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UK set to trigger Brexit on March 29

When should the UK celebrate Independence Day?

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O

oti

Banned
Muffin1611 said:
Oh crap, March 29th is tomorrow already.

How are y'all Brits doing?
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gif_you_ve_met_with_a_terrible_fate__haven_t_you__by_repee-d7ly25i-1020x500.jpg
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.
 
S

Shadowhelper

Banned
Jazzy Geoff said:
There's going to be hurt all other, mostly in the UK but the implications for France, Ireland, certain sectors of German industry, an independent Scotland, Spain and many other places are also not great (but obviously no where near as bad in some cases). Unless both sides pull their heads out of their arses.
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For the UK, it's going to be really really ugly.

I could be wrong, but from what I am reading, the banking industry of London is going to stay mostly in tact. This is for the benefit of the EU itself. They don't want London to lose its passporting rights because this would probably lead to another 2008 banking collapse of the EU. They EU negotiators haven't mentioned EU passporting as a bargaining chip in a very very long time, unless I am wrong.

So, let's say we somehow also keep access to the single market, well then, the EU is gonna want to hurt us in other ways. This is not simply about making smart practical decisions, there is a lot of ego, anger, both within the politicians and especially the people who voted those politicians in.

I don't know. It's not good for the country at all. I doubt we'll stay in the single market, but there might be hope. May is overwhelmed, and incompetent. Country is going to the dogs.
 
X

Xando

Member
Shadowhelper said:
For the UK, it's going to be really really ugly.

I could be wrong, but from what I am reading, the banking industry of London is going to stay mostly in tact. This is for the benefit of the EU itself. They don't want London to lose its passporting rights because this would probably lead to another 2008 banking collapse of the EU. They EU negotiators haven't mentioned EU passporting as a bargaining chip in a very very long time, unless I am wrong.

So, let's say we somehow also keep access to the single market, well then, the EU is gonna want to hurt us in other ways. This is not simply about making smart practical decisions, there is a lot of ego, anger, both within the politicians and especially the people who voted those politicians in.

I don't know. It's not good for the country at all. I doubt we'll stay in the single market, but there might be hope. May is overwhelmed, and incompetent. Country is going to the dogs.
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There is not much to mention. EU politicians have said time and time again the four freedoms are non negotiable so if the UK leaves the customs union and declines freedom of movement there won't be any passporting.

France,Germany, Poland, Spain, Ireland and pretty much every other EU country is trying to get part of the financial industry(Or any other multinational industry) in the UK. For now it seems Frankfurt and Dublin are the clear winner.

Banks moving to the EU will not cause a 2008 like crash. Even suggesting the UK losing passporting resulting in such a crash is rubbish.
 
Charles Brandon

Charles Brandon

Member
Shadowhelper said:
For the UK, it's going to be really really ugly.

I could be wrong, but from what I am reading, the banking industry of London is going to stay mostly in tact. This is for the benefit of the EU itself. They don't want London to lose its passporting rights because this would probably lead to another 2008 banking collapse of the EU. They EU negotiators haven't mentioned EU passporting as a bargaining chip in a very very long time, unless I am wrong.

So, let's say we somehow also keep access to the single market, well then, the EU is gonna want to hurt us in other ways. This is not simply about making smart practical decisions, there is a lot of ego, anger, both within the politicians and especially the people who voted those politicians in.

I don't know. It's not good for the country at all. I doubt we'll stay in the single market, but there might be hope. May is overwhelmed, and incompetent. Country is going to the dogs.
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I agree that The City might scrape through intact because there is nothing in place that can replace it but if we keep that and single market access (read: tariff free access, same as what we have now) then that would be OK. I can't see how that would lead to huge problems. In fact it would be fucking brilliant considering the alternatives. I imagine we would have to pay some serious cash for this so the EU can't be seen to have given us an easy ride but that would be fine.
 
M

Miles Quaritch

Member
No point getting angry any more.

If you're youngish, capable, skilled and don't have any obligations, leave.

Why would you stay and help pay into the pension pot of people who voted to steal your future? Fuck them, let them suffer.

It's the only way people learn. Stop thinking you can stick around and help, you're only limiting your own opportunities.

The country doesn't deserve your skills or what you being to the table. Leave. It seems scary, but it's really not. Just do it and leave behind those who fucked up to fix their own mess.

For those who voted remain and can't leave. I'm sorry, it sucks you're left trying to help those who fucked up fix things and continue to subsidise those who fucked up.
 
C

CyclopsRock

Member
Xando said:
There is not much to mention. EU politicians have said time and time again the four freedoms are non negotiable so if the UK leaves the customs union and declines freedom of movement there won't be any passporting.
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Well Turkey is in the customs union and doesn't have freedom of movement so clearly it's not non-negotiable. Whether we'll actually be able to achieve it is another matter.
 
Chittagong

Chittagong

Gold Member
Our fund decided to stay in London and accept no passporting. We are simply getting authorised in the countries we operate in separately. A bit more work, but mostly we can outsource it all. Not that big of a deal.
 
X

Xando

Member
CyclopsRock said:
Well Turkey is in the customs union and doesn't have freedom of movement so clearly it's not non-negotiable. Whether we'll actually be able to achieve it is another matter.
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Turkeys advantage is that it has the refugees as leverage. If there wasn't a refugee problem turkey would be kicked out by now.

I don't see what the UK has to offer to make such a exception.
 
M

Muffin1611

Banned
CyclopsRock said:
Well Turkey is in the customs union and doesn't have freedom of movement so clearly it's not non-negotiable. Whether we'll actually be able to achieve it is another matter.
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That would only cover goods afaik though, and not services and finances. Which make a big part of the British GDP.
 
K

kmag

Member
CyclopsRock said:
Well Turkey is in the customs union and doesn't have freedom of movement so clearly it's not non-negotiable. Whether we'll actually be able to achieve it is another matter.
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May doesn't want to be in the Custom Union though, she wants some form of illegal partial deal on specific sectors (the majority of trade needs to be covered by a Customs Union under WTO rules)

But you're right the customs union doesn't really have anything to do with freedom of movement. The customs union is basically distinct from the single market, you can have the single market without the customs union and vice versa.
 
U

uncleniccius

Member
Miles Quaritch said:
No point getting angry any more.

If you're youngish, capable, skilled and don't have any obligations, leave.

Why would you stay and help pay into the pension pot of people who voted to steal your future? Fuck them, let them suffer.

It's the only way people learn. Stop thinking you can stick around and help, you're only limiting your own opportunities.

The country doesn't deserve your skills or what you being to the table. Leave. It seems scary, but it's really not. Just do it and leave behind those who fucked up to fix their own mess.

For those who voted remain and can't leave. I'm sorry, it sucks you're left trying to help those who fucked up fix things and continue to subsidise those who fucked up.
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Pretty much.

I'm graduating next year and am hoping to do either banking or civil service. If it is the former I'm getting the fuck out.
 
C

CyclopsRock

Member
Xando said:
Turkeys advantage is that it has the refugees as leverage. If there wasn't a refugee problem turkey would be kicked out by now.

I don't see what the UK has to offer to make such a exception.
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Yeah, but what you're describing is basically the definition of "negotiable".
 
Charles Brandon

Charles Brandon

Member
kmag said:
May doesn't want to be in the Custom Union though, she wants some form of illegal partial deal on specific sectors (the majority of trade needs to be covered by a Customs Union under WTO rules)

But you're right the customs union doesn't really have anything to do with freedom of movement. The customs union is basically distinct from the single market, you can have the single market without the customs union and vice versa.
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The biggest single obstacle to a reasonable deal for both parties seems to be Theresa May herself who seems hell-bent on refusing to compromise on anything and more than happy to walk away with nothing. I sincerely hope this is just her bargaining posture (and even then she needs to tone it down a bit) because if it wasn't for her I would be mildly confident of some sort of "everyone gets to say they won and the other side lost" fudge.
 
I

Izuna

Banned
Miles Quaritch said:
No point getting angry any more.

If you're youngish, capable, skilled and don't have any obligations, leave.

Why would you stay and help pay into the pension pot of people who voted to steal your future? Fuck them, let them suffer.

It's the only way people learn. Stop thinking you can stick around and help, you're only limiting your own opportunities.

The country doesn't deserve your skills or what you being to the table. Leave. It seems scary, but it's really not. Just do it and leave behind those who fucked up to fix their own mess.

For those who voted remain and can't leave. I'm sorry, it sucks you're left trying to help those who fucked up fix things and continue to subsidise those who fucked up.
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I concur with this treason.

I can't decide Germany or US tho. God's Speed to my CCNA and graduation. 14 months to go.
 
Charles Brandon

Charles Brandon

Member
Xando said:
What does that have to do with the current situation we have right now?

If Turkey didn't have leverage over the EU it wouldn't be part of the customs union by now.


If the UK has no leverage it's not negotiable.
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The UK has a lot of leverage, it's a huge market and a factor in trade agreements between the EU and third party states, not to mention what it brings to the table in terms of security and the military. It may not have enough leverage but it certainly has quite a lot.
 
Q

QuicheFontaine

Member
Xando said:
What does that have to do with the current situation we have right now?

If Turkey didn't have leverage over the EU it wouldn't be part of the customs union by now.
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You said that Turkey has the refugees as leverage, but they didn't when they joined the Customs Union. So...how did they join?
 
M

MontyBrown

Banned
Miles Quaritch said:
No point getting angry any more.

If you're youngish, capable, skilled and don't have any obligations, leave.

Why would you stay and help pay into the pension pot of people who voted to steal your future? Fuck them, let them suffer.

It's the only way people learn. Stop thinking you can stick around and help, you're only limiting your own opportunities.

The country doesn't deserve your skills or what you being to the table. Leave. It seems scary, but it's really not. Just do it and leave behind those who fucked up to fix their own mess.

For those who voted remain and can't leave. I'm sorry, it sucks you're left trying to help those who fucked up fix things and continue to subsidise those who fucked up.
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Or wait and see what actually happens. Nobody knows what the impact on the country will be. It could be not so bad, the same, or better. Why take drastic action now?

(I voted remain)
 
S

Shadowhelper

Banned
Xando said:
There is not much to mention. EU politicians have said time and time again the four freedoms are non negotiable so if the UK leaves the customs union and declined freedom of movement there won't be any passporting.

France,Germany, Poland, Spain, Ireland and pretty much every other EU country is trying to get part of the financial industry in the london. For now it seems Frankfurt and Dublin are the clear winner.

Banks moving to the EU will not cause a 2008 like crash. Even suggesting the UK losing passporting resulting in such a crash is rubbish.
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Well, it wasn't me friend. It was the EU main negotiator himself. But perhaps I am wrong and things have changed since, but I think you cannot deny the severe financial risk to the EU from London losing its passporting and the EU recognizing this.

I probably haven't been following it as closely as you, but it's hasn't always been as cut and dry as you put it, but perhaps it is now. But this is what I was referencing. There was another article, I hopefully will be able to fish it out. A secret EU memo voicing fears that passporting should remain in London, at the behest of many EU countries. Like I said previously, there is a lot of anger and ego involved, but there is quite a risk for the EU banking industry too. Perhaps, it is not big enough to matter.

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...-special-deal-over-access-to-city-post-brexit

The EU's chief negotiator in the Brexit talks has shown the first signs of backing away from his hardline, no-compromise approach after admitting he wants a deal with Britain that will guarantee the other 27 member states continued easy access to the City.

Michel Barnier wants a ”special" relationship with the City of London after Britain has left the bloc, according to unpublished minutes seen by the Guardian that hint at unease about the costs of Brexit on continental Europe.

Barnier told a private meeting of MEPs this week that special work was needed to avoid financial instability, according to a European parliament summary of the session. ”Some very specific work has to be done in this area," he said, according to the minutes. ”There will be a special/specific relationship. There will need to be work outside of the negotiation box ... in order to avoid financial instability."
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The remarks hint at concern among senior Brussels policymakers about the damaging consequences of Brexit for the continent if Europe's biggest financial centre is cut adrift.

The suggestion recorded in the minutes does mirror the view of the governor of the Bank of England, Mark Carney. He told MPs on Tuesday ”there are greater financial stability risks on the continent in the short term, for the transition, than there are for the UK".

Carney said other EU nations relied heavily on the City for their financial needs and could face serious problems if international banks based in London were no longer able to gain easy access to European countries and corporations. ”If you rely on a jurisdiction [the UK] for three-quarters of your hedging activities, three-quarters of your foreign exchange activity, half your lending and half your securities transactions, you should think very carefully about the transition from where you are today to where the new equilibrium will be," he said.

The fear is that European governments and companies would find it harder and more expensive to raise capital if they were denied access to the City, which acts as Europe's investment bank. Countries such as Italy, with very large national debt, are concerned that their economies would become even more fragile if financing costs rose.

The minutes indicate that Barnier repeated during Thursday's meeting the well-worn mantra that the UK should not be allowed to cherry-pick the bits of the EU it likes. But his apparent concern about financial instability contrasts with bullish statements by EU leaders about swooping on London's financial sector business.
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Behind the scenes, EU officials are maintaining that the UK will be hardest hit by Brexit, but they are concerned about the costs facing continental Europe.

One senior source recently told the Guardian that closing London as a euro clearing centre was likely to increase costs for EU banks and companies. Another source has voiced concern that there would be limited gains for rival financial centres as a result of a smaller European single market.

On Friday, one the City's most senior bankers welcomed growing recognition of the risk to the global financial system. ”The industry and the regulatory community, and the political community, are fully aware of the importance of maintaining financial stability," said Douglas Flint, chairman of HSBC, Europe's largest bank.

”There are clearly negotiating positions that will evolve over the next several months and years but the importance of preserving the functionality of the markets that exist today ... is seen by everybody," he said, following similar warnings to the Treasury select committee.

Flint suggested a new special relationship with the City could be achieved with a treaty guaranteeing ”mutual recognition" of regulations. City firms are able to do business across the EU by using a ”passport", which will disappear when the UK quits the EU.
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Charles Brandon

Charles Brandon

Member
MontyBrown said:
Or wait and see what actually happens. Nobody knows what the impact on the country will be. It could be not so bad, the same, or better. Why take drastic action now?

(I voted remain)
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Agree, there is no point gnashing and wailing. Wait and see what happens. Nothing wrong with moving abroad but I wouldn't do it just because of brexit. Not yet anyway.
 
C

CyclopsRock

Member
Xando said:
If the UK has no leverage it's not negotiable.
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Well we're kinda getting into semantics here, but you did say "EU politicians have said time and time again the four freedoms are non negotiable" which evidently isn't true. What you actually mean is that you don't think the UK's able to negotiate it due to a lack of leverage, which is different.
 
M

Miles Quaritch

Member
MontyBrown said:
Or wait and see what actually happens. Nobody knows what the impact on the country will be. It could be not so bad, the same, or better. Why take drastic action now?

(I voted remain)
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Wait until you lose access to freedom of movement? And the opposite is true too. Move now and if the country doesn't go to shit, you can choose to come back, but why would you?
 
I

itsbenoclock

Member
Just went to my local Tesco Express for a few bits, thought I'd pick up a six-pack of Heineken since they're cheap in there and it's a sunny week.

Nothing there.

Friend then tells me Tesco have stopped stocking Heineken brand beers because of a supply issue...fuckin' Brexit, man.
 
M

MontyBrown

Banned
Miles Quaritch said:
Wait until you lose access to freedom of movement? And the opposite is true too. Move now and if the country doesn't go to shit, you can choose to come back, but why would you?
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Seems easier to me to stay where you are (if happy now) and react if things go bad, rather than making a big life change on the chance things go wrong and then come all the way back if it's okay...
 
P

Par Score

Member
MontyBrown said:
Seems easier to me to stay where you are (if happy now) and react if things go bad, rather than making a big life change on the chance things go wrong and then come all the way back if it's okay...
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You seem to be missing the whole losing access to Freedom of Movement point.

Some of us are stuck here without much choice, but if you can get out I would absolutely advise it. It's just playing the odds really, 27 to 1.

When they announce the cut-off date you need to either have a plan to move by that date, or be willing to commit your future to this ever smaller, ever shittier island.
 
Charles Brandon

Charles Brandon

Member
cut-off date is tomorrow as far as the UK is concerned so if you move to the EU after tomorrow,m you run the risk of being unceremoniously booted back at some point. Wait and see.
 
X

Xando

Member
Jazzy Geoff said:
The UK has a lot of leverage, it's a huge market and a factor in trade agreements between the EU and third party states, not to mention what it brings to the table in terms of security and the military. It may not have enough leverage but it certainly has quite a lot.
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I'm not saying there isn't going to be any kind of deal. What i'm saying is that the UK has no kind of leverage for the EU to sacrifice one of it's core pillars. Security and the military is all fine but that doesn't have much to do with the EU. Unless May is gonna threaten to leave NATO i don't see what she could offer to the other 27 countries.

Shadowhelper said:
Well, it wasn't me friend. It was the EU main negotiator himself. But perhaps I am wrong and things have changed since, but I think you cannot deny the severe financial risk to the EU from London losing its passporting and the EU recognizing this.

I probably haven't been following it as closely as you, but it's hasn't always been as cut and dry as you put it, but perhaps it is now. But this is what I was referencing. There was another article, I hopefully will be able to fish it out. A secret EU memo voicing fears that passporting should remain in London, at the behest of many EU countries. Like I said previously, there is a lot of anger and ego involved, but there is quite a risk for the EU banking industry too. Perhaps, it is not big enough to matter.

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...-special-deal-over-access-to-city-post-brexit
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I see what you're saying but the tone of EU politicians has changed quite a bit these past weeks and i'm sure there's going to be some kind of trade deal but May made it clear she will end freedom of movement which means passporting is gone. There is a reason banks started (or have announced it) to move staff to the EU.
It's true that the EU economy will take a hit when there is a hard brexit but this is more of a principle issue than a economic.

Here is the EU negotiator on this topic last week:

Writing in The Financial Times on Monday, Michel Barnier—who is leading the negotiations for the European Commission—said that a ”no-deal scenario" was a ”distinct possibility."

”It goes without saying that a no-deal scenario, while a distinct possibility, would have severe consequences for our people and our economies. It would undoubtedly leave the U.K. worse off," Barnier said.
He said that it was in both sides' interest to secure a good deal. But, he warned, the remaining 27 members of the EU would find it easier to cope with the fallout from such a scenario.

”The 27 member states will find it easier to adjust—as they will still benefit from the single market, the customs union and more than 60 trade deals with their international partners," Barnier wrote.
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http://www.newsweek.com/brexit-eu-m...-50-talks-no-deal-wto-rules-free-trade-574593

And also don't forget every EU country, EU parliament and also some regional parliaments have a veto on any deal the UK will get offered.

Jazzy Geoff said:
cut-off date is tomorrow as far as the UK is concerned so if you move to the EU after tomorrow,m you run the risk of being unceremoniously booted back at some point. Wait and see.
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Remains to be seen if that is legally possible:
He said: ”We have heard that Theresa May is considering a cut-off date as the notification date. We completely disagree on this and we believe that the British citizens and those from the other 27 states are EU citizens until the day of the divorce. During this period the UK is a member state with full rights and obligations.

”It cannot be right that someone signing a work contract in the UK on Tuesday has more rights than someone signing a contract on Thursday."

In a further sign that the chamber will prove a major thorn in the British prime minister's side, the Guardian has learned that MEPs will also insist in their resolution that a trade deal cannot be sealed within two years but only after the UK leaves, echoing the position of the European commission.

It will demand that the European court of justice ”should be the competent authority for the interpretation and enforcement of the withdrawal agreement".

And while MEPs will say that Britain should be allowed to change its mind about leaving the EU during the two years of talks, they will insist that this must be strictly on terms decreed by the remaining 27 EU member states. MEPs want to ensure that revocation of the triggering of article 50 will not be used by the UK simply to buy more negotiating time once the two years of talks laid down in the treaty of Lisbon are done.

The parliament will also demand that the UK's multi-billion pound financial liabilities, including commitments to spend on projects after 2019, should be paid in full by the Treasury. Senior figures in the European parliament have decided to issue further resolutions at key pinch-points in the talks, to strengthen the hand of the EU's Brexit negotiator, Michel Barnier, as he sits down with David Davis, the secretary of state for exiting the EU.

The development lays bare the difficulties that will face Davis when he finally begins negotiations with Barnier in mid-May. The European parliament has the right to veto any deal between the EU and the UK when talks come to a close in 2019, and the MEPs' opening diktat and its subsequent resolutions, while non-binding, will inevitably set the parameters for the negotiations.
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Brexit deal with 'cut-off date' for free movement would be vetoed by MEPs
 
Charles Brandon

Charles Brandon

Member
Xando said:
I'm not saying there isn't going to be any kind of deal. What i'm saying is that the UK has no kind of leverage for the EU to sacrifice one of it's core pillars. Security and the military is all fine but that doesn't have much to do with the EU. Unless May is gonna threaten to leave NATO i don't see what she could offer to the other 27 countries
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Well I'm telling you that it does have leverage of the sort that comes with being one of the world's biggest markets. Security is no joke either, UK policing is a big part of the europe-wide counter-terrorism initiative and, whilst there are no firm military ties between EU nations outside of NATO that does not mean to say that a souring of relations between the EU and one of the biggest military powers in the world is something that should be overlooked in the context of increasing Russian posturing and american ambivalence towards NATO.

edit: And yes I know what the EU says but the fact is that, at some point, there will be a difference between someone signing a contract on one day and signing one the next. That Date may be tomorrow or in two years or some other time but the risk is there.
 
M

Miles X

Member
Miles Quaritch said:
Wait until you lose access to freedom of movement? And the opposite is true too. Move now and if the country doesn't go to shit, you can choose to come back, but why would you?
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Family? Friends? Opportunities here? oh sorry I forgot, it's gonna become a Mad Max wasteland post 2019. Your drama and woe is ridiculous, acting like there is nothing left in this country worth staying for.
 
N

Nuzzle

Member
itsbenoclock said:
Just went to my local Tesco Express for a few bits, thought I'd pick up a six-pack of Heineken since they're cheap in there and it's a sunny week.

Nothing there.

Friend then tells me Tesco have stopped stocking Heineken brand beers because of a supply issue...fuckin' Brexit, man.
Click to expand...

Looks like you're better off, already.
 
R

Rush_Khan

Member
So in 10 years' time who are we gonna blame for all of this?

David Cameron for the calling the referendum in the first place?

Theresa May for pursuing a hard brexit against the interests of the country?

Jeremy Corbyn for... wait, what does he actually do?

Immigrants?
 
T

TheBlackMarvel

Member
Rush_Khan said:
So in 10 years' time who are we gonna blame for all of this?

David Cameron for the calling the referendum in the first place?

Theresa May for pursuing a hard brexit against the interests of the country?

Jeremy Corbyn for... wait, what does he actually do?

Immigrants?
Click to expand...

I think we all know who's going to take the blame if
when
things go wrong.
 
M

Miles Quaritch

Member
Miles X said:
Family? Friends? Opportunities here? oh sorry I forgot, it's gonna become a Mad Max wasteland post 2019. Your drama and woe is ridiculous, acting like there is nothing left in this country worth staying for.
Click to expand...

It's not drama or woe. I'm giving advice to people who might be on the fence and need extra push to take action. And I chuckled heartily at you thinking there's going to be better opportunities here if you're young and skilled. Nah mate.

Nah.

Croyles said:
I don't get it. What are you excited about?
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Fewer Romanians.
 
S

Shadowhelper

Banned
Rush_Khan said:
So in 10 years' time who are we gonna blame for all of this?

David Cameron for the calling the referendum in the first place?

Theresa May for pursuing a hard brexit against the interests of the country?

Jeremy Corbyn for... wait, what does he actually do?

Immigrants?
Click to expand...

It'll depend on who you ask. But the papers and historians will surely blame David Cameron. That's who the EU leaders did too. The EU I think, learned their lesson with the EU constitution, which was voted down by Ireland and France I think? They don't blame the people. The people are too dumb or busy, sorry, I hope that is not offensive to anyone, but isn't this hard to dispute?

When you give the people a chance, there is always a possibility of anti EU sentiment to emerge. The point is, don't give people the chance to do something stupid, especially on a topic they barely understand the nuances about, and David Cameron solely did that with his recklessness. He took a bold gamble with using the countries future as his poker chips, and lost.
 
Charles Brandon

Charles Brandon

Member
Rush_Khan said:
So in 10 years' time who are we gonna blame for all of this?

David Cameron for the calling the referendum in the first place?

Theresa May for pursuing a hard brexit against the interests of the country?

Jeremy Corbyn for... wait, what does he actually do?

Immigrants?
Click to expand...


Good question.

Ravey Davey The Pig Enthusiast gets my vote. He gambled the future of the country on winning an internal party dispute and lost. Mind-boggling recklessness.

Corbyn is a cunt and handwaved it through but I suppose it's difficult to blame him given that he is opposed to the EU concept on a fundamental level.

May is either mental or really shit at negotiating and probably feels a bit insecure hence the ridiculously aggressive stance she has taken. I think she's just out of her depth.

Cameron wins because he knew what the stakes were.
 
F

Frankfurter

Member
Rush_Khan said:
So in 10 years' time who are we gonna blame for all of this?

David Cameron for the calling the referendum in the first place?

Theresa May for pursuing a hard brexit against the interests of the country?

Jeremy Corbyn for... wait, what does he actually do?

Immigrants?
Click to expand...

The EU of course. For the bad deal ;)
 
K

kmag

Member
Japanese Companies in the UK getting antsy again

Japan’s powerful Keidanren business lobby is stepping up its challenge to Theresa May’s handling of Brexit, with a communique demanding that the UK prime minister give “deeper consideration” to the effects on the British economy, according to people involved in its drafting.

The five-page document being prepared by Keidanren, whose membership includes Toyota, Hitachi and other large Japanese investors in the UK, will specifically take issue with Mrs May’s suggestion that “no [Brexit] deal is better than a bad deal” — a comment that has sent a chill through the boardrooms of Japanese companies that collectively employ an estimated 140,000 people in their UK operations.

“The key message is this: please negotiate with deeper consideration for the economy,” said a person who has seen a draft of Keidanren’s communique, which is expected to be released in early April. “What is desirable is a right deal for sound economic development.”

The push by Japanese investors to step up pressure on the May government comes as it emerged that one in 10 German companies in the UK plans to respond to Brexit by moving investment to other EU states, according to a survey by the German chambers of commerce of 2,200 companies. Some 40 per cent of respondents said they expected business to weaken in Britain....

People familiar with the latest communique said it has the backing of several of Japan’s largest financial services companies and manufacturers, but has received minimal direct input from the Japanese government.

Japan’s banking sector has been especially rattled by the apparently hardening stance of Britain’s position as it prepares to trigger Article 50 on Wednesday. All have begun looking at continental financial centres as possible alternatives to London. Senior Japanese banking executives have described “deep scepticism” over optimistic presentations made by David Davis, the UK’s Brexit minister.

While Mrs May has said she would seek a bold free-trade agreement with the EU and hopes to maintain tariff-free trade, fears run deep among the Japanese business community on whether the UK would be able to deliver on its ambitions.
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A

Ashes

Banned
Rush_Khan said:
So in 10 years' time who are we gonna blame for all of this?
Click to expand...

Nobody. We'll just have a different workable relationship with the EU. The [western] world has bigger problems ultimately. Productivity, slow growth, robotics intrusion in the employment space, sustainability, population implosion (lower birthrate/ageing population).
 
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