But were you saying this last gen when tons of people were screaming for changes? I appreciate the complete change in the direction of Sony but it seems like there's a lot of flip floppers here now that the story that Sony is telling has changed. Were you actually among those acknowledging how bad Sony fucked up last gen or are you just dancing to the song they are now singing (admittedly it's a pretty damn good song)?
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Phil Spencer responds to Sony's 'dig' at Gamescom
- Thread starter CrunchinJelly
- Start date
But were you saying this last gen when tons of people were screaming for changes? I appreciate the complete change in the direction of Sony but it seems like there's a lot of flip floppers here now that the story that Sony is telling has changed. Were you actually among those acknowledging how bad Sony fucked up last gen or are you just dancing to the song they are now singing (admittedly it's a pretty damn good song)?
again with this nonsense. I'm sure sony heard people telling them they didnt want a 600 dollars console and blu ray.
But you know what? They lowered the price as soon as they could and dumped kutaragi.
Listening to many people on this forum they should not have bought ps3, because they didnt listen consumers, they listened their wallets!!!!!Those demons!!!!!
lol
But you know what? They lowered the price as soon as they could and dumped kutaragi.
Listening to many people on this forum they should not have bought ps3, because they didnt listen consumers, they listened their wallets!!!!!Those demons!!!!!
lol
maquiladora
Member
I know, its obvious. I don't think we can expect them to say that though.
Waiting for him to sport a gaf tee underneath his blazer next time we see him.
I'm not arguing against your critique of any of their products. Windows 8 came with my laptop, and I wish it didn't. I'm saying customer feedback (at any given stage) can only ever be one factor, and even then, properly organizing and maneuvering through it all can be pretty complicated. It's overly simplistic to say, "Oh, you like conversations? So what's up with Windows 8, then?"
disastermouse
Banned
So much awesome in this quote!
I don't really know if Sony had a conversation with gamers via feedback either though - they just made a common sense prediction as to what gamers would want and they communicated heavily with developers (as opposed to publishers) about making their platform much more developer friendly than previous efforts. They got their reality check in the current gen and learned what NOT to do.
People say brand loyalty doesn't exist, but clearly it does. Don't let the fact that Sony didn't own the current gen make you think that it wasn't in some part brand loyalty that kept them from being utterly destroyed this gen. Sony made some major fuck ups that would have SUNK a relatively unproven (at the time) competitor like Microsoft had THEY made the same mistakes.
The question is really whether Microsoft has developed enough brand loyalty and good will to get them through this even more colossal train wreck of fuck up upon fuck up that is the Xbox One. I honestly don't know. Microsoft currently has the resources to do it but I don't see anything in their track record that shows that they can maintain the effort in the face of being significantly outmatched. I don't know how important it is to them considering the multi-front war they are facing in nearly EVERY aspect of their many businesses. In a similar vein, Microsoft responds to these crises in a very particular way - they throw more resources, and in the past some very shady business practices, at the problems. Money-hatting FIFA is a clear indication of this sort of 'problem-solving' philosophy. It CAN work (Windows and Office, and for a significant time for IE). Often times it DOESN'T work (nearly everything else they've done since except Xbox 360).
Microsoft doesn't seem to understand that it's hard to buy a product we hate ourselves for buying regardless of our immediate self-interest.
ChosenPredator
Banned
pretty much, at this point its useless some people are going to hate microsoft console no matter what.
mangochutney
Member
Phil is totally missing the point here, it isn't that they're 'listening' and 'getting feedback' and making changes - it is the fact that those changes need to be made at all.
Andy's 'dig' wasn't saying oh look at MS always flip-flopping around changing things, it was saying that we at Sony haven't needed to change anything, we had the gamers' interests at heart from day one, we haven't had to go back on out entire vision because our vision turned out not to be what gamers want in the slightest.
Andy's 'dig' wasn't saying oh look at MS always flip-flopping around changing things, it was saying that we at Sony haven't needed to change anything, we had the gamers' interests at heart from day one, we haven't had to go back on out entire vision because our vision turned out not to be what gamers want in the slightest.
Shaunboy97
Member
Thank you
phosphor112
Banned
I didn't buy a PS3 until MGS4 came out. And I bought it used. And that one died 2 years ago. And trying to get it revived to transfer data was ass. Data transfer utility took over 24 hours to complete.
I had buyers remorse.
I didn't start truly enjoying my PS3 until around 2010, when there were a lot of games to play. I felt like I was constantly scraping the bottom of the barrel to get either a) a good multiplat b)a good Sony exclusive.
Hell, a lot of the OS functionality was... just... bad when it launched up until 2009/2010.
A lot more apps started to become available. Netflix, Hulu, Amazon. I use those 3 constantly now. It feels like the media device I bought and the game device I bought now.
So no, I wasn't "dancing to the song." Do I still think they should have included the Cell SPE's into the APU? Yes. I would have fucking loved native PS3 support on the PS4... but alas... we can't have everything can we?
Marvel
could never
Doug Heffernan
Member
Money speaks louder than words.
This is how all for-profit corporations work; no surprise there.
Microsoft, Sony and Nintendo are all in the business of making money at the end of the day.
Many companies have shifted policies/designs because of negative feedback. Some projects have been scraped altogether to avoid consumer backlash.
Thing is, its MS saying "We Are Listening" when they are not paying any attention unless its the sound of money. That shows a company that has given little thought to finding a balance between consumer & corporation needs
Shaunboy97
Member
You guys want MS to think outside the box YET you don't want a Kinect!! Make up your minds... I was NOT pleased with Sony's conference yesterday and I'm just even more excited about my Xbox One preorder!
Stone Ocean
Member
You don't get a second chance merely months after fucking things up big time. People don't give a shit about empty PR, release your console and reedeem yourself with acts and not with empty promises.
We aren't friends with multimillion corporations, they only get trust if they deserve it, and MS pretty much burned all trust they had in the past few months. Gotta work your way to the top again, this isn't a charity.
la flama blanca
Banned
This
1). Do you really want publishers/developers to overly emphasize threads on NeoGAF...?
2). Backlash before something is even announced is hardly cause to automatically backtrack.
3). "The bottom line" tends to be, in large part, a function of consumer feedback.
4). Low pre-orders would say very little in a vacuum. The things Microsoft changed are exactly what people were complaining about. That constitutes listening to the consumer.
What's so awesome about not being familiar with an increasingly prevalent public relations concept? Just google "two way conversations," and it'll be pretty obvious where Phil Spencer is coming from.
Okay, I think that's enough saying the same thing in repetition for one thread.
purpletentacle
Member
Right, I see. I misunderstood what you meant. I agree, a company shouldn't only base its strategy on what the customer says. That said, the Microsoft of today doesn't understand what the market wants regardless. That's their biggest problem, but I think we agree there.
The Wraith
Member
Good if you're now listening to the consumers MS, lower the price of the console or make a Kinectless sku for 400$. That is when my wallet will open up for you.
gamechanger87
Member
What if some people want a kinect with their system? I guess Microsoft should ignore them?
Can Crusher
Banned
He means pre orders feedback. If the hardcore was raging but softcore/casuals were keeping pre orders at the level they wanted, they wouldn't give a shit about "us".
Sony were arrogant, no doubt about it. They paid for that arrogance for a good number of years. Thing is, the majority of that was the price point and very exotic hardware. Sony had no option but to plow ahead regardless.
Which makes MS's failings even funnier. A high price point without exotic hardware, yet they still refuse to dump kinect. Hilarious.
Fuck this guy. He really should just keep his stupid mouth shut. Everyone knows no policy changes would have been enacted if Sony chose to follow the same path, which Microsoft tried to get Sony to do by announcing them early.
The public isn't s stupid as you hope they are Phillip. You'll find that out in November anyway.
The public isn't s stupid as you hope they are Phillip. You'll find that out in November anyway.
Have you heard of "Optional Extras"
You want it, fine, then you pay for it. Just dont expect the rest of us to part with money for something we didn't want.
highrider
Banned
maverick40
Junior Member
another generic shill comment from a shill king
KaptinKeezey
Banned
NAILED IT
KaptinKeezey
Banned
I thought they 180'd this as well?
CosmicQueso
Member
Nope.
PJV3
Member
I think they still will, if you need FIFA during a console launch to add value, something is very wrong.
Can't believe he would ever look at GAF. It must give him nightmares whenever he does.
Seriously, what others are saying is how I feel. I don't understand why they didn't listen to people and go into E3 and announce that they dropped the DRM. That would have been really listening, and they would have got a lot of praise for going on stage and addressing it. I'm happy they did the 180 eventually, but people were being loud well before Sony dropped the mic at E3. So, yeah, pre-orders must have spooked them. Which is good, I guess, since that means people spoke with their wallets.
Seriously, what others are saying is how I feel. I don't understand why they didn't listen to people and go into E3 and announce that they dropped the DRM. That would have been really listening, and they would have got a lot of praise for going on stage and addressing it. I'm happy they did the 180 eventually, but people were being loud well before Sony dropped the mic at E3. So, yeah, pre-orders must have spooked them. Which is good, I guess, since that means people spoke with their wallets.
gamechanger87
Member
Then don't buy it. Some of us want it there because we believe it will actually be used by developers if it is in the box. All this complaining over and over about the same thing is nauseating.
Why does everyone want each console to be the exact same?
cookie-monster
Member
what a load of drivel
Uno Venova
Banned
That sounds like your own interpretation of what others think.
I don't think so. Being a PR person is basically like acting, right? I bet most PR persons don't care that much on a personal level.
It's harder to sort out things when your console has already launched. They couldn't put in cross game chat, for example, because they couldn't find the memory to do so in the PS3. It's not that Sony was being lazy, they simply couldn't. Microsoft still apparently had time to make changes with Xbone so they did. I don't see how that's comparable though. People whined to Microsoft for months and they flat out told people to get over it. It wasn't until late June that things changed. Sony did not ever tell people to fuck off, they always stuck to their plans and told people they were listening and interested in their fans. Regarding the Xbone, Microsoft wasn't always interested in consumer feedback. In May and June they were confirming the rumors to be true and going so far as to belittle people for living in places with mediocre Internet to insulting naval submarine soldiers to telling customers to just buy a 360 because Xbone wasn't made for them. To go from that to say WE ALWAYS LISTEN TO OUR FANS is a change of tune, inconsistent with their previous behaviors and just PR shit.
Deadly Cyclone
Pride of Iowa State
Don't listen to this person. This is a bad idea.
RedAssedApe
Banned
So many neogaf shout outs. No wonder other gaming forums hate us.
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