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Cosmo: Guys Get Turned on When Women Orgasm...It's a Bad Thing (It'sTimetoStop.gif)

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T

Two Words

Member
backslashbunny said:
Well sure, but those partners treated it like a reflection of their own sexual prowess.

It's honestly gobsmacking how many men don't seem to care what their partner says to them. Like, why can't I enjoy sex my way? Why do you want to dictate how and what I enjoy in sex?

And sure, I love orgasms. I have a vibrator for that. No one's dick is going to work, because that's the wrong part of my anatomy that causes orgasms. (I don't have a clit inside my vagina.) I have a feeling many heterosexual women share this perspective, but many men just seem to not be able to hear.

Sex can still be enjoyable without orgasming for women. I know, how novel.

(Just look at polls that ask women if they've ever faked orgasms. I bet it vastly outweighs how many times men have.)
Click to expand...
Umm, how can a man fake an orgasm? The evidence is a bit more obvious in that case.
 
F

FyreWulff

Member
Two Words said:
Umm, how can a man fake an orgasm? The evidence is a bit more obvious in that case.
Click to expand...

Penises don't deflate right after orgasm. Also, you can totally fake it by just twitching your dick while you're inside and make some noise (same thing you're doing when you make it jump while pissing and whatever)

Hell if you're using a condom it's even easier to pretend.
 
archangelmorph

archangelmorph

Member
Chmpocalypse said:
Sure, and I agree. I'm not really a fan of the study used or the slant of the article, but the underlying theory (summarized well by you) is still worth discussing, but too many in this thread immediately leap to defending themselves and dismissing the very real problem of toxic masculinity.

"I made her cum" is a lot different than "she came", you know?
Click to expand...

Sorry I don't understand this position...

Did the man literally not "make her cum"?

Is that no different than the woman "making the man cum" which is significantly more pervasive an occurrence?

I mean we're talking about sex here not masturbation right?

Isn't that the whole point, that any agency of sexual fulfillment of self is exclusively within the remit of your partner?

Like "I made her cum" is not the same thing as "I'm the only one who can/has made her cum" right?

This whole thing smacks to me, about being some hyper-feminist perspective orientated around the idea that a woman's sexual gratification can only be [exclusively] owned by her, and that it must only be about female empowerment. That's a nice ideal but it just feels flawed and doesn't stack up in the real world. Like sexual fulfillment within the context of a loving relationship is never about one person or the other but both at the same time. So it just seems so obtuse to try to take umbridge with, purely on the basis that a man's masculinity being affirmed should not happen at the same time a woman's femininity is being affirmed by the same act.

To me this is no different to a soccer player scoring the 1-0 goal of a tournament to win the premier league. Of course he's going to feel a sense of personal satisfaction for scoring the goal, but he's also provided a tremendous amount of satisfaction both for the team, the manager and also the fans.

Sometimes when multiple human beings engage in activities, multiple goals can be served at the same time by the same action. There is no inherent rule that these things must be entirely orthogonally linked.
 
C

Chmpocalypse

Blizzard
Plum said:
We should, I agree, but as I've said above (i.e. the last page), we are not discussing the issue, we are discussing the article. You personally don't believe that the majority of posters in this thread are in need of shaming, the article does, however; therefore, posters respond with dismissive snark because the article deserves nothing but. You're assuming that your personal interpretation of the article is what's being attacked here, it's not, people are attacking Cosmo's attempts at shaming all feelings of masculinity and improved self-esteem after sex as being inherently bad. Attempting to have the discussion under the guise of justifying an article such as Cosmos does nothing but harm any possibility of said discussion happening; shaming and attacking those who discuss what the OP actually says only harms things further.
Click to expand...

I can agree with this.
 
G

Gordon Shumway

Banned
Fudgepuppy said:
Me, before, during and after sex:
Screen_shot_2011-12-25_at_4.52.05_AM.png
Click to expand...

giphy.gif
 
C

Chmpocalypse

Blizzard
FyreWulff said:
The first step to being a feminist is to drop the "but, I'm an ally!" schtick, 'specially if you're a dude. Yeah, great for you for being part of the movement, but don't be the Dangerous Moderate or the Butiamanaly that insists they'll push for change and equality, as long as you don't hurt their feelings along the way.

You also have to remember just because you're a feminist now, you don't know every woman's experience, what they've had to go through with previous partners, etc.

The article makes a good point. Guys can be incessantly annoying about the woman having to orgasm so that they've "conquered" them, or the woman's issues, what have you. Even if you think you're doing it from the point of view that you're taking care of them, this leads to infantilsing the woman you're with in your mind. They MUST have their orgasm, no matter what! They have a hang up? Curing them. Similar idea to when a guy thinks a woman shouldn't have anyone be not-friends with her or be "nice" to her all the time. It's removing their identity and their personality and putting them on a pedastal or infantilising them to some abstract person you've invented in their mind.

I think women are very much being tired of being gaslighted about their own sexuality and wants out of sex by dudes, and the reaction a lot have here and elsewhere "ha, well if you don't like my awesome providing dick, then go fuck yourself" - says a lot. Cut the "not ALL...." BS. Own up to some shit once in a while, I promise feminism will not exile you over it.
Click to expand...

And I definitely agree with this.
 
C

Chmpocalypse

Blizzard
archangelmorph said:
Sorry I don't understand this position...

Did the man literally not "make her cum"?

Is that no different than the woman "making the man cum" which is significantly more pervasive an occurrence?

I mean we're talking about sex here not masturbation right?

Isn't that the whole point, that any agency of sexual fulfillment of self is exclusively within the remit of your partner?

Like "I made her cum" is not the same thing as "I'm the only one who can/has made her cum" right?

This whole thing smacks to me, about being some hyper-feminist perspective orientated around the idea that a woman's sexual gratification can only be [exclusively] owned by her, and that it must only be about female empowerment. That's a nice ideal but it just feels flawed and doesn't stack up in the real world. Like sexual fulfillment within the context of a loving relationship is never about one person or the other but both at the same time. So it just seems so obtuse to try to take umbridge with, purely on the basis that a man's masculinity being affirmed should not happen at the same time a woman's femininity is being affirmed by the same act.

To me this is no different to a soccer player scoring the 1-0 goal of a tournament to win the premier league. Of course he's going to feel a sense of personal satisfaction for scoring the goal, but he's also provided a tremendous amount of satisfaction both for the team, the manager and also the fans.

Sometimes when multiple human beings engage in activities, multiple goals can be served at the same time by the same action. There is no inherent rule that these things must be entirely orthogonally linked.
Click to expand...

Is removing a woman's agency regarding her sexual pleasure the point? What? Of course it isn't! This is such a disturbing thought.
 
Hale-XF11

Hale-XF11

Member
Poor GRIMES said:
Okay but did any of ya'll actually read the article?

It states that there's nothing wrong with giving a woman an orgasm, the results of heightened masculinity are problematic because there's a deep seated cultural belief that without men, women cannot orgasm. My lesbian friends always get asked how they make each other orgasm, this is absolutely a problem wherein men try to form stupid conclusions about "owning" female orgasms as their own.
Click to expand...

Unless you're a complete asshole, this is 100% bull shit.
 
H

HawksWinStanley

Member
Kevdo said:
Isn't the source study pretty...well, unfairly leading in the first place?

Wouldn't it be a more effective and meaningful study if they instead ask "How would you feel" in general?
Click to expand...

Well yeah but then they wouldn't be able to write an article like this to fit their agenda.
 
S

Shamrock7r

Member
FyreWulff said:
I think women are very much being tired of being gaslighted about their own sexuality and wants out of sex by dudes, and the reaction a lot have here and elsewhere "ha, well if you don't like my awesome providing dick, then go fuck yourself" - says a lot. Cut the "not ALL...." BS. Own up to some shit once in a while, I promise feminism will not exile you over it.
Click to expand...

Please point out the large amount of people in this thread saying that.
 
U

UnemployedVillain

Member
Kevdo said:
Isn't the source study pretty...well, unfairly leading in the first place?

"We then asked men to rate how masculine they would feel". The study is already framing the focus of emotion on masculinity, then damning the people that rate it high. Wouldn't it be a more effective and meaningful study if they instead ask "How would you feel" in general?
Click to expand...

Thank you. This is literally what I said a while back. If you're going to ask "How are these things, correlated with your masculinity, affected when you make a woman orgasm?" then of course you're going to find a high positive correlation between the two
 
P

Plum

Member
FyreWulff said:
Snip
Click to expand...

If an article says that doing something is bad without explaining why that thing is bad outside of the behaviour of a few, nobody needs to "own up" to anything. The article explicitly states that getting turned on when a woman orgasms, and/or feeling a heightened sense of self-esteem/masculinity is bad, it's in the very title, how can you not see why a man who has done literally nothing wrong might get offended by that? Men aren't a hive-mind, one man feeling masculine will not inevitably partake in the same actions as another man who feels masculine. You're projecting your own interpretation of the article onto those that called out the article as terrible.

If your definition of being a feminist means fully accepting any baseless, poorly-researched and poorly-developed attack on your gender because it "may have a point" then your standards are incredibly high.
 
M

MugiwaraCole

Member
Me saying "I made her cum" isn't the same thing as me saying "I'm the only one who can make her cum/I have a magic penis". I did make her cum. She made me cum. Because we enjoyed sex with each other.

This is an extremely weird argument.

efyu_lemonardo said:
This part, if I'm understanding correctly, seems to be an admission that there is a lack of communication in the bedroom. Isn't that enough to explain what's going on without attempting to put the blame on just one of the partners? Growing up a lot of men in our generation were surrounded by talk about how unfair it is that women don't achieve orgasm as easily as men do. Consequently it has become important to a lot of us that the women we are with get to climax. Now you're saying "wait a minute, it's not that simple" which is perfectly fine but don't expect us do understand it intuitively after we've been hammered a different message during our formative years. TALK ABOUT IT WITH YOUR PARTNER(S).
Click to expand...

All of this. If she's not gonna orgasm and she wants you to stop, stop. Seriously. If you don't out of some need to make her cum, no matter what, you're stepping into rape territory.

Women, I sympathize that that may make you anxious and feel like you HAVE to get a nut, but you can't really stop the men involved in that situation from feeling bad that you didn't climax too. All you can both do is openly communicate about it. But dammit, we've been told for so long, by women, that men in general are terrible lovers, so there are bound to be men that really take that shit to heart. Ergo, when they're successful, they feel better about themselves. Human nature.
 
S

Snowman Prophet of Doom

Member
FyreWulff said:
The first step to being a feminist is to drop the "but, I'm an ally!" schtick, 'specially if you're a dude. Yeah, great for you for being part of the movement, but don't be the Dangerous Moderate or the Butiamanaly that insists they'll push for change and equality, as long as you don't hurt their feelings along the way.

You also have to remember just because you're a feminist now, you don't know every woman's experience, what they've had to go through with previous partners, etc.

The article makes a good point. Guys can be incessantly annoying about the woman having to orgasm so that they've "conquered" them, or the woman's issues, what have you. Even if you think you're doing it from the point of view that you're taking care of them, this leads to infantilsing the woman you're with in your mind. They MUST have their orgasm, no matter what! They have a hang up? Curing them. Similar idea to when a guy thinks a woman shouldn't have anyone be not-friends with her or be "nice" to her all the time. It's removing their identity and their personality and putting them on a pedastal or infantilising them to some abstract person you've invented in their mind.

I think women are very much being tired of being gaslighted about their own sexuality and wants out of sex by dudes, and the reaction a lot have here and elsewhere "ha, well if you don't like my awesome providing dick, then go fuck yourself" - says a lot. Cut the "not ALL...." BS. Own up to some shit once in a while, I promise feminism will not exile you over it.
Click to expand...

Or it's a trash article going after a non-problem for clicks.
 
M

m3k

Member
late to thread butdid the article talk about being shamed for not performing in bed?

or having a bad relationship because of no orgasms for girl

those are relationship enders so, it might just be a bit more than about being selfish or whatever... premis being applied to men is trash
 
S

Snowman Prophet of Doom

Member
backslashbunny said:
^ it's not a non problem just because YOU feel like you don't have that problem...



Sorry, the analogy is just that it can be hard to see from someone else's perspective, especially when there's nothing that you can personally do if you're not actually doing something bad because it's not your personal fault but it comes from your gender despite it being unfair. So if I made a statement like, I feel nervous when I am alone in an elevator at night and a large man gets in-- many women may be able to relate, and while it's also understandable a man who reads that will be offended, it's because he probably also hasn't lived the life of a woman and isn't able to understand where the statement is coming from.



Haha yeah. To be fair, I think this is easier said than done. There's being blunt, but there's also the fear of hurting someone's ego, and when you love someone, sometimes their feelings are more important to you than yourself.

It would be nice if there was a way to have an anonymous survey where women could answer questions about their sex life truthfully. I think there's been a lot of surveys where yeah, basically most women have faked orgasms. If they let you talk about why, that would be pretty insightful imo.



I'm not a guy, I don't know how, but I've heard guys say they have to otherwise their partner gets upset.
Click to expand...

Nor is it a problem just because someone says.
 
P

perfectchaos007

Member
There are women who get pleasure from giving bj's, even though the benefactor is rather one sided. The reason why some women enjoy it is because while giving head they feel like they're in total control of the man in that moment, and they know they are making the man feel really good. Its a womans nature to be a nurturer and theres nothing more nurturing than a good blowjob so they get pleasure and satisfaction from making their man feel really really good. And thats okay, just like it is for a man to feel satisfaction from making his woman feel good.
 
P

Phrozenflame500

Member
After reading through the thread, some posters here do a good job establishing that even though this isn't fundamentally a bad thing it can be if it's combined with otherwise misogynist intent.

Which says to me you could probably make a decent article about this if you weren't a click-baiting trash publication like Cosmo.
 
H

Horse Detective

Why the long case?
I remember a comment from a female redditor saying how her boyfriend acts as though "he slayed a dragon" any time he made her cum.
This shit is only happening because tv and internet media in the 90's and 2000's made pleasing a woman sound like this impossible thing
for an average person to do.

The funny thing about it, those jokes are supposed to make women seem difficult. They actually just make men seem like they can't
listen to feedback, or are incapable of learning very basic things.
 
I

Imperfected

Member
Listen, I'm going to tell you a secret about society:

People are shit.

The entire point of society as a construct is to bully people into not acting like shit. This is done by making it to their benefit to not act like shit, or at least making it to their detriment to do so. This is why people don't act like shit constantly: because we all get together as a group and agree to make things easier and better for people who don't act like shit.

Part of this social contract is also politely pretending like everyone around you is actually a decent person and they aren't simply pretending to be decent because we're holding a proverbial gun to their head. Pretending like you don't know this and acting aghast every time it turns out someone doing nice things is only doing so because it triggers reward mechanisms in their neural chemistry or implicitly for the potential of future social or material rewards is, in fact, also a form of acting like shit.

Don't act like shit.
 
C

Chmpocalypse

Blizzard
backslashbunny said:
All I can say is, sincerely, I hope neither you nor your loved ones ever experience this...experience, then, because when it does happen, it's really not pleasant.
Click to expand...

Between this thread and the yoga pants one, I'm seriously wondering if a bunch of gamergaters infiltrated this place again.
 
D

Dartastic

Member
...this is the first time I've seen this thread. Cosmo historically obviously has no idea what a healthy sexual relationship is like so...... what's the problem?
 
D

Dead Man

Member
Dartastic said:
...this is the first time I've seen this thread. Cosmo historically obviously has no idea what a healthy sexual relationship is like so...... what's the problem?
Click to expand...

Lot's of people listen to their shitty advice so I reckon it's fair to be concerned when that advice is rubbish.
 
B

Buddha Beam

Banned
The girl I dated all through college was literally incapable of having an orgasm, I think. Not even the mighty Hitachi could get the job done. Only one time did I ever manage to get her going apeshit horny and you're damn right I celebrated.

Now I'm married to a woman who can get off on a riding mower, which always makes me feel like a champion for sure, but it's also like playing on easy mode.
 
H

Horp

Member
Chmpocalypse said:
Between this thread and the yoga pants one, I'm seriously wondering if a bunch of gamergaters infiltrated this place again.
Click to expand...
Can you stop it?
Pretty much everyone in here, men and women, is in agreement. Mods too, even the founder. If a bunch of gamergater has infiltrated as you say, does that mean that everyone, including EvilLore is a gamergater?
Maybe, just maybe, you're backing the wrong horse here? You're backing a fucking Cosmo article that uses a very questionable study then further misrepresents it to be provokative and to (just like most sex related Cosmo articles) claim people are doing the sex thing wrong and people should feel bad about it.
 
Rest

Rest

All these years later I still chuckle at what a fucking moron that guy is.
I don't know what to say about this idea that I keep seeing over and over that things that are good for anyone are bad for a woman if a man is involved. It's misandry for sure, but that's a word that if people started using it, it would be thrown around too much and misattributed to things which it is not. What would be a good word for it? The first thing that comes to mind is metafeminism, but that might also be too broad and become a bad descriptor.

Maybe PostLib? Because it always seem like it's something that wants to take away from things that make people's live better and more enjoyable, and wants to put barriers between people working together, making things easier and better for each other, and take options away from people, which is the opposite of the goal of women's liberation.
 
P

perfectchaos007

Member
Rest said:
I don't know what to say about this idea that I keep seeing over and over that things that are good for anyone are bad for a woman if a man is involved. It's misandry for sure, but that's a word that if people started using it, it would be thrown around too much and misattributed to things which it is not. What would be a good word for it? The first thing that comes to mind is metafeminism, but that might also be too broad and become a bad descriptor.

Maybe PostLib? Because it always seem like it's something that wants to take away from things that make people's live better and more enjoyable, and wants to put barriers between people working together, making things easier and better for each other, and take options away from people, which is the opposite of the goal of women's liberation.
Click to expand...

I think the media just pits everyone against eachother, because they know it gets people talking, and increases their viewership on our well-being's expense. This is a case of gender v. gender, but the media also loves race v. race, religion v. religion, democrat v. republican etc.

If this article was titled,
"Men and women both benefit from a female orgasm" would it get as many hits? No, because its not confrontational, not really controversial. The key is to make an underhanded or blatant attack on a group of people to get views, in this case its vilifying males and lo and behold men on this forum ( including myself ) feel obligated to defend ourselves.
 
M

ModestMouseTrap

Banned
There is something to be said about the way a man may pressure a woman to orgasm for the sake of his ego, but the way this article frames the whole thing is stupid. There is nothing inherently wrong with taking pride in pleasing your partner. As a matter of fact positive feelings are a large factor in all of it.

What is this article really trying to say? That a man's motives in making his partner have to be absolutely completely selfless? Devoid of pride or enjoyment? Those emotions are the engines and driving factors for a human to please another person (sexually or otherwise).

And we can talk about agency, but orgasms are a biological function, part of what makes them so thrilling is the loss of control in that release. This article and a few of the comments on this board seem to politicize it in the most bullshit nonsense way.

I forwarded this article to my girlfriend who is very strongly into feminist critique and think pieces and even she thought it was bullshit.

In a nutshell, it seems we've gone from "guys aren't concerned about women's pleasure, this is a problem!" To "guys motives for a women's pleasure arent right!"

Should men be mindful and listen to their partners needs and not pressure them? Yes. Absolutely!

But I don't think that's the same as not taking joy or pride in it.

Just my two cents. Don't kill me please.
 
TheRedSnifit

TheRedSnifit

Member
I once had a woman break down in tears because I wasn't feeling it. Then she tried to murder me a week later. I choose to believe these events were related.

Needless to say, I fake these days.
 
N

neorej

ERMYGERD!
Making a man cum is simple, stroke the dick and sperm comes out. Making a woman orgasm is a fine, delicate art that requires practice and patience before it's perfected. Fuck yeah I take some pride in achieving that shit. Hell, my fiancee takes pride in my ability to make her orgasm, too.
 
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