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FIFA warns Mexico over fans' anti-gay chant at Confederations Cup

C

cartographer

Member
FIFA doesn't want to come down too hard because 1) they ultimately don't care all that much and 2) the Mexican fanbase is enormous, dedicated and makes FIFA a lot of money.

FIFA will choose slaps on the wrist and empty gestures over real solutions 99 times out of 100. They could curb it if they wanted to by forcing games to be played in empty stadiums, but it would likely need to be a string of games and that would risk antagonizing one of their biggest money makers.

Tl;Dr - everything about this is cynical and terrible
 
R

Regulus Tera

Romanes Eunt Domus
chicken_pasta said:
Not really. Mamón is, again, an insult rooted in homophobia. Mamón means cocksucker, and it's directed at men. Wonder why.
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It comes from the verb mamar, which is quite literally the act of a baby partaking in breastfeeding. And no mames as an interjection is pretty gender neutral.
 
J

Joeytj

Banned
PSqueak said:
Ah yes, all bad hombres right?

Tho i guess you assume some are good people?
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I'm Mexican, and I agree that too many of us want to stick our heads in the sand on this issue.

Even if it wasn't a homophobic slur, it's still not good sportsmanship, honestly. A couple of fans shouting slurs or boos is expected, but an entire stadium shouting it against a member of the opposing theme is not a good look.
 
R

Regulus Tera

Romanes Eunt Domus
We wouldn't have this problem if Atlas fans didn't start it back in the day. Atlas has, once again, done nothing for Mexican football.
Joeytj said:
Even if it wasn't a homophobic slur, it's still not good sportsmanship, honestly. A couple of fans shouting slurs or boos is expected, but an entire stadium shouting it against a member of the opposing theme is not a good look.
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Honestly don't see why this is even seen as bad sportsmanship. Putting pressure on rivals is widely accepted as part of the reason home advantage is a thing in sports. I will agree there's a line that was crossed, but the act of focusing on a player (who are supposed to be able to ignore outside heckling) is hardly outrageous.
 
S

Sr Kitsune

Member
Ehhh as a Mexican "puto" can be used to mean different things, in the stadium it leans more to asshole or weak.

Would be better if they didn't use it.

FECDSFX.jpg
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"Yell "putin", and everybody will be happy, FIFA, fans, and the russian president."


Also, trying to convince Mexicans that they're using "puto" in an homophobic way (if that was the case) will be as hard as to convince Mexicans that our country is, in fact, heavily racist and classist.
 
V

Verano

Reads Ace as Lace. May God have mercy on their soul
DominoKid said:
FIFA aint gonna do shit to Mexico this is just a PR grab.
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Pretty much this...sonehow they get offended when fellow mexicans chant pvto which could be a gay slur to some however they host WC tournament in Russia 2018 LGBTQ people are abused, harassed, and possibly end up dead as well as prevalent racism and xenophobia. So before calling out Mexico's fanbase on a word that could be offensive in how you say it, FIFA needs to take a really good look on the countries that are hosting world cups from now til 2022.
 
R

Regulus Tera

Romanes Eunt Domus
DominoKid said:
FIFA aint gonna do shit to Mexico this is just a PR grab.
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Reminder there's a match on Saturday versus Russia where both teams will likely be pressured to win in order to reach the semifinals.

I am not saying there's a fix or anything, but don't be surprised if FIFA uses this controversy to dock away points from Mexico. 👀
 
Z

Zasa

Member
PSqueak said:
It's another case of "that's what it used to mean, but nobody uses it like that anymore".

It's used as "Liar" or "jerk".

In mexico If you say "Ese tipo es un mamon" , absolutely nobody will think you are saying "that guy sucks cocks" instead everyone will understand you're saying "That guy is a jerk".

Also if you just yell "Que mamon!", it's the equivalent of yelling "You gotta be shitting me!".

Do note, the word is considered a cuss, so people will frown upon the usage in most contexts.

The usage of the word Mamon, however, does come from telling people "no mames" as a stand in for "cut that shit out", but it literally means "Stop sucking [cock]", which is still pretty homophobic and rude to say. The alternative to that is "No manches" which is used in the same way but literally means "stop smearring".
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Yup, & in Chile it's pretty much exclusively used as 'mommy's boy', it really just depends on the region. You seee it thrown around in national TV all the time.
 
K

King Tubby

Member
TIL puto was a homophobic slur. The slur I usually hear against gay people is maricon, but maybe it's just dialectic differences.
 
I

Iva Demilcol

Member
Sr Kitsune said:
Ehhh as a Mexican "puto" can be used to mean different things, in the stadium it leans more to asshole or weak.

Would be better if they didn't use it.


"Yell "putin", and everybody will be happy, FIFA, fans, and the russian president."
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This made me lol in real life.

"Instead of 'Puto' yell 'Putin' (basically the same insult) and everyone will be happy: FIFA, the fans and even the Russian president!"


Come on guys, stop acting as if you didn't know better: Puto is an anti-gay slur, it can mean "coward", "jackass", "asshole" because Gay people are cowards, jackasses and assholes. Then, because we didn't stop junior high school kids from saying that 20 years ago it's a common word that "has several meanings" today. Many of us were called "puto" while we grew up because we weren't manly enough. Stop pretending it's all okay now.
 
S

SomedayTheFire

Member
Man, fuck everyone who chants this.

Also y'all know gay and faggot are used as synonyms for "coward", "assholes", whatever else derogatory someone can think of in English too? Eh?
 
I

Iva Demilcol

Member
AcademicSaucer said:
Isnt really a slur, many romance languages have the word , its of Latin origin and it somehow comes from puera/puer/pueri IIRC.

Its use has changed but in the Royal Spanish Academy dictionary it still means male prostitute.
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I'm not arguing about the origin of the word but how it's used in Mexico. Words that aren't offensive in other countries like "pendejo", "pinche" or "puñal" have other "uses" and you know it.

azyless said:
I don't get it. Is putin a real word in spanish ?
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More like "putín", but the people who like to shout "puto" at soccer matches don't really care about grammar either.
 
C

chicko1983

Member
this is not the first time Mexico have been warned over this - same thing happened at the 2014 world cup (I even went to a couple of mexico games and heard it).

They should be kicked out of FIFA competitions unless they stop.

Grow up Mexican fans.
 
E

Eila

Member
chicko1983 said:
this is not the first time Mexico have been warned over this - same thing happened at the 2014 world cup (I even went to a couple of mexico games and heard it).

They should be kicked out of FIFA competitions unless they stop.

Grow up Mexican fans.
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Haha if only you knew how bad things really are. Shouting puto to the keeper, using laser on players and throwing beer during corner kicks is smalltime compared to the shit that happens on pitches all over the world.
 
F

Fercho

Member
i wonder how many Mexicans (living in Mexico) posted in this thread.

A couple of points:

  • "Puto" nowadays is most commonly used as a slang word for "coward". Nevertheless it was used before as an insult towards male gay people.
  • Mexico it is (sadly) an homophobic country still , like a lot of places out there (like the USA?) nevertheless in big cities like CDMX , Guadalajara etc this is slowly changing and the climate is a lot more tolerant than years before.
  • I can't remember a derogatory/racist word in the Mexican dictionary (or in the Spanish lenguaje altogether) with the same pain, meanness and misery than behind some racist terms in the English lenguaje Specially in the USA.
  • Here, we don't throw bananas nor make monkey noises like some pitches in Europe.

so some of you should take a little Cross cultural training and chill with some of your opinions, specially for some post on the first page of this thread.


Having said that:

I hope that FIFA sanctions the Mexican team.

I'm embarrassed by this behavior. Especially on the Trump era, which put us under the spotlight of some issues that a more racially/discriminatory charged than the image they want to give officially to the public (Immigration). Bros please.

Normally , if you have money to afford a trip to fucking Russia it means that those guys are upper/middle class, they should know better, i guess that idiots will be idiots, no matter your social status.
 
A

azyless

Member
Fercho said:
"Puto" nowadays is most commonly used as a slang word for "coward". Nevertheless it was used before as an insult towards male gay people.
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Yeah I'll trust the opinion and experience of the gay people in here that have shared their views after being called "puto" for no reason other than being gay.
It's not just a different meaning, it's used for coward because gay people are seen as cowards.
Same way in English people will say "this is gay" for the most random things they see as negative. Same way if you go to France and you hear "pédé" or "tapette" they don't just mean you're a coward or weak, they mean "you're a coward like these gays" or "you're weak because you're probably gay". And I imagine that goes on in plenty of other countries.
 
M

Mindlog

Member
Some have asked what could be actually be done.
This would mostly be an empty gesture since they travel so well throughout the Americas, but take home games away from the Mexican National team if you are really serious about trying to change things.
King Tubby said:
TIL puto was a homophobic slur. The slur I usually hear against gay people is maricon, but maybe it's just dialectic differences.
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Spanish is chock full of that.
Quite similar to the Aussie/English word for 'buddy' being horrifically offensive in that states just much more widespread.

Somewhat related: Anyone remember when Xuxa had to change her name? I feel like that was a thing, but the internet is scant on the details.
 
S

Skellig Gra

Member
azyless said:
Yeah I'll trust the opinion and experience of the gay people in here that have shared their views after being called "puto" for no reason other than being gay.
It's not just a different meaning, it's used for coward because gay people are seen as cowards.
Same way in English people will say "this is gay" for the most random things they see as negative. Same way if you go to France and you hear "pédé" or "tapette" they don't just mean you're a coward or weak, they mean "you're a coward like these gays" or "you're weak because you're probably gay". And I imagine that goes on in plenty of other countries.
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Exactly. When I first heard the chant many years ago I sent a text to my best friend who is from Mexico and asked him what it meant without any context. His response was "it means fag". If you are using a word that a significant portion of the population knows is a gay slur AND it is used as an attack on someone then you've fucked up. Doesn't get any simpler than that.
 
F

Fercho

Member
azyless said:
Yeah I'll trust the opinion and experience of the gay people in here that have shared their views after being called "puto" for no reason other than being gay.
It's not just a different meaning, it's used for coward because gay people are seen as cowards.
Same way in English people will say "this is gay" for the most random things they see as negative. Same way if you go to France and you hear "pédé" or "tapette" they don't just mean you're a coward or weak, they mean "you're a coward like these gays" or "you're weak because you're probably gay". And I imagine that goes on in plenty of other countries.
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Yeah, nevertheless as i said, the word is slowly changing his meaning (and currently, has a lot of meanings) than an insult towards gay people, it is not as straightforward and simple as "that's so gay" which does not leave any room for doubts.

Nevertheless i do agree that half of these assholes make the chant as a derogatory word towards gay people and the other half (i hope) are just people going with the flow.

Dai101 said:
giphy.gif


Disclaimer: I don't like futbol, or any sport for that matter.



Hola.
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I think i know you, are you in Guadalajara? LOL
 
F

FuuRe

Member
Sadly a common thing among all Latin American soccer fans, the Chilean federation was also fined a while ago for this
 
I

Iva Demilcol

Member
azyless said:
Yeah I'll trust the opinion and experience of the gay people in here that have shared their views after being called "puto" for no reason other than being gay.
It's not just a different meaning, it's used for coward because gay people are seen as cowards.
Same way in English people will say "this is gay" for the most random things they see as negative. Same way if you go to France and you hear "pédé" or "tapette" they don't just mean you're a coward or weak, they mean "you're a coward like these gays" or "you're weak because you're probably gay". And I imagine that goes on in plenty of other countries.
Click to expand...

Hollywood Duo said:
Exactly. When I first heard the chant many years ago I sent a text to my best friend who is from Mexico and asked him what it meant without any context. His response was "it means fag". If you are using a word that a significant portion of the population knows is a gay slur AND it is used as an attack on someone then you've fucked up. Doesn't get any simpler than that.
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You're both right. People defending the use of that word because it has other "meanings" fail to see that "puto" has all those (negative) meanings because all those traits are seen as normal if you're gay. And when you don't want to throw that word around because your parents would scold you for using that word you can always use "gay" and "puñal" as totally acceptable substitutes.
 
Y

YesThatGuy

Banned
I think is a lot more likely that the shout will be heard in more matches, even when Mexico isn't playing, if FIFA goes ahead with this. We're, regretably, that spiteful (and stubborn).

Can't wait to see the same applies to clubs and teams that make racist chants and noises! /s
 
E

Eila

Member
FuuRe said:
Sadly a common thing among all Latin American soccer fans, the Chilean federation was also fined a while ago for this
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Oh Chile is also warned, along with Russia.
The discriminatory chants that the referees were made aware of are:
Ehh puto
Chango
Negro hijo de puta

Don't think they had a problem in their matches, though.
 
I

Iva Demilcol

Member
Dai101 said:
Sabia que ese nick me era familiar (Iva Demilcol).

Que paso con ese cesspol? Despues de que cerro el foro ya no supe nada.
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I'm not sure exactly what happened to their website... i believe they have a webcast that 'paquitos' somehow support in their comments section. But the people in charge of said webcast are a bunch of idiots in general. They didn't reopen the forums as far as I know.

The community in the other hand went to other places or created their own communities, and they are as aggressive and racist and homophobic as ever. I've remained in touch with some atomix members through Facebook or Twitter occasionally but I lost contact with several great posters too :(
 
J

joseranulfo

Member
I had this debate with one of my friends here and he is also a "puto has many meanings" apologist,

I, as a closeted gay man living in the south of Mexico just told him that when gay people in general tell him that they are offended by that slur he better stop doing it because if he continues then he is knowingly offending them anyways, so that makes him homophobic by default, and if he wants to continue shouting slurs he is free to keep doing it but he has to realize that he is actually homophobic then and to face the consecuentes of it instead of making excuses and blaming gay people for being to sensitive or easily offended.

Now don't get me started on the gay fans that actually support the "puto" chant because they are soccer fans or because they managed to go trough hell being gay in Mexico society for years and carved their little place in it and are stronger for it and deserve all the respect I can give them but think that because they don't feel offended about being called puto anymore everyone should just get over it without thinking of all the people that didn't actually survive that hell and all the young people that we fight for so they don't need to go trough it... Just no.
 
D

Dai101

Banned
Iva Demilcol said:
I'm not sure exactly what happened to their website... i believe they have a webcast that 'paquitos' somehow support in their comments section. But the people in charge of said webcast are a bunch of idiots in general. They didn't reopen the forums as far as I know.

The community in the other hand went to other places or created their own communities, and they are as aggressive and racist and homophobic as ever. I've remained in touch with some atomix members through Facebook or Twitter occasionally but I lost contact with several great posters too :(
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O yeah. I remember those fuckers went and created their bullshoit site. It's a shame that i lost contact with the good posters tho'. Except Bunnyfriend, i still chat with him from time to time and on ocassion go hang around.

Good times, good times.
 
S

Syder

Member
Sounds like these Mexico fans have found a place accepting of their homophobic views.

2018 and 2022 World Cups are going to be a farce.
 
A

aBarreras

Member
Mindlog said:
Some have asked what could be actually be done.
This would mostly be an empty gesture since they travel so well throughout the Americas, but take home games away from the Mexican National team if you are really serious about trying to change things.

Spanish is chock full of that.
Quite similar to the Aussie/English word for 'buddy' being horrifically offensive in that states just much more widespread.

Somewhat related: Anyone remember when Xuxa had to change her name? I feel like that was a thing, but the internet is scant on the details.
Click to expand...

well i know that Xuxa, chucha means vagina sometimes
 
S

Syntsui

Member
This behaviour is so toxic that it contaminated brazilian fans too, there is not a single game between popular teams where they don't chant that shit.
 
L

LaNaranja

Member
Mufc1427 said:
Mexicans just don't fucking understand.
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NoRéN;241357956 said:
They just don't give a fuck. They are not stupid. They are ignorant and refuse to change.
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Is this a thing we can do now?

Regulus Tera said:
We wouldn't have this problem if Atlas fans didn't start it back in the day. Atlas has, once again, done nothing for Mexican football.
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What the fuck. I can maybe handle the people calling all Mexicans stupid and ignorant BUT I WILL NOT STAND FOR PEOPLE TALKING SHIT ON MY ZORROS!
 
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