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Atlus announces Shin Megami Tensei: Strange Journey (DS)

duckroll

Member
Error said:
I really like the premise of the plot. An SMT game that doesn't take place in Tokyo for once, a varied cast of characters from different countries in the world etc... etc...

I wonder how they will implement the alignment system, and how harsh it'll be on the player. In SMT1 if you were LAW you couldn't get demons that were CHAOS. You couldn't equip equipment branded as CHAOS either. Also, I wonder how it'll be implemented in the story.

I'm geeking out right now, I can't wait for this game. This is the biggest game announcement of the year for me, easily.

I'm guessing that the alignment in the game will be very technological in nature. Since you're part of the crew in a large scale exploration/frontier mission of sorts into this strange new world, it's possible that what you do in the game, and how you interact with the world and demons and other characters, will determine what alignment direction the entire team moves towards. Which means the development of new equipment and applications for your suit will differ depending on the alignment you're moving in, and it will also affect the story in terms of what happens to other crew members, etc.

Just a guess though. But I'm feel STRONG about that guess!
 

Varna

Member
Error said:
I really like the premise of the plot. An SMT game that doesn't take place in Tokyo for once, a varied cast of characters from different countries in the world etc... etc...

I wonder how they will implement the alignment system, and how harsh it'll be on the player. In SMT1 if you were LAW you couldn't get demons that were CHAOS.
You couldn't equip equipment branded as CHAOS either. Also, I wonder how it'll be implemented in the story.

I'm geeking out right now, I can't wait for this game. This is the biggest game announcement of the year for me, easily.

I don't it will be as harsh as SMT1. Even back then that mechanic was way to hardcore and was quickly tweaked for SMT2. It just made the demons choices so limited... plus you could fuse demons only to find that you could not summon them if alignments did not match (that was such bull shit).

Hopefully it will work something like... conflicting alignment demons are VERY hard to gain through negotiation and fusion problems are increased when trying to obtain one that way. Don't know if this game is using MAG or Macca to summon demons, but the cost should be higher if the demons are of conflicting alignment. Battle performance should be affected somehow too.

Also like the idea of alignment based equipment. They had way to few pieces in SMT1.

Error said:
Hopefully that means alignment exclusive bosses and dungeons :eek:

Oh god yes. Just balance is out so neutral isn't the hardest path by default, but yes please.
 

duckroll

Member
Varna said:
Oh god yes. Just balance is out so neutral isn't the hardest path by default, but yes please.

I really hope they balance it such that true neutral is the most BORING path. Although, that's kinda how it always is in SMT anyway. People who have no real opinion or a weak opinion on matters should not be rewarded with interesting outcomes in the world. :)
 

MechaX

Member
duckroll said:
I really hope they balance it such that true neutral is the most BORING path. Although, that's kinda how it always is in SMT anyway. People who have no real opinion or a weak opinion on matters should not be rewarded with interesting outcomes in the world. :)

To be fair, both possible allegiances in SMT I and II were batshit insane.
 

Aeana

Member
Varna said:
I don't it will be as harsh as SMT1. Even back then that mechanic was way to hardcore and was quickly tweaked for SMT2. It just made the demons choices so limited... plus you could fuse demons only to find that you could not summon them if alignments did not match (that was such bull shit).

Huh? It's still like that in SMT2.
 

Varna

Member
Aeana said:
Huh? It's still like that in SMT2.

They made it a lot easier by switching many of the previous Law/Chaos demons to neutral. Can you really still fuse demons only to find that you can't summon them? Can't believe they did not fix that. :lol On my first playthrough of SMT1 at a certain point fairly late in the game when I did not have so many human companions I went on a fusion spree and got a wicked new demon roster... once I started battling I learned the horrible truth. It was so frustrating.

MechaX's is right. You have to be fricken crazy to go along with any of the non-neutral paths. Hopefully they are as interesting this time around as they are in Nocturne.
 

Aeana

Member
Varna said:
They made it a lot easier by switching many of the previous Law/Chaos demons to neutral. Can you really still fuse demons only to find that you can't summon them? Can't believe they did not fix that. :lol On my first playthrough of SMT1 at a certain point fairly late in the game when I did not have so many human companions I went on a fusion spree and got a wicked new demon roster... once I started battling I learned the horrible truth. It was so frustrating.

MechaX's is right. You have to be fricken crazy to go along with any of the non-neutral paths. Hopefully they are as interesting this time around as they are in Nocturne.
Yep. It's the easiest way to check your alignment!
 

Varna

Member
Aeana said:
Yep. It's the easiest way to check your alignment!

Ah... now that I think about it I never even bothered checking my alignment in either of those games. It's quiet easy to stay neutral... when situations like some guy asking you if it's okay to blow up Tokyo you just have to tell them "no."
 

duckroll

Member
Varna said:
Ah... now that I think about it I never even bothered checking my alignment in either of those games. It's quiet easy to stay neutral... when situations like some guy asking you if it's okay to blow up Tokyo you just have to tell them "no."

Bu-bu-but... the pretty explosions... me like fireworks!
 

Yaweee

Member
Uh... they took the System page down from the official site? What?


As for the alignment mechanics, the only demon profile on the Famitsu webpage (copied by duckroll):


2s6rnlk.jpg



I can't tell whether NEUTRAL-CHAOS means "can be used by Neutral or Chaos alignments" on the 3 alignment system, or if it means the demon is Neutral-Chaos on the 3x3 alignment system.

It also looks like there's at least 5 degrees of compatibility (Bright Red, Dark Red, White, Dark Blue, Light Blue), maybe more.
 

Aeana

Member
Yaweee said:
I can't tell whether NEUTRAL-CHAOS means "can be used by Neutral or Chaos alignments" on the 3 alignment system, or if it means the demon is Neutral-Chaotic on the 3x3 alignment system.
Historically, you have light/neutral/dark and law/neutral/chaos associated with each demon. So a demon can be light-neutral, neutral-chaos, etc. That's what I assumed it was from the start.
 
Yawee said:
I can't tell whether NEUTRAL-CHAOS means "can be used by Neutral or Chaos alignments" on the 3 alignment system, or if it means the demon is Neutral-Chaotic on the 3x3 alignment system.

There is no such alignment as 'Neutral-Chaotic'. Maybe you meant Chaotic Neutral?

Also, the 3x3 grid usually doesn't work for SMT games - everyone's an asshole. It's just a question of whether they're uptight knight templar assholes or berseker loony assholes (or the 'screw this I'm going home' assholes).

EDIT: Or the light-neutral-dark thing Aeana just said. I'm still a SMT newbie.
 

Yaweee

Member
Aeana said:
Historically, you have light/neutral/dark and law/neutral/chaos associated with each demon. So a demon can be light-neutral, neutral-chaos, etc. That's what I assumed it was from the start.

Thanks. Weren't the story paths in SMT1+2 just Law/Neutral/Chaos? How did Light/Neutral/Dark factor into everything?
 

Aeana

Member
Yaweee said:
Thanks. Weren't the story paths in SMT1+2 just Law/Neutral/Chaos? How did Light/Neutral/Dark factor into everything?
Demon alignment and human alignment are a little different. Humans can only be law/neutral/chaos, but demons have both. Dark demons cannot be recruited, and they are the only demons that drop magnetite. Some items only work on demons with specific alignments, as well. For example, hiranya will only heal light demons.

Error said:
I think that was added in Devil Summoner (the first one) wasn't it?
What was? Light/neutral/dark have been in since SMT1.
 

Teknoman

Member
Yaweee said:
Uh... they took the System page down from the official site? What?


As for the alignment mechanics, the only demon profile on the Famitsu webpage (copied by duckroll):


2s6rnlk.jpg



I can't tell whether NEUTRAL-CHAOS means "can be used by Neutral or Chaos alignments" on the 3 alignment system, or if it means the demon is Neutral-Chaos on the 3x3 alignment system.

It also looks like there's at least 5 degrees of compatibility (Bright Red, Dark Red, White, Dark Blue, Light Blue), maybe more.

Is that a redone Ose or something totally new?
 

Yaweee

Member
And what is D-SOURCE beneath the demon's picture? Is it something like Raidou's Loyalty system, or is it used in some kind of inheritance points system? Or something from previous SMTs that I'm missing?
 
battle graphics look surprisingly well, and they even had some money to animate the demons. roaming in first person looks like shit though. meh for the backgrounds there.

i'll be getting this first day, so don't disappoint me!
 

Varna

Member
Only eight damage types eh...

*Sigh*

I wish I could lock myself out of a thread. I don't want to learn too much about this game.
 

Gorgon

Member
vagabondarts said:
ds forever. this game is going to be amazing. Lovely dungeons, art, I can't believe this is really coming to the ds!

Well, looking at the dozens of games Atlus has published on portable systems like Gameboy, Gameboy Advanced and cell phones it doesn't surprise me in the least to see them on the DS. I expect a shit ton of games for the DS in the coming years.
 
Gorgon said:
Well, looking at the dozens of games Atlus has published on portable systems like Gameboy, Gameboy Advanced and cell phones it doesn't surprise me in the least to see them on the DS. I expect a shit ton of games for the DS in the coming years.

Yeah, I'm really starting to doubt we'll ever see a true SMT game on something like PS3 or 360.
It just makes so much more sense to keep it on handhelds at this point.
 

Gorgon

Member
In a sense yes, it certainly is cost effective. But I have no doubts it will hit the HD consoles. Atlus is an official Home supporter and Atlus has been hiring PS3 and 360 devs for a while. That means that the SDKs are already bought and something is in the works, IMHO. If we look at Persona 3 it came out in 2006 in Japan and Persona 4 came out two years later (last year in fact). I suspect we will hear about a new Megaten game for PS360 next year. And I have a feeling it may very well be Persona 5 and not a SMT core game like SMT IV. Persona is very fashionable by now and it would make business sense.

But yeah, I think most releases will be on the DS from now on, maybe also on cell phones for the Japanese market. I like the direction they're taking with Strange Journey. Devil Survivor was ok but nowhere near as interesting as SJ.
 

ethelred

Member
Gorgon said:
Anyywwaaayyy, I'm loving the vibe of Strange Journey. Really my kind of shit. Devil Survivor must have been sucessful in sales for them to invest so much on Strange Journey, and a "true" SMT series at that.

It's enormously unlikely that Devil Survivor's sales had anything to do with Strange Journey. For one thing, Devil Survivor just came out this year, and Strange Journey has pretty obviously been in development for a much longer timeframe than that... and for another thing, Devil Survivor's sales weren't all that hot, relatively speaking. They weren't awful, but they weren't super, either. The Etrian Odyssey games did much better.

Recent Atlus game sales, if anyone's curious:
Code:
Persona 4				PS2	294,214
Shin Megami Tensei III: Nocturne	PS2	245,520
Persona 3				PS2	210,319
Persona 3 Fes				PS2	159,431
Digital Devil Saga			PS2	153,421
Etrian Odyssey 2			NDS	145,421
Devil Summoner: Kuzunoha Raidou 2	PS2	143,080
Persona					PSP	128,709
Etrian Odyssey				NDS	122,461
Growlanser IV: Wayfarer of Time		PS2	107,134
Megami Ibunroku: Devil Survivor		NDS	106,779
Devil Summoner: Kuzunoha Raidou		PS2	91,008
Digital Devil Saga 2			PS2	90,812
Odin Sphere				PS2	90,232
Wizardry: Tale of the Forsaken Land	PS2	82,067
Growlanser II				PS2	81,666
Shin Megami Tensei III: Nocturne Maniax	PS2	77,791
Growlanser III				PS2	74,814
Growlanser V				PS2	69,711
Growlanser VI				PS2	58,451
Stella Deus				PS2	56,276
Growlanser				PSP	43,273
Shin Megami Tensei Nine			XBX	42,920
Wizardry Alternative			PS2	42,893
Princess Crown				PSP	22,466
Growlanser IV Return			PS2	19,885

It's much more likely that this project was spawned off of Etrian Odyssey's success, since even way back when they were developing the first game, Atlus stated that they viewed Etrian Odyssey as a test to see whether or not they could successfully develop a Shin Megami Tensei game on the hardware. Clearly the answer was "yes."

Error said:
What if there's never a Next-gen SMT? Persona=PSP, SMT/other spinoffs=DS.

Like it was mentioned already, I doubt they'd create a lot of sprites have them animate... just for a game. This is Atlus after all.
AgentOtaku said:
Yeah, I'm really starting to doubt we'll ever see a true SMT game on something like PS3 or 360.

Well, I think there's no question that Atlus is developing for the PS3 and the 360. They've been pretty clear about that. It may or may not be a mainline Shin Megami Tensei game... I think the odds are somewhat lessened, now that Strange Journey has been announced, that the first HD game will be SMT4, and I'm okay with that. Maybe (most likely) it will be Persona 5, maybe it'll be something else. But they're doing something, and it'll probably be out next year. And I have little doubt that at some point, even if it's not in the immediate timeframe of the next two years, there will be another core SMT on the home consoles -- a full evolution of the 3D, Nocturne experience.

At the same time, though, the fact that Atlus is really stepping things up a few notches with Strange Journey (in comparison to both the Etrian Odyssey series and Devil Survivor) is also indicative that Atlus plans on continuing with some pretty strong DS support in the years to come. I don't think they'd go through the effort of making that many demons (300!) and animating them if they weren't planning on reusing all this stuff in a number of games to come. If I had to guess, I'd say they'll probably have another two and a half years of DS games coming after this -- maybe a Devil Survivor 2 with more/animated demons, maybe a sequel to Strange Journey, maybe an entirely unrelated or new spinoff series. Who knows.
 

Error

Jealous of the Glory that is Johnny Depp
Looking at those sales, Strange Journey doing 250k is not out of the realm of possibility. Pretty nice improvement for Raidou 2, I wonder how many of those sales came from the SMT3 pack-in... Deserved, though, the game is a big improvement over the first one. Game must've turned in quite the profit, seeing as 50% of the game's content can be found in the first game!
 

Yaweee

Member
ethelred said:

Thanks for the info, and I agree with pretty much everything you said. There's no chance that Atlus won't be recycling these demons in the future, and Devil Survivor 2 is almost a sure bet. What Atlus developed games in the last six years haven't had an immediate successor (or enhanced version)?

It's kind of strange to think that the DS is nearly five years old, and that there's no end in sight to its reign.

EDIT: Out of curiosity, how have the Trauma Center games done in Japan? Has Atlus grown considerably on the success of Persona 3/4 and TC:Second Opinion?
 

Gorgon

Member
ethelred said:
It's enormously unlikely that Devil Survivor's sales had anything to do with Strange Journey. For one thing, Devil Survivor just came out this year, and Strange Journey has pretty obviously been in development for a much longer timeframe than that... and for another thing, Devil Survivor's sales weren't all that hot, relatively speaking. They weren't awful, but they weren't super, either. The Etrian Odyssey games did much better.

Recent Atlus game sales, if anyone's curious:
Code:
Persona 4				PS2	294,214
[/QUOTE]

You're probably right.

By the way, are you sure those sales aren't Japan only? In Wikipedia it states Persona 4 sold over 500k worldwide.
 

duckroll

Member
Yaweee said:
EDIT: Out of curiosity, how have the Trauma Center games done in Japan? Has Atlus grown considerably on the success of Persona 3/4 and TC:Second Opinion?

You don't wanna know. Just think of the TC games as a US franchise, instead of a Japanese one.... :lol

Gorgon said:
You're probably right.

By the way, are you sure those sales aren't Japan only? In Wikipedia it states Persona 4 sold over 500k worldwide.

We are talking about a Japanese game being released by a Japanese company. What do you think?
 

Error

Jealous of the Glory that is Johnny Depp
Gorgon said:
You're probably right.

By the way, are you sure those sales aren't Japan only? In Wikipedia it states Persona 4 sold over 500k worldwide.
those are japanese sales.
 

Gorgon

Member
duckroll said:
We are talking about a Japanese game being released by a Japanese company. What do you think?

I think that Japanese game released by that Japanese company get's them money outside of Japan too; it sold at least as much outside of Japan as inside so I guess it's relevant? Unless I'm missing something here.
 

duckroll

Member
Gorgon said:
I think that Japanese game released by that Japanese company get's them money outside of Japan too; it sold at least as much outside of Japan as inside so I guess it's relevant? Unless I'm missing something here.

How is it relevant when this is not a Persona thread? :p
 

ethelred

Member
Yaweee said:
Thanks for the info, and I agree with pretty much everything you said. There's no chance that Atlus won't be recycling these demons in the future, and Devil Survivor 2 is almost a sure bet. What Atlus developed games in the last six years haven't had an immediate successor (or enhanced version)?

It's kind of strange to think that the DS is nearly five years old, and that there's no end in sight to its reign.

EDIT: Out of curiosity, how have the Trauma Center games done in Japan? Has Atlus grown considerably on the success of Persona 3/4 and TC:Second Opinion?

As Ducky said, Trauma Center is very much a nonentity in Japan. Neither the DS games nor the Wii ones have had any kind of impact; I expect the upcoming Trauma Team will also see negligible sales (we're talking lower than those of the Princess Crown port). I left them off the list for a reason.

I think your point about Atlus consistently doing sequels or revised releases of their recent games is a valid one, and that's another reason I wouldn't at all be surprised to see a Devil Survivor 2 despite the less-than-stellar sales of the original (although it beat Stella Deus and most of the Growlansers, which are the other recent Atlus SRPGs; and didn't it have some Growlanser staff on it? it seems a more productive use of their time than that tanking series). The neat thing, too, is that the sequels they've been doing are pretty much always mechanically better than the originals, with all sorts of enhancements, additions, and rebalancings to improve the gameplay experience. They did that with P3 -> P3 Fes -> P4, with EO -> EO2, with Raidou -> Raidou 2. I love that Atlus doesn't just experiment with new stuff, but also subsequently refines their experiments. And Devil Survivor was already a pretty great game, so an improved sequels along the lines of other recent Atlus follow-ups would be great. :eek:. (just ditch the composer and character designer please)

I'm actually very curious about what else they might do beyond that, since I can't at all see Persona on the DS (modern Persona requires a lot more voice acting than DS carts allow for). There aren't too many obvious choices... That's what leads me to wonder if they might come up with even more new side series (like DDS or Kuzunoha Raidou). That'd be pretty cool; Atlus comes up with some pretty neat ideas when it does totally new stuff.

This is all getting pretty far afield; obviously the most immediate thing is being super-excited about Strange Journey. It's just fun to speculate!
 

duckroll

Member
Devil Survivor was directed by the Growlanser series director. Considering how it outsold his subsequent Growlanser PSP release by over 3x, I would say it's highly possible that they might release another Megaten SRPG next year on the DS. Hopefully they'll use the animated sprites now available from SJ. :eek:
 

Gorgon

Member
duckroll said:
How is it relevant when this is not a Persona thread? :p

I just wanted to know if the table refered to worldwide sales. I wasn't refering to any game in particular although what caught my eye was Persona 4's sales number beying so low compared to wikipedia's info and that's why I refered to it. Sorry if I passed on the idea that I was commenting specifically on the Persona games.

ethelred said:
I'm actually very curious about what else they might do beyond that, since I can't at all see Persona on the DS (modern Persona requires a lot more voice acting than DS carts allow for).

Hum..I don't think that a Persona game on the DS would necessarily need voice over. It could be adapted for the DS as an offshoot from the PS2 games, and they could even use the Megami Ibunroku as a label for that.
I do agree however that they probably are going for another Devil Survivor in the future, and maybe some other new stuff. I don't know about another SMT though, at least not to the point of churning out one SMT every year or two. I guess it's best to savour Strange Journey as much as we can because we may not see something of that caliber for a while :lol
 

Busaiku

Member
duckroll said:
Devil Survivor was directed by the Growlanser series director. Considering how it outsold his subsequent Growlanser PSP release by over 3x, I would say it's highly possible that they might release another Megaten SRPG next year on the DS. Hopefully they'll use the animated sprites now available from SJ. :eek:
It's also not too far away from Etrian Odyssey's last tracked number.
Given the rest of the year, I think it may be able to reach it.

It will definitely outsell all other Growlansers though (well, I'm not sure what the first one did).
 

duckroll

Member
Busaiku said:
It's also not too far away from Etrian Odyssey's last tracked number.
Given the rest of the year, I think it may be able to reach it.

It will definitely outsell all other Growlansers though (well, I'm not sure what the first one did).

In the US maybe. In Japan, DS has no chance of touching the EO/EO2 numbers.
 

jj984jj

He's a pretty swell guy in my books anyway.
duckroll said:
Devil Survivor was directed by the Growlanser series director. Considering how it outsold his subsequent Growlanser PSP release by over 3x, I would say it's highly possible that they might release another Megaten SRPG next year on the DS. Hopefully they'll use the animated sprites now available from SJ. :eek:
No doubt, no point in look for resources or outside help from mediocre developers like Y'sk to make a new Growlanser when Team Career can do another DS game on their own. It'd be nice if they did a new 2D Growlanser though, I don't think they'd need outside help if they did it on the DS and we'd get Satoshi Urushihara as the character designer. I know it's not going to happen though, why do that when you have a game with better sales potential on your hands? Oh well, Atlus still caters to their fans regardless of their business model so I'm sure they'll make a Devil Survivor sequel worth it.
 
I'm kind of late to the party, but the trailer has me all hot and bothered now. I can't believe there's animated sprites! I just hope that isn't indicative of Atlus looking away from consoles. >_>
 

ethelred

Member
duckroll said:
Devil Survivor was directed by the Growlanser series director. Considering how it outsold his subsequent Growlanser PSP release by over 3x, I would say it's highly possible that they might release another Megaten SRPG next year on the DS.

Yeah... I was a little curious about that. It looks like the key staff for Devil Survivor is about half Career Soft Growlanser/Langrisser vets and half Atlus R&D1, which certainly makes for kind of an interesting mix. The director had been directing and producing Career Soft games, and three of Devil Survivor's six design planners worked on Career Soft games while the other three were R&D1 (EO2, specifically). The programming team also seems like an even split between Career Soft and R&D1 (the R&D programmers had worked on a variety of games ranging from P4 to Raidou to the Trauma Center series).

Devil Survivor had four scenario writers and two scenario advisors. Two of the writers were Career Soft, and the other two were R&D1. One of those two worked on EO2, and the other was the scenario writer for P3 and one of the two writers for P4 -- I can definitely see that influence in a lot of Devil Survivor's character stuff. Both of the scenario advisors were R&D1 (one of the advisors, Shogo Isogai, is the SMT2/if/Nocturne writer who's also doing Strange Journey).

So... yeah, kind of interesting. The Growlanser series was never a super strong seller, but it hit a high-water mark with 4 and then just kind of tanked afterward -- 5 and 6 sold much worse than 2 and 3 had, and the PSP port's numbers weren't all that good either. So if Atlus is cannibalizing that team and putting key members of Career Soft on projects with a half & half mix of R&D personnel, and having them make Megaten-branded games, that really is probably a better use of their resources given how the series was struggling. And like I said, while Devil Survivor's sales weren't great relative to Atlus's overall lineup of games, they're much better than the company's other SRPGs, and a sequel that improved on the quality of the first could do even better. If the choice is "should we have these guys make Growlanser 7 or Devil Survivor 2?" that's probably an easy call.

duckroll said:
Hopefully they'll use the animated sprites now available from SJ. :eek:

Hopefully. :eek:

And hopefully it'll have a compendium, too, and maybe even terrain effects.

Gorgon said:
Hum..I don't think that a Persona game on the DS would necessarily need voice over. It could be adapted for the DS as an offshoot from the PS2 games, and they could even use the Megami Ibunroku as a label for that.

Well, the Persona PSP port sold rather well, and I don't think there'd be a reason to switch over to the DS after that. But mainly, I just think that, like Tales and Nippon Ichi games, more of the potential fanbase for the modern Persona games in Japan would be on a system like the PSP or the HD systems rather than the DS, and I think Atlus probably recognizes that.

jj984jj said:
No doubt, no point in look for resources or outside help from mediocre developers like Y'sk to make a new Growlanser when Team Career can do another DS game on their own.

Well, they're not really on their own with Devil Survivor... but really, I wonder to what extent the distinct Career Soft team even exists anymore. I'm curious if this integration of Career Soft and R&D1 continues on future projects. This may have been a one-off project, but if we see a trend of all the main people at Career Soft working on R&D1 projects (the director/producer, writers, artists, game designers, programmers), then it effectively marks the end of the team as a unique entity.

That's probably preferable for the overall quality of their projects anyway, given how poorly Growlanser V (and presumably VI as well) turned out. I see Shinjiro Takata didn't direct either of them, just produced; having him directing again and having the team supplemented by R&D1 should do a lot for the quality of the games.
 
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