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Fitness |OT3| BroScience, Protein Dysentery, XXL Calf Implants, and Squat Rack Hogs

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One time a guy got pissed that I was using the rack for pressing. I would have asked if he wanted to work in but he walked away all huffy.

I don't think it matters what you are using the rack for, so long as you are using it for some purpose and mindful of people waiting. I'd rather someone do their sets of curls and get out than wait for a group of guys talking and squatting, just cuz I know from experience that talking lengthens the workout. Or worse, guys who set up all their shit in the rack and then do a circuit.
 

Ashhong

Member
Whoa guys, lets all become bros and hug it out. That is what bros do right?

I noticed my grip when doing 165lb deadlift was slipping today. The bar was practically at my fingertips when I brought them up. I'm thinking I should switch to the reverse grip I think it's called? Does it matter which hand is reversed?
 

Izick

Member
One time a guy got pissed that I was using the rack for pressing. I would have asked if he wanted to work in but he walked away all huffy.

I don't think it matters what you are using the rack for, so long as you are using it for some purpose and mindful of people waiting. I'd rather someone do their sets of curls and get out than wait for a group of guys talking and squatting, just cuz I know from experience that talking lengthens the workout. Or worse, guys who set up all their shit in the rack and then do a circuit.

That was my stance from the start.

If someone needed the squat rack for something, then I would gladly give it to them. I have no qualms with giving it up to someone who needs it for an exercise. I just don't think it's a big deal to use it if it's been unattended, and doesn't look like anyone is about to use it.

Whoa guys, lets all become bros and hug it out. That is what bros do right?

I noticed my grip when doing 165lb deadlift was slipping today. The bar was practically at my fingertips when I brought them up. I'm thinking I should switch to the reverse grip I think it's called? Does it matter which hand is reversed?

Hey, I have nothing against the guy, other than him calling me those things, but I think I understand why he did. If I came off as arogent, or selfish, then I just want to say I wasn't trying to, and that's not really the kind of person I am.

Oh, when I dead-lift I always go one hand overhand, one hand underhand, try that next time Ashhong. Oh and no it really doesn't matter, but I suggest you flip which hand is every once in a while.
 

Ashhong

Member
Hey, I have nothing against the guy, other than him calling me those things, but I think I understand why he did. If I came off as arogent, or selfish, then I just want to say I wasn't trying to, and that's not really the kind of person I am.

Oh, when I dead-lift I always go one hand overhand, one hand underhand, try that next time Ashhong.

Seems like you guys got way out of hand over just one little power rack argument. Luckily hardly anyone uses the power rack at my gym when I go. I do squats and OHP in them no problem. Would do curls too if I did straight bar curls.

I had been doing relatively low weight previously, so I just did both overhand with no problems. I take it it doesn't matter which hand I make go underhand? Man deadlifts are getting hard.
 

Izick

Member
Seems like you guys got way out of hand over just one little power rack argument. Luckily hardly anyone uses the power rack at my gym when I go. I do squats and OHP in them no problem. Would do curls too if I did straight bar curls.

I had been doing relatively low weight previously, so I just did both overhand with no problems. I take it it doesn't matter which hand I make go underhand? Man deadlifts are getting hard.

No, no it doesn't matter which you go underhand with, I always preferred going under-hand with my right hand, and I'm right handed if that makes a difference. Like I said though, it's good to switch them up every once in a while to increase grip strength.
 

Timedog

good credit (by proxy)
You acted like I said "yeah, I'm going to use the squat rack for whatever I want, when I want, and if they don't like it, fuck em'," which is not what I expressed at all.

TBH, that's kind of how this part came off:

iblO0nKfoILQF7.gif


Love it. I do this every time that I do BB curls, bitches.

If you didn't mean it that way, fair enough.
 

Cheeto

Member
I just don't see the point of barbell curls when every gym I've ever been to has a ton of preloaded straight and ez bars that you can use anywhere.
 

Timedog

good credit (by proxy)
I just don't see the point of barbell curls when every gym I've ever been to has a ton of preloaded straight and ez bars that you can use anywhere.
I've been to gyms that only have preloaded EZ bars. Plus those only usually go up to like 100 or 110.
 

MjFrancis

Member
I had been doing relatively low weight previously, so I just did both overhand with no problems. I take it it doesn't matter which hand I make go underhand? Man deadlifts are getting hard.
Is the bolded referring to deadlifts? I would suggest keeping everything overhand until the weight gets a good bit heavier. Others will disagree, perhaps even vehemently, but I see value in a novice lifter keeping their grip strength from falling behind early in the game.
 

Izick

Member
TBH, that's kind of how this part came off:



If you didn't mean it that way, fair enough.

I was just joking, hence the gif and the "bitches." I was just poking fun with those two things because I know a lot of people get up in arms about it, no pun intended.

I understand how you could see it like that though.

Is the bolded referring to deadlifts? I would suggest keeping everything overhand until the weight gets a good bit heavier. Others will disagree, perhaps even vehemently, but I see value in a novice lifter keeping their grip strength from falling behind early in the game.

I've always liked doing the one over, one under method, just because it's always felt more natural, but to each their own.
 

Petrie

Banned
I've always liked doing the one over, one under method, just because it's always felt more natural, but to each their own.

It isn't about "to each their own". Double overhand is going to develop your grip strength better. There is no "to each their own" about it.
 

Izick

Member
It isn't about "to each their own". Double overhand is going to develop your grip strength better. There is no "to each their own" about it.

I'm saying I prefer one under, one over, I never said that builds more grip strength or that is "right", I was just saying it is what I prefer more.
 

Izick

Member
Yes, but the discussion was about what was more beneficial. Saying "to each their own" indicates that it should just be about personal preference, and it isn't.

It is a personal preference as to which feels more natural or better, but I never said it was better for your grip. If he was saying it was more beneficial, then I wasn't disputing that, I was just saying that the other way just felt more natural to me.
 

MjFrancis

Member
Going double overhand for a novice is beneficial for more than just grip strength, too. It helps maintain proper posture during the movement, especially critical for a novice. There's no chance of a shoulder floating in front of the other since both will be on the exact same horizontal plane as the bar. The elbows are easier to lock and arms easier to use as "rope" rather than as active synergists, in which failure to apply results in dangers such as a torn biceps tendon at higher weights.

When the weight gets heavier and form is down, I believe the mixed-grip has it's place. It's a better option that straps, since your grip is still being worked, just not as well. It's wise to change up which hand you supinate, so as to build strength and muscle a little more evenly in the long run. It's also wise not to rely on it, perhaps saving it for the occasional high-intensity set. Intensity being a percentage of your one-rep max, not sweat equity as most people translate it.

Personally I mix-grip on occasion but usually just for a warm-up set and my final 5/3/1 set, usually on week three. Rippetoe has yet to knock down my door and kick my ass for doing so.
 

Izick

Member
If you're on a bulk, how would one continue to hit abs? Obviously you don't want to unnecessarily burn calories, but I still think I should work abs in more.
 

kylej

Banned
Direct ab work seems crazy to me. Kinda hard to squat, or bench, or overhead press, or deadlift, or row, or whatever without working the shit out of your abs. If you want to see them, just stay lean.
 

Ashhong

Member
Is the bolded referring to deadlifts? I would suggest keeping everything overhand until the weight gets a good bit heavier. Others will disagree, perhaps even vehemently, but I see value in a novice lifter keeping their grip strength from falling behind early in the game.

How heavy are we talking? Like I said earlier, the bar felt like it was slipping from me, hence my desire to switch it up. When I was in the up position, the bar was almost resting on my fingertips. I don't think thats right
 

Cheeto

Member
If you're on a bulk, how would one continue to hit abs? Obviously you don't want to unnecessarily burn calories, but I still think I should work abs in more.

Do you do standing barbell presses? Try finishing some sets by holding that bitch above your head for a count...if you don't feel your core after that then I don't know what to tell you.
 
How heavy are we talking? Like I said earlier, the bar felt like it was slipping from me, hence my desire to switch it up. When I was in the up position, the bar was almost resting on my fingertips. I don't think thats right

Switch it up, it starts to affect your form when you have to think about it.
 
I've been severely obese throughout my childhood (reached a max of 285lbs/5"10 at 16yo), worked my way down very slowly to a personal record of 155lbs (8% bf) just 2 months ago (now 23yo), I occasionally tried to bulk up but nothing serious/well prepared.

2 Months ago I decided it's time to put on some serious muscles, so I've been working out really hard and eating well while sticking to beginners rules (compound lifts, recovery... etc).

Today was arms day, I was shocked at the pump I got in my arms, OMG those veins:

http://clip2net.com/clip/m40331/1331663642-clip-550kb.jpg
http://clip2net.com/clip/m40331/1331662826-clip-449kb.jpg

This is awesome!
 

Izick

Member
Do you do standing barbell presses? Try finishing some sets by holding that bitch above your head for a count...if you don't feel your core after that then I don't know what to tell you.

No, actually usually do seated, I could definitely give it a shot though. Thanks!


I've been severely obese throughout my childhood (reached a max of 285lbs/5"10 at 16yo), worked my way down very slowly to a personal record of 155lbs (8% bf) just 2 months ago (now 23yo), I occasionally tried to bulk up but nothing serious/well prepared.

2 Months ago I decided it's time to put on some serious muscles, so I've been working out really hard and eating well while sticking to beginners rules (compound lifts, recovery... etc).

Today was arms day, I was shocked at the pump I got in my arms, OMG those veins:

http://clip2net.com/clip/m40331/1331663642-clip-550kb.jpg
http://clip2net.com/clip/m40331/1331662826-clip-449kb.jpg

This is awesome!

Good job man! There's really no rush like the pump you get from working out. I'm glad that you stuck with it, when losing so much weight, and now you want to look even better!
 

Veezy

que?
If you're on a bulk, how would one continue to hit abs? Obviously you don't want to unnecessarily burn calories, but I still think I should work abs in more.
The question reads a bit confusing to me.

If your asking how you can continue to hit abs, you can do additional core work should you desire. I find heavy dumbbell side bends, toes/knees to bar while hanging, and planks are solid for abdominal work and should also assit with making compound strength exercises better. However, depending on your amount of experience in the gym that type of work may not be needed at all.

If the question is in regards to having a defined abdominal region while on a bulk, that can prove difficult depending on your body type. While putting on weight, one must "embrace the smooth" and understand that, while you don't have to get fat, eating enough calories is going to require some sacrifice in aesthetics.
 
Reading this thread is so frustrating. Why are a lot of you so militant on minor issues? So what if someone wants to do curls in the squat rack if no one is using it. 99% of the time when i'm in the gym i'm alone, and I get the impression that a lot of you would be pissed off at me curling in the rack even though there is no one else in the building.

It isn't about "to each their own". Double overhand is going to develop your grip strength better. There is no "to each their own" about it.

Even if I did feel my grip strength in the deadlift was lacking, then I would still not do normal double overhand deadlifts with an olympic bar, but single-arm deadlifts, or double overhand deadlift with a thick 2- 3" bar, or a whole host of other exercises such as farmer's walks and weighted hangs. It is about "to each their own".

However, for a novice, I do agree with MjFrancis. No need to go too heavy before you are ready.
 

Kwhit10

Member
My thing is people say "I only use the squat rack to curl when no one is using it."

Well no shit. I use the squat rack to squat when no one is using it too.
 

MjFrancis

Member
How heavy are we talking? Like I said earlier, the bar felt like it was slipping from me, hence my desire to switch it up. When I was in the up position, the bar was almost resting on my fingertips. I don't think thats right
How many reps and on what set is it slipping from your fingers? I've experienced that sensation in the past. If you are lifting 1.5x - 2.0x your bodyweight for reps I don't think a final set (and warm-up set) of deadlifts with a mixed-grip are going to cause problems. Much less and I might recommend grip-specific work or a 10% drop in weight until your grip catches up. Farmer's walks, barbell shoulder shrugs and bar hangs for time are my favorite grip strengtheners.

Either way should assist your deadlifts well. Ask away if I left anything out.
 

Veezy

que?
How many reps and on what set is it slipping from your fingers? I've experienced that sensation in the past. If you are lifting 1.5x - 2.0x your bodyweight for reps I don't think a final set (and warm-up set) of deadlifts with a mixed-grip are going to cause problems. Much less and I might recommend grip-specific work or a 10% drop in weight until your grip catches up. Farmer's walks, barbell shoulder shrugs and bar hangs for time are my favorite grip strengtheners.

Either way should assist your deadlifts well. Ask away if I left anything out.

I'll piggyback off this to say:

Make sure you're using chalk, if your gym allows it. Also, one arm dumbbell rows work great for grip strength, too.
 

Ashhong

Member
How many reps and on what set is it slipping from your fingers? I've experienced that sensation in the past. If you are lifting 1.5x - 2.0x your bodyweight for reps I don't think a final set (and warm-up set) of deadlifts with a mixed-grip are going to cause problems. Much less and I might recommend grip-specific work or a 10% drop in weight until your grip catches up. Farmer's walks, barbell shoulder shrugs and bar hangs for time are my favorite grip strengtheners.

Either way should assist your deadlifts well. Ask away if I left anything out.

I am doing the StrongLift program, so I am only doing 5 reps and 1 set. It slipped for the first time the other day at 165. I weigh 135, so not quite 1.5x. I am also using gloves, so maybe I'll try taking those off next time?

I know you guys say not to use gloves in general, but lets get past that. I like them. If it is holding me back in DL though, I'll try without them.

My thing is people say "I only use the squat rack to curl when no one is using it."

Well no shit. I use the squat rack to squat when no one is using it too.

You really don't understand what people mean by that? They mean they won't try to work in when someone is doing squats or something. Only use it to curl when its completely unused and wont bother anyone. You can use the squat rack to share when someone else is squatting.
 

SeigO

Banned
You should try using a hexagon bar.

For some reason I was struggling to do 225 on DL's because I constantly felt like I was going to drop the bar. But I switched to using a hexagon bar a few months ago and I'm having 0 grip problems at 300+. Now I'm limited by what I can lift rather than by my grip, I'm not sure what the difference is though.
 
My thing is people say "I only use the squat rack to curl when no one is using it."

Well no shit. I use the squat rack to squat when no one is using it too.

If there are multiple squat racks, and none are being used, I can KINDA think this is acceptable. But if anyone is in a squat rack, or in the room and obviously looking for a rack, you better not be curling in it.

Go use a bench for curls. Since most gyms will have 2x the number of bench stations vs squat racks--no harm done.

I know you guys say not to use gloves in general, but lets get past that. I like them. If it is holding me back in DL though, I'll try without them.

In some situations, gloves may "help" your grip based on the fabric, but overall, it's much harder to develop actual grip strength if you're using gloves. Use chalk, instead.
 

Veezy

que?
I am doing the StrongLift program, so I am only doing 5 reps and 1 set. It slipped for the first time the other day at 165. I weigh 135, so not quite 1.5x. I am also using gloves, so maybe I'll try taking those off next time?

I know you guys say not to use gloves in general, but lets get past that. I like them. If it is holding me back in DL though, I'll try without them.

The reason why gloves are, generally, frowned upon is they do, slightly, hold back your grip strength and they're less safe. You're effectively wrapping a piece of fabric around the bar before grabbing it.

Using your bare hands will help you get more solid lifts, especially with the DL. Just be sure to keep the inevitable callouses in check.
 

BeesEight

Member
Doesn't your gym have dumbells, barbells, racks, machines, etc.?

The key (or at least have of the key) to gaining size is eating a lot, more importantly eating the right stuff a lot. If you can do that, and train hard, you should see results.

It has an all-in-one machine and a really small selection of dumbbells. No barbells or even higher end weights. It mostly contains treadmills and rowers. It's just a tiny community gym that's obviously used more losing weight than gaining.

I'll start focussing more on my diet. It's definitely something I've neglected though I have been eating more.
 
I am doing the StrongLift program, so I am only doing 5 reps and 1 set. It slipped for the first time the other day at 165. I weigh 135, so not quite 1.5x. I am also using gloves, so maybe I'll try taking those off next time?

I know you guys say not to use gloves in general, but lets get past that. I like them. If it is holding me back in DL though, I'll try without them.

You really don't understand what people mean by that? They mean they won't try to work in when someone is doing squats or something. Only use it to curl when its completely unused and wont bother anyone. You can use the squat rack to share when someone else is squatting.

Like others have said, no gloves is really the way to go for your best grip. In addition, use chalk or a mixed group if it's starting to become an issue.

On a positive note, I remember that you started not that long ago and you seem to be making good progress. Congrats and keep it up. Your grip will get stronger in time.
 

Izick

Member
If there are multiple squat racks, and none are being used, I can KINDA think this is acceptable. But if anyone is in a squat rack, or in the room and obviously looking for a rack, you better not be curling in it.

Go use a bench for curls. Since most gyms will have 2x the number of bench stations vs squat racks--no harm done.

My gym has like around 6 (give or take one) flat benches and 4 squat racks. There's always at least 3 flat benches being used at any time. If there's one person on a squat rack, then I'm going to use one of the other 3 to curl, because it's really not going to affect anything. If people use up the other two, then I'm cautious to see if someone near by is waiting or looking at the squat rack I'm at. I've moved in the past, and I'll move again in the future.

At the end of the day, it doesn't really matter, because none of us go to the same gym, and I've explained multiple times why I said what I said. Nobody has ever given me question about it in my gym, and I'm acquaintances with most of the people there, so I think somebody would have been comfortable enough to ask or confront me on it, if it really was a problem.

I'm done arguing over this because it's stupid, dumb bullshit at this point. It's devolved into saying the same things over and over again. I get it, a lot of you think it's an unnecessary luxury to use, I don't. I think it's fine if it's not inconveniencing anyone trying to actually do squats. That's just how it is.
 

balddemon

Banned
I was forced to use gloves for a couple weeks for pullups and deadlifts because at the bottom joint on my middle finger, it was literally split open. Couldn't pick the bar up or do a pullup without them, or it just re opened the wound. Annoying as hell.

--

Did some accessory work today for what I did yesterday, minus legs. Pullups, machine rear flyes, arnold press, and lateral/front shoulder raises. All 3x8. My arms are tired lol. Also, I'm starting to ride my bike to and from work (10 miles total) and stopping at the gym on the way home. I am starving when I get home, I guess I am gonna eat more calories at lunch or something.
 

Izick

Member
I was forced to use gloves for a couple weeks for pullups and deadlifts because at the bottom joint on my middle finger, it was literally split open. Couldn't pick the bar up or do a pullup without them, or it just re opened the wound. Annoying as hell.

--

Did some accessory work today for what I did yesterday, minus legs. Pullups, machine rear flyes, arnold press, and lateral/front shoulder raises. All 3x8. My arms are tired lol. Also, I'm starting to ride my bike to and from work (10 miles total) and stopping at the gym on the way home. I am starving when I get home, I guess I am gonna eat more calories at lunch or something.

Shit, is the wound still re-healing when you're using gloves?
 

Ashhong

Member
You should try using a hexagon bar.

For some reason I was struggling to do 225 on DL's because I constantly felt like I was going to drop the bar. But I switched to using a hexagon bar a few months ago and I'm having 0 grip problems at 300+. Now I'm limited by what I can lift rather than by my grip, I'm not sure what the difference is though.

Not available at my gym, LA Fitness

Like others have said, no gloves is really the way to go for your best grip. In addition, use chalk or a mixed group if it's starting to become an issue.

On a positive note, I remember that you started not that long ago and you seem to be making good progress. Congrats and keep it up. Your grip will get stronger in time.

I will definitely try DL with no gloves. I haven't had any grip issues with anything else I do, squats, OHP, bench press. If I start having problems with pendlay rows I will also try no gloves. My hands tend to blister up very easily to the point where I can't lift while they're "open".

Thanks, I am in week 6 of Stronglifts, and I am definitely seeing improvements. Going pretty well so far :)
 

balddemon

Banned
Shit, is the wound still re-healing when you're using gloves?

It's gone now, but it probably didn't help that I kept lifting. The gloves did help protect it, and stopped the bandaid from sliding off constantly. So I could actually WEAR a bandaid instead of my finger goin raw dog. To give you an idea of hte severity, I couldn't really open my hand all the way without resplitting it. Had to be really careful
 

Izick

Member
Not available at my gym, LA Fitness



I will definitely try DL with no gloves. I haven't had any grip issues with anything else I do, squats, OHP, bench press. If I start having problems with pendlay rows I will also try no gloves. My hands tend to blister up very easily to the point where I can't lift while they're "open".

Thanks, I am in week 6 of Stronglifts, and I am definitely seeing improvements. Going pretty well so far :)

Where exactly do your hands blister up? Right under like where the fingers start to come out, on the inside of your palm?

I remember that would happen to me as well, but you work through it. Eventually they will just harden up and be rough, I don't quite remember how long it took me to adjust though. Obviously if they're impairing your grip, then you might want to try another solution. I say just try and work it out and through the pain at first, unless it's unbearable, or they're bleeding, or something like that.

EDIT:
It's gone now, but it probably didn't help that I kept lifting. The gloves did help protect it, and stopped the bandaid from sliding off constantly. So I could actually WEAR a bandaid instead of my finger goin raw dog. To give you an idea of hte severity, I couldn't really open my hand all the way without resplitting it. Had to be really careful

Youch, maybe you could try some more padding inside the gloves or something? Just make sure it heals up again all the way before attempting anything bare-handed, since we don't want that wound to re-open and set you back.
 

Ashhong

Member
Where exactly do your hands blister up? Right under like where the fingers start to come out, on the inside of your palm?

I remember that would happen to me as well, but you work through it. Eventually they will just harden up and be rough, I don't quite remember how long it took me to adjust though. Obviously if they're impairing your grip, then you might want to try another solution. I say just try and work it out and through the pain at first, unless it's unbearable, or they're bleeding, or something like that.

Yea thats the spot. I'm pretty sure the normal blister spot for most people. If I do too much bare handed lifting they start to blister and then after a day or two they will open and sting and be painful. Since using gloves I haven't had one problem with that. A little barehanded lifting like for my 5x1set of deadlifts shouldn't be a problem.
 

Izick

Member
Yea thats the spot. I'm pretty sure the normal blister spot for most people. If I do too much bare handed lifting they start to blister and then after a day or two they will open and sting and be painful. Since using gloves I haven't had one problem with that. A little barehanded lifting like for my 5x1set of deadlifts shouldn't be a problem.

Have you been bare-handed lifting before you started Stronglifts?

All I can say is that I know where your at, and it is painful, but if you fight through the pain and annoyance, then it should ease up, and your hands should harden up, and you'll be alright. And yeah, you should be okay for deadlifting bare handed, but bring your gloves along just in case. It's better to be prepared than not.
 

Slurmer

Banned
I heard recently that having bcaa powder before a workout was useless and to just have whey protein powder instead. Any opinions on this? Any significant difference? I usually have a protein shake right after working out
 

Ashhong

Member
Have you been bare-handed lifting before you started Stronglifts?

All I can say is that I know where your at, and it is painful, but if you fight through the pain and annoyance, then it should ease up, and your hands should harden up, and you'll be alright. And yeah, you should be okay for deadlifting bare handed, but bring your gloves along just in case. It's better to be prepared than not.

Yea, before SL I worked out for about a year off and on just doing whatever, without a real plan. Machines, some bench, curls, the stuff of noobs. I did all of that bare handed which is where I first experienced the problems. I do see myself in the future getting rid of gloves completely. I will slowly work towards that.

The girlfriend also doesn't like my hands too rough ;)
 
Yea thats the spot. I'm pretty sure the normal blister spot for most people. If I do too much bare handed lifting they start to blister and then after a day or two they will open and sting and be painful. Since using gloves I haven't had one problem with that. A little barehanded lifting like for my 5x1set of deadlifts shouldn't be a problem.

Be careful of where you are holding the bar in your hand. For the pulling motions (DL, pull up, etc.), you want the bar to begin along the callus line of your hand, not in the palm of it. If it's in the palm of your hand, it will move towards your fingers and exacerbate callus formation and potentially rip one off later. Rippetoe did a video about this, but I don't have the link handy.

Calluses are impossible to completely prevent but if you work on the bar position in your hand, you can minimize the problem.
 
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