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PS3 Firmware 4.10 - WEB BROWSER IMPROVEMENTS JEFF_RIGBY REDEEMED

Kapow

Member
Sorry for the bump, but is anyone having problems since this upgrade?

Sites that worked fine before don't work as well. And now when i try to type something in, the keyboard locks up and i have to reset the console.

And just now i lost all my bookmarks. I had over 100!!!

Yea it's frozen for me just about everytime i've used it. I've had javascript on all the time, don't know if it makes a difference.
 

patsu

Member
Sorry for the bump, but is anyone having problems since this upgrade?

Sites that worked fine before don't work as well. And now when i try to type something in, the keyboard locks up and i have to reset the console.

And just now i lost all my bookmarks. I had over 100!!!

What site is that ?

The new browser works great for me. I played through my entire YouTube playlist using the PC YouTube page (instead of the TV page).
 

samdavis

Neo Member
Sorry for the bump, but is anyone having problems since this upgrade?

Sites that worked fine before don't work as well. And now when i try to type something in, the keyboard locks up and i have to reset the console.

And just now i lost all my bookmarks. I had over 100!!!

Yeah, my PS3 restarted to complete the update and then never booted up again. Black screen all day. "Holla!" is the normal reaction in this situation, I believe.
 

Sipowicz

Banned
didn't know where to ask this so apologies if this is the wrong place

does anyone know if there's a way to get TVCatchup working on the PS3?
 

C.Dark.DN

Banned
Is netflix messed up from this? I have to delete and re-install each time I want to use it. I deleted the data under game data too.
 

Emwitus

Member
Okay, who is having problems with buffering video? The video buffer for streaming videos is now snail speed. the crap!!!
 

alr1ght

bish gets all the credit :)
Why are all of my friends with a Vita relegated to the bottom of my offline list with no last online date?
 
No problems here! I would like to join the Jeff_Rigby fan club!

believe.jpg
 

Utako

Banned
Is everyone in here joking? This update and Jeff's claims are worlds apart, aside from a better web browser, which is only scratching the surface of Jeff's insanity.

Seriously. I hope this is lulz or I SMH at the meager tech comprehension on display.
 

Utako

Banned
It doesn't even support inline SVG, which is The crux of Rigby's argument - that Sony would be using SVG for everything. Kind of difficult when your SVG support is worse than IE9's.

The Xperia Play's browser is better than this, leagues better.
 

Utako

Banned
Now update the Vita browser please!
I am pretty certain that the PS3 was updated to match the Vita browser.

BTW, the version of Webkit they run is over 2 years old, and for some reason has fewer web features than the version of Chrome (a Webkit browser) at that time.
 

androvsky

Member
Is everyone in here joking? This update and Jeff's claims are worlds apart, aside from a better web browser, which is only scratching the surface of Jeff's insanity.

Seriously. I hope this is lulz or I SMH at the meager tech comprehension on display.

I just go with it. People were giving him a lot of crap over the browser before this update, even though that's not really what he was talking about. Genuine technical discussions are a dicey proposition on any forum, so it's not too surprising it got derailed and widely misunderstood.
 
It doesn't even support inline SVG, which is The crux of Rigby's argument - that Sony would be using SVG for everything. Kind of difficult when your SVG support is worse than IE9's.

The Xperia Play's browser is better than this, leagues better.
Sony on the PS3 and Vita is using OpenVG (SVG) for almost everything (Pixman is being used too), Flash 9 support is using OpenVG (SVG) for rendering.

The Vita and PS3 browser backends are a modified version of GTKwebkit2 version 1.7 (Jan 2012) and the Webkit2 APIs for SVG and many other features are not done.

Yes the Xperia browser on Android does have more features and it was rewritten by Sony-Erricson to support WebGL, Androids browser did not support WebGL and was not in strict compliance with webkit.

I've explained my guess as to why Sony went with GTKwebkit2 as the basis for the browser in the Vita and PS3....it's because they can manipulate Gstreamer VIDEO with Cairo (Augmented Reality coming Sept 2012) and it's a standard across multiple platforms including their TVs and Blu-ray players. This is why Cairo was disclosed at the same time as the browser Feb 2011 but it appears as though they are not using Cairo YET for the browser.

Again, I've stated this is not a finished browser on the PS3 or Vita; SVG, HTML5 <video> and WebGL are coming. From message 438

The current implementation of the PS3 browser is not OpenGL accelerated! ; CairoGL is not being used. Cairo-Pixman as in the combined library to support webkit is OpenGL accelerated, Pixman listed by it'self is apparently not accelerated and is using PPU code only.

If Sony's PS3 disclosures are accurate, Sony is using the AVM+ Open Source (they can only use it for non-commercial applications) Adobe flash player (with OpenVG) to support DASH IPTV player functionality for Home. This would explain Sony not using IPTV for commercial use till either Gstreamer 1.0 is done, PROVED secure and they disclose it or they decide to pay Adobe for the commercial use of AVM+. That Sony has a DASH player as seen with Home on the PS3 but is not using it for commercial IPTV themselves makes me believe that Gstreamer is the first choice, a choice so critical that they will delay implementing their entire ecosystem and the money to be made from it until Gstreamer 1.0 is finished.

I assume they want WebGL, accelerated codecs and video manipulation with CairoGL (Cairo-Pixman) which is necessary for zooming into video streams (Playmemories Studio). So it's Gstreamer and Cairo SPU-RSX accelerated support or Something they will have to write themselves and constantly upgrade. (can't use AVM+ without disclosing to Adobe or Pay Adobe for it's use).

Read http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=37023526&postcount=1309 then http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=37062140&postcount=1319

My guess is PS Suite's player will be Gstreamer with Cairo bindings to support AR (a PS Suite developer mentioned that codec support is coming, probably via OpenMax, which implies a native player is coming); that is unless Google provides a better player for Android ICS but then Codecs would not be needed.

Edit: "From a brief look at OpenVG, there seeem to be chips that support hardware OpenVG and not hardware OpenGL. That seems to be much of the point of OpenVG: So low-end devices can accelerate graphics, without being powerful GL-capable GPUs. As far as I can tell, those chips are used only in phones, not desktops." OpenVG is simpler, like a subset of Cairo and requires fewer resources while giving SVG benefits to the XMB. CairoGL (as used in GTKwebkit is Pixman-Cairo-Glitz) with Gstreamer bindings will be needed by Augmented Reality, a WebGL browser and can be used to manipulate pictures and video.

So the version of webkit we have now is probably the smallest and requires the least support (native libraries). Some form of this version may be seen intact as a basis for in-game browser support on both Vita and PS3. There is no CairoGL, no modified GTK toolkit and Gstreamer which require Glib. OpenVG is already being used by the XMB and can be used to support this version of webkit without using more in game memory. OpenVG can not be used to support WebGL, W3C SVG or Gstreamer with Cairo bindings for HTML5 <video>. Edit: OpenVG in the application side would be used to create pixel version of fonts and graphics as cached bitmapped images and then Pixman would be used to display and manipulate the graphics images

Utako; does this now make sense to you? This version of webkit for a game console (Vita and PS3) was in hind sight predictable. It is not (now debatable point again) the final Browser version but might be the final in-game version. My opinion is that W3C SVG support is coming as we have seen PSN SVG menus, WebGL and HTML5 <video> support for the ability to view 3-D video which we were told is coming.

The big difference to come IN MY OPINION is in-game XMB will be OpenVG (no change) and the application side XMB will be CairoGL (Changed from OpenVG and Pixman) with webkit and support libraries always loaded or partially loaded with some, FAST and easily swapped via a special reserved portion of the Hard disk on the PS3.

The above would then support what Gnome desktop, Chrome OS and other OS are doing; Browser desktops with RIAs. Maximum use of the same libraries allowing for Zero copy and resource efficiency.

Oh, one of the reasons the current browser appears to load so fast and does not require the XMB to reboot on exit is that the XMB is already using OpenVG and Pixman so the browser NOW does not require they be reloaded. When we move to SVG or WebGL or a more full featured HTML5 the application side XMB will probably be CairoGL.

Why is a game warning message now seen for the first time on the application side XMB after 4.10? Games and active screens that might cause the same issues will be seen shortly in the application side of the XMB. Games already have warning messages so the first post boot warning is redundant for current games. Coming to the application side XMB; 3-D for the XMB, WebGL games, 3-D viewing from the browser, 3-D picture and video including home video, Augmented Reality including on-line Web etc. which, to be safe, would require a warning message for the entire Application side XMB.

To this point I've duplicated some of http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=402172 in this thread. In the future I'll post simple conclusions in this thread and supporting information in the other thread. I hope this will keep people from thinking I'm trying to " hijack" threads.

Again, I have no insider information and what I am posting is obvious for the most part and is now partially hindsight. We are over the hump as a Webkit browser has been released though it's a very minimal version with few advanced features. From this point forward it gets exciting.

This OpenMax 2007 Powerpoint gives an overview of 1.1 and what's coming with OpenMax 1.2 (Clicking downloads a PPT file). It sets the stage with support for middleware for PS3 firmware releases from 2007, what's been released in 3.0 (2009) - 3.5 (Sept 2010) - 4.0 and this year with the recently released OpenMax 1.2 through 5.0 (Sept 2012 Augmented reality coming Sept of this year).
 
Xbox 360 web browser may force Sony to make PS3 improvements

PS3 users have been crying out for a fully functional and easy to use web browser for years, but unfortunately Sony hasn&#8217;t delivered. The web browser remains pretty shocking and sadly, the browser on the PS Vita isn&#8217;t exactly amazing either.

For some reason, Sony has really struggled in this department. Navigating to simple websites on the PS3 such as Facebook remains a chore and it is an area that many users wish Sony spent a bit more time improving.

With that said, their efforts to improve the browser may be forced, as we&#8217;re hearing that Microsoft may be planning to finally bring a web browser to the Xbox 360. Not only that, but it could be compatible with the Kinect camera, meaning that Xbox 360 users can navigate through websites using voice and hand gestures only.

Sony is waiting for GTKwebkit2 to implement APIs for HTML5<video> support and Gstreamer 1.0 to be released. They won't be forced but I expect they know each others' timetables. Same thing happened a couple of years ago with DLNA, Microsoft released a crippled/non-standard version and Sony soon after released a version of DLNA that complied with the standards. It was assumed in error that Sony released DLNA after pressure because the Xbox had DLNA.

The EFL port of webkit does not have Video support yet also.

The port shares code with the [WebKitGTK GTK+ one], as we also use Cairo for rendering and LibSoup for networking.

Most of HTML5 features (video is missing);

Future plans:

NSAPI plugins, using windowless systems (Netscape API plugins)
HTML5 feature completion (video, geolocation);
Improving API coverage, exposing more features such as the Editor and Inspector clients;
Exposing DOM;
WebKit2 support.
Other desired features:

Less dependency on GNOME technologies, maybe remove Cairo (to use Clutter) and exchange LibSoup for an EFL-based network backend.

Tizen is the Intel Samsung joint venture to provide an embedded OS and uses EFL Webkit which is essentially GTKwebkit. This PDF has information we are not getting from Sony and should apply to the PS3 and Vita port. Page 16 of the PDF shows both the Pixman and CairoGL 2D rendering routes of Webkit with only the Pixman backend active in the PS3 and Vita at this time. Page 12-15 show the webkit accelerated rendering which require the CairoGL 2D drawing route which is not active in the PS3 and Vita yet.

It's what I have been trying to get across (page 16 left hand block drawing). It's the first step for rendering in a port (CPU only and Pixman (Pixel rendered). Next comes accelerated CairoGL then WebGL with WebGL & Cairo/WebGL now being worked on for Webkit2 .

This is fact not speculation! Articles complaining about the state of the PS3 and Vita browser need to do their research!!!!!
 

Cheska

Member
Uhh so I was pretty sure that I had already downloaded this, but when I popped in Max Payne 3 it asked me to update-so I did. Well now I noticed that my trophy level is down to Level 1. WTF? There's one other person on my list that seems to have gone through the same problem, and I'm wondering if anyone else is experiencing this. I'll be super pissed if this is permanent.
 

Hanmik

Member
Uhh so I was pretty sure that I had already downloaded this, but when I popped in Max Payne 3 it asked me to update-so I did. Well now I noticed that my trophy level is down to Level 1. WTF? There's one other person on my list that seems to have gone through the same problem, and I'm wondering if anyone else is experiencing this. I'll be super pissed if this is permanent.

your profile looks fine in here:

zAnq6.jpg


http://us.playstation.com/publictrophy/index.htm?onlinename=cheska19
 
Gaikai has major announcements for E3, which has the potential to change the future of video game, the game consoles and the way in which we play.

On a PC (Google Chrome) the Cloud Play is h.264 video + Java Plugin for Browser. If this is supported on the PS3 and Vita using the browser or a webview app using the browser libraries, we could be getting an upgrade for the browser at the same time. Most likely HTML5 <video> and possibly SVG with slightly less likely WebGL. And also a Java plugin for the browser. Security issues may limit any feature on the PS3 and Vita.

Gstreamer 1.0 was just announced and released for Ubuntu Linux even though Collabora has Gstreamer 1.0 at RC 2 not full 1.0. GTKWebkit+ 2.0 HTML5 <video> support should be pretty easy, WebGL (Gstreamer with bindings to Cairo) to manipulate the video (rotate, stretch, zoom or overlay) may come later. SVG would just be using Cairo for rendering and can be accelerated or not depending on the Cairo backend.

Considering Webkit browsers are on just about EVERY networked platform, providing remote game play through webkit browsers would be the easiest method to get support for remote game play.

Edit: If HTML5 <video> is supported then Sony will release their Streaming media service, we might get a new DLNA render and more.

The following seen in Tizen is what I speculated is coming for the PS3 (there will be differences in implementation; look and feel).

Samsung and Sony appear to be paralleling each other with Samsung more open about their plans. Sony's Tim Bird is working with the Linux and embedded Linux community starting and supporting projects to evolve Linux and eLinux for use in Sony CE platforms. Tizen 1.0 has now been released (Samsung Intel project to provide a eLinux flavor for embedded platforms).

Wayland/Westin OpenGLES2 using CairoGLES replacing Xwindows with GTK toolkit may be the Simpler eLinux Sony is talking about in the PS4 and the OtherOS (No Xwindows) Linux released for PS3 and PS4 at the same time. Wayland is already shipping on one TV.

Tizen Desktop is 100% HTML5 applications using Cairo.
Tizen video of a 100% HTML5 application platform/desktop

Running Android Apps on Tizen (Linux kernel was recently updated using routines out of Google"s Android Kernel and now Linux and Android use the same kernel making it easier to run Android on Linux platforms.)

GTKwebkit 2.0 using Gnome Mobile Libraries with GTK 3.0 toolkit designed to run on Wayland/Westin rather than Xwindows and HTML5/javascript desktop has everything Zero Copy using the same libraries. The Linux Kernel recently absorbing Google Android modifications to the Linux Kernel make the Kernel faster, smaller, ecosystem friendly as well as support to make it easier to run Android applications on the new Linux kernel. This should all happen this year.

The above is the ideal allowing, for instance, a GTK webkit browser the ability to remote play a GTK Linux application even if not HTML5. How Sony modifies the above to have the smallest memory footprint I can't predict, nor it's impact on features that for instance Samsung is showing with Tizen 1.0.
 

yurinka

Member
Great work. Now please do the same in Vita and give me proper Flash 11 support in both devices with HW acceleration please (maybe they're working on it since the latest Adobe Air supports PS Certified specific input control layouts).
 
Sony to embark on 'Storyteller' ebook initiative at E3

A PS3 ebook strategy will be unveiled by Sony at E3, MCV understands.

It will be called &#8216;Storyteller&#8217; and will see PS3 &#8211; and possibly Vita &#8211; used to present interactive documents and books, with a particular focus on children&#8217;s content.

This content will form another sub-section of Sony&#8217;s PlayStation Network Store &#8211; the rejuvenation of which is expected to constitute a large part of the company&#8217;s E3 offering.
This content will form another sub-section of Sony&#8217;s PlayStation Network Store &#8211; the rejuvenation of which is expected to constitute a large part of the company&#8217;s E3 offering. Which could mean more use of the browser libraries and SVG as well as HTML5 <Video> for user instruction, Gameplay and features explained with video and more.

Children's eBook will require an easy to use interface for children. I'd speculate a limited voice and gesture control both have to take into account small children.

As I mentioned earlier, the Game warning for the application side of the PS3 can indicate casual use like eBooks on the application side not game side with more OS resources always loaded in the Application side XMB like web browser libraries, voice and gesture recognition.
 
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