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Christopher Nolan criticizes Netflix's digital distribution model for movies

RoadHazard

Gold Member
Can't really agree here. If I'm paying for Netflix, why should I have to pay again to watch a movie they produced using my money, or wait until the theatrical run is over and it shows up on the service? This is not the same as a traditional studio making a movie.
 
Can't really agree here. If I'm paying for Netflix, why should I have to pay again to watch a movie they produced using my money, or wait until the theatrical run is over and it shows up on the service? This is not the same as a traditional studio making a movie.
Just because you subscribe to Netflix, doesn't instantly entitle you to everything they produce. You subscribe to their library, and it's up to Netflix to decide what goes on it. If they want to hold a film for a theatrical run, that's their decision to make. I imagine if they did, they'd have very few if any people cancel their subscription as a result.
 
There must be some pretty high end cinemas in the states. In the UK, cinemas are generally out of focus with shitty speakers.

Only thing they usually have going for them is size and loudness.

I never considered how bad theaters could be in other countries. Here, I've got access to a 4K Dolby Vision HDR laser projection with Dolby Atmos sound in reserved reclining seats.

This depends on what you value most in the experience. No cinema would touch the image quality of a 4K HDR presentation on a 65'' OLED screen.

See above. I'll take a 4K Dolby Vision HDR laser projection or 70mm IMAX easily over that 65" OLED screen any day. So you're mistaken if you think that your 65" OLED screen is considered top of the line.
 

HStallion

Now what's the next step in your master plan?
See above. I'll take a 4K Dolby Vision HDR laser projection or 70mm IMAX easily over that 65" OLED screen any day. So you're mistaken if you think that your 65" OLED screen is considered top of the line.

Yeah its a laughable statement to make and I think 4K OLED sets with HDR look incredible but they don't hold a candle to something like a 70 mm projector, IMAX and so on. The resolution difference is huge in of itself and that's not even getting into a full theater Dolby Atmos speaker system.
 
Yeah its a laughable statement to make and I think 4K OLED sets with HDR look incredible but they don't hold a candle to something like a 70 mm projector, IMAX and so on. The resolution difference is huge in of itself and that's not even getting into a full theater Dolby Atmos speaker system.

Ya. I actually don't get why people are trying to prove their home setups can match the theater. You can say it's good enough but that's not the same as as good. I'm planning a dedicated theater room and I'm under no disillusion that it's going to be as good as going to the theater.
 

The Cowboy

Member
Why not give us the option for both? Release online and in the theater on day one. If enough people go to the theaters for them to survive, then they will. If no one goes, then they won't. Why not give me a choice rather than tell me what I should do?

I would almost always watch at home
I would love this, I'd happily pay the price of a cinema ticket to just watch a new release on my setup at home (heck i'd add a couple of quid as i'd save money on the travel) via a super high quality stream (like Netflix UHD streams), i'd even pay a premium over a regular a blu-ray cost if it was released on the same day as the cinema release.

I know a lot of people go to the cinema for the experience, I go as its the place to see new releases.
 
Ya. I actually don't get why people are trying to prove their home setups can match the theater.

Even in a better (not best) case scenario, where a home setup includes, say, a $3-4k home projector, a 10-12ft wide screen & a fully-light controlled room and a 7.1 surround setup, perfectly calibrated by professional installers - you're not going to equal the theatrical experience in a well-maintained screening room of notable size.

but:

Like I said upthread, for a lot of people, you don't have to 1 to 1 replicate that experience. You just have to get close enough that it becomes worth it to trade spending money on those tickets/concessions and spending time with other people (insert Sartre quote here) for spending money on putting a smaller version of that theater in your living space.

And that's using an idealized potential exhibition experience as a measuring stick. For a lot of people, that's not a thing they're getting frequently. They're getting 25ft wide projection via half-powered bulbs sitting like 30-40ft back and dealing with shitheads livetweeting the screening.

That closes that "close enough" gap a little. At that point, it's on the viewer to decide where "close enough" actually resides, should they have the time and the money and the space to indulge their movie fandom.

And even in those instances, those fans are probably still going to be more than willing to shell out whatever it costs to go see something in IMAX when the right movie comes along.
 

Blueingreen

Member
no thanks

because of movie theaters I'm able to see movies 4 days after release for 6 dollars per ticket with a giant screen and surround sound

The picture and sound quality in most theatres is abysmal though. The sound is either horribly mixed and the picture quality is often drab and washed. I only realised this in the last few years when a friend of mine in the industry mentioned it to me and it's bothered me ever since. The mainstream cinemas genuinely don't give a fuck yet they'll charge and exorbitant amount in ticket and concession stands.

I used to love going to the cinema when I was younger, and even to this day when everything's flawless it's still the best way to watch a film, but the lack of quality assurance in most theatres has pushed me towards home viewing where the audiovisual experience is bespoke to my tailoring and far cheaper. I remember spending almost £40 on me and my friend when we went to watch Arrival at our local Vue when all costs accounted it's ridiculous.

I have faith in the small independent picture houses but I don't see Cinemas in their current state surviving the next decade given how convenient streaming is becoming.
 

near

Gold Member
He's reasoning for not liking Netflix's model doesn't make sense to me, a model that allows films to get to a much wider audience in a shorter time frame is really a blessing. Netflix is a competitor to the cinema experience, not an alternative to it any more. A lot of people prefer Netflix for a variety of different reasons and the policy employed by Netflix which he's complaining about is actually drawing in more viewers. Nolan needs to understand that the cinema experience isn't as great as it use to be because now we have so many alternatives and options to enjoying entertainment when we want and how we want, Nolan should embrace this idea and Netflix. Cinema won't die out that easily and Netflix wont kill it either, it will do that all by itself eventually.
 

Not

Banned
People want to watch movies at home. Point blank. If I could just order a new movie for 20$ on my cable box or through an internet site and skip the theatre then so be it. Not having to share a theatre with loud ass teenage kids will be a god send. Sorry Mr. Nolan but theatres are kind of a novelty this day and age.

I certainly would have never seen Okja if it were only in theaters.
 

Big Blue

Member
What will remain in theaters are movies deserving of the medium. All of Nolan's movies are examples of that. Along with Torrintino. What may move away from theaters are 90 minute comedies, Katherine Hiegle-esque romance movies, and many dramas that are nearly as good streamed on a phone with headphones.

Like the stage, movie theaters will become more botique and expensive, but will never dissapear.

The funny thing is that to get the full Dunkirk IMAX experience, it's very difficult and very expensive. There are not a lot of true IMAX theaters, and the sole one in NYC costs $25!!!
 

Syriel

Member
I never considered how bad theaters could be in other countries. Here, I've got access to a 4K Dolby Vision HDR laser projection with Dolby Atmos sound in reserved reclining seats.

See above. I'll take a 4K Dolby Vision HDR laser projection or 70mm IMAX easily over that 65" OLED screen any day. So you're mistaken if you think that your 65" OLED screen is considered top of the line.

Yeah its a laughable statement to make and I think 4K OLED sets with HDR look incredible but they don't hold a candle to something like a 70 mm projector, IMAX and so on. The resolution difference is huge in of itself and that's not even getting into a full theater Dolby Atmos speaker system.

You're missing the point if you're comparing home theater setups with Dolby Vision laser projection + Atmos or true IMAX setups. Yes, those high end theaters will excel.

But they are not representative of the typical theater in America.

I've gone to the Dolby theater in SF. I've seen movies at Pixar's on site theater. Those screenings were fantastically proficient from a technical perspective and I'm not going to easily replicate that at home.

But that's not the experience that most people have when they go to the theater. Hell, most towns in the US don't even have access to a theater with Dolby Vision projectors and Atmos sound.

Those saying that the home experience can be equal to or better than the theater are comparing it to the typical, run-of-the-mill theater that is all across middle America.

To use a gaming perspective, consoles will never best things like SEGA Gameworks locations (deluxe arcades in limited locations), but they can certainly provide an equal or better experience than your typical mall arcade.
 

HStallion

Now what's the next step in your master plan?
You're missing the point if you're comparing home theater setups with Dolby Vision laser projection + Atmos or true IMAX setups. Yes, those high end theaters will excel.

But they are not representative of the typical theater in America.

I've gone to the Dolby theater in SF. I've seen movies at Pixar's on site theater. Those screenings were fantastically proficient from a technical perspective and I'm not going to easily replicate that at home.

But that's not the experience that most people have when they go to the theater. Hell, most towns in the US don't even have access to a theater with Dolby Vision projectors and Atmos sound.

Those saying that the home experience can be equal to or better than the theater are comparing it to the typical, run-of-the-mill theater that is all across middle America.

To use a gaming perspective, consoles will never best things like SEGA Gameworks locations (deluxe arcades in limited locations), but they can certainly provide an equal or better experience than your typical mall arcade.

And most people aren't sporting high end OLED sets that are calibrated correcting in a room made for viewing movies, i.e. black out curtains to mask all light, a proper acoustic design to maximize the sound, let alone an actual surround sound set up that is done properly and so on. If everyone sported excellent home entertainment systems then yes they'd be comparable to mid range movie theater set ups but most people don't even know how to properly calibrate their TV's and turn on shit like motion smoothing and other effects that actually make things look works. Your average movie theater even with issues is most likely still a much better experience.
 

Syriel

Member
And most people aren't sporting high end OLED sets that are calibrated correcting in a room made for viewing movies, i.e. black out curtains to mask all light, a proper acoustic design to maximize the sound, let alone an actual surround sound set up that is done properly and so on. If everyone sported excellent home entertainment systems then yes they'd be comparable to mid range movie theater set ups but most people don't even know how to properly calibrate their TV's and turn on shit like motion smoothing and other effects that actually make things look works. Your average movie theater even with issues is most likely still a much better experience.

Which, if true, should have no issue competing with day/date streaming.

If the actual experience is better, people will still go to the theater.

If the actual experience is not better, people will just opt for a viewing at home.
 

HStallion

Now what's the next step in your master plan?
Which, if true, should have no issue competing with day/date streaming.

If the actual experience is better, people will still go to the theater.

If the actual experience is not better, people will just opt for a viewing at home.

I actually agree. Theaters have to step up their game in a variety of ways to make up with the convenience of in home streaming. I've actually brought this up earlier in the thread as many theaters are now following after the trail blazed by the Alamo Drafthouse in offering a much higher end experience for movie goers. I just don't think comparing the actual quality of the viewing experience between a TV set up and a movie set up really makes much sense as the movies, by their very nature, will almost always come on top unless you're an absolute AV nerd who goes all the way on a home set up, which is by no means cheap.
 

Blueingreen

Member
And most people aren't sporting high end OLED sets that are calibrated correcting in a room made for viewing movies, i.e. black out curtains to mask all light, a proper acoustic design to maximize the sound, let alone an actual surround sound set up that is done properly and so on. If everyone sported excellent home entertainment systems then yes they'd be comparable to mid range movie theater set ups but most people don't even know how to properly calibrate their TV's and turn on shit like motion smoothing and other effects that actually make things look works. Your average movie theater even with issues is most likely still a much better experience.

The average Joe doesn't give a damn about this, they go to theatres due to marketing hype and it being the only place to watch said movie, if someone could stream Dunkirk on their 5s via paid subscription right now they would watch it on that rather than go to the theatre.

It's the people that understand a good cinema experience and the qualities you listed that are more likely to have a half decent home set up. Based on my experience most cinemas fail to match my audiovisual setup imo, because the sound quality is either poorly mixed/mastered and the picture quality is just abysmal. I recently saw Baby Driver and was shocked by how bad the sound was in particular dialogue which was almost inaudible in some cases. The average person wouldn't have noticed it but my god I found it grating.
 

Ashhong

Member
The average Joe doesn't give a damn about this, they go to theatres due to marketing hype and it being the only place to watch said movie, if someone could stream Dunkirk on their 5s via paid subscription right now they would watch it on that rather than go to the theatre.

It's the people that understand a good cinema experience and the qualities you listed that are more likely to have a half decent home set up. Based on my experience most cinemas fail to match my audiovisual setup imo, because the sound quality is either poorly mixed/mastered and the picture quality is just abysmal. I recently saw Baby Driver and was shocked by how bad the sound was in particular dialogue which was almost inaudible in some cases. The average person wouldn't have noticed it but my god I found it grating.

Would a person rather watch a brand new movie for "free" instantly rather than going to the theater and paying money? Of course! But the point is the experience and the quality is not as good. A movie like Dunkirk, which was pretty much tailor made to be experienced in theaters, loses much of it's effect.

Now mind you, I am not sure where you are but I have never been to a theater with poor sound mixing and picture quality, even in the non IMAX screens. So maybe it's different for other people where their home setup is somehow better than a theater.
 

HStallion

Now what's the next step in your master plan?
The average Joe doesn't give a damn about this, they go to theatres due to marketing hype and it being the only place to watch said movie, if someone could stream Dunkirk on their 5s via paid subscription right now they would watch it on that rather than go to the theatre.

It's the people that understand a good cinema experience and the qualities you listed that are more likely to have a half decent home set up. Based on my experience most cinemas fail to match my audiovisual setup imo, because the sound quality is either poorly mixed/mastered and the picture quality is just abysmal. I recently saw Baby Driver and was shocked by how bad the sound was in particular dialogue which was almost inaudible in some cases. The average person wouldn't have noticed it but my god I found it grating.

You totally missed the point I was making. I was talking about the sheer quality of the audio Visual experience between someone's home set up and a theater and why I think its foolish for people to base their argument on that as to why its better to watch something at home versus a movie theater. Hell you basically agreed with my part of my post as I brought up the fact most people don't even know how to calibrate their TV's if they even know about that at all as they don't much care. Your average joe won't go out of their way to create a great audio visual experience at home and most movie theaters, even mid range ones will easily out do that.

My follow up post even brings up that theaters still have to step it up as the shear convenience and cheapness of staying at home often out weighs a superior AV experience with an audience of fellow movie goers.
 

cwmartin

Member
People got over entire seasons being released at the same time, and they will get over the awful movie theatre experience as well.

The fact will remain, the majority of the population DOES NOT care about the technical majesty of how the movie is displayed at the movie theatre. They just want to watch it in their living room without the hassle.
 

Compsiox

Banned
People got over entire seasons being released at the same time, and they will get over the awful movie theatre experience as well.

The fact will remain, the majority of the population DOES NOT care about the technical majesty of how the movie is displayed at the movie theatre. They just want to watch it in their living room without the hassle.

I don't agree with this. Seeing a movie on a huge 4k screen tops any experience you can have at home.
 

Tagg9

Member
People got over entire seasons being released at the same time, and they will get over the awful movie theatre experience as well.

The fact will remain, the majority of the population DOES NOT care about the technical majesty of how the movie is displayed at the movie theatre. They just want to watch it in their living room without the hassle.

It's why UHD Blu-ray will never surpass Blu-ray sales, which itself will never surpass DVD sales. And of course all physical sales have long been passed by streaming services now.
 

cwmartin

Member

Etzer

Member
All these posts comparing a home setup to IMAX... I just want to pay to watch a new movie at home. I don't go to a theater to watch a movie because it looks or sounds better, I go because it's the only way to watch a new release.
 
tenor.gif
 

border

Member
People got over entire seasons being released at the same time, and they will get over the awful movie theatre experience as well.

Full season dumps are probably the other obnoxious thing Netflix does. They sabotage their own content by not serializing it in some way. Communities never form around a show. What could have been weeks of speculation and conversation just becomes "Yeah, I watched all 12 episodes. It was pretty good."
 

HelloMeow

Member
Full season dumps are probably the other obnoxious thing Netflix does. They sabotage their own content by not serializing it in some way. Communities never form around a show. What could have been weeks of speculation and conversation just becomes "Yeah, I watched all 12 episodes. It was pretty good."

This is not what's happening at all.
 
I wanted to watch All Eyez On Me (yeah I know crap reviews) when it was first realised in the UK but couldn't because I didn't have the funds a couple of weeks later I get paid and it's been pulled from my local cinema.

Great.

At this point I would still pay a premium to watch it on a streaming platform right now but I can't I now have to wait till it's released.

But guess what people who use certain pieces of software will likely watch it before me for FREE how is that fair?

I WANT to pay a premium here, but instead I'm supposed to stick to my morals and wait for a full release.

Something has to change.
 

border

Member
This is not what's happening at all.

The months of hype, buildup and discussion around shows like Walking Dead or Game of Thrones very much overshadow the brief blip of activity surrounding most Netflix shows.....even the ones that manage to catch on in the cultural zeitgeist (Stranger Things, early seasons of House of Cards and Orange is the New Black).
 

HStallion

Now what's the next step in your master plan?
Full season dumps are probably the other obnoxious thing Netflix does. They sabotage their own content by not serializing it in some way. Communities never form around a show. What could have been weeks of speculation and conversation just becomes "Yeah, I watched all 12 episodes. It was pretty good."

This isn't true at all. They have thriving fan communities for shows like Stranger Things and 13 Reasons Why was a cultural phenomenon
 
The months of hype, buildup and discussion around shows like Walking Dead or Game of Thrones very much overshadow the brief blip of activity surrounding most Netflix shows.....even the ones that manage to catch on in the cultural zeitgeist (Stranger Things, early seasons of House of Cards and Orange is the New Black).


Stranger Things was a way biggest cultural phenomenon than Walking Dead last year
 
Again, theaters are arcades for movies. Even today a well made special arcade machine is going to blow consoles out of the water. If you think people wouldn't eat that up if given half a chance on first run movies you're crazy.

Yes, there will always be die hards and if first run movies appeared at home, there might be enough niche to maintain the theaters despite that... But let's not pretend that it's what the majority of people actually want.
 

Syriel

Member
People are out of their mind if they think they would ever see Avengers being made for 200 million dollar budget if it was only streamed at home .

People getting together in a living room and only having to fork out $20 to watch it?

Yeah, glad you guys think that's even practical if you want cinema and technology to advance lol

Replying again to this post about $$$, because of Smith's comment about Bright on the panel.

Will Smith said:
[The] risk profile is different. So Netflix can make a hard, rated R movie for a $170 million. Studios can't do that if the executive wants to be at work on Monday.

$170 million on a sci-fi action flick for Netflix.

We're nearly at that $200 million mark that RBelong2Us said was insanity at the beginig of the thread.

All these posts comparing a home setup to IMAX... I just want to pay to watch a new movie at home. I don't go to a theater to watch a movie because it looks or sounds better, I go because it's the only way to watch a new release.

No one has been comparing home setups to IMAX screens (which are pretty darn rare, in and of themselves).

It's been said in the thread that high end home theater setups can easily compete with or exceed the quality of the typical theater in the US. No one made the claim that a home theater can best a proper IMAX installation.
 

jtb

Banned
He's absolutely right. Put them in the fucking theater.

Amazon is kicking Netflix's ass at original films. Chiraq (!!!!) and Manchester by the Sea were both great, interesting projects that deserved to be seen in the theater.
 

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
People want to watch movies at home. Point blank. If I could just order a new movie for 20$ on my cable box or through an internet site and skip the theatre then so be it. Not having to share a theatre with loud ass teenage kids will be a god send. Sorry Mr. Nolan but theatres are kind of a novelty this day and age.

Actually they aren't. Just because you don't like them doesn't mean millions of people aren't still using them.
 
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