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Ambitious
Member
(05-29-2012, 10:33 PM)
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Originally Posted by StateofMind

Ruby is an awesome language, and it is a joy to use. Magical really is a good word to describe it.

People smarter than I am have said that it comes at the cost of performance, though.


e: I also love Scala! I like the way it does parameters, although it does take getting used to.

Yes, this was mentioned in the book. Direct quote: "Application performance is secondary. Ruby is about the performance of the programmer."


Originally Posted by Aeris130

Here's how you do it with 1 line:

Code:

CollectionUtils.filter(myListWithNumbers, new HigherThanPredicate(10));
Turns [5,11,17,1] into [11,17].

Plus the lines for HigherThanPredicate.
Aeris130
Member
(05-29-2012, 10:41 PM)
Aeris130's Avatar

Originally Posted by Ambitious

Plus the lines for HigherThanPredicate.

Code:

return ((Integer) val).intValue() > 10;
?

SQL exception catching on the other hand...
Sqorgar
Banned
(05-29-2012, 10:45 PM)
Sqorgar's Avatar

Originally Posted by Ambitious

It's not just about the lines of code, it's about expressiveness. I always like Java, but after reading the aforementioned book, I almost hate it. So much code to support the task you wanna achieve instead of just doing the task.

Expressiveness is a red herring. Fewer lines of code means fewer bugs. Expressiveness is convenient, but it doesn't really save that much time when you become an expert in a language.

Java is an example of a language API which has classes that exist just to make other classes work. Take the io system with readers and writers. Rather than creating something that performs a behavior, you have to create things which allow something else to perform a behavior. The end result is that you end up with a lot of lines of code to do something really simple, to the point where you can literally end up with game stopping bugs just by trying to print something to System.out.
Misguided
Banned
(05-29-2012, 10:56 PM)
Thanks again to everybody that helped me out last night; I now have another basic beginner's problem with an overly simple solution I just can't figure out for the life of me :D.

So here's my code:

Code:

package
{
	import flash.display.*;
	import flash.events.*;
	import flash.ui.*;

	
	public class Main extends MovieClip
	{
        public var ball1:Ball;
		public var vx:int = 0;
		public var vy:int = 0;
		public function Main()
		{
			ball1 = new Ball();
			ball1.x = 350;
			ball1.y = 400;
            addChild(ball1);
			addEventListener(MouseEvent.MOUSE_DOWN, onMouseDownHandler);
			addEventListener(MouseEvent.MOUSE_UP, onMouseUpHandler);
			addEventListener(KeyboardEvent.KEY_DOWN, onKeyDownHandler);
			addEventListener(KeyboardEvent.KEY_UP, onKeyUpHandler);
			addEventListener(Event.ENTER_FRAME, onEnterFrameHandler);
		}
		public function onMouseDownHandler(event:MouseEvent):void
		{
			ball1.startDrag();
		}
		public function onMouseUpHandler(event:MouseEvent):void
		{
			ball1.stopDrag();
			ball1.alpha = Math.random();
		}
		public function onKeyDownHandler(event:KeyboardEvent):void
		{
			if (event.keyCode == Keyboard.DOWN) 
			{
				ball1.y - 3;
			}
			if (event.keyCode == Keyboard.UP)
			{
				ball1.y + 3;
			}
			if (event.keyCode == Keyboard.LEFT)
			{
				ball1.x - 3;
			}
			if (event.keyCode == Keyboard.RIGHT)
			{
				ball1.x + 3;
			}
		}
		public function onKeyUpHandler(event:KeyboardEvent):void
		{
			if (event.keyCode == Keyboard.LEFT || event.keyCode == Keyboard.RIGHT)
			{
				vx = 0;
			}
			else if (event.keyCode == Keyboard.UP || event.keyCode == Keyboard.DOWN)
			{
				vy = 0;
			}
		}
		public function onEnterFrameHandler(event:Event):void
		{
			ball1.x += vx;
			ball1.y += vy;
		}

	}
}
The only things that work when I export the SWF are my start and stop drag methods and the Math.random() which randomly changes the alpha property of my ball. I can't get any of my Keyboard events to move the ball in anyway, even though the syntax is fine and I receive no compiler errors. Help? Thanks.
Ixian
Member
(05-29-2012, 11:21 PM)
I'm not really familiar with ActionScript, but in your onKeyDownHandler shouldn't you be doing ball1.x/y += or -= instead of the statements you're currently doing?
Haly
One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
(05-29-2012, 11:26 PM)
Haly's Avatar
Try adding the keyboard event listeners to the stage.
Mondriaan
Member
(05-29-2012, 11:32 PM)

Originally Posted by nekura

I'm not really familiar with ActionScript, but in your onKeyDownHandler shouldn't you be doing ball1.x/y += or -= instead of the statements you're currently doing?

The onEnterFrameHandler is already doing that, so it's a matter of doing something with vx and vy in onKeyDownHandler. There is already code that resets vx and vy when the key is released, which kind of makes me think that this is a homework question.
Ixian
Member
(05-29-2012, 11:34 PM)

Originally Posted by Mondriaan

The onEnterFrameHandler is already doing that, so it's a matter of doing something with vx and vy in onKeyDownHandler. There is already code that resets vx and vy when the key is released, which kind of makes me think that this is a homework question.

Edit: Nevermind, I guess what your first line answered the question I posed when I first wrote this post (which was where are vx and vy being set to anything besides 0).
Ihateyouchris
Member
(05-29-2012, 11:36 PM)
Ihateyouchris's Avatar

Originally Posted by SuicideUZI

Does anyone know a good place for a beginner to start with Objective-C with a focus on creating iOS apps?

I really liked the Stanford iPhone application development classes on iTunes U. They're free and you can check them out here.
Misguided
Banned
(05-29-2012, 11:37 PM)

Originally Posted by nekura

I'm not really familiar with ActionScript, but in your onKeyDownHandler shouldn't you be doing ball1.x/y += or -= instead of the statements you're currently doing?

Well what's happening here is the onKeyDownHandler moves the ball 3 pixels in whatever direction I pick, and then the onEnterFrameHandler uses vx and vy, which were previously assigned values of 0, is stopping the ball from constantly moving.

Originally Posted by Haly

Try adding the keyboard event listeners to the stage.

Tried this, and it doesn't seem to work.

Originally Posted by Mondriaan

The onEnterFrameHandler is already doing that, so it's a matter of doing something with vx and vy in onKeyDownHandler. There is already code that resets vx and vy when the key is released, which kind of makes me think that this is a homework question.

Homework question? What do you mean? (it's summer lol)

I simply can't get the ball moving! Thanks again for the suggestions.
Nevasleep
Member
(05-29-2012, 11:38 PM)
Nevasleep's Avatar
I actually love PHP, its fun......so far.
Functions like String to time, and how easy it is to load a text file into an array, then into a combobox.

Really need to learn some html and css though. Far too used to .net and java.
Fersis
It is illegal to Tag Fish in Tag Fishing Sanctuaries by law 38.36 of the GAF Wildlife Act
(05-29-2012, 11:39 PM)
Fersis's Avatar
Im no longer a coder!!! WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!
* Runs naked *
Ixian
Member
(05-29-2012, 11:43 PM)

Originally Posted by Misguided

Well what's happening here is the onKeyDownHandler moves the ball 3 pixels in whatever direction I pick, and then the onEnterFrameHandler uses vx and vy, which were previously assigned values of 0, is stopping the ball from constantly moving.

You're not actually modifying the x and y members of your ball, though. Your statements are basically:

Code:

			if (event.keyCode == Keyboard.DOWN) 
			{
                                 //ball1.y - 3;
                                397;
			}
			if (event.keyCode == Keyboard.UP)
			{
				//ball1.y + 3;
                                403;
			}
			if (event.keyCode == Keyboard.LEFT)
			{
				//ball1.x - 3;
                                347;
			}
			if (event.keyCode == Keyboard.RIGHT)
			{
				//ball1.x + 3;
                                353;
			}
Neat Machine
Member
(05-29-2012, 11:44 PM)
Neat Machine's Avatar

Originally Posted by Sqorgar

Expressiveness is a red herring. Fewer lines of code means fewer bugs. Expressiveness is convenient, but it doesn't really save that much time when you become an expert in a language.

I don't really want to argue with you since I'm sure you are much more knowledgeable than I am, but are you sure that expressiveness isn't an important quality for a language to have?

I suppose it becomes less important to an "expert" in that given language, but how many people are truly experts of any language, much less all of them? Something like Brainf*ck comes to mind as an extreme example, but even in a more realistic sense- is it practical to expect programmers to be experts? A language like Ruby seems like it would provide a genuine advantage for certain types of projects. While it may make more sense for larger, more complicated applications to be written in a more efficient language- surely it might sometimes make more sense to approach certain projects with the goal of getting it done quickly and with clarity (which I imagine would improve quality, since everyone is more aware of what's going on).
Tomat
Wanna hear a good joke? Waste your time helping me! LOL!
(05-29-2012, 11:45 PM)
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So at what point in studying programming do I become a master video game developer?
Haly
One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
(05-29-2012, 11:46 PM)
Haly's Avatar
EDIT: nekura answered, can't believe I missed that.
Misguided
Banned
(05-29-2012, 11:52 PM)

Originally Posted by nekura

You're not actually modifying the x and y members of your ball, though. Your statements are basically:

Code:

			if (event.keyCode == Keyboard.DOWN) 
			{
                                 //ball1.y - 3;
                                397;
			}
			if (event.keyCode == Keyboard.UP)
			{
				//ball1.y + 3;
                                403;
			}
			if (event.keyCode == Keyboard.LEFT)
			{
				//ball1.x - 3;
                                347;
			}
			if (event.keyCode == Keyboard.RIGHT)
			{
				//ball1.x + 3;
                                353;
			}

Thanks for the input! I ended up completely removing both my keyUpHandlers and my enterFrameHandlers, and now the ball moves and drags fine. No problems with this, right? I feel like I may be practicing some sort of bad practice...
Neat Machine
Member
(05-29-2012, 11:53 PM)
Neat Machine's Avatar

Originally Posted by Tomat

So at what point in studying programming do I become a master video game developer?

When you start to develop an RPG in your first object-oriented language, and then give up when you get done setting up the basic classes/structures.
Zeouterlimits
Member
(05-30-2012, 01:08 AM)
Zeouterlimits's Avatar

Originally Posted by Tashi0106

http://www.amazon.com/Learning-XNA-4...8239863&sr=8-1

Anyone have this XNA 4.0 book? I have the 3.0 one and it's good but I think I need to upgrade because of some of the things that have changed. Right now looking to do 2D stuff.

I do Tashi, funnily enough.
It's good, but I haven't ever had 3.0, so I can't really compare...
hodgy100
Member
(05-30-2012, 01:12 AM)
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Originally Posted by StateofMind

When you start to develop an RPG in your first object-oriented language, and then give up when you get done setting up the basic classes/structures.

Funny that. I made a 3d RPG for my game development module at university.

We programmed it in C++ with DirectX 9 and my god was it a massive task.

this is the prototype we ended up with: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/40547891/Hero%27s%20Quest.zip

Don't be surprised if it doesn't work on your pc though. its fairly glitchy, and we forced 4x AA and 16x AF to keep the IQ up.

It's also the worst code I've produced. Due to time constraints everything was really rushed.
Miutsu
Member
(05-30-2012, 01:19 AM)
Miutsu's Avatar

Originally Posted by Fersis

Im no longer a coder!!! WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!
* Runs naked *

What are you now?
Mondriaan
Member
(05-30-2012, 01:19 AM)

Originally Posted by Misguided

Thanks for the input! I ended up completely removing both my keyUpHandlers and my enterFrameHandlers, and now the ball moves and drags fine. No problems with this, right? I feel like I may be practicing some sort of bad practice...

Directly modifying your position will cause movement to depend on how frequently the system is calling your key handler. Maybe this frequency is locked to some arbitrary value or you can set it. I have no idea about flash, but I would guess that flash sets an upper limit to that sort of thing, so that aspect is probably not a big deal.

The other thing about movement is that if this is for a game, characters often accelerate (up to some maximum velocity) and decelerate instead of being stop and go.

If you have some sort of idle processing (enterFrameHandler I suppose), you would change the position by the velocity multiplied by the delta time between frames.
Haly
One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
(05-30-2012, 01:34 AM)
Haly's Avatar
Updating using delta time is usually not necessary in Flash applications because framerate is fixed.
Sqorgar
Banned
(05-30-2012, 01:48 AM)
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Originally Posted by StateofMind

I don't really want to argue with you since I'm sure you are much more knowledgeable than I am, but are you sure that expressiveness isn't an important quality for a language to have?

I'd say its convenient. Under the hood, most imperative programming languages are largely the same. If you wanted to write a game in Python, at the top most level, it will be structured identically to a game you would write in C or Ruby or something else. The expressiveness will decide whether you can do that task more easily, with fewer bugs. But it isn't a deal breaker.

Much more important, in my opinion, are the language libraries and portability. For instance, I wouldn't write a game in Perl. I could. But I wouldn't. I really like Objective-C and its libraries over Java and its libraries, but when it comes down to it, I can't write Objective-C programs that work on Macs, Windows, and Linus. It's easier to find help writing your Python game in the Python community than it would be to find support writing an Ada application. And of course, there's whatever you need to write in - like if you want to get into the game industry, you'll want to practice your C and C++ even though it might be more fun to write Python. No matter what language you prefer, you'll be using JavaScript for client-side web apps and Objective-C for iOS apps.

At the end of the day, expressiveness isn't about what you can do but more about how easily it is to do something. It makes some languages better suited to some problems and not others, but at the end of the day, you can pretty much solve most problems with most languages. So, don't get upset if you get stuck needing sets in JavaScript.

A language like Ruby seems like it would provide a genuine advantage for certain types of projects.

It is an advantage, but it's not a deal breaker. You can certainly solve those same problems in other languages. But Ruby has Rails, which has been far more of an advantage to its growth than any language feature. Again, it's not what the language can do, but the libraries, community, and necessity.
Mondriaan
Member
(05-30-2012, 01:56 AM)

Originally Posted by Haly

Updating using delta time is usually not necessary in Flash applications because framerate is fixed.

True, but that's for linear movement. Depending on the movement you're implementing, it might be better not to bake in the delta time.
Haly
One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
(05-30-2012, 03:29 AM)
Haly's Avatar
Although linking your game to system time rather than frame time does have some advantages. For example you can make your Flash app run at 60 fps just by inputting 60 fps in the doc properties, and your game will immediately get smoother, rather than having to recalculate all the "speeds" of objects in your games.

Also it helps combat lag, which can be common with Flash.

Unrelated note, I bought Game Engine Architecture and it is exactly what I've been looking for.
Fersis
It is illegal to Tag Fish in Tag Fishing Sanctuaries by law 38.36 of the GAF Wildlife Act
(05-30-2012, 03:30 AM)
Fersis's Avatar

Originally Posted by Miutsu

What are you now?

Game Designer

Gonna keep coding prototypes and stuff like that though.
injurai
Banned
(05-30-2012, 03:31 AM)

Originally Posted by Haly

Although linking your game to system time rather than frame time does have some advantages. For example you can make your Flash app run at 60 fps just by inputting 60 fps in the doc properties, and your game will immediately get smoother, rather than having to recalculate all the "speeds" of objects in your games.

Also it helps combat lag, which can be common with Flash.

Unrelated note, I bought Game Engine Architecture and it is exactly what I've been looking for.

Isn't this how you can get minecraft to run at super speeds by changing the date and time?
Haly
One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
(05-30-2012, 03:33 AM)
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I've never played Minecraft so I don't know if you mean running Minecraft at increased speeds (moving faster, jumping faster etc) or "time traveling" like resetting the internal clock in Animal Crossing to relive Christmas week.
injurai
Banned
(05-30-2012, 05:39 AM)
By setting your system time in the future after you have launches the game. The game begins to run at what seems to be a faster clock speed. The game plays like it is on fastward or something. I presume it has something to do with it being rendered off the CPU clock or something.
Legato.Reborn-
Member
(05-30-2012, 06:05 AM)
Legato.Reborn-'s Avatar

Originally Posted by Fersis

Game Designer

Gonna keep coding prototypes and stuff like that though.

For who? (congrats!)
soultron
Banned
(05-30-2012, 06:11 AM)
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I've been using Code Academy to learn some JS in my spare time and it's hilarious. The game-y aspects to it (achievements and the like) are pretty neat though.

If only they enforced proper programming practises and better explained things for people new to programming. I feel it's a great resource if you're already familiar with OOP otherwise. I just worry for people who're only getting half the story; just because they can get the code to work doesn't mean they're really understanding things.

Still, whatever gets people into programming, I'm all for it. I've gotten some of my non-programmer friends into it and one even picked up a proper JS book. c:
An-Det
Member
(05-30-2012, 06:18 AM)
Nice to see a general thread for programming pop up. I never paid much attention to the C++ one, but I've enjoyed the stuff in the programming rant thread.

I've been thinking of trying to pick up a new language over the summer. I could pick from one of a few and be fine, but mostly I just want to try something different to really get me thinking, just doing something. Some great resources so far for a few of the options.
Somnid
Member
(05-30-2012, 06:27 AM)
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Originally Posted by soultron

I've been using Code Academy to learn some JS in my spare time and it's hilarious. The game-y aspects to it (achievements and the like) are pretty neat though.

If only they enforced proper programming practises and better explained things for people new to programming. I feel it's a great resource if you're already familiar with OOP otherwise. I just worry for people who're only getting half the story; just because they can get the code to work doesn't mean they're really understanding things.

Still, whatever gets people into programming, I'm all for it. I've gotten some of my non-programmer friends into it and one even picked up a proper JS book. c:

I'd have to see what they teach but for anyone that uses javascript extensively you don't actually try to go down the OO path with it, it's just not its strength. People who do are often mistakenly caught up in this aspect because of previous OO experience and wind up shoehorning OO principals into a language that is a lot more functional than it is object oriented. If you really want that you'd probably use coffeescript or something.
amrihua
Member
(05-30-2012, 06:47 AM)
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Originally Posted by KorrZ

If you wanted to learn C, I don't know why you wouldn't just learn C++ first. You learn a lot of C from C++ and it's basically learning 2 languages for the price of one.

Nope. Unfortunately this isn't the case. Avoid C++.

Originally Posted by CrudeDiatribe

Functional or merely procedural / structured with functions?

Functional.

Learning functional programming by learning a purely functional language teaches you good practices that you can carry on to high performance computing that is usually done in C and Fortran.

Intel MIC development is in C and Fortran, no C++ nor anything OOP

I hope I can't be traced to who I'm really are IRL I just violated an NDA I think
youta
Member
(05-30-2012, 06:50 AM)
youta's Avatar
Just for fun, in Python:

Code:

[i for i in [5,11,17,1] if i > 10]
It's not as compact, but I like how is just reads in plain English.

Currently writing a web-based CMS with a Python back-end (and no, the world does not need another CMS, but it's a custom-made thing).
Spoo
Member
(05-30-2012, 06:56 AM)
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Originally Posted by amrihua

Nope. Unfortunately this isn't the case. Avoid C++.

This is the case. People who think they "know" C after having done C++ have not actually sat down to write anything in C that isn't trivial. It's not a package deal.

edit: I disagree with the sentiment of "avoiding" C++ -- I just don't feel that it's ever a "Learn C++: Be effective with C!" scenario.
gblues
Banned
(05-30-2012, 07:01 AM)
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I'm working on trying to get an actual working custom kernel working for my phone, and I'm trying to un-fuck the touchscreen driver. Found this little gem:

Code:

void print_msg(void)
{
        printk("[TSP] msg = ");
        if ((quantum_msg[1] & 0x80) == 0x80 )
                printk("1");
        else
                printk("0");
        if ((quantum_msg[1] & 0x40) == 0x40 )
                printk("1");
        else
                printk("0");
        if ((quantum_msg[1] & 0x20) == 0x20 )
                printk("1");    
        else
                printk("0");    
        if ((quantum_msg[1] & 0x10) == 0x10 )
                printk("1");    
        else
                printk("0");    

// ... it goes on for the remaining bits ...
}
Refactored version:

Code:

void print_msg(void)
{
        int i;
        printk("[TSP] msg = ");

        for(i = 0x80; i > 0; i >>= 1)
        {
                if(quantum_msg[1] & i)
                        printk("1");
                else
                        printk("0");
        }
        printk("\n");
}
Sqorgar
Banned
(05-30-2012, 07:10 AM)
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Originally Posted by Spoo

edit: I disagree with the sentiment of "avoiding" C++ -- I just don't feel that it's ever a "Learn C++: Be effective with C!" scenario.

C++ makes you a worse programmer. I'd recommend new programmers to stay the hell away from C++ until they're more experienced.
Ydahs
Member
(05-30-2012, 07:46 AM)
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Wonder how many have used Mercury?

For those who are interested in functional languages such as Haskell, it's worth checking out.
ghostofsparta
Member
(05-30-2012, 07:51 AM)
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Originally Posted by Sqorgar

C++ makes you a worse programmer. I'd recommend new programmers to stay the hell away from C++ until they're more experienced.

I agree. I am new to programming, but going from Java to c++ had been bad. There's a lot of 'don't do it unless you really know what you're doing and even then you probably shouldn't do it' in c++. But like I said I am still a noob so maybe I will grown to like it.
opticalmace
Member
(05-30-2012, 07:55 AM)
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Any IDL users here? :P
jvalioli
Member
(05-30-2012, 08:21 AM)
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Originally Posted by Spoo

This is the case. People who think they "know" C after having done C++ have not actually sat down to write anything in C that isn't trivial. It's not a package deal.

edit: I disagree with the sentiment of "avoiding" C++ -- I just don't feel that it's ever a "Learn C++: Be effective with C!" scenario.

This. Nothing wrong with learning C++ first.

Hell, I never learned C++ formally and even I don't think you should avoid C++.
Slavik81
Member
(05-30-2012, 08:24 AM)
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Originally Posted by Sqorgar

C++ makes you a worse programmer. I'd recommend new programmers to stay the hell away from C++ until they're more experienced.

What do you mean? I can understand disliking C++. As someone who has used it extensively for the past few years, I have my own personal grudges against it. But, I don't see how it would make someone a worse programmer.

Oh, do you mean specifically in regards to C?
Haly
One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
(05-30-2012, 08:24 AM)
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I'm also curious about the people suggesting functional languages before C++. If a novice programmer's career goals are to work in the game industry, wouldn't it be in their best interest to start out with C++ or a C++ like language?
Misguided
Banned
(05-30-2012, 08:51 AM)

Originally Posted by Haly

I'm also curious about the people suggesting functional languages before C++. If a novice programmer's career goals are to work in the game industry, wouldn't it be in their best interest to start out with C++ or a C++ like language?

It's sort of a messy language for a beginner and they might have a hard time getting their head around the fundamentals of programming with a syntax like that.

Btw

"1120: Access of undefined property stage."

How is that even a thing? Fuck AS3

I feel like the language combined with the Flash Pro interface is confusing and weird for no good reason; or maybe I'm just stupid. Probably the latter. :/
Linkhero1
Member
(05-30-2012, 08:52 AM)
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Originally Posted by Linkhero1

Subscribed and bookmarked.

I need good sources for learning Java. I'm taking it next semester and never dabbed too much into it. I've tried reading a book and I can't get into the book, so I think some good, descriptive online sources would better suit me.

Anyone?
Nevasleep
Member
(05-30-2012, 08:59 AM)
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Originally Posted by Linkhero1

Anyone?

Check out YouTube. I was skeptical, but it's pretty good for seeing code in action, and quicker than reading.
Best to have an IDE open too so you can try it as your watching, then afterwards tinker with it, change the code.
Also find online/written materials for what you watched, as they'll be more detailed.
Linkhero1
Member
(05-30-2012, 09:31 AM)
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Originally Posted by Nevasleep

Check out YouTube. I was skeptical, but it's pretty good for seeing code in action, and quicker than reading.
Best to have an IDE open too so you can try it as your watching, then afterwards tinker with it, change the code.
Also find online/written materials for what you watched, as they'll be more detailed.

Did you find this way more helpful when it came to learning java? I watched some videos earlier this year, but I wasn't able to remember anything from them.
Haly
One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
(05-30-2012, 10:24 AM)
Haly's Avatar

Originally Posted by Misguided

It's sort of a messy language for a beginner and they might have a hard time getting their head around the fundamentals of programming with a syntax like that.

Btw

"1120: Access of undefined property stage."

How is that even a thing? Fuck AS3

I feel like the language combined with the Flash Pro interface is confusing and weird for no good reason; or maybe I'm just stupid. Probably the latter. :/

Only the document class gets direct access to the stage supervariable I believe.

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