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Alan Wake - The First 12 Minutes (German)

S1kkZ

Member
so, this is based on screens/videos from videogamezone.de huh?
the guys that claimed that dantes inferno on 360 is missing some animations, has much lower texture resolution and weaker/missing effects? which were lies of course (the game looks identical on both systems). after the lens of truth/digital foundry comparisons came out, they removed the claims and changed the screenshots (now they look identical, before the change the 360 screenshots looked much worse).
 

MMaRsu

Banned
brain_stew said:
540p is not your "typical" sub HD resolution either. Its pitifully low (almost half 720p resolution) and in vasoline-o-vision territory, try and sugarcoat it all you want but if it wasn't such a big deal why would Remedy and Microsoft go to such lengths to cover it up? If it makes no difference to how the game looks why have they only ever released PC/BS mode media in the past? I never thought 1024x768 would be classed as "high resolution" in 2010 but that's the situation we're in.




Expecting acceptable levels of image quality has got nothing at all to do with being a "graphics whore." Why shouldn't people expect excellent graphics anyway? This is/was the big exclusive showcase Xbox 360 title and has been in development for half a decade. If they got completely rid of the tearing maybe people would be able to let it slide but it appears they haven't even done that despite nearly slashing the resolution in half.

I thought there is no tearing left ( according to what Blim said ) and that it's just the video causing the tearing itself?

I have 100% faith in Remedy, and also I wont give a shit what resolution it's in ( ofcourse I'd rather have it in 1080P or 720P but hey ), it's a remedy game and it's going to be amazing no matter what. The graphics in the video's look good enough, and the lightning is gorgeous.

You have zero proof so far that it's beneath 720p, and haven't Remedy stated it's 720p?
 
Kenak said:
Wouldn't 360p be half of a 720p resolution?

/ignorant

No it'd be quarter resolution as you're halving both the vertical and horizontal resolution.


MMaRsu said:
You have zero proof so far that it's beneath 720p, and haven't Remedy stated it's 720p?

The two most respected pixel counters around say its ~540p. Its 540p.

Developers lie. Surely you have learnt this by now?
 

MMaRsu

Banned
metareferential said:
Remedy says it's 720p, then 720p it is until someone puts his hands on the actual game.

Exactly. Also, what S1kkZ said is pretty important. This website doesn't have a good reputation I think not.

brain_stew said:
No it'd be quarter resolution as you're halving both the vertical and horizontal resolution.




The two most respected pixel counters around say its ~540p. Its 540p.

Developers lie. Surely you have learnt this by now?

Yes developers do lie.. BUT let's just start pixel counting when the actual game is out instead of video's /screens.
 

derFeef

Member
brain_stew said:
The two most respected pixel counters around say its ~540p. Its 540p.

Developers lie. Surely you have learnt this by now?

Sorry, I lost respect on them because if you count pixels on an upscaled 540p video you are not a good pixelcounter :lol

Aw man I give up, you guys try to twist it as you want.
 

Lebron

Member
MMaRsu said:
Man what happened to this thread? Graphic whores are a sad breed of gamers ..
Shut it, this has been entertaining so far. Whenever you read a comment that makes your head hurt, just lean back and laugh, dance, drink, what have you.

206csco.gif
 

MMaRsu

Banned
Lebron said:
Shut it, this has been entertaining so far. Whenever you read a comment that makes your head hurt, just lean back and laugh, dance, drink, what have you.

206csco.gif

This would be a good time to quote my avatar :lol . But yeah.. :p Who's the girl in that gif btw?
 
derFeef said:
Sorry, I lost respect on them because if you count pixels on an upscaled 540p video you are not a good pixelcounter :lol

Aw man I give up, you guys try to twist it as you want.

The analysis isn't taken from the video. Its from 720p screenshots with a 1:1 mapped HUD, taken from here:

http://www.videogameszone.de/Alan-W...Xbox-360-Highlight-702157/galerie/1277744/#tp

Please explain to me why the HUD is razor sharp and native resolution and the rendered image looks like its covered in vaseline if its rendered at native 720p just like the HUD? Are you trying to suggest this website went in and manually added a HUD to everyone one of their captures?

You don't need to be a pixel counter to realise something is amiss with the resolution of the rendered image in a shot like this:


bildinoriginalgre-2010dui1.jpg


Functional eye sight will do.
 

Pooya

Member
brain_stew is right, this resolution is way too low, it's near Wii territory to be honest and even then there is noticeable tearing. this is a resolution even 60fps games surpass. Considering they lied about this and claimed it would be a graphical showcase for 360 makes it even worse. I don't care about what effects/textures they are pushing when the resolution is so low that everything is blurred to hell and getting something like this from a first party game is even more embarrassing. these are VIDEO games, graphics is a huge part of games and most certainly affects the overall experience. it's hard not to be disappointed really. 3rd parties are doing a much better job on 360 right now than Microsoft, just look at Red Dead Redemption. I have to admit, after playing more than 100 hours of FFXIII and God of War III on PS3 and then moving to Splinter Cell and now seeing this was very disappointing, 360 can do a lotbetter, no one really bothers aside from Capcom at the moment.
 

Apath

Member
brain_stew said:
The analysis isn't taken from the video. Its from 720p screenshots with a 1:1 mapped HUD, taken from here:

http://www.videogameszone.de/Alan-W...Xbox-360-Highlight-702157/galerie/1277744/#tp

Please explain to me why the HUD is razor sharp and native resolution and the rendered image looks like its covered in vaseline if its rendered at native 720p just like the HUD? Are you trying to suggest this website went in and manually added a HUD to everyone one of their captures?

You don't need to be a pixel counter to realise something is amiss with the resolution of the rendered image in a shot like this:


http://www.abload.de/img/bildinoriginalgre-2010dui1.jpg

Functional eye sight will do.
Welp, that looks like checkmate.
 

shinnn

Member
Relaxed Muscle said:
They were online for 2 or 3 days and only got removed after all this 576p stuff happened?

:lol :lol

teh videos are ok... MS need to take down the screenshots now :lol
 
miladesn said:
brain_stew is right, this resolution is way too low, it's near Wii territory to be honest and even then there is noticeable tearing. this is a resolution even 60fps games surpass. Considering they lied about this and claimed it would be a graphical showcase for 360 makes it even worse. I don't care about what effects/textures they are pushing when the resolution is so low that everything is blurred to hell and getting something like this from a first party game is even more embarrassing. these are VIDEO games, graphics is a huge part of games and most certainly affects the overall experience. it's hard not to be disappointing really. 3rd parties are doing a much better job on 360 right now than Microsoft, just look at Red Dead Redemption.

:lol
 

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
Stew, is there something about 540p that makes it work well in the 360 framebuffer?

That shot with the 720p HUD makes it very obvious.
 

Lebron

Member
miladesn said:
brain_stew is right, this resolution is way too low, it's near Wii territory to be honest and even then there is noticeable tearing. this is a resolution even 60fps games surpass. Considering they lied about this and claimed it would be a graphical showcase for 360 makes it even worse. I don't care about what effects/textures they are pushing when the resolution is so low that everything is blurred to hell and getting something like this from a first party game is even more embarrassing. these are VIDEO games, graphics is a huge part of games and most certainly affects the overall experience. it's hard not to be disappointed really. 3rd parties are doing a much better job on 360 right now than Microsoft, just look at Red Dead Redemption. I have to admit, after playing more than 100 hours of FFXIII and God of War III on PS3 and then moving to Splinter Cell and now seeing this was very disappointing, 360 can do a lotbetter, no one really bothers aside from Capcom at the moment.
Probably the closet I've come to visiting Valhalla due to all the laughing. Well done, sir. Well done.
 

Ploid 3.0

Member
It don't matter what resolution the game is as long as it the graphics does what it's supposed to (set a mood/feeling) and the game is awesome. The game isn't out and this is all you guys have to talk about, I know. When new info, commercials, etc. is out this whole argument will drop.
 

soco

Member
brain_stew said:
Please explain to me why the HUD is razor sharp and native resolution and the rendered image looks like its covered in vaseline if its rendered at native 720p just like the HUD? Are you trying to suggest this website went in and manually added a HUD to everyone one of their captures?

not gonna bother trying to count pixels or anything, but there is another possibility, albeit perhaps remote. if you look at some of the other screenshots, there's a shit ton of post processing going on. the one on the porch if you look at the trees to the right you can see this that appears to be from the lighting and such. it looks like a pretty bad motion blur.
 

Jigsaw

Banned
brain_stew said:
The analysis isn't taken from the video. Its from 720p screenshots with a 1:1 mapped HUD, taken from here:

http://www.videogameszone.de/Alan-W...Xbox-360-Highlight-702157/galerie/1277744/#tp

Please explain to me why the HUD is razor sharp and native resolution and the rendered image looks like its covered in vaseline if its rendered at native 720p just like the HUD? Are you trying to suggest this website went in and manually added a HUD to everyone one of their captures?

You don't need to be a pixel counter to realise something is amiss with the resolution of the rendered image in a shot like this:


bildinoriginalgre-2010dui1.jpg


Functional eye sight will do.

god damn this looks so blurry,and the hud is so sharp...no way in hell this is native 720p...the blurryness eats up all the detail on his clothes
 
S1kkZ said:
the guys that claimed that dantes inferno on 360 is missing some animations, has much lower texture resolution and weaker/missing effects? which were lies of course (the game looks identical on both systems). after the lens of truth/digital foundry comparisons came out, they removed the claims and changed the screenshots. . .

The chartzzzz of comparison sites?

That's just. . . wow. I mean it's not like your cover's not gonna be blown by legit comparison sites, don't know why anyone would bother.
 

Azerach

Banned
Ploid 3.0 said:
It don't matter what resolution the game is as long as it the graphics does what it's supposed to (set a mood/feeling) and the game is awesome. The game isn't out and this is all you guys have to talk about, I know. When new info, commercials, etc. is out this whole argument will drop.
Yeah, just bend over to sweep this whole thing under the rug :D
 

ShogunX

Member
Oh god what an utter fucking troll fest this thread has turned into. I'm utterly convinced that this place has had a huge influx of members from N4G because the quality of posting is atrocious.

I mean we have idiots claiming they are now canceling pre-orders because the game might not be native 720p despite the fact that they didn't have a clue about the resolution before the pixel count was posted up. I honestly cant remember the last time a quality exclusive title was nitpicked as bad as Alan Wake has been.

Since when has the resolution of a game directly affected the fun you get out of it?
 

MMaRsu

Banned
Shogun PaiN said:
Oh god what an utter fucking troll fest this thread has turned into. I'm utterly convinced that this place has had a huge influx of members from N4G because the quality of posting is atrocious.

I mean we have idiots claiming they are now canceling pre-orders because the game might not be native 720p despite the fact that they didn't have a clue about the resolution before the pixel count was posted up. I honestly cant remember the last time a quality exclusive title was nitpicked as bad as Alan Wake has been.

Since when has the resolution of a game directly affected the fun you get out of it?

I know man, shit's crazy.
 
Shogun PaiN said:
Since when has the resolution of a game directly affected the fun you get out of it?
Only for those so trapped by the value of underlying metrics, I suppose. The impression from playing something on your display should be the truest test of what looks good to someone, but you know it's like when people can't stop seeing the arrow in the Fed Ex logo...they can't unshackle themselves from it and it just ruins everything no matter what. They can make all of the arguments that might make sense on paper about numbers and technical expectations, but they cannot seem to divorce themselves from that thinking when playing a game. They can't just enjoy themselves for the experience on offer. Poor bastards...for them, it's all about what it isn't rather than what it is.
 

ShogunX

Member
Lebron said:
Halo 3. I still have yet to recover.

I guess I just don't let these type of things bother me at all. I was more than likely having a blast with the 4 player co-op campaign than worrying about the games resolution.

each to their own I guess.
 
Ploid 3.0 said:
It don't matter what resolution the game is as long as it the graphics does what it's supposed to (set a mood/feeling) and the game is awesome. The game isn't out and this is all you guys have to talk about, I know. When new info, commercials, etc. is out this whole argument will drop.
This


Who cares what the resolution is? All I care about is if the game is GOOD or not. Couldn't care less if it's 1080p or 21i for f@cks sake.
 

daxter01

8/8/2010 Blackace was here
from what i undrestand remedy is using something called A2C (wich i dont know what it is)for their ALPHA BLENDING(wich i dont know what it is)this a2c apparently is an ugly son of a bitch that needs msaa so remedy probably sacrificed resolution for 4x msaa
 

Lebron

Member
Shogun PaiN said:
I guess I just don't let these type of things bother me at all. I was more than likely having a blast with the 4 player co-op campaign than worrying about the games resolution.

each to their own I guess.
I was kidding :p

If you can't laugh/joke about stuff like this then you'll slowly turn into one of the trolls. DON'T LET IT HAPPEN, ANAKIN!

I'm trying my very best to prolong writing this paper
 
derFeef said:
Very well then. Is this quite usual that the HUD renders separately?

Its standard practice and the smart way to do it. No need to have a blurry HUD no matter how low resolution your rendered 3D image is, its not going to affect performance. Honestly, 700p, 680p, those sorts of drops are fine to me, as once they're upscaled to 1080p their isn't a huge difference to an upscaled 720p. 540p is nearly half the resolution of 720p though, the 4xmsaa helps ofcourse but when you're rendering in the equivalent of ~800x600 it can only do so much. Detail and clarity are going to be really lacking in Alan Wake it seems.

Fwiw, I'm not claiming this is definitive or anything, but it sure as hell looks likely. If the tearing is totally gone, coupled with the 4xmsaa I'll let it slide, if its not then I'll pass. I don't want to play my games at 1/4 of the resolution I usually play them at and still suffer tearing, the drop is just too much for an image quality whore like me. Its an exclusive game. If the console/engine can't handle the game with acceptable performance/image quality then tone down the effects, don't bludgeon the game like this.
 

Shurs

Member
woodsey1982 said:
This


Who cares what the resolution is? All I care about is if the game is GOOD or not. Couldn't care less if it's 1080p or 21i for f@cks sake.

Graphics and gameplay are two separate discussions. They don't need to be tied together, but that doesn't mean that both aren't worthy of discussion.
 

burgerdog

Member
Is this image 720p or a crazy ass res downsampled to 720p?

AlanWake_07_BrightFallsBay2_720p.png.jpg


vs

bildinoriginalgre-2010dui1.jpg


I'm still buying the game, of course, but it's rather disappointing after all the 720p 4xaa shit we've been fed.
 
MightyHedgehog said:
Only for those so trapped by the value of underlying metrics, I suppose. The impression from playing something on your display should be the truest test of what looks good to someone, but you know it's like when people can't stop seeing the arrow in the Fed Ex logo...they can't unshackle themselves from it and it just ruins everything no matter what. They can make all of the arguments that might make sense on paper about numbers and technical expectations, but they cannot seem to divorce themselves from that thinking when playing a game. They can't just enjoy themselves for the experience on offer. Poor bastards...for them, it's all about what it isn't rather than what it is.

Technically dissecting game engines, seeing how lighting/physics systems interact, discovering and understanding compromises made by developers and seeing the performance characteristics of engines on various hardware is a huge part of the fun for me. And so is producing the absolute best image I can and tweaking things when and where I can. Its part of the hobby for me, it may not be for you. That some people have different priorities, preferences and quirks shouldn't really surprise anyone

Oh and yes, the resolution of a game absolutely does have a direct impact on my enjoyment of a game. I wouldn't have invested in a high end GPU and a nice 1080P TV if it didn't. For all those that claim resolution and image quality have no effect on their enjoyment at all, I assume you're all on SDTVs hooked up via composite cables right? If not, then it clearly does matter to you as well because you have invested cold hard cash to take advantage of higher resolution content with better picture quality.
 

ShogunX

Member
brain_stew said:
Its standard practice and the smart way to do it. No need to have a blurry HUD no matter how low resolution your rendered 3D image is, its not going to affect performance. Honestly, 700p, 680p, those sorts of drops are fine to me, as once they're upscaled to 1080p their isn't a huge difference to an upscaled 720p. 540p is nearly half the resolution of 720p though, the 4xmsaa helps ofcourse but when you're rendering in the equivalent of ~800x600 it can only do so much. Detail and clarity are going to be really lacking in Alan Wake it seems.

Fwiw, I'm not claiming this is definitive or anything, but it sure as hell looks likely. If the tearing is totally gone, coupled with the 4xmsaa I'll let it slide, if its not then I'll pass. I don't want to play my games at 1/4 of the resolution I usually play them at and still suffer tearing, the drop is just too much for an image quality whore like me. Its an exclusive game. If the console/engine can't handle the game with acceptable performance/image quality then tone down the effects, don't bludgeon the game like this.

I see your point but what strikes me as odd is that when the videos initially appeared I don't recall anybody mentioning the resolution. The videos to me at least looked pretty crisp but since the pixel count was posted up there suddenly seems to be a lot of posters claiming its going to directly affect their Alan Wake experience if the game isn't 720p native.
 
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