktop OS should come with 8GB minimum. Especially in this bullshit age of soldered-on RAM.

(I'm certain Apple will refresh their laptops next month with 4GB base models too...)
 
LordOfChaos

LordOfChaos

Member
Zaph said:
Yeah, the pricing/config on these seem really messed up. To get a reasonable amount of storage space to use as a daily driver laptop (400GB+ imo), I'd have to upgrade to the i7 which is a £900 bump? There really should be factory customisation options.
Click to expand...


That's annoying. Somehow, Microsoft managed to under-customize Apple, where you can at least get 1TB drives without processor bumps (new 2TB SKU is a proc bump, but that's fairish)
 
S

secretanchitman

Member
4GB of RAM again? What the hell is this, 2005? 8GB should be the bare minimum for any machine, period.

I'm assuming Iris Plus graphics for the i7 model?
 
H

Haruko

Member
FinaruDensetsu said:
I've never owned a Surface Pro. For people who have, what's your opinion on the necessity of 16gb? I know 4gb is too little.
Click to expand...

Wondering the same thing.

The Surface Pro 4 (256 GB, 16 GB RAM, Intel Core i7e) is just under $1,299 on Amazon right now, which seems hard to pass up compared to the new Surface Pro configs/prices...

esp. if the new Pen's tilt functionality will be compatible
 
DrDamn

DrDamn

Member
gamz said:
Interesting stat on Rubino's tweeter.

Only 30% of Pro owners use their pen. Thus, it's optional. Makes sense.
Click to expand...

Did he say how many use the keyboard? ;).

Don't include it fine, but take the cost of the price and don't include it in all the pictures when you buy one and leave it to the customer to notice the small print that it isn't included.
 
S

Shogmaster

Member
ryan299 said:
Price is a bit high for me. Should I try to get a 4 on the cheap or the Miix 510?
Click to expand...

Definitely look around. Too many great device with the same form factor with much better bang for your buck out there.

You can get Kaby Lake i5, 8GB RAM, 256GB NVMe, Keyboard cover for less than $700 with Miix 510. It doesn't have as high of resolution LCD nor the color gamut, but it's literally half the price at this point vs SP4 and SP 2017. Ask yourself how important are those things in your value equation.

Also remember that the Miix 510 runs actual Wacom digitizer so you can do things like map the barrel buttons on your Wacom pen. MS still won't let you do that with Surface pens and they actually took one button away from us back in SP4.

Don't be a brand whore for sake of being one. Be an objective shopper.
 
chekhonte

chekhonte

Member
Ug, I'm buying too much stuff as of late. I just bought one of those fire sale 12 in screen, i7 512gb suface 3's just to see if I like the pen stylus for drawing. I'm such a sucker. At least amazon has a liberal return policy if I really don't like it.

What keyboard should I get with this? I'm tempted just to get a compact logitech keyboard touchpad but don't like the idea of filling the devices only usb port with the dongle. The SP keyboard cover is slick though which still temps me. I might need to go to my microsoft store and test things out.

Should I wait and get the new surface pen or just get the old if and when the go on sale?

Anything else I should know from current surface users?

EDIT: OH! One last thing. How bright is the SP3 12 inch screen? I will be using it to view reference photos for physical drawing.
 
S

Shogmaster

Member
chekhonte said:
Ug, I'm buying too much stuff as of late. I just bought one of those fire sale 12 in screen, i7 512gb suface 3's just to see if I like the pen stylus for drawing. I'm such a sucker. At least amazon has a liberal return policy if I really don't like it.

What keyboard should I get with this? I'm tempted just to get a compact logitech keyboard touchpad but don't like the idea of filling the devices only usb port with the dongle. The SP keyboard cover is slick though which still temps me. I might need to go to my microsoft store and test things out.

Should I wait and get the new surface pen or just get the old if and when the go on sale?

Anything else I shouIld know from current surface users?
Click to expand...

If drawing is crucial, then determine which is more important: reduction of input lag or reduction of Initial Activation Force. The new pen has 21ms input lag, which puts it in top of the class, but still has 9 grams of IAF, which sucks ass compared to Wacom's 1 gram.

If you are novice at drawing and need to watch the lines you make as you draw to determine what lines you draw next, then go with the new pen and 2017 model.

If you are already good at drawing and have really soft touch that requires a pen to start marking with lightest pressure, then go with SP4 on sale and but the new Wacom Bamboo Ink Smart for it for $70 (should be in most Best Buys tomorrow).
 
chekhonte

chekhonte

Member
Thanks. I am new to digital drawing and the thing that has turned me off with wacom tablet was how the slightest touch would create a line. I might like the surface pen. I'll try out the new sf4 at the ms store near me to see what matters. Low response time seems crucial for me but I don't know yet.
 
S

Skittles

Member
Keep an out for places like staples getting rid of surface pro 4s. Just picked up a demo unit with manufacturer warranty for $300
 
D

dLMN8R

Member
Anyone check whether Microsoft Stores have these around to check out and play with? I know they got the Surface Laptop the same day or next day after announcement.
 
K

kiguel182

Member
Even Apple, a company famous for being stingy in storage and memory, realized 256/8 gb is the minimum these days.


Shogmaster said:
Value wise Lenovo is the king.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/lenovo-...drive-platinum-silver/5722715.p?skuId=5722715

Also, uses Wacom instead of N-Trig of HP Spectre X360.
Click to expand...

That's a 1080p display and how is it color wise compared to the Surface?

Edit: no info on the SSD speed and memory speed also makes it hard to compare. It's cheap but it has its short comings. Screen most obviously and other under the hood stuff too.
 
G

Grazzt

Member
Yea I think I'm just gonna stick with my 2-year-old surface pro 3 for a while longer since this is not a huge upgrade anyway. But I need the new keyboard.
 
R

Rizific

Member
TheLaughingStock said:
4GBs is more than enough for 100s of millions of users. Relax.
Click to expand...
Yep, completely depends on what you want to use it for. I picked up the m3/4gb sp4 for $550 during best buys Easter sale. But then again I also picked up the keyboard and pen for an additional $150. It's fucking fantastic at what I use it for. It kills those spreadsheets and Word docs like no ones business. Boots quick, wakes from sleep quickly, I love it. Now if your getting one to replace a desktop then Yeah...you probably wouldn't want the m3/4gb version.
 
J

JoeLT

Member
What happened to Xbox Wireless? They announced it and included it in the Surface Studio so I assumed all their future products would have it but now both the Laptop and Pro don't have it? Was really looking forward to using the new Xbox Wireless headphones on both my Xbox, Desktop with the dongle and on a Surface. Unless they surprise me at E3 with it being added in a firmware update to the WiFi card this along with no Thunderbolt 3 make it a no buy for me.
 
K

kiguel182

Member
family_guy said:
Sure, but if you bought the minimum spec Macbook that just came out it's $1299.
Click to expand...

That price also doesn't have keyboard (or pen). Also, MacBooks have better SSD speeds too. The prices aren't that different.

I just think that 8gb and 256gb should be the base model at this point and time. For the same price too.

Apple also overcharged on ram upgrades, they aren't the example to follow btw. Just mentioned how as terrible as they are when it comes to that stuff have given in on this.
 
S

Servbot24

Banned
Looks great, but I can't swing it right now. I'll stick with iPad Pro which is frankly much more affordable. Granted missing a full OS.
 
G

gamz

Member
kiguel182 said:
That price also doesn't have keyboard (or pen). Also, MacBooks have better SSD speeds too. The prices aren't that different.

I just think that 8gb and 256gb should be the base model at this point and time. For the same price too.

Apple also overcharged on ram upgrades, they aren't the example to follow btw. Just mentioned how as terrible as they are when it comes to that stuff have given in on this.
Click to expand...

Mac don't have touch screens or pen support either. Can't really compare Surface Pro with MacBooks.
 
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