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Fitts · May 21, 2017

Just read that strikes (and assumedly other pve content) is still only 3 players. Super disappointing. Why not make everything six players? And pvp has been decreased to four? Awful. Not having enough spots for friends to play was a big problem in the first game. Six was fine most of the time. I was really hoping they would up fireteam sizes to (at least) that across the board, but they've taken a step backwards if anything.

This on top of no new classes, enemy factions, or compelling new activities. (that strike video was some bog standard shit) But hey, more cutscenes and bland chatter to ignore!

EloquentM · May 21, 2017

Fitts said:
This on top of no new classes, enemy factions, or compelling new activities. (that strike video was some bog standard shit) But hey, more cutscenes and bland chatter to ignore!

They specifically spoke on a new mode called lost sectors which are dungeons with light raid mechanics a boss and loot at then in the game world (patrol). As for new features the keynote seemed to mostly focus on the new qol (clans, guided activities, lore in-game, etc.), weapon, crucible, subclass, and crucible changes. I mean it was a reveal not a full blowout. I'm fully expecting them to release a lot more information at e3 and the coming months so I feel like most of the disappointment is premature. That being said I completely understand it given this was the biggest opportunity for them to save face with burned out players. They talked about a lot of new stuff, just didn't show it.

WaterAstro · May 21, 2017

It looks more of the same.

Wasn't hyped before or after. I did love to play Destiny when it launched.

border · May 21, 2017

Fitts said:
Just read that strikes (and assumedly other pve content) is still only 3 players. Super disappointing. Why not make everything six players?

Presumably because it's difficult to design a Strike that can challenge 6 players, while not punishing those that only show up with 2-3 players. You'd end up with a mission that is either way too hard for 3 people or way too easy for 6.

GankzyMcfly · May 21, 2017

Slightly disappointed...didnt expect much but was hoping bungie could do something to bring me back but its starting to look more and more like a hard pass for me.

Fitts · May 21, 2017

EloquentM said:
They specifically spoke on a new mode called lost sectors which are dungeons with light raid mechanics a boss and loot at then in the game world (patrol). As for new features the keynote seemed to mostly focus on the new qol (clans, guided activities, lore in-game, etc.), weapon, crucible, subclass, and crucible changes. I mean it was a reveal not a full blowout. I'm fully expecting them to release a lot more information at e3 and the coming months so I feel like most of the disappointment is premature. That being said I completely understand it given this was the biggest opportunity for them to save face with burned out players. They talked about a lot of new stuff, just didn't show it.

First I'm hearing about Lost Sectors. Sounds good, but hopefully it's not just more recycled content.

I don't care about clans if you can't even buddy up for activities. (limited to 3/4). Changes/tweaks are whatever. I would've preferred they just keep subclasses/etc mostly the same and work on wholly new ways to play. They also need to nail down an upgrade path and stick with it. Lore I super don't care about as I've never found the writing in Bungie's games the least bit compelling. Just let me use those great core gameplay mechanics to do fun shit.

border said:
Presumably because it's difficult to design a Strike that can challenge 6 players, while not punishing those that only show up with 2-3 players. You'd end up with a mission that is either way too hard for 3 people or way too easy for 6.

So if it's difficult, make the effort to have activities scale properly instead of allocating resources toward designing ships that look like dumpster fires and do literally nothing. It in no way seems impossble to make all activities six players max. And besides strikes, what would be the reason to limit something like, say, patrols? Why take a step backwards with pvp?

mr teaspoon · May 21, 2017

While I'm definitely happy that they're adding matchmaking (this is basically a deal breaker for me. I won't even consider purchasing a game where I have to coordinate playtimes with a dozen or however many frickin' people), I still haven't seen anything that addresses how goddamn repetitive the first game was.

Haines · May 21, 2017

Are people comparing destiny 2 to destiny 1 vanilla? Bc you should be.

By the time d2 is at the end if it's life...it might be a bit of a different game lol.

Either way this looks much better than vanilla 1

EloquentM · May 21, 2017

Fitts said:
First I'm hearing about Lost Sectors. Sounds good, but hopefully it's not just more recycled content.

I don't care about clans if you can't even buddy up for activities. (limited to 3/4). Changes/tweaks are whatever. I would've preferred they just keep subclasses/etc mostly the same and work on wholly new ways to play. They also need to nail down an upgrade path and stick with it. Lore I super don't care about as I've never found the writing in Bungie's games the least bit compelling. Just let me use those great core gameplay mechanics to do fun shit.

im a veteran player with 1500 so obviously the gameplay loop does not bother me in the least. Hopefully though for new and old players alike there is more than just the lost sectors as an edition. Diablo 3 style procedurally generated dungeons has been on my wishlist forever. This is the chance but they need to show more. I'm hoping for e3

LTWood12 · May 21, 2017

Can't wait to dive into 2. Gonna be weird leaving 1 behind after all those hours, but I really dig what they showed.

border · May 21, 2017

Fitts said:
So if it's difficult, make the effort to have activities scale properly instead of allocating resources toward designing ships that look like dumpster fires and do literally nothing.

This is a classic design fallacy, though.

"Why are people designing new ships when they could be making more balanced strikes?"

Well, probably because the people designing ships are artists who don't have the expertise to design balanced gameplay experiences. Strikes could probably accommodate large groups, but it would amount to just more, larger waves of trash enemies and bosses with huge HP pools. At the same time, larger groups mean longer times in matchmaking queues. It's easier just to design for small groups and enforce that limit rather than try to fit in more people.

teacupcopter · May 21, 2017

Haines said:
Are people comparing destiny 2 to destiny 1 vanilla? Bc you should be.

By the time d2 is at the end if it's life...it might be a bit of a different game lol.

Either way this looks much better than vanilla 1

Why would we do that?

I'm comparing it to Destiny, the game I've got in front of me, right now. I'm comparing it to a host of other games I've enjoyed playing. I get it, people's expectations were out of whack, but to be honest if you packaged this shit up into an expansion or a huge content patch in a subscription game, I wouldn't be surprised.

Fitts · May 21, 2017

EloquentM said:
im a veteran player with 1500 so obviously the gameplay loop does not bother me in the least. Hopefully though for new and old players alike there is more than just the lost sectors as an edition. Diablo 3 style procedurally generated dungeons has been on my wishlist forever. This is the chance but they need to show more. I'm hoping for e3

Over 700 hours sank into Destiny. The incredibly poor value of the "expansion pass" and the persistent and drastic changes to upgrade paths/weapon balance drove myself and most of my friends away from the game after initially having a blast with it.

I was really hoping Bungie would come out swinging with fresh new ideas and meaningful improvements with the announcement of a sequel but... nope. Group text has been eerily silent about D2. Our blind Vault of Glass run was the most fun I've had playing online in about a decade (laughing just thinking about it) and it would be awesome to recapture that feeling.

border said:
This is a classic design fallacy, though.

"Why are people designing new ships when they could be making more balanced strikes?"

Well, probably because the people designing ships are artists who don't have the expertise to design balanced gameplay experiences. Strikes could probably accommodate large groups, but it would amount to just more, larger waves of trash enemies and bosses with huge HP pools. At the same time, larger groups mean longer times in matchmaking queues. It's easier just to design for small groups and enforce that limit rather than try to fit in more people.

I was being facetious. And if queuing is that big of a problem (I don't think it is) then make fireteam size user selectable.

And yeah, bring on the trash mobs and bullet sponges. Rather that and everyone in the same activity than a dude or two playing odd man out in party chat.

EloquentM · May 21, 2017

Fitts said:
Over 700 hours sank into Destiny. The incredibly poor value of the "expansion pass" and the persistent and drastic changes to upgrade paths/weapon balance drove myself and most of my friends away from the game after initially having a blast with it.

I was really hoping Bungie would come out swinging with fresh new ideas and meaningful improvements with the announcement of a sequel but... nope. Group text has been eerily silent about D2. Our blind Vault of Glass run was the most fun I've had playing online in about a decade (laughing just thinking about it) and it would be awesome to recapture that feeling.

I was being facetious. And if queuing is that big of a problem (I don't think it is) then make fireteam size user selectable.

And yeah, bring on the trash mobs and bullet sponges. Rather that and everyone in the same activity than a dude or two playing odd man out in party chat.

We'll see if they win you back in 3 months when more info is released. If not we always will have VoG *shrug*

Aztechnology · May 21, 2017

EloquentM said:
im a veteran player with 1500 so obviously the gameplay loop does not bother me in the least. Hopefully though for new and old players alike there is more than just the lost sectors as an edition. Diablo 3 style procedurally generated dungeons has been on my wishlist forever. This is the chance but they need to show more. I'm hoping for e3

Yea, it would be pretty awesome. Hopefully they get on the ball quick with the feedback (assuming it's like it is here elsewhere) and give us a carrot so we don't go crazy thinking that's all we're getting.

EloquentM · May 21, 2017

Aztechnology said:
Yea, it would be pretty awesome. Hopefully they get on the ball quick with the feedback (assuming it's like it is here elsewhere) and give us a carrot so we don't go crazy thinking that's all we're getting.

I lol'd at the we have a ton of content in this game then they spoke about finding treasures, lost sectors, and "adventures". I mean the keynote excited me, I'm into destiny so I'm in on the sequel but when they went over those features and didn't go more in depth I was like 🤔

Rathorial · May 21, 2017

I figured the sequel would be fairly iterative like most are, but a PC version with 60fps + keyboard/mouse controls + quality of life improvements to restart the series was already enough to get me on board. There are too few shooters out there than involve co-op, much less have the gunplay quality of Destiny (Borderlands the opposite of good gunplay).

The story, RPG elements and mission design were the weaknesses that I hope get ironed out in the sequel. Only disappointment I got from the reveal was how little information got shown about the actual game. Just a "gameplay" trailer that was predominately cinematics with slight moments of gameplay intersected in-between, and less of an idea of what structural changes are happening to the game.

Are they giving up on the shared world shooter thing, where other players stream into non-raid or strike levels, and complete objectives together? Are they keeping it the same, or actually...you know...make it some fleshed out feature that adds real value and uniqueness to the game vs. the weak gimmick version they advertised the first game around? Or are they just going to make it more like Guild Wars 1, where you have hubs with socializing, and primarily do instanced-based MMO content with good gunplay?

Trace · May 21, 2017

EloquentM said:
I lol'd at the we have a ton of content in this game then they spoke about finding treasures, lost sectors, and "adventures". I mean the keynote excited me, I'm into destiny so I'm in on the sequel but when they went over those features and didn't go more in depth I was like 🤔

Yea that would have been a really easy time to sell that feature. Start a patrol, go into a lost sector and fight a boss with some random people, would have taken 5-10 minutes at most and would have really sold this as a sequel.

Ramirez · May 21, 2017

EloquentM said:
I lol'd at the we have a ton of content in this game then they spoke about finding treasures, lost sectors, and "adventures". I mean the keynote excited me, I'm into destiny so I'm in on the sequel but when they went over those features and didn't go more in depth I was like 🤔

They have months before release, they had to keep something in the dark to talk about over the next few months.

Ryuuga · May 22, 2017

EloquentM said:
I lol'd at the we have a ton of content in this game then they spoke about finding treasures, lost sectors, and "adventures". I mean the keynote excited me, I'm into destiny so I'm in on the sequel but when they went over those features and didn't go more in depth I was like 🤔

Right? I was even more bewildered when they had the new crucible ready to play, but some regular-ass strike available on the PvE side. You figure they had a lot of hardcore destiny fans there that'd want to experience the new PvE content.

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