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Armband-wearing Nazi roams Seattle instigating, gets KOed, removes armband and leaves

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Or their people start to think twice before going outside and maybe they even reconsider their stances altogether. Lets go for that one.

But yeah, we definitely should smack the shit out of them in groups, too.

That second part didn't happen with Richard Spencer. In fact, all we usually get is we keep that specific person from going out so publicly. In the meantime, harassment will continue via other avenues.

Punching doesn't begin to solve the problem. Congratulations, one loud, obnoxious Nazi isn't going to be loud and obnoxious anymore. The fact that we know this is a large-scale issue, yet you only have a few who are as outgoing as this guy is telling.
 

sirap

Member
So wait? At the end of it all. The guy who threw the punch was the one the Neo Nazi was harassing? What's the issue?

"Violence isn't the answer"

"We need to talk with these people and understand their point of view"

"Mental illness"

"Free speech"

+ something about muslims
 

Sibylus

Banned
It's basically a slippery slope test.

As I posted above, I'm trying to guage how much violence is acceptable to some people when stuff like this happens.

A punch? Murder?

I think people are being way to cavalier with their responses in here.

But maybe it's just me that's concerned about it?

I don't know. That's why I'm asking hypotheticals.

I have a question for you, while we're posing them.

At what threshold is violence against Nazism acceptable in your eyes?


  1. Private assemblies, political incorporation
  2. Formalized extremist creeds
  3. Public assemblies
  4. Formal security personnel
  5. Public speeches and lectures
  6. Brawling with political opponents
  7. Riot-as-revolution
  8. Vandalism
  9. Dodgy pardons
  10. Growing membership and political participation
  11. Discharging firearms against political opponents
  12. Martyrdom
  13. Political gains
  14. Political mainstream
  15. Anti-minority vandalism
  16. Political alliances, political coalition
  17. Government inaction
  18. Executive office
  19. Arson, false-flagging
  20. Partial political party bans
  21. Emergency, unlimited executive powers
  22. Full political party bans
  23. Political purges
  24. Permanent, unlimited executive powers
  25. Concentration camps for political enemies
  26. Laws discriminating against minorities
  27. Desertion of international causes and organizations
  28. Violation of international treaties
  29. Proxy wars
  30. Annexation of border regions
  31. Annexation of the rest
  32. Pogroms of minorities
  33. Invades a neighbor
  34. Segregates minorities into ghettoes
  35. Moves minorities into death camps
 

Wamb0wneD

Member
DB5b7ni.png

This is damn good.

Considering the dude is black it's not like much would change anyway

Is he though? Might as well be a white dude who got some sun on him.
 

The Kree

Banned
That second part didn't happen with Richard Spencer. In fact, all we usually get is we keep that specific person from going out so publicly. In the meantime, harassment will continue via other avenues.

Punching doesn't begin to solve the problem. Congratulations, one loud, obnoxious Nazi isn't going to be loud and obnoxious anymore. The fact that we know this is a large-scale issue, yet you only have a few who are as outgoing as this guy is telling.

We just haven't done it enough yet. Give it time. These people are stupid, they're slow to learn. They'll get it eventually.
 

spidye

Member
If I continue to readmore posts in this thread I'm pretty sure to get a ruptured brain aneurysm

Mentaly ill excuse
Rapists
Quoting Adolf Hitler


god damn it
 

xBladeM6x

Member
This is an incredibly insulting take on the Russian contribution to the war effort.
How? They sacrificed the most. The most important loss is human lives, and they gave the most by a long shot. They were the bulk of the manpower that pushed back the Nazis.
 

NervousXtian

Thought Emoji Movie was good. Take that as you will.
Also 800mg of THC? Like goddamn dude.

Not really, tolerance is a bitch. :/

Edit: Dude got rekt and he deserved it

Tolerance or not, 800mg would make you comatose.

10mg is a basic starter serving.

You also don't gain tolerance the same way to edibles you do to smoking.. and eating that much would just mean you are wasting money. Besides it would suck.

Someone eating 100mg is usually enough to make someone absolutely regret eating that much.

10mg is enough to get almost anyone pretty damn high.
 

GaimeGuy

Volunteer Deputy Campaign Director, Obama for America '16
Well, throwing out any option of modhood down the trash shoot, I actually concur with Iapetus that violence can never be considered justified 'just because'. I know that's not something US people like to hear, but that is how things work in Europe. No vigilante justice, no mob justice, only justice by law will stand.

The trade-off is that we have hate speech laws, and far stricter approaches to anything resembling neo-nazi rallies, and violence used by any individual regardless of their motivation. Punching people because you don't like them is something that cannot be avoided, but the potential medical costs resulting from it (and if brain damage does occur, this result can be a vast array of negative outcomes) are on the aggressor.
Even military police, despite having a state-granted sanction on applying a certain degree of violence, are held to standards of only using what is necessary. Europe isn't the US. If a cop fucks up by shooting somebody, that cop is going to jail until a court has sorted it out. That being a court independent of what the state wants, meaning states and their monopoly on violence are kept in check. This division of power is held to be solid in Europe, but only exist theoretically in the US, as the Trump presidency has increasingly demonstrated on all ends.

So yeah, when Iapetus is talking about a "ideological position", he's referring to privately held beliefs that do not directly violate the law or cause harm to others as understood in the EU. So he's not talking about this guy or some Charlottesville rally guy, as those people would find themselves being swept up by MP and in jail by the end of the day.
Because justice is a matter for laws that we've all agreed on, not some vigilante or mob.

I know that this sentiment gets lost in translation, but perhaps that is why you find yourselves where you are now to begin with. Instead of quoting Hannah Arendt and others on the existential philosophy and banality of evil, perhaps you should read them and how it effected actual policy and government.

I actually thought the same thing when the OP of this thread started with a Twitter account specifically targeting an individual. It may feel satisfying, but it's still targeted assault. Also, making potential martyrs out of people has literally never paid off. Imagine if his landing had been unfortunate, and how media reactions would have played out. If you want us to cheer for your narrowly avoided martyr caused by amateurs at politics...
In the US, "Kill that particular Jew" is not protected speech, but, unfortunately, "Kill all Jews" is protected speech because it is considered hyperbole, not targeted, or not imminently actionable.

We refuse to acknowledge the destructive potential of speech.
 
But please stop attacking people who speak up against violence. It doesn't mean they support nazis.
When people get morally sanctimonious and judgmental at others when being against violence towards Nazis ("I'm disturbed by people in this thread violence isn't okay"), that's when they're called out.
 

ZOONAMI

Junior Member
So YouTube pulls down a video of a nazi getting punched for their harassment and bullying policy, but are totally fine with giving racists a huge platform to make bank with.

Hmmm.
 

Mr_Moogle

Member
How? They sacrificed the most. The most important loss is human lives, and they gave the most by a long shot. They were the bulk of the manpower that pushed back the Nazis.

Russians did a hell of a lot more than just throw waves of men at the enemy. They utterly destroyed the German invasion on both the tactical and strategic level.
 
When people get morally sanctimonious and judgmental at others when being against violence towards Nazis ("I'm disturbed by people in this thread violence isn't okay"), that's when they're called out.

Considering anybody anti-violent vigilantism is pretty immediately dogpiled on as a "white moderate" on the forum these days, it's not as though the sanctimony is unilateral.
 

blackflag

Member
Something along the lines of people being able to stand for their political beliefs.

Right, he basically equated being a nazi to having a normal run of the mill political belief. I can't speak for his intention but that's the way it came across. Like we shouldn't punch people (nazis) because of their political beliefs.
 

Jeremy

Member
Can you imagine if you were a PoC and went out walking with a GAFfer and stumbled across this dude?

You'd have to ride the line between having your humanity harassed and desecrated on a public sidewalk, while trying not to offend your companion by reacting or saying anything except listening intently because they're actually super fucking passionate about allowing this guy his freedom of speech, no matter the cost to you or anyone else.
 

ZeoVGM

Banned
I remember one mod arguing anyone who defended harassing Ivanka Trump was wrong and bad and would probably be banned. Looks like the times are changing.

I mean... that's not remotely the same situation.

I think a Nazi sympathizing mod would have been de-modded then too.
 

slider

Member
What if.......... I was born white. So I didn't have to put up with people hating me for my skin colour.

Serious or not, that's the saddest thing I've heard. I've heard a couple of people say it irl so it messes with my humanity.

Nothing but love, Beefy. Even though you're a Saints fan.
 
Can you imagine if you were a PoC and went out walking with a GAFfer and stumbled across this dude?

You'd have to ride the line between having your humanity harassed and desecrated on a sidewalk in public, while trying not offending your companion by reacting or saying anything except listening intently because they're actually super fucking passionate about allowing this guy his freedom of speech, no matter the cost to you or anyone else.

I punch that nazi across the face, turn the gafer and say:

Icestorm.gif
 

Principate

Saint Titanfall
Well, throwing out any option of modhood down the trash shoot, I actually concur with Iapetus that violence can never be considered justified 'just because'. I know that's not something US people like to hear, but that is how things work in Europe. No vigilante justice, no mob justice, only justice by law will stand.

The trade-off is that we have hate speech laws, and far stricter approaches to anything resembling neo-nazi rallies, and violence used by any individual regardless of their motivation. Punching people because you don't like them is something that cannot be avoided, but the potential medical costs resulting from it (and if brain damage does occur, this result can be a vast array of negative outcomes) are on the aggressor.
Even military police, despite having a state-granted sanction on applying a certain degree of violence, are held to standards of only using what is necessary. Europe isn't the US. If a cop fucks up by shooting somebody, that cop is going to jail until a court has sorted it out. That being a court independent of what the state wants, meaning states and their monopoly on violence are kept in check. This division of power is held to be solid in Europe, but only exist theoretically in the US, as the Trump presidency has increasingly demonstrated on all ends.

So yeah, when Iapetus is talking about a "ideological position", he's referring to privately held beliefs that do not directly violate the law or cause harm to others as understood in the EU. So he's not talking about this guy or some Charlottesville rally guy, as those people would find themselves being swept up by MP and in jail by the end of the day.
Because justice is a matter for laws that we've all agreed on, not some vigilante or mob.

I know that this sentiment gets lost in translation, but perhaps that is why you find yourselves where you are now to begin with. Instead of quoting Hannah Arendt and others on the existential philosophy and banality of evil, perhaps you should read them and how it effected actual policy and government.

I actually thought the same thing when the OP of this thread started with a Twitter account specifically targeting an individual. It may feel satisfying, but it's still targeted assault. Also, making potential martyrs out of people has literally never paid off. Imagine if his landing had been unfortunate, and how media reactions would have played out. If you want us to cheer for your narrowly avoided martyr caused by amateurs at politics...
The obvious problem being they are not in Europe the police force is filled with racists and there's a reason why the dude hasn't faced any trouble by the police in questions to this point.

This isn't an argument about how you should act in a just and reasonably policed society it's about the question of how you should act without. Sending a strongly worded letter to the police or the now Nazi in question is hardly going prevent their further harassment so how would you act in that situation when not in the Europe?
 
Something along the lines of people being able to stand for their political beliefs.

Right, he basically equated being a nazi to having a normal run of the mill political belief. I can't speak for his intention but that's the way it came across. Like we shouldn't punch people (nazis) because of their political beliefs.

Ah right.
Yeah people should be better educated about what nazis really did....
It's sad. And dumb... there is no real logical reason for an american to become a Neonazi.. Make up something new if you have to but most don't even have a clue of what Nazis did and what they stood for.
It's not the NSDAP with some political agenda. It's glorifying some of the most horrific stuf that happened.
 

jay

Member
I mean... that's not remotely the same situation.

I think a Nazi sympathizing mod would have been de-modded then too.

It's not the same because it is actually much less controversial to give a Trump verbal shit. Arguing that was intolerable was far more moderate than arguing you shouldn't punch Nazis. The conversation moved from don't be rude to Ivanka to don't be violent in the streets, even to people who deserve it.

Upon reflection, I understand your position. I think you are saying hitting a Nazi is actually less controversial, though I disagree. We are taught propaganda of nonviolence from the day we are born and it is very ingrained in people. The point to most people arguing against the violence is not who was punched but that a punch was thrown.
 
What if.......... I was born white. So I didn't have to put up with people hating me for my skin colour.
Whites get so much benefit of the doubt I would probably engage in criminal activity if I were born white. Being Black in America has made me a model citizen.
 
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