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IBM: WiiU running on Watson's brain. 45nm MultiCore CPU with "lots" of embedded DRAM.

GLopez12

Neo Member
Yup. Looks like Reggie was not lying about this system running great graphics at 1080p at a decent framerate. This will blow the 360 and PS3 away.
 
So the console is more powerful than PS3 and 360. Nintendo should of showed demos that shows this. The bird demo was ok. But you could tell it was something beyond what the PS3 and 360 could do.

But will it matter next year when/if MS and sony announce their new systems?
 

scy

Member
Luigiv said:
That's the very definition of a computer. Computers are very stupid devices that, at an architecture level, can only do very simple things. However their strength lies in being able to perform billions of these simple tasks every second.

No, when I say "faster" I meant reaction speed to pushing a button faster, not "shit, was it 1982 or 1983?" faster. The article makes it seem like Watson's CPU was blazing circles around either of them due to raw processing power when it's just the fact it reacted to knowing the question faster than either of them (which is not a component of it's processing ability). Yes, it still was fast as hell in figuring out the response but so were the two of them. Much of Jeopardy comes down to the buzzer speed, not so much just knowing the answer. It's kind of a flawed premise to be able to say "Watson beat some humans, holy shit our processing ability is magnificent!"

Again, not that the processing power ISN'T magnificent, it's just not the reason it won.

Regardless, I think it's a bit premature to say how the games will look in the future, especially multiplatform titles. We can argue all day back and forth about which console is better but there's so many ports right now that look worse between the PS3 and 360 that the specs aren't 100% indicative of performance in this. Will the Wii U beat them both in terms of raw power? Sure. Will a same-day release version look vastly better than them? Possibly, but I'd have some bated breath about the whole thing working out that way.
 
AceBandage said:
First thing I thought when the demo started. Looked exactly like a better version of UE3.

Geoff Keighley also asked Reggie specifically about who developed this demo and he was suspiciously tight lipped about it. He was quick to reveal the Zelda demo was made by Nintendo's Japanese teams though.
 
So pretty much the answer to all of this is: we still don't know enough to say anything, but it's at least a little more powerful than the 360 or PS3, right?

I'm bad at this techie stuff so I would appreciate if someone would weigh in here
 

clav

Member
TunaLover said:
Still no news about what GPU will use Wü?
Quite beast CPU BTW
Most likely AMD (formally ATi) as Nintendo has loved them since Gamecube.

Also it makes backwards compatibility doable.
 

Chiggs

Member
Kung Fu Grip said:
So the console is more powerful than PS3 and 360. Nintendo should of showed demos that shows this. The bird demo was ok. But you could tell it was something beyond what the PS3 and 360 could do.

Hmmm, I think they're probably not releasing the specs or showing elaborate demos because they don't want to divulge everything to the competition.
 

Lonely1

Unconfirmed Member
TunaLover said:
Still no news about what GPU will use Wü?
Quite beast CPU BTW, the bird trailer real tiem confirmed? D:
The R700 variant rumor seems pretty solid so far.
 

linkboy

Member
Chiggs said:
Hmmm, I think they're probably not releasing the specs because they don't want to divulge everything to the competition.

Plus, they haven't officially released specs for any of their consoles since the Gamecube.
 

Nairume

Banned
JWong said:
Uuuuh thanks for confirming that they didn't announce it in the conference?
They said new console a bunch of times, man.

The new controller was just the focus of the presentation.
 

Vanillalite

Ask me about the GAF Notebook
1-D_FTW said:
Why? Because they don't suck down at the alter of Nintendo's dick? Guys making comments like yours are the same people who used to bitch at people who said DS/Wii would be a huge success. An inability to think for yourself and judge evidence that is new is the real problem. We've got too many Pachter's who are only capable of judging what happened the very last cycle and base all their opinions on that. Things change. Evaluate evidence and think for yourself. Sometimes you can "see the future" if it's obvious enough.

P.S. Watson was running 2880 cores. WiiU will be just as stupid as many of the comments here.

I love how you insinuated I was even talking about comments about the new Nintendo system when I said GAF comments in general. Way to go and put words out there that I didn't bring up.
 

thefro

Member
Log4Girlz said:
So someone give me numbers. How much more powerful would this be than Wii's CPU? Do this for the lulz. And if you're really tech savy, take into account that Wii U should only have 3 cpu cores, not 4.

The stock Power7 has 16 cpu cores (4 chips with 4 cores each).

The question is whether we're just getting a single module with 3 cores or 4 chips with 3 cores each, or 3 chips with 4 cores each.
 

teiresias

Member
I hardly think it's headline worthy news to say a system coming out in 2012 will have a more powerful CPU then systems released in 2005 and 2006. To act like this is some sort of coup or ingenious move is pretty ridiculous.
 

Dragon

Banned
Nairume said:
They said new console a bunch of times, man.

The new controller was just the focus of the presentation.

Stop arguing with the guy, he's delusional or a troll.

teiresias said:
I hardly think it's headline worthy news to say a system coming out in 2012 will have a more powerful CPU then systems released in 2005 and 2006. To act like this is some sort of coup or ingenious move is pretty ridiculous.

Well Nintendo fans were going crazy over voice overs in Icarus so...not surprising...
 

Chiggs

Member
linkboy said:
Plus, they haven't officially released specs for any of their consoles since the Gamecube.

If I had to release the Wii, I would have swept the specs under the rug, too.
 
teiresias said:
I hardly think it's headline worthy news to say a system coming out in 2012 will have a more powerful CPU then systems released in 2005 and 2006. To act like this is some sort of coup or ingenious move is pretty ridiculous.


Apparently is has to be headline worthy news, considering how large a portion of GAF somehow thinks the WiiU is WEAKER than the 360/PS3...
 

antonz

Member
teiresias said:
I hardly think it's headline worthy news to say a system coming out in 2012 will have a more powerful CPU then systems released in 2005 and 2006. To act like this is some sort of coup or ingenious move is pretty ridiculous.
When 2/3 of Neogaf is actling like fucking morons saying derp derp worse than 360 etc pointing out they are fucking morons and showing the fact its using the latest technology out there is only logical
 

itxaka

Defeatist
Lonely1 said:
That's GPU EDRam.


I see you edited, that makes sense. But now I looke more stupid that I am! :p


The 360 has 10MB in it's GPU. In it's CPU, it only has 1216KB. 16MB is huge for a CPU cache.


Ahhh that makes sense. What is it used for? Just more raw power? Or could it help the gpu with processing?
 

Dragon

Banned
antonz said:
When 2/3 of Neogaf is actling like fucking morons saying derp derp worse than 360 etc pointing out they are fucking morons and showing the fact its using the latest technology out there is only logical

Yes it's incredibly logical to fight complete ignorance with stupidity.
 

scitek

Member
antonz said:
When 2/3 of Neogaf is actling like fucking morons saying derp derp worse than 360 etc pointing out they are fucking morons and showing the fact its using the latest technology out there is only logical

It's not, is it? Well, at least if the GPU rumors pan out it isn't.
 
AceBandage said:
Both EA and Vigil said just that, though...

But they didn't show it. If they had one third party come out and showed a game and explain how this version is better than the competitors, I think the announcement would have appealed more to the hardcore.
 

Neo C.

Member
1-D_FTW said:
P.S. Watson was running 2880 cores. WiiU will be just as stupid as many of the comments here.
lol, it was just a joke. Nobody really thinks Watson is smarter than a gaffer (computer doesn't work like that anyway).
 

chaosblade

Unconfirmed Member
thefro said:
The stock Power7 has 16 cpu cores (4 chips with 4 cores each).

The question is whether we're just getting a single module with 3 cores or 4 chips with 3 cores each, or 3 chips with 4 cores each.
I think you're confused. The base Power7 has 4 cores w/ 4 threads, so 16 threads total. Not 16 cores. Think Intel's Hyperthreading.

Performance with SMT isn't the same as multiple real cores, although it can come reasonably close with well optimized software.

so to put this in perspective, how is this compared to the ps3 and 360?
Leagues ahead if true, even if it's clocked low. Wouldn't be surprised to see 1.8GHz or something.
 

Matt

Member
snoopeasystreet said:
But they didn't show it. If they had one third party come out and showed a game and explain how this version is better than the competitors, I think the announcement would have appealed more to the hardcore.
The system dosen't come out for over a year. What you're asking for is something that has never before been done in this industry.
 

scy

Member
They really should've had a better third-party reel showing off more titles that aren't going to be yesterday's news by the time the console releases. That would've easily been the easiest way to alleviate much of this, honestly. Showcasing off Metro, Arkham City, etc. is all fine to demo the power but it's hard to get worked up over playing "last year's game" as your big launch title.

But, really, what can you expect ~18 months prior to the console dropping?
 
itxaka said:
I see you edited, that makes sense. But now I looke more stupid that I am! :p





Ahhh that makes sense. What is it used for? Just more raw power? Or could it help the gpu with processing?

The 10 MB of EDRAM on Xbox 360's Xenos GPU is used for things like framebuffer and anti-aliasing (reduces the jaggies). It puts much of the graphic data much closer to the GPU logic than it would otherwise be in main memory. The GameCube and Wii also have embedded 1T-SRAM, though a smaller amount (3.12 MB) than Xbox 360's Xenos. The original Xbox 360s had seperate GPU and EDRAM/logic, unlike GameCube and Wii which had their GPU RAM embedded directly onto the GPU. The current Xbox 360 S has everything (CPU, GPU, EDRAM) on a single chip. Someone else can explain this stuff MUCH better than I can. I did my best.
 
Sounds like a fairly powerful processor. I kinda wished Nintendo showed off a little bit of what the system was capable of. That tech demo looked nice but it's a tech demo, it could really mean anything.

scy said:
But, really, what can you expect ~18 months prior to the console dropping?
Pretty much. The games we will be playing on it are nowhere near ready to being revealed. I think Nintendo mostly just wanted to show off that they are getting that type of support, and to expect some major third party titles at launch. It's also why the games shown didn't look really any better than current gen games, since more than likely they were videos of the 360 or PS3 versions.
 
scy said:
They really should've had a better third-party reel showing off more titles that aren't going to be yesterday's news by the time the console releases. That would've easily been the easiest way to alleviate much of this, honestly. Showcasing off Metro, Arkham City, etc. is all fine to demo the power but it's hard to get worked up over playing "last year's game" as your big launch title.

But, really, what can you expect ~18 months prior to the console dropping?


Which is the entire thing, isn't it.
We already know developers are working on exclusive stuff for the system, but they probably aren't far enough along right now for a full showing, where as, 360/PS3 games are.
 

Luckyman

Banned
thefro said:
The question is whether we're just getting a single module with 3 cores or 4 chips with 3 cores each, or 3 chips with 4 cores each.

What do you think? 12 Cores on this system? No. :D
 

Lonely1

Unconfirmed Member
teiresias said:
I hardly think it's headline worthy news to say a system coming out in 2012 will have a more powerful CPU then systems released in 2005 and 2006. To act like this is some sort of coup or ingenious move is pretty ridiculous.
This is confirming what many of us already knew. Didn't you read all those "as powerful at most posts"? What's the point of your post anyway?
 

antonz

Member
scitek said:
It's not, is it? Well, at least if the GPU rumors pan out it isn't.
GPU wise they are sure to be lacking as far as latest technology just due to power/heat issues. Id love to see something like a 6970 in the Wii U but just not gonna happen. 4850-4870 range though will be nice though and still offer plenty of a boost.

Nintendo s whole problem is multiplatform titles are not going to be a huge step up on WiiU at quick glance. Devs might up resolution and things like that which will be great but its going to take WiiU exclusive or multiplatform where WiiU is lead to show its power.
 

Lord Error

Insane For Sony
I dunno, that devkit spec sheet didn't' really peg the CPU as something extraordinarily impressive. If anything, GPU seemed like a better deal.

Either way, the console is simply too small to be some kind of performance monster.
 

antonz

Member
Lord Error said:
I dunno, that devkit spec sheet didn't' really peg the CPU as something extraordinarily impressive. If anything, GPU seemed like a better deal.
The fake devskit specsheet is fake.
 
Matt said:
The system dosen't come out for over a year. What you're asking for is something that has never before been done in this industry.

A lot of the announced games come out before then, though. Don't you think it would have been wise of them to say something like "here's Batman: Arkham city and this is why you should wait for the Wii U to play it"?

I know I'm coming off as a bit down on the console, but I think it has the potential to be cool. I was just trying to argue the point that announcing a bunch of ports isn't enough to appeal to the hardcore.
 
I'm confident that the actual Wii U games on display next year will surprise people. Almost everything we've seen so far was running on 360/PS3 coded trailers.

I have a good feeling.
 

gofreak

GAF's Bob Woodward
chaosblade said:
Leagues ahead if true, even if it's clocked low. Wouldn't be surprised to see 1.8GHz or something.

Can you elaborate?

The only raw performance metric I can find for it to compare wouldn't suggest that, if we're talking about a 3 or 4-core chip. edit - though i may be comparing apples to oranges, if the power7 numbers are dp

I can certainly see given its features and the amount of memory on chip that it would be much easier to extract a level of performance out of it vs the others, but if comparing tuned code with good utilisation, would it be 'leagues ahead'?
 
antonz said:
GPU wise they are sure to be lacking as far as latest technology just due to power/heat issues. Id love to see something like a 6970 in the Wii U but just not gonna happen. 4850-4870 range though will be nice though and still offer plenty of a boost.

Nintendo s whole problem is multiplatform titles are not going to be a huge step up on WiiU t quick glance. Devs might up resolution and things like that which will be great but its going to take WiiU exclusive or multiplatform where WiiU is lead to show its power.

AMD RV770 (Radeon 4850-4870) would be an awesome GPU which to base the WiiU GPU on. It's much more powerful than either Xbox 360's Xenos or PlayStation3's RSX.

Of course Wii U will really shine with internally developed games, not 360/PS3 ports.
 

wsippel

Banned
Lord Error said:
I dunno, that devkit spec sheet didn't' really peg the CPU as something extraordinarily impressive. If anything, GPU seemed like a better deal.

Either way, the console is simply too small to be some kind of performance monster.
That "devkit spec sheet"'s most certainly wrong. IBM says it's Watson, Watson's Power7 - not Power6. Huge difference.
 

scitek

Member
antonz said:
GPU wise they are sure to be lacking as far as latest technology just due to power/heat issues. Id love to see something like a 6970 in the Wii U but just not gonna happen. 4850-4870 range though will be nice though and still offer plenty of a boost.

Nintendo s whole problem is multiplatform titles are not going to be a huge step up on WiiU at quick glance. Devs might up resolution and things like that which will be great but its going to take WiiU exclusive or multiplatform where WiiU is lead to show its power.

The question I have is that now that there will be a more powerful system on the market than the PS360, at least for a year or two, and it's capable of running UE3 and whatnot, will it become the lead platform for multiplatform titles for the remainder of this generation with the PS360 versions being scaled down? Or will it be ported from the PS360 and have exclusive stuff shoe-horned in?
 

clav

Member
herzogzwei1989 said:
AMD RV770 (Radeon 4850-4870) would be an awesome GPU which to base the WiiU GPU on. It's much more powerful than either Xbox 360's Xenos or PlayStation3's RSX.

Of course Wii U will really shine with internally developed games, not 360/PS3 ports.
I hope they use the Radeon 5XXX series since the 4 series run a bit hot.
 

antonz

Member
scitek said:
The question I have is that now that there will be a more powerful system on the market than the PS360, at least for a year or two, and it's capable of running UE3 and whatnot, will it become the lead platform for multiplatform titles for the remainder of this generation with the PS360 versions being scaled down? Or will it be ported from the PS360 and have exclusive stuff shoe-horned in?
I think it will likely Get upgraded ports for the rest of this generation besides its Special exceptions. Nintendo is likely gunning for a situation where they have enough of an install base to be lead platform in the next gen battle
 

Bert

Member
So does this tally up with the IGN rumours that included the r700 (or whatever, I'm not a graphics whore/tech head)? If so what does that mean for power compared to PS360?

Please put in simple "number of 360s ductaped together" terminology. (WolframAlpha should really include this in their calculation thingy)

TunaLover said:
Quite beast CPU BTW, the bird trailer real tiem confirmed? D:

Yes, in several places. It's one of the "interactive experiences" shown, but by all accounts not the most impressive one, that's a Japanese street thing that hasn't hit the web AFAIK.
 
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