WickedLaharl
Member
well i was afraid that this might happen.
original VA not present, no involvement from vic, no sale
original VA not present, no involvement from vic, no sale
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XSeed giving LUNAR PSP a fresh translation
- Thread starter May16
- Start date
octopusman
Member
What? I didn't know you could upscale PSX games, I thought you could only use texture filters and stuff, how do you do that?God's Beard said:
Count of Monte Sawed-Off
un33dab@dpu$$y
Macstorm said:
Exactly! Fuck another Lunar remake let's move on to Lunar 3!
I don't think that's what you meant, but really does this game need to be remade again. How long until it surpasses FF1 in unnecessary remakes. If older RPGs really need to be remade, how about some different ones. The first 2 suikodens maybe. I would still like to see an HD Final Fantasy Tactics in 3D.
Hours Left
Member
I welcome the new translation. Considering it's a complete graphical overhaul and not just a port, using the exact same script would be awkward IMO.
While WD's translation were good at making the characters memorable, I personally was not fond of the abundance of pop culture references. I'm interested in seeing how a fresh take on the story will play out.
While WD's translation were good at making the characters memorable, I personally was not fond of the abundance of pop culture references. I'm interested in seeing how a fresh take on the story will play out.
I wish I could say that I'm even cautiously optimistic.
XSeed have outputted efforts solid enough to warrant giving them the benefit of the doubt.
I even welcome a fresher, more modern perspective on this Lunar revisit.
But even if they succeed with infusing the game with all of the charm that its predecessors benefited from, I'm still very concerned about the voice acting. While some of the characters were less-than-impressively voiced, I always rather liked Alex, Luna, and especially Ghaleon.
I just don't see them beating the existing voice work, and that really was a huge part of that charm.
Crossing my fingers. Can't wait to see (and hear) more.
Edit - Also very curious about the music. Is it being remixed? If so, then by whom? I'll sacrifice my Ghaleon puppet to the gaming gods if they restore (or remake) the standard battle theme from the Sega CD original, and get rid of the awful new song that sullied the PSOne and GBA incarnations...
XSeed have outputted efforts solid enough to warrant giving them the benefit of the doubt.
I even welcome a fresher, more modern perspective on this Lunar revisit.
But even if they succeed with infusing the game with all of the charm that its predecessors benefited from, I'm still very concerned about the voice acting. While some of the characters were less-than-impressively voiced, I always rather liked Alex, Luna, and especially Ghaleon.
I just don't see them beating the existing voice work, and that really was a huge part of that charm.
Crossing my fingers. Can't wait to see (and hear) more.
Edit - Also very curious about the music. Is it being remixed? If so, then by whom? I'll sacrifice my Ghaleon puppet to the gaming gods if they restore (or remake) the standard battle theme from the Sega CD original, and get rid of the awful new song that sullied the PSOne and GBA incarnations...
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
I see nothing wrong with a new translation if it's good to go with a new look and packaging of the game. The original Lunar translation is classic but hey now, it's getting pretty old.
That, and WD's references and humor has always been hit or miss. I'm interested in seeing a fresh translation for is own sake.
That, and WD's references and humor has always been hit or miss. I'm interested in seeing a fresh translation for is own sake.
charlequin
Banned
Ravidrath said:
"GAF" is (or rather, members who post to GAF are) upset that the translator of the two previous well-liked releases of the game, whose work was responsible for a great deal of the charm and appeal of Lunar, offered his services to work on the new version but was rebuffed.
I mean, seriously, just, like, read the thread.
Shouta
Member
Shame they aren't using the WD version as a base. There was still room for improvement in WD's version of Lunar and XSeed could've further improved it. Since they're working from scratch, they'll have to climb to the level of WD's translation then work to make it even better and that can be a tall order.
As for the game itself, without WD's work on the original, I think it would've been a fairly average game. Nothing particularly stand-out about it at all.
As for the game itself, without WD's work on the original, I think it would've been a fairly average game. Nothing particularly stand-out about it at all.
Macstorm said:
I'm generally a big fan of "something new." I like getting "something new!" I enjoy when developers try to give us "something new." But I don't really go looking for "something new" out of the third remake (not port, but remake) of a 16-bit game that I've been playing for over a dozen years, you know?
As far as game remakes go, my typical expectation is that the remake will improve upon things that were busted or not too great in the original while retaining with some degree of faithfulness the things that worked the first time around and made the game even worth remaking to begin with. In my opinion, the localization of Lunar fell into the latter category, not the former; it's the biggest thing about the game that I'd want to see faithfully maintained in remakes, not fixed. At the most, my preference would have been for, as mentioned previously, an FF6A/CTDS style touch-up job, not a built-from-the-ground-up effort, which is more what it sounds like we'll be getting here. I think those ports totally did a great job of retaining the bulk of Woolsey's very good work while just fixing or enhancing things here and there.
I haven't prejudged the game too harshly, and nor have I ruled out any intent to buy. But as I said, my interest has been significantly diminished; maybe I'll wait to buy it now, or maybe I'll buy it used. I'm really puzzled as to why some people are finding it difficult to understand why there'd be a reluctance to embrace this; I find it baffling that some folks are having a hard time understanding why, to anyone for whom the original localization was the biggest draw of Lunar, this would be disappointing news and potentially lost sale news.
Obviously I've still got my originals and I can still play those, and obviously XSEED is free to do whatever it wants; they bought the rights to the game, they can handle it as they see fit. But, you, voting with dollars and all that good stuff. I might still get it, but XSEED will have to sell me on it now... when before, they wouldn't have had to sell me, or probably any other fan of the original (quite successful!) Lunar; I would've said, 'hey, original game + spruced up visuals, easy buy.'
Calints Neos
Member
Was it this bad when chrono trigger DS came out?
ShockingAlberto
Member
I don't think it's all that baffling that people are not excited about a new translation.
While I am interested to see what becomes of this (although I am no fan of WD translations), if it were something I held near and dear, I am sure it would bother me and diminish my interest.
But it's not, so I'm looking forward to see how it works out.
While I am interested to see what becomes of this (although I am no fan of WD translations), if it were something I held near and dear, I am sure it would bother me and diminish my interest.
But it's not, so I'm looking forward to see how it works out.
Augemitbutter
Member
i do respect older WD translations, pop culture references excluded. but it won't come back and i'm more than ready to give the new one a chance. besides, i'm more interested to see the new gameplay, graphics and music anyway. i wonder if we'll see new music for the remake?
KibblesBits
Member
I'm glad they're using a new script. Those pop culture references are OLD.
And I don't like how someone in this thread compared Atlus to WD.
Oh hell no, that's not cool. :/ What the hell is wrong with you?
And I don't like how someone in this thread compared Atlus to WD.
Oh hell no, that's not cool. :/ What the hell is wrong with you?
RomanticHeroX
Member
All the love for the WD translation of Lunar exists entirely in a rose-tinted bubble of nostalgia. The only reason the voice acting seemed to be incredible is because it was pretty competent compared to the sea of crap it existed in at the time, whereas now any competent localization company can do a dub of at least the same quality. And Lunar GBA isn't a good example of what a non-WD Lunar would look like doesn't exactly hold up since Ubisoft isn't so much an RPG company, and I'm guessing that game didn't get too much budget to back it. The point is that an average localization effort by a competent studio today has every chance to completely surpass what was a good localization when set to the very low standards of the day.
DarknessTear
Banned
I don't like Lunar, so this doesn't bother me. I'll give it a chance when it comes out.
dark_preacher
Member
will not buy.
i still bleed working designs through and through. can't wait to see what vic has coming down the pipe.
i still bleed working designs through and through. can't wait to see what vic has coming down the pipe.
AtomskEater
Member
Expected. It's been years so getting all the same VAs would be costly, plus there's new scenes and probably updated dialog from the original stuff. The old translations will always exist, so this isn't bad news IMO. Xseed does pretty solid work.
Segata Sanshiro
Member
Oh man, I'm totally going to get on answering this question I already answered a day ago in this very thread.Lain said:
And again I ask, what's wrong with nostalgia? Particularly when we're talking about a re-release? If I was buying without the nearest hint of nostalgia as you mighty stone fortresses seem to, why would I be even remotely interested in an RPG as long in the tooth as Lunar?RomanticHeroX said:
Stop pointing the nostalgia finger around when the reason that 99% of you are interested in this remake is due to nostalgia yourselves.
There was a bit of griping about some key lines being changed (notably "but the future refused to change"), but that was a touched up Woolsey script, not a from-scratch rewrite.Calints Neos said:
Also, I think you'll find if you have people make a list of the five things they liked best about Chrono Trigger SNES, the translation isn't going to make a prominent appearance, while if you did the same for Lunar, the localization/dialogue is probably going to bogart the top two or three choices for most people.
I hate to put it this way because I like Lunar: SS better than Chrono Trigger, but if you replaced all the dialogue in both games with FFII SNES-circa trashlation, Chrono Trigger would mop the floor with Lunar so badly it wouldn't even be funny.
bernardobri
Steve, the dog with no powers that we let hang out with us all for some reason
Now I really wonder if I should wait for this revision or play the original on either PSX or SCD.
Prime crotch
Banned
Another Lunar remake? Doesn't Game Arts own better games to remake? Heck, remake Alisia Dragoon.
I'm surprised Lunar never got a fan retranslation with awful stilted dialogue
I'm surprised Lunar never got a fan retranslation with awful stilted dialogue
What I don't understand is that people don't think that XSEED is capable of creating an updated blend of old and new to retain the style that WD's script gave, but at the same time make it more true to the Japanese. Of course, the 90s references had to go.
And also, you have to wonder if there were more reasons for not taking Victor's help than just not feeling like it. Just because he was turned away doesn't mean they're not still aiming for something like WD did. I know for a fact that they have played older copies of Lunar, so they have a point of reference for what made them fun. I fear that Ubisoft's tainting of the series might still be too fresh in people's minds.
And also, you have to wonder if there were more reasons for not taking Victor's help than just not feeling like it. Just because he was turned away doesn't mean they're not still aiming for something like WD did. I know for a fact that they have played older copies of Lunar, so they have a point of reference for what made them fun. I fear that Ubisoft's tainting of the series might still be too fresh in people's minds.
Segata Sanshiro
Member
Don't think of it so much as a knock on XSEED (though I think they wouldn't know a decent joke if it bit them in the ass), more that, at least for myself, having Lunar translated by anyone other than Vic Ireland feels wrong. It's not the Lunar I love and I find it hard to get excited to buy a fourth version of the game with that in tow.Macstorm said:
As for the out-dated pop culture references, most of the outdated ones at the time Lunar:SSSC released in 1999 were removed, replaced, and updated. They could certainly be updated again, though I really question why out-the-way unimportant NPC dialogue has managed to characterize Lunar's entire localization with the "hardcore".
I can understand that, because I played both the Sega CD and PlayStation versions of both Lunar games and love what Working Designs did. I'm just not going to write off the XSEED translation until it shows me that I should.Segata Sanshiro said:
I'm actually more worried about the gameplay. If GameArts used the Legend/Genesis combat system, which looks possible, I'm not sure if I like that.
LocoMrPollock
Banned
RomanticHeroX said:
Bullshit. The voice work for Lunar and WD's other games, up until Growlanser are untouchable. If we're talking about jrpgs, anyway.
The crap that comes out today, not even close.
ethelred said:
I have been playing Lunar: Eternal Blue for PS1 over the past few weeks, my first time ever... Currently, I am up to the final battle
i.e. Zophar, then I have to do the epilogue quest
I'll buy the PSP port of Lunar, of course... but I am hoping it retains some of the WD 'character'.
duckroll said:If they wanted to actually pick up an oldschool 2D JRPG on the PSP which has never been localized before and would appeal to the same fanbase that liked WD games, they should have licensed Tengai Makyou 4th Apocalypse. Then they wouldn't even have to deal with this nonsense about retranslation.
I love you, ducky, for mentioning Tengai Makyou
Though I am holding out a far-fetched glimmer of hope that Gaijinworks gets their hands on that game ethelred said:
Wow, are you serious? Fuck them. Nobody says no to Vic Fucking Ireland when he asks to translate your game.
Lunar was, like a great many Working Designs games, notable mainly for what WD put into it - memorable translation, extravagant packaging, etc. They made even otherwise utterly mediocre games like Albert Odyssey worth playing. Without WD....it just isn't the same.
Kintaro said:
Macstorm said:
Well, er, I doubt that's what happened, but I also doubt they were asking for some sort of exorbitant fee. I mean, his first project was with Hudson of all companies, which is one of the cheapest and shoddiest publishers in the US marketplace. Considering that XSEED doesn't do any internal localization work, and all of their projects are outsourced to other companies (such as 8-4 or GaijinWorks) that specialize in localization, I'm not sure why people believe some sort of a deal couldn't have been worked out.
I don't know all the details of what went down, but I don't feel that I need to know the details. I don't find the business end of it particularly relevant. I am sure there are business details I'm not privy to here, just as there are business details that have guided decisions such as Nintendo declining to publish a whole host of its games in the west, or business decisions such as Sony deciding that ports or 2D games were undesirable products on its systems, or business decisions such as Ignition deciding against an English dub. I don't really care! I'm not Michael Pachter; it's not my job to analyze the business details behind the decisions companies make, just like the business details behind Sega's decision to pass on future Yakuza games because the first two were miserable failures hasn't stopped Kintaro from whining about that. I'm a consumer. Not relevant info.
My perspective is that I know GaijinWorks was interested in getting the deal, that it was offered, that it was declined, and that this diminished my interest in the game. This is a bad thing not because I intend to use the inability to reach a deal as a means to damning XSEED; it isn't cogent to me which end of the business operation was responsible for a deal not being reached, as all that matters to me is that the outcome I wanted hasn't come to pass. A Lunar without a Vic translation is less desirable regardless of whether the ultimate responsibility for that falls on Vic or on XSEED. I don't care much either way.
"God's Beard!"
Member
You can be damn sure this won't get a working designs-quality guide, either.
Kintaro said:
Sorry, but I miss Working Designs and Vic should be getting more work than he is now. Why did Working Designs have to die? Imagine if all the games brought over by XSeed and their ilk had been WD instead. Litte King Story wasn't bad, but WD would have been better. How does something like XSeed survive when WD couldn't?
True. Lots of this sounds like blind Vic fan worship. And while I fall into the category of loving most everything he did at WD, I'm not going to let him not working on something put a damper on it for me.Volcynika said:
Would I love another Vic Lunar game? Sure. Would I like him to have a chance at theoretical Lunar 3? Sure. Am I giving up on XSEED because of him not being involved? No.
Macstorm said:
You're right; I stand corrected. I know originally they weren't doing anything in-house, but I see now that some of their most recent projects have been handled by internal staff. I don't think this alters my central points, though -- they have still used external localization outfits often in the past and still use them frequently. 8-4 handled XSEED's localizations of Wild ARMs 5, Brave Story, and Wild ARMs XF, for instance. And it seems like even on projects (such as Retro Game Challenge and Little King's Story) where the translation is handled internally by XSEED, they're still licensing out other aspects of the localization such as the PR and quality assurance.
Macstorm said:
You can write it off in that way if you wish, but most of the people expressing disappointment have not come across as blind, but have rather posted fairly well reasoned explanations for that disappointment.
And as Segata noted, the "you're all being nostalgic" complaint is pretty laughable. Nostalgia is driving interest in the first place when it comes to the fourth remake of a game to be released in the US. If it wasn't for nostalgia of Lunar, there wouldn't have been nearly as many people who even cared to begin with when XSEED licensed the project. And when much of the nostalgia that people feel is tied up with a specific element, well... let's just say that the defenders can't invoke nostalgia to justify interest in the game and then decry it when it then stirs disinterest when the element people most cared for isn't replicated.
CO_Andy said:
The WD design translation has charm that cannot be easily reproduced. No one is saying that the translation is going to be bad, it even may be good. But, the WD translation itself takes Lunar:SSSC beyond average to pretty good and makes it a classic. The voice casting was excellent, the jokes lightened the moods, the characters were quite interesting. It will be very hard for Xseed to recapture this.
As for the people stating "well, all you complainers can go and play the old version"....thats the point. Much of the target audience for this loves the WD translation and are not interested in the new translation. This does not mean you cannot like it or that we are mad if you buy it. It just means we will not buy it. And it really is no skin off our backs.
And I do not dislike xseed, I like them. This is just one project i went from being very interested in to not caring about.
djtiesto said:I love you, ducky, for mentioning Tengai Makyou
Well, I've mentioned it many times, often even when Vic is in the thread. He loves the game too, and I know if he's able, and it makes sense, he'll want to do it. But since Gaijinworks hasn't really announced anything yet, I'm not going to be overly optimistic about the chances. :/
That's exactly my point. The element most people cared for was the charm of the localization. I agree with that exactly, but those upset that Vic isn't involved seem to automatically assume that XSEED couldn't do the same quality of work. That's where I have a problem; people assuming that only Victor Ireland can do Lunar. I'd like to give XSEED the benefit of the doubt and at least see what they have to offer before I write it off or get disinterested.ethelred said: