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Vilix
I think Bayonetta and Samus are more iconic than Lara Croft.
(05-20-2017, 04:05 AM)
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I'd prefer a transgender Samus.
ElBoxyBrown
Member
(05-20-2017, 04:06 AM)
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Originally Posted by Mango The Magician

Yes over two thousand hours within the series proper, two smash bros appearances, various manga appearances, various action figures, various cameos in other games, and all time people have collectively had to get to know the Samus under the mask, but let's burn all that to the ground, let's arbitrary rebrand Samus as black and spend tons of money trying to erase the previous Samus, all to appease Neogaf, because that's what Nintendo wants to do is take a series that already doesn't sell well and make what little brand awareness it has even more confusing, as opposed to just making a new character to star alongside Samus.

That's a lot of words for "black people don't sell."
JB-the-Hunter
Member
(05-20-2017, 04:06 AM)
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Originally Posted by staticneuron

But of course, because traditional asian names like Link, mario, luigi, samus, princess peach, Icarus, kirby and so many others make it incredibly obvious!

I'm talking about the humanoid characters... so why even bring up Kirby?

Originally Posted by Madame M

Ooh, which ones?

Originally Posted by ScientificPizza

Such as?

Originally Posted by spazchicken

Do I really have to spell it out for you guys? The characters from the Legend of Zelda series, the characters from the Fire Emblem series, the characters from the Pokemon series, the characters from the Xenoblade series, etc. There is nothing that says these characters are white just because a lot of them have light skin. Also, I didn't say that they are Asian either, I said have any of you considered it? Light skin does not equal white.
kamineko
Does his best thinking in the flying car
(05-20-2017, 04:07 AM)
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seems fine
Madame M
Banned
(05-20-2017, 04:08 AM)

Originally Posted by JB-the-Hunter

The characters from the Legend of Zelda series, the characters from the Fire Emblem series, the characters from the Pokemon series, the characters from the Xenoblade series, etc. There is nothing that says these characters are white just because a lot of them have light skin. Also, I didn't say that they are Asian either, I said have any of you considered it? Light skin does not equal white.

Yes, and we all considered that those series take places in fictional universes where Asia doesn't exist
The Horror the horror
Member
(05-20-2017, 04:09 AM)
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Originally Posted by JB-the-Hunter


Do I really have to spell it out for you guys? The characters from the Legend of Zelda series, the characters from the Fire Emblem series, the characters from the Pokemon series, the characters from the Xenoblade series, etc. There is nothing that says these characters are white just because a lot of them have light skin. Also, I didn't say that they are Asian either, I said have any of you considered it? Light skin does not equal white.

Just like all those dark skinned Nintendo characters aren't Black. Oh wait.
xealo
Member
(05-20-2017, 04:10 AM)
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When has radically changing already established characters ever gone over well with a fan base?

It just seems like asking for controversy instead of making a brand new character for that role instead.
JB-the-Hunter
Member
(05-20-2017, 04:11 AM)
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Originally Posted by Madame M

Yes, and we all considered that those series take places in fictional universes where Asia doesn't exist

Europe doesn't exist either and this is the post I originally responded to:

Originally Posted by ScientificPizza

They have a bunch of white people and then animals and monsters and shit. that's not the kind of diversity people are talking about

Originally Posted by The Horror the horror

Just like all those dark skinned Nintendo characters aren't Black. Oh wait.

I don't even know what your sarcasm is implying...
Skittles
Member
(05-20-2017, 04:11 AM)
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Originally Posted by Mango The Magician

Funny how that measly 1% of the time is popular enough to have it's own action figures, name, amiibo, and spot in Smash, yet is so miniscule that it shouldn't matter to anyone.

I agree, but going by the logic presented in the thread; watch your footing. ;P

Yes, smash is a great example when popular characters like mr game n watch and duck hunt get those same things
Madame M
Banned
(05-20-2017, 04:14 AM)

Originally Posted by JB-the-Hunter

Europe doesn't exist either and this is the post I originally responded to:

Just because the fictional universe doesn't have a Europe doesn't mean white people can't exist in them. You're talking about "Asians" like everyone from Asia has the same skin tone. That's why you're confusing people.

Originally Posted by Skittles

Yes, smash is a great example when popular characters like mr game n watch and duck hunt get those same things

And you can change Mr. Game and Watch's skin tone!
Mango The Magician
Banned
(05-20-2017, 04:14 AM)

Originally Posted by Madame M

Definitely not clones. In the NES Zelda, Link had brown hair, in Link to the Past he was pink haired, then for the most part he was blonde.

Actually, much like Samus, Link's hair is depicted as both brown and blonde in the first game. As for ALttP, his hair is blond it's just pink in game, similar to how Agahnim has a red cloak but it's green in the game.

Originally Posted by ElBoxyBrown

That's a lot of words for "black people don't sell."

I actually don't know or care to reaserch how well "black characters" sell. My point was that changing a character like Samus seems like a huge waste of effort for very little gain. I mean should they also patch all the virtual console games to make Samus black in those? What of Smash, would it be allowed to make reference to the pre-reboot samus?

Originally Posted by Skittles

Yes, smash is a great example when popular characters like mr game n watch and duck hunt get those same things

Bro Smash actually introduced me to both Samus and Zero Suit Samus. In fact it introduce me to Mr. Game & Watch as well. So yeah, Smash has an effect on how people view Ninty characters, thanks for pointing that out.
Last edited by Mango The Magician; 05-20-2017 at 04:17 AM.
JB-the-Hunter
Member
(05-20-2017, 04:19 AM)
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Originally Posted by Madame M

Just because the fictional universe doesn't have a Europe doesn't mean white people can't exist in them. You're talking about "Asians" like everyone from Asia has the same skin tone. That's why you're confusing people.

Asian the race, not the nationality. It's not my fault they didn't name it after a color. What am I supposed to say? East Asian? Japanese?

"White" and "black" are just simpler ways of saying "of European decent" and "of African decent" anyway.
Last edited by JB-the-Hunter; 05-20-2017 at 04:30 AM.
Thanati
Member
(05-20-2017, 04:23 AM)
why give a crap what color she is? Why would it matter?
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
(05-20-2017, 04:26 AM)
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No seriously just make the new character be a orphan samus raised/trained.

Then do one of two things,

Samus has them go off on a final test of sorts, things slowly start to go bad, power ups can be a mix of samus giving access to powers samus used plus finding new things. Near the end Samus and new character team up to fight the final boss

Or

Samus and the orphan get ambushed by something/someone, Samus goes out like a bad ass protecting the orphan, but now the orphan is stranded alone on a planet and slowly get their upgrades learning how to use the suit and so on trying to survive


Grats you just made a new main character for the metroid series and a new story arc
Shang
Member
(05-20-2017, 04:26 AM)
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Originally Posted by ElBoxyBrown

That's a lot of words for "black people don't sell."

You've clearly missed the point of that post. Samus is recognizable. Why bother starting from scratch for the sole reason of changing the characters race for the sake of doing so?

That said, I wouldn't mind a black samus, but if that's the only thing that changes in this proposed reboot, what's the point?
erawsd
Member
(05-20-2017, 04:26 AM)
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I don't like the idea of replacing one under represented character type with another. If wider diversity is the goal then it should be a character from the over represented group or a new one entirely.
Unison
Member
(05-20-2017, 04:40 AM)
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Injustice 2 got this already.
Mango The Magician
Banned
(05-20-2017, 04:42 AM)

Originally Posted by QisTopTier

No seriously just make the new character be a orphan samus raised/trained.

Then do one of two things,

Samus has them go off on a final test of sorts, things slowly start to go bad, power ups can be a mix of samus giving access to powers samus used plus finding new things. Near the end Samus and new character team up to fight the final boss

Or

Samus and the orphan get ambushed by something/someone, Samus goes out like a bad ass protecting the orphan, but now the orphan is stranded alone on a planet and slowly get their upgrades learning how to use the suit and so on trying to survive


Grats you just made a new main character for the metroid series and a new story arc

I really like the second one, though I wouldn't much care for Samus dying. :/ Conversely, the first Prime made it canon that the Chozo existed on multiple planets, so I fail to see how a second person like Samus couldn't also exist somewhere in the Metroid Universe. Heck, she could even be Samus's rival.
SalvaPot
Member
(05-20-2017, 04:47 AM)
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Originally Posted by Mango The Magician

I really like the second one, though I wouldn't much care for Samus dying. :/ Conversely, the first Prime made it canon that the Chozo existed on multiple planets, so I fail to see how a second person like Samus couldn't also exist somewhere in the Metroid Universe. Heck, she could even be Samus's rival.

Kind of like Dark Pit.

Man, now I wonder how would a Metroid directed by Sakurai would look like.
KnightimeX_Legacy
Banned
(05-20-2017, 04:58 AM)
Samus is an established person.
I'd be ok with a black character who does stuff like Samus.
Mango The Magician
Banned
(05-20-2017, 04:59 AM)

Originally Posted by SalvaPot

Kind of like Dark Pit.

Man, now I wonder how would a Metroid directed by Sakurai would look like.

Honestly, I was thinking more along the lines of the Yiga in Botw, where a split in the Chozo created a evil Chozo, and they did the same thing that the Chozo did with Samus, but lead the nonSamus individual into believing all the wrong things, and the story would have Samus and this individual cross paths multiple times until something happens and the nonSamus individual decides to stop fighting Samus and they team up, and then the game would end with Samus and the individual being mutual allies who always have each others back, and then Smash could finally have a second Metroid character.

But that's literally the very first scenario that popped into my head, it wouldn't have to be that way.
Platinumstorm
Member
(05-20-2017, 05:02 AM)
She's in a suit nearly all of the time. Someone would probably complain it is a cop out.

I wouldn't care.

It's amazing how much time we spend on thinking about making protagonists black; not American Indian, not Saudi, not Indian, Cuban, Venezuelan; just black.
Wild Card
Member
(05-20-2017, 05:09 AM)
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Light skinned Ramlethal worst Ramlethal
superpickleman
Member
(05-20-2017, 05:12 AM)
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"Remember me?"

I just want to explore an alien labyrinth and shoot monsters. Samus could be be a woman for all I care.
SirPinkyNose
Member
(05-20-2017, 05:20 AM)
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Depends.
How would people react if Alyx Vance turned white?
Madame M
Banned
(05-20-2017, 05:21 AM)
Anything that would reboot the franchise is a step in the right direction, considering it's, you know... dead
MattKeil
BIGTIME TV MOGUL #2
(05-20-2017, 05:22 AM)
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Samus can be whatever color she needs to be to get a good Metroid game for the first time in a decade. Being white has no importance to the character whatsoever.

Originally Posted by JB-the-Hunter

"White" and "black" are just simpler ways of saying "of European decent" and "of African decent" anyway.

Originally they were simpler ways of saying "human" and "not human." That's kind of part of the issue here if you read carefully.
wildfire
Banned
(05-20-2017, 05:34 AM)
So has anyone explained why Samus inherently needs to be white?

For example if they redesigned her look but kept the skin tone the same. How many would be arguing that a reboot is still needed?
MadJackChurchill
Member
(05-20-2017, 05:38 AM)
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Would appreciate the inclusion of a woman of colour as a main character. The industry is lacking in this department.
Forkball
Member
(05-20-2017, 05:42 AM)
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Originally Posted by wildfire

So has anyone explained why Samus inherently needs to be white?

For example if they redesigned her look but kept the skin tone the same. How many would be arguing that a reboot is still needed?

Does Mario need a mustache? Why can't Poke Balls be cubes? Does Princess Peach need to be royalty or would the games work with her as a commoner?

Think about it man. The answers are out there.
Ms.Galaxy
Member
(05-20-2017, 05:44 AM)
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Originally Posted by KnightimeX_Legacy

Samus is an established person.
I'd be ok with a black character who does stuff like Samus.

I am in agreement with this, even have this new black character be the successor of Samus. The woman is reaching her mid-30s currently and as the series moves forward chronologically, and with the themes about motherhood popping out, I can see her saving and raising an orphaned human who would likely one day take over the mantle as her successor. (I have a feeling Samus can't get pregnant, she's been too heavily effected with being fused with Chozo, Metroid, and even X DNA, plus the Phazon likely did some long term damage to her too.)
Mango The Magician
Banned
(05-20-2017, 05:44 AM)

Originally Posted by wildfire

So has anyone explained why Samus inherently needs to be white?

For example if they redesigned her look but kept the skin tone the same. How many would be arguing that a reboot is still needed?

There is no inherent reason she has to be white, in fact there's rarely any Nintendo character has to be anything. Twintelle could easily be Japanese or Korean. There's just no real benefits to rebooting a franchise and significantly altering the main character when simply introducing a new character alongside the existing character does not only everything this hypothetical change would in spades, but also so much more.

I also fail to see how Nintendo would market past Metroid games, especially ones on the VC without stirring up confusion amongst uninformed gamers.
Madame M
Banned
(05-20-2017, 05:52 AM)

Originally Posted by Mango The Magician

There is no inherent reason she has to be white, in fact there's rarely any Nintendo character has to be anything. Twintelle could easily be Japanese or Korean. There's just no real benefits to rebooting a franchise and significantly altering the main character when simply introducing a new character alongside the existing character does not only everything this hypothetical change would in spades, but also so much more.

I also fail to see how Nintendo would market past Metroid games, especially ones on the VC without stirring up confusion amongst uninformed gamers.

There's also no reason this new hypothetical character can't also be named "Samus."

Also you might want to reconsider your word choices in the above post.
Macka
Member
(05-20-2017, 05:56 AM)
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Is there any argument for why retconning Samus as black would be preferable to introducing a new black lady who takes over the armour?
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
(05-20-2017, 05:57 AM)
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Originally Posted by Mango The Magician

I really like the second one, though I wouldn't much care for Samus dying. :/ Conversely, the first Prime made it canon that the Chozo existed on multiple planets, so I fail to see how a second person like Samus couldn't also exist somewhere in the Metroid Universe. Heck, she could even be Samus's rival.

The second choice could even bring metroid back to it's scifi horror roots with amazing use of atmosphere and art direction, leave the players feeling helpless scared of what's next, struggling to make it to the next safe place with the obvious pay off of becoming a bad ass by the end of everything.

Metroid 2 and 3 were pretty god damn scary as a kid with intensity, music, and just weirdness. Metroid 4 had a terminator 1 type of scary


Also I doubt they would but make the game rated M, though Teen is fine too
Last edited by QisTopTier; 05-20-2017 at 06:02 AM.
PBalfredo
Member
(05-20-2017, 05:58 AM)
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I won't entertain any thoughts on reboots until we get a follow up to Fusion, dammit!
ForsakenLotus
Member
(05-20-2017, 06:00 AM)
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Would I be upset? No. Would it seem completely unnecessary? Yes.

I'd much rather see new, interesting and well written black characters (or any minority in general) as opposed to taking established characters and changing ethnicities and other major characteristics. I guess for side characters it's more acceptable for whatever reason.

Like if Bruce Wayne were made black and nothing about him changed, then it would be a superficial change to an established character seemingly to appease that minority. If they change other elements of his character/backstory to justify changing something like race, then it's plainly a different character.

However as a white man I understand that my indifference/slight annoyance could be outweighed by the appreciation for a minority to feel more represented in an entertainment medium.
Mango The Magician
Banned
(05-20-2017, 06:01 AM)

Originally Posted by Madame M

There's also no reason this new hypothetical character can't also be named "Samus."

Also you might want to reconsider your word choices in the above post.

A) It wouldn't make sense to have two character coexist at the same time with the same name.

B) by "uninformed gamers" I'm referring to children. Specifically children who would be introduced to Samus via the hypothetical presented by the op. Why get the hopes of a young girl up by presenting her with a character who visually she can relate to only to dash said hopes when said little girl goes back to previous games and finds a "Samus" that is nothing like her "Samus?" Especially when you can just introduce said little girl to a new character who would exist alongside Samus, and have her become a fan of both and be able to enjoy any game in the franchise.
Raging Spaniard
If they are Dutch, upright and breathing they are more racist than your favorite player
(05-20-2017, 06:01 AM)
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I ... dont care? I will say that if its just a color skin swap "just because" then that would be really creatively bankrupt, thats not really how Nintendo and Retro operate.
TheSun
Member
(05-20-2017, 06:01 AM)
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For me, ideally I would want a minority protagonist to stand up on their own merits rather than be based on a prestablished character.

But, like I mentioned before, that if they were to make her black I would be totally cool with it. It'd be nice to have more people of color in starring roles.

Edit:
Also appeasing to minorities ain't a bad thing.
Also different race interpretations of known characters have happened before.
Last edited by TheSun; 05-20-2017 at 06:08 AM. Reason: more stuff
Madame M
Banned
(05-20-2017, 06:05 AM)

Originally Posted by Mango The Magician

A) It wouldn't make sense to have two character coexist at the same time with the same name.

B) by "uninformed gamers" I'm referring to children. Specifically children who would be introduced to Samus via the hypothetical presented by the op. Why get the hopes of a young girl up by presenting her with a character who visually she can relate to only to dash said hopes when said little girl goes back to previous games and finds a "Samus" that is nothing like her "Samus?" Especially when you can just introduce said little girl to a new character who would exist alongside Samus, and have her become a fan of both and be able to enjoy any game in the franchise.

It's a teaching opportunity, in our world two different people can have the same name, just look at how many Mohammeds there are.

It works fine for Link.
SalvaPot
Member
(05-20-2017, 06:05 AM)
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Honestly I really like the idea of Samus taking on an orphan and training her to be her succesor, she can be black too, that would be really cool. Alternate missions between a older, middle aged Samus and a young new character.

Man, now that I think about it a middle aged Samus would make an interesting take on the Metroid formula, and it could be a good excuse for her having to relearn her abilities: Imagine she has been retired for a while and gave all her abilities, even her best suit, to her succesor. Then she learns her succesor has gone missing while on a mission and she takes it on herself to go and help. She only has a worn out, old Varia Suit and gains her old upgrades as she progresses through the game.

You alternate between both characters and both stories connect in different ways, making levels where you need each others abilities to be able to get 100% on the run.
texhnolyze
Member
(05-20-2017, 06:07 AM)
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Why does it have to be Samus?

How about black Master Chief, or black Nathan Drake, or black Lara Croft on their respective reboot?
Violet_0
(05-20-2017, 06:09 AM)
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they could soft-reboot the series by having Samus retire and let her kid carry on her legacy as the Galaxy's most reknown bounty hunter



pic of her kid:
Mango The Magician
Banned
(05-20-2017, 06:10 AM)

Originally Posted by Madame M

It's a teaching opportunity, in our world two different people can have the same name, just look at how many Mohammeds there are.

It works fine for Link.

So Nintendo should create a fully unique and separate from Samus character that stands completely on her own, with her own design, voice, personality, and history, and give her the same name as Samus...because shenanigans?

Also, no, Link "reincarnates" within the "lore" of the series. There's never been any evidence provided that multiple Links can exist at that same time, bar:

A) The Hero's Shade, which is dead and as such likely operates similarly to the past Avatars managing to appear before both Aang and Korra.

B) Whatever the heck is going on in Tri Force Heroes.

Link, as a entity, in regards to how he's viewed separately from his series of origin, is a singular individual.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
(05-20-2017, 06:12 AM)
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Originally Posted by Mango The Magician

I'm not, I'm just not oblivious to the fact that the petite blonde is the evolution of the original design to make it more "modern." Which if a far far far cry different then changing her race.

....Modern? Wat

There was no reason to make her a petite blonde when she was originally conceived as a tall, muscular brunette. But they did anyway. There's no reason to change her skin tone, but they could anyway. Samus' non-suit appearance is utterly unimportant to her character.

You know what changes to her character they did bring? Making her into a subservient, weak-willed, empty-headed whiner in Other M. Now that was offensive. Making her black would be infinitely preferable than what they already did to destroy her character.

Originally Posted by HStallion

I feel people would have a better argument in defending a drastic change to her armor design than her skin color.

Agreed. Actually I hated how in Zero Mission you played so much of Samus without her suit with those stealth sections. I was like "bitch this isn't Metroid, I don't want stealth in my Metroid, and I don't want to play a skinny girl without a suit, I want the badass armoured bounty hunter!" :(

Originally Posted by Htown

I don't trust Nintendo with any depiction of any version of Samus at this point.

True.

Originally Posted by Skittles

then you got shit like this happening within the same game.

Wooooow what the fucking fuck....
psyfi
Member
(05-20-2017, 06:13 AM)
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Honest question: if comic books can make big changes like this, why can't video games? I totally welcome it, personally.
Madame M
Banned
(05-20-2017, 06:14 AM)
There's no legitimate reason a black woman cannot be named Samus.
The Horror the horror
Member
(05-20-2017, 06:19 AM)
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Originally Posted by psyfi

Honest question: if comic books can make big changes like this, why can't video games? I totally welcome it, personally.

Well, because it would ruin the series. Look at the new Nick Fury. According to the traditonalist/conservatives in this thread, his "palette swap" was an example of being lazy and they should have made a whole new Black character instead.
Noks415
Member
(05-20-2017, 06:19 AM)
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I would have two simultaneous reactions to be honest.

1. What was the point in making her black?

2. What does it matter if she is black.

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