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hydruxo
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(09-13-2017, 05:28 PM)
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Originally Posted by Bobby Roberts

You see the absence of an arm. I don't think you actually see it come off. You don't see the disembodied arm. And you don't really see much but a shock of red and the hint of a stump on his coat.

Seriously, I don't think Muschietti actually shows you much of much there.

It's kinda like how everyone swore they saw some crazy shit in the napkin during that one shot in Blair Witch Project.

Yeah they really didn't show much. Pennywise gets a big ol chomp on his arm and then the arm is just gone when it shows George fall back. There's some puddles of blood on the ground but that's about it. Wasn't as gruesome as people made it seem.
carlsojo
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(09-13-2017, 05:29 PM)
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Originally Posted by Pilgrimzero

No, the murders are all penned on Bowers who is still alive.

Bowers looked pretty dead. But I guess no body no death?

I was kind of disappointed we didn't see his gang get killed. The scene where his buddy is dragged into a pipe by lights was a favorite of mine. Maybe they'll show it in a flashback in Part 2.

Originally Posted by hydruxo

Yeah they really didn't show much. Pennywise gets a big ol chomp on his arm and then the arm is just gone when it shows George fall back. There's some puddles of blood on the ground but that's about it. Wasn't as gruesome as people made it seem.

An armless little kid screaming and bleeding in the street is pretty gruesome.
teiresias
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(09-13-2017, 06:17 PM)
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Originally Posted by carlsojo

An armless little kid screaming and bleeding in the street is pretty gruesome.

The effectiveness of the scene really had more to do with the kid's performance after the bite than anything else. It certainly wasn't the horrible CGI or awkward shot used to show the bite that was selling it.

The more I think on the film, the less I like it . Mainly because, as someone mentioned above, the mini-series did more character and group development than this movie did, and the tv movie had the following to contend with:

1) Actually had to allocate time to parts with the adults.
2) Possibly shorter running time (Wikipedia says the two episodes had a combined running time of 197 minutes on initial broadcast).
3) Was written for a TV movie cadence to take commercial breaks into account.
4) It was the 80s so probably more pressure then now to bow to racial and sexist stereotypes.

The fourth one continues to really annoy the ever-loving shit out of me. The mini-series had no problem showing Mike being brainy and smart, and had no problems NOT damsel-in-distress'ing Bev, but this R-rated movie in 2017 has these issues.
Maligna
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(09-13-2017, 06:24 PM)
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Originally Posted by Pilgrimzero

No, the murders are all penned on Bowers who is still alive.

Seriously? Is that from the book?

How could one teenager kill hundreds of kids? Especially one that have been missing for decades presumably.
Vault Dweller 111
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(09-13-2017, 06:25 PM)
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I enjoyed it. The kids were great and their relationship was what I was hoping the movie would nail down. I thought Skarsgard was really good as Pennywise. I wasn't super scared, but I found the 'scary' moments imaginative and fun. The whole theater was having a great time.

The Stranger Thing kid stole the show, but all of the child actors impressed me. Liked Bev a lot.
DeviantBoi
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(09-13-2017, 06:28 PM)
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Originally Posted by hydruxo

Yeah they really didn't show much. Pennywise gets a big ol chomp on his arm and then the arm is just gone when it shows George fall back. There's some puddles of blood on the ground but that's about it. Wasn't as gruesome as people made it seem.

Watching a 6-year old try to crawl away for his life is pretty gruesome. You don't need blood and guts for that scene to make an impact.
Last edited by DeviantBoi; 09-13-2017 at 07:25 PM.
nicoga3000
Saint Nic
(09-13-2017, 06:29 PM)
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Haven't seen the movie yet, but I'm intrigued.

Is the book worth the time investment?
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
(09-13-2017, 06:30 PM)
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Originally Posted by Maligna

Seriously? Is that from the book?

How could one teenager kill hundreds of kids? Especially one that have been missing for decades presumably.

Just the ones of this summer, of which there are only two or three. It sleeps for 27 years, people don't connect the dots
Vincent Alexander
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(09-13-2017, 06:30 PM)
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Originally Posted by nicoga3000

Haven't seen the movie yet, but I'm intrigued.

Is the book worth the time investment?

Yes. Fuck yes (not a real spoiler)
nicoga3000
Saint Nic
(09-13-2017, 06:31 PM)
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Originally Posted by Vincent Alexander

Yes. Fuck yes

I have a flight to Paris coming up next week, so I may have some light reading to do, ha.
carlsojo
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(09-13-2017, 06:32 PM)
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Originally Posted by Maligna

Seriously? Is that from the book?

How could one teenager kill hundreds of kids? Especially one that have been missing for decades presumably.

That's how the people of Derry are. They subconsciously ignore the existence of It, they don't go looking for the kids that go missing, and basically forget about them. They're more than happy to be like oh yeah that shithead Bowers kid did it, let's move on.
AuthenticM
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(09-13-2017, 06:38 PM)
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Originally Posted by Bobby Roberts

I dont' believe you actually see his arm come off. This got talked about earlier in the thread, but Muschietti does some pretty nifty work in that scene to make you feel like you saw way more than you did.

You see the mouth distend, you see the bite come down - but I don't know that you actually see the teeth go in, and the rip isn't onscreen either. I think it's a cut to Georgie crawling away almost immediately, and even then, you don't really see the stump. I think it's just a shock of red on the side of his coat for maybe a second - and then Pennywise grabs him and pulls him down.

So basically, all you saw was a kid screaming and a puddle of blood. But you would SWEAR you saw Pennywise physically pull the whole arm off while blood was gouting everywhere.

hmm, you might be right. That would be some pretty clever filmmaking right there.

Still, that's still pretty gruesome, and definitely a higher level of violence depicted against children than what we usually get. At least, in Hollywood.
Gozer the Gozerian
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(09-13-2017, 07:02 PM)
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Originally Posted by carlsojo

That's how the people of Derry are. They subconsciously ignore the existence of It, they don't go looking for the kids that go missing, and basically forget about them. They're more than happy to be like oh yeah that shithead Bowers kid did it, let's move on.

Yup, re-reading It again right now, and there is this great sense of creeping dread as that side of things gets delved into in the Derry Interludes.
Kyleripman
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(09-13-2017, 07:02 PM)
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Originally Posted by Maligna

Seriously? Is that from the book?

How could one teenager kill hundreds of kids? Especially one that have been missing for decades presumably.

I want to say he was only convicted for the current round of murders at the time, which would've been a smaller number than the total historical number of murders and disappearances.

Originally Posted by Pilgrimzero

I took beep beep as a squeaky clown nose since He was surrounded by clowns and has a fear or clowns.

In the book, "beep beep Richie" is something the kids say to shut him up when he is getting obnoxious. (Sorry if you already know this, it's hard to keep track since lots of gaffers haven't read it and I can't remember if it's in the miniseries).
LakeEarth
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(09-13-2017, 07:03 PM)
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Originally Posted by carlsojo

That's how the people of Derry are. They subconsciously ignore the existence of It, they don't go looking for the kids that go missing, and basically forget about them. They're more than happy to be like oh yeah that shithead Bowers kid did it, let's move on.

Yeah, when discussing the movie with my wife, she said "why is every adult so fucked up!?" and I had to explain how it is in the book.
More_Badass
My indie-sense is tingling
(09-13-2017, 07:10 PM)
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Originally Posted by LakeEarth

Yeah, when discussing the movie with my wife, she said "why is every adult so fucked up!?" and I had to explain how it is in the book.

The movie really did a bad job with that aspect. It's as important to the story as Pennywise or the Loser's Club but the little hints they have aren't enough and the town is too nice 80s Spielbergian without peeling that facade back

Originally Posted by Maligna

Seriously? Is that from the book?

How could one teenager kill hundreds of kids? Especially one that have been missing for decades presumably.

Just the recent murders that the curfew is in effective for. All the other past kids and incidents are willfully ignored as runaways or missing
Maligna
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(09-13-2017, 07:14 PM)
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Originally Posted by Kyleripman

I want to say he was only convicted for the current round of murders at the time, which would've been a smaller number than the total historical number of murders and disappearances.

So then they did leave the other (older) bodies to rot?
Ignatz Mouse
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(09-13-2017, 07:17 PM)
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I'm surprised at the negativity. While certainly the movie doesn't give as much depth as the book, I'd rather have damsel-in-distress Bev (who only plays that part for a very brief time) than the infamous scene in the book.

And apart from Pennywise, I didn't think much of the TV version at all. Saw it right after I first read the book (5 years ago-ish) and it's really terrible in a lot of ways.
Martinski43
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(09-13-2017, 07:17 PM)
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It was pretty damned great and very funny as well. (pun intended, can't be avoided)

Not very scary personally but good horror scenes anyway. And if you loved Stranger Things this is pretty much more of it until season 2. One of the kids is in this too.

Loved the chemistry in the gang and great child actors.
More_Badass
My indie-sense is tingling
(09-13-2017, 07:25 PM)
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Originally Posted by Ignatz Mouse

I'm surprised at the negativity. While certainly the movie doesn't give as much depth as the book, I'd rather have damsel-in-distress Bev (who only plays that part for a very brief time) than the infamous scene in the book.

Criticism, not negativity

Most of the criticism isn't coming from a "this was bad" place, but rather "it was good but lacking and missed potential". Obviously the movie can't get into the depth of the book, but some of the most critical aspects of the story are either not done well, not done at all, or changed in ways that hinders the story, when they didn't have to be given how the movie presented things
Ignatz Mouse
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(09-13-2017, 07:35 PM)
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Originally Posted by More_Badass

Criticism, not negativity

Most of the criticism isn't coming from a "this was bad" place, but rather "it was good but lacking and missed potential". Obviously the movie can't get into the depth of the book, but some of the most critical aspects of the story are either not done well, not done at all, or changed in ways that hinders the story, when they didn't have to be given how the movie presented things

I see some of that, but I keep hearing people say they didn't like it, and then comparing it to the TV movie, which boggles my mind.
Kyleripman
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(09-13-2017, 07:41 PM)
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Originally Posted by Maligna

So then they did leave the other (older) bodies to rot?

A good question. Most of the historical events in previous 30-year cycles is described in terms of It influencing people (like Claude Heroux murdering people or the Bradley Gang events) or "accidents" like the Kitchener Ironworks. Off the top of my head I can't recall many historical accounts of kids flat-out disappearing as happens in the "present day" timeline. But I would assume they mostly went unsolved or were blamed on someone else.
MagnaderAlpha
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(09-13-2017, 07:43 PM)
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Originally Posted by Kyleripman

I want to say he was only convicted for the current round of murders at the time, which would've been a smaller number than the total historical number of murders and disappearances.

In the book, "beep beep Richie" is something the kids say to shut him up when he is getting obnoxious. (Sorry if you already know this, it's hard to keep track since lots of gaffers haven't read it and I can't remember if it's in the miniseries).

In the book (and mini-series), It's victims weren't all considered "missing". He left a LOT of bodies out in the open for the police to find. Georgie wasn't taken, either. His arm was ripped off and eaten by It (from the descriptions in the book, It rarely fully consumed bodies, and just ate "pieces" out of It's victims), but Georgie's body was found by the grate and eventually buried by his family. Both novel and mini-series gives Bill's reason to find and kill It being revenge, while in this movie, it is hope that Georgie is still alive, somewhere.

But yeah, because there were bodies of dead kids being found around Derry, that is why Henry was convicted. The police didn't actually go under the city into the sewers to recover whatever pieces or full bodies It took into it's lair. Patrick Hockstetter, Victor Criss and Belch Huggins' remains were all still in the sewer by the time the adult Losers returned.


And yeah, "Beep beep Richie" WAS in the mini-series... a lot.
Last edited by MagnaderAlpha; 09-13-2017 at 07:46 PM.
Bobby Roberts
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(09-13-2017, 07:43 PM)
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Originally Posted by Ignatz Mouse

I see some of that, but I keep hearing people say they didn't like it, and then comparing it to the TV movie, which boggles my mind.

I mean, there's problems with the film, but I can't see any good arguments that the miniseries even approaches this take on the material in terms of quality, or effectiveness.

The number of things the miniseries does well period is small, and that number shrinks to damn near zero if you try counting the things it does as well or better than this film.

And that includes the presence & performance of Pennywise the Dancing Clown
StanleyStutters
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(09-13-2017, 07:47 PM)
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Originally Posted by Maligna

So then they did leave the other (older) bodies to rot?

I'm a little fuzzy, but from what I remember, none of the bodies were ever found in the books. The sewer system is overly complicated and nearly impossible to navigate. Eddie has an almost supernatural ability to navigate through and just "knows" where to go the whole time.

Once the leave the sewers, and as time passes, they all forget what they experienced and it's highly unlikely Eddie could lead anyone back to the bodies after they left the sewers.
MagnaderAlpha
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(09-13-2017, 07:49 PM)
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Originally Posted by Ignatz Mouse

I'm surprised at the negativity. While certainly the movie doesn't give as much depth as the book, I'd rather have damsel-in-distress Bev (who only plays that part for a very brief time) than the infamous scene in the book.

That's not a valid equivalency as far as swapping is concerned. They NEVER needed the infamous scene to begin with. The blood oath was always something that could take its place (and if I remember, that was in the book as well, as when the adults' memories start awakening, their scars on the palm of their hands starts bleeding again.
Vincent Alexander
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(09-13-2017, 07:52 PM)
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Originally Posted by Ignatz Mouse

I see some of that, but I keep hearing people say they didn't like it, and then comparing it to the TV movie, which boggles my mind.

I think this movie is beyond better than the TV miniseries, but still falters in some really important areas. The kid actors are great, but their bond feels weak. Pennywise is great, but his final confrontation made him feel like a pushover. He wasn't as imposing as Pennywise from the miniseries in that final scene specifically. The rest of him was fantastic.
Ignatz Mouse
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(09-13-2017, 07:53 PM)
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Originally Posted by MagnaderAlpha

That's not a valid equivalency as far as swapping is concerned. They NEVER needed the infamous scene to begin with. The blood oath was always something that could take its place (and if I remember, that was in the book as well, as when the adults' memories start awakening, their scars on the palm of their hands starts bleeding again.

It's not that it needs it, I'm just pointing out at least one huge improvement over the book-- the omission of that scene, and contrasting it with a complaint about a much more minor offense (if you can call it that).

Obviously you don't need either, but I think people are editing that scene out of the book in their heads-- I know I do.
Kyleripman
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(09-13-2017, 08:18 PM)
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Originally Posted by MagnaderAlpha

And yeah, "Beep beep Richie" WAS in the mini-series... a lot.

Gonna have to rewatch it one of these days. It's been a looooong time as it didn't leave a particularly favorable impression on me.
teiresias
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(09-13-2017, 08:26 PM)
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Originally Posted by Ignatz Mouse

I'm surprised at the negativity. While certainly the movie doesn't give as much depth as the book, I'd rather have damsel-in-distress Bev (who only plays that part for a very brief time) than the infamous scene in the book.

How is this a choice? The mini series didn't damsel Bev nor have the infamous scene, and in fact managed to make kid Bev a badass as one of only two of losers to physically hurt Pennywise.
Ignatz Mouse
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(09-13-2017, 08:53 PM)
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Originally Posted by teiresias

How is this a choice? The mini series didn't damsel Bev nor have the infamous scene, and in fact managed to make kid Bev a badass as one of only two of losers to physically hurt Pennywise.

See above post. It's not either/or. just a point where the movie improves on the book but people ignore that part of the book.

Yes, the TV movie did better by Bev in relation to these things, but was also much worse in many other areas. Like quality.
MagnaderAlpha
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(09-13-2017, 09:19 PM)
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Originally Posted by Ignatz Mouse

See above post. It's not either/or. just a point where the movie improves on the book but people ignore that part of the book.

Yes, the TV movie did better by Bev in relation to these things, but was also much worse in many other areas. Like quality.

From my standpoint, the mini-series was more TRUE to the book as events were concerned, but more like a neutered version, a watered down cliff-notes version.

This movie captures more gore, scares and uncensored swearing from the kids, certain "key" scenes and characters, but also opted to just do its own thing with the concept of the book in mind.

In the end, it is one of those cases with neither are true as true can be to the spirit of the book. Both get different aspects right, but also, both lack in certain aspects when compared to the book.

Still hoping, in 27 years, when I'm in my 60s, we get another remake, and maybe it will be a fuckin' TV series this time, with enough time spent to flesh the story out without scrambling to see what to change and cut do to limitations. It also makes me wonder how the original concept for the It mini-series was going to be, considering George Romero was tapped to do it and it was supposed to be 8-hours long (and then the studio suits came in and we got the mini-series instead).
Ignatz Mouse
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(09-13-2017, 10:12 PM)
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Originally Posted by MagnaderAlpha

From my standpoint, the mini-series was more TRUE to the book as events were concerned, but more like a neutered version, a watered down cliff-notes version.

This movie captures more gore, scares and uncensored swearing from the kids, certain "key" scenes and characters, but also opted to just do its own thing with the concept of the book in mind.

In the end, it is one of those cases with neither are true as true can be to the spirit of the book. Both get different aspects right, but also, both lack in certain aspects when compared to the book.

Still hoping, in 27 years, when I'm in my 60s, we get another remake, and maybe it will be a fuckin' TV series this time, with enough time spent to flesh the story out without scrambling to see what to change and cut do to limitations. It also makes me wonder how the original concept for the It mini-series was going to be, considering George Romero was tapped to do it and it was supposed to be 8-hours long (and then the studio suits came in and we got the mini-series instead).


I get this. Just a string of posts praising the TV version (in parts) and being lukewarm on the movie stood out to me.

I'm personally OK with how condensed the movie was, but wished they made some different choices. Mostly I liked it though.
bitbydeath
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(09-13-2017, 10:12 PM)
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Originally Posted by SoundLad

I've been looking for a clip of it too. Let me know if you find one.

Haven't seen a clip but saw someone post this image in the horror gifs thread.

Wanderer5
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(09-13-2017, 10:40 PM)
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Just came back from it. Decided to bring some earplugs just to be a bit on the safe side, which might be silly, but I got to really enjoy and still get creep out by the movie, like that librarian in the post above lol. That was so weird just suddenly noticing her staring at him and being a bit closer a shot later, and yet nothing comes out from it.XD

Overall I really liked it. Kids were great (through a couple of them had the short end of the stick), and I think this movie had a nice balance of being really creepy and being light hearted and fun. Pennywise was good despite some stupid looking dashes towards someone/camera, and the other stuff the kids see were mostly good too, like the appearances of Georgie after his death, through that lady with the flute was quite bleh.

Shall look forward to Chapter 2.
Last edited by Wanderer5; 09-13-2017 at 10:45 PM.
Auctopus
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(09-13-2017, 10:46 PM)
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Just got back. Pretty good but was pretty much 15 scarejump scenes cut together with an Act 3. None of the hangouts/character development from the book but you can't really expect them to fit it all in.

Only scene I was disappointed by was the Hobo/Leper. That scene is much creepier and longer in the book. The make-up/effects in the movie are kind of silly and the hobo just sort of limps around Eddie.
- J - D -
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(09-13-2017, 11:01 PM)
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Originally Posted by bitbydeath

Haven't seen a clip but saw someone post this image in the horror gifs thread.

Huh. in my memory it felt like the librarian stood further back. Is this image actually taken from the final film itself? It seems flattened, like it was shot with a different camera lens.

In any case, I really love this scene. It's the only thing that still comes back to me consistently, days after I've seen the film.
bitbydeath
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(09-13-2017, 11:24 PM)
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Originally Posted by - J - D -

Huh. in my memory it felt like the librarian stood further back. Is this image actually taken from the final film itself? It seems flattened, like it was shot with a different camera lens.

In any case, I really love this scene. It's the only thing that still comes back to me consistently, days after I've seen the film.

Not sure, I shamelessly stole it from here - http://m.neogaf.com/showpost.php?p=248783318
- J - D -
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(09-13-2017, 11:36 PM)
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Originally Posted by bitbydeath

Not sure, I shamelessly stole it from here - http://m.neogaf.com/showpost.php?p=248783318

Ah okay.

I think I'm gonna see this movie again just to validate my memory of this scene, lol. And also to see other easter eggs and hidden bits.
t hicks
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(09-13-2017, 11:43 PM)
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just got back from the theater and goddamn I loved IT (hehe)
Just wish there was like 1-2 more pennywise scenes but man, that was great
Can't wait for part 2
Brian_FETO
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(09-14-2017, 12:04 AM)
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Originally Posted by bitbydeath

Haven't seen a clip but saw someone post this image in the horror gifs thread.

Yeah I just got back from seeing the movie, this was probably my favorite shot. So creepy, weird how it seemed to be the only instance of something like that, that didn't loop back around into something actually affecting him

Overall I really, really enjoyed the movie. Definitely too much reliance on "BOOM" scares for my taste, and I thought Richie was overly grating (I get it comes back around for his payoff at the end though)
mokeyjoe
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(09-14-2017, 12:04 AM)
Read the book about 25 years ago, and have been waiting a long time for a decent adaptation as I thought the miniseries was awful.

I didnít know it was going to be a two parter, but it does make sense I guess. I generally enjoyed it. I donít really like effects heavy horror much, but I liked some of the visual design here, and the more bestial Pennywise worked for me.

The kids and the drama were the highlight, as they were in the book. But itís interesting watching this in a post Stranger Things world, which is clearly so influenced by King. Also interesting how the time period has shifted from the 1950s, to one that approximates my own childhood . Guess Iím old.
carlsojo
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(09-14-2017, 12:06 AM)
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Originally Posted by Brian_FETO

Yeah I just got back from seeing the movie, this was probably my favorite shot. So creepy, weird how it seemed to be the only instance of something like that, that didn't loop back around into something actually affecting him

Overall I really, really enjoyed the movie. Definitely too much reliance on "BOOM" scares for my taste, and I thought Richie was overly grating (I get it comes back around for his payoff at the end though)

Richie was like my favorite, he was hysterical.

AND NOW IVE GOTTA KILL THIS FUCKING CLOWN
i-Lo
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(09-14-2017, 12:08 AM)
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Given how much more prolific the psychological torment is, would Pennywise fit the description of cosmic horror entity?

Originally Posted by bitbydeath

Haven't seen a clip but saw someone post this image in the horror gifs thread.

If I'm not mistaken, it was Pennywise that entire scene when they conversed up until he came across the real librarian at the end of chase sequence, right?
Brian_FETO
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(09-14-2017, 12:10 AM)
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Originally Posted by carlsojo

Richie was like my favorite, he was hysterical.

AND NOW IVE GOTTA KILL THIS FUCKING CLOWN

Yeah that's the payoff which makes me sort of ok with it. Without it, nooooooo thanks

Originally Posted by i-Lo

If I'm not mistaken, it was Pennywise that entire scene when they conversed up until he came across the real librarian at the end of chase sequence, right?

Nah, it was the same person with those colors. But she was just standing there and it looked like she was doing a creepy smile to him (but she's out of focus)
PeskyToaster
(09-14-2017, 12:16 AM)
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Originally Posted by carlsojo

Richie was like my favorite, he was hysterical.

AND NOW IVE GOTTA KILL THIS FUCKING CLOWN


I've mentioned this before but I'm still cracking up over the line "Derry used to be a beaver trapping town"

"Still is, am I right?" Unreturned high five.
CampbellzSoup
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(09-14-2017, 01:10 AM)
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Could Georgie had survived if IT just ate his arm? Ugh I know people said it wasn't a graphic scene but the innocence of a child being so brutally killed :(
Timeaisis
(09-14-2017, 01:12 AM)
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Originally Posted by PeskyToaster

I've mentioned this before but I'm still cracking up over the line "Derry used to be a beaver trapping town"

"Still is, am I right?" Unreturned high five.

Lmao I loved that line, especially considering how quickly he delivered it and how none of the boys laughed.
VenomousCoffee
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(09-14-2017, 01:14 AM)
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Just saw it. I read the book when I was in about 6th grade, which was a really long time ago, so I've forgotten a lot. But I remember Beverly's dad being an abuser, hitting her, and not a molester (until maybe at the end, when It took him over??). Did they change that?

Also, in that scene upstairs in the haunted house, when Eddie breaks his arm, I thought the make-up was shockingly bad. The kid is clearly wearing a vest with a fake arm. It seemed bizarre in a movie with such good effects otherwise. Was there a point to this?
Ignatz Mouse
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(09-14-2017, 01:25 AM)
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I eagerly await the Ritchie one liner YouTube supercut.

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