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ebullientprism
Member
(08-11-2016, 06:50 PM)
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Maybe MS's idea of making Steam worse is by releasing shitty godawful ports on it. :P
LordRaptor
Member
(08-11-2016, 06:51 PM)
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Originally Posted by Trup1aya

At this point, thanks to Digital. Many publishers on PC don't bother with box retail at all. Why is it a surprise that MS would hand off the logistics on the SKU that will inevitably have the smallest impact on the market?

We'll never get the numbers to prove it, but I strongly suspect QB retail sales will exceed QBs W10 Storefront sales.
Trup1aya
Member
(08-11-2016, 06:54 PM)

Originally Posted by LordRaptor

We'll never get the numbers to prove it, but I strongly suspect QB retail sales will exceed QBs W10 Storefront sales.

Totally irrelevant.

Please answer the question. Since when is the last time retail presence has been an indication of how important PC gaming is to a publisher?

Because there are COUNTLESS games on Steam that cannot be found in stores. And many that do get retail releases are limited.

Edit: since you continue to want to drive this train off the rails, how do you think retail sales of QB will compare to Steam?

Edit2: you still haven't explained what Xbox users have to do with any of this. Nor have you provided any proof to support ANY of Sweeney's allegations.
Last edited by Trup1aya; 08-11-2016 at 06:57 PM.
dragonelite
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(08-11-2016, 06:57 PM)
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lol people on pc still care about retail copies?
Steam or bust bruh.
LordRaptor
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(08-11-2016, 07:09 PM)
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Originally Posted by Trup1aya

Please answer the question. Since when is the last time retail presence has been an indication of how important PC gaming is to a publisher?

Last months NPDs, Overwatches retail game sales in NA.

MS don't provide retail copies of PC games because they don't give a fuck.
Their marginal costs to stick a download code in a DVD box and ask GameStop or whoever to put it on a shelf next to their existing Xbox One displays are almost nothing.

Quantum Break isn't some indie title with niche appeal - although, you know, Max: The Curse Of Brotherhood gets a retail presence - its a tentpole AAA exclusive, that had major ad spends to push.
A publisher that gave a shit about it would have given it a retail presence.
Ryse: Son Of Rome on Pc got a retail release. Titanfall for PC got a retail release.

And I'm not going to 'prove' Tim Sweeneys allegations, I have already said in this topic what parts of what he said are demonstrably true, and what parts are speculation, and that the motivation (the only speculative part) for those actions is irrelevant.

Originally Posted by Trup1aya

It's called being objective. You should try it.

Trup1aya
Member
(08-11-2016, 07:21 PM)

Originally Posted by LordRaptor

Last months NPDs, Overwatches retail game sales in NA.

MS don't provide retail copies of PC games because they don't give a fuck.
Their marginal costs to stick a download code in a DVD box and ask GameStop or whoever to put it on a shelf next to their existing Xbox One displays are almost nothing.

Quantum Break isn't some indie title with niche appeal - although, you know, Max: The Curse Of Brotherhood gets a retail presence - its a tentpole AAA exclusive, that had major ad spends to push.
A publisher that gave a shit about it would have given it a retail presence.
Ryse: Son Of Rome on Pc got a retail release. Titanfall for PC got a retail release.

And I'm not going to 'prove' Tim Sweeneys allegations, I have already said in this topic what parts of what he said are demonstrably true, and what parts are speculation, and that the motivation (the only speculative part) for those actions is irrelevant.

What the actual fuck?!?!?

1) MS DOES provide retail copies of their PC games. YOU HAVE PROVIDED SEVERAL EXAMPLES YOURSELF. (This is so silly) Your issue (for whatever reason) seems to be that MS doesn't handle distribution of these discs on their own. From the perspective of the end user, why the hell does it matter who presses the disc? Hint: it doesn't

2) the question is: since when has a retail presence been required for a PC publisher to "prove they care"? How do Overwatche's sales PROVE anything about a correlation between a publisher having a retail presence, and a publisher caring about PC? Overwatch is 1 game out of hundreds of thousands of games sold digitally. The vast majority of these games NEVER HIT RETAIL, yet no one accuses these publishers of not caring.

3) I'm not asking you to prove Sweeney's allegations. I'm asking you whether or not he has ever provided any proof. The answer is no. Sweeney has said himself that HE HAS NONE, so the idea that you anything he said is demonstrably true is demonstrably FALSE.

You are moving goalposts to so many irrelevant places. And STILL haven't provided any reasonable rationale for your bringing console ownership into this discussion.

No one is saying you or Sweeney or anyone else shouldn't be suspicious. We are asking for PROOF to support these damning allegations. And all you seem to be able to do is bring up unrelated things like Xbox ownership, retail distribution, speculative arguments, and empty labels like "ms defenders".

Yet it your mind you believe you are the objective one... This is unreal.
Last edited by Trup1aya; 08-11-2016 at 07:27 PM.
horkrux
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(08-11-2016, 07:24 PM)
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Originally Posted by LordRaptor

Their marginal costs to stick a download code in a DVD box and ask GameStop or whoever to put it on a shelf next to their existing Xbox One displays are almost nothing.

Funny. If they did this, people would still be mad and rightfully so. I'd rather they don't give us physical releases at all instead of doing this crap. I don't need another incident like with MGSV. If you release boxes, put the proper amount of discs in it for Christ's sake.
Trup1aya
Member
(08-11-2016, 07:40 PM)

Originally Posted by horkrux

Funny. If they did this, people would still be mad and rightfully so. I'd rather they don't give us physical releases at all instead of doing this crap. I don't need another incident like with MGSV. If you release boxes, put the proper amount of discs in it for Christ's sake.

The retail version of the Quantum Break: Timeless Collector’s Edition will cost EUR/USD 39.99 and includes:

Premium packaging
5 Game Discs (one-time Steam key redemption required)
Making of Blu-Ray
Making of Book
1 Soundtrack CD (Audio-CD)
2 Posters
Quickstart Guide

Like all of the games MS released through this partnernship, the disc is included.

Yet this guy is faux-outraged because MS having a distribution partner is (somehow) a sign of a lack of caring... I guess MS personally slapping a download code in a DVD sleeve would be a sign of true dedication.
Last edited by Trup1aya; 08-11-2016 at 07:45 PM.
LordRaptor
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(08-11-2016, 07:44 PM)
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(sigh)

the only person here who is outraged - and I don't think its faux - is you because Tim Sweeney has besmirched the honour of MS, and yet nobody can provide you with 100% incontrovertible proof of his suspicions.
Trup1aya
Member
(08-11-2016, 07:48 PM)

Originally Posted by LordRaptor

(sigh)

the only person here who is outraged - and I don't think its faux - is you because Tim Sweeney has besmirched the honour of MS, and yet nobody can provide you with 100% incontrovertible proof of his suspicions.

I don't even want "incontrovertible proof". I just want some sort of evidence at all...

And let's be clear, we aren't talking about suspicions. We are talking about allegations.

And I, honestly, get a kick out of destroying the irrelevant and irrational points you keep bringing up in your defense what thus far has amounted to nothing more than FUD.

It's been a great thread.

LordRaptor has taught us:

that only Xbox fanboys like their accusations with a side of evidence.

That almost no publishers care about PC gaming, because only a few bother with retail releases

That Sweeney can somehow provide proof without actually having any

And


That physical releases that are delivered with the help of a partner are a sign of indifference.

That physical releases delivered without the help of a partner and without actuall disks are better than MS' current solution.

And that in the abscence of a rational argument LordRaptor will reliably fallback on the idea that anyone who calls him out is doing so to defence the company he hates.

It's been a wild ride.
Last edited by Trup1aya; 08-11-2016 at 07:58 PM.
LordRaptor
Member
(08-11-2016, 08:16 PM)
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Man... I don't even know what it is you are asking for or why you are so angry.
You think MS is great. Okay.
And its entirely unrelated to you being an Xbox gamer. Fine.
And its disrespectful to call you and other people also in that "Plays on Xbox, tells PC gamers they're wrong" position "MS defenders", but its fine to call me an "MS hater". Right.

"some evidence" Post 1327

Almost all major games publishers release retail PC editions. Some publishers go out of their way to pick up titles by indies too small to self publish at retail to do it for them.

Strawman the shit out of the above, IDGAF.

Tim Sweeney had something important to say, but it doesn't matter how nuanced or complicated a position might be to people who don't want to hear it in the first place.
Trup1aya
Member
(08-11-2016, 08:36 PM)

Originally Posted by LordRaptor

Man... I don't even know what it is you are asking for or why you are so angry.
You think MS is great. Okay.
And its entirely unrelated to you being an Xbox gamer. Fine.
And its disrespectful to call you and other people also in that "Plays on Xbox, tells PC gamers they're wrong" position "MS defenders", but its fine to call me an "MS hater". Right.

"some evidence" Post 1327

Almost all major games publishers release retail PC editions. Some publishers go out of their way to pick up titles by indies too small to self publish at retail to do it for them.

Strawman the shit out of the above, IDGAF.

Tim Sweeney had something important to say, but it doesn't matter how nuanced or complicated a position might be to people who don't want to hear it in the first place.

1) I'm not angry
2) I don't think MS is "great". I also have said anyone is right or wrong about MS. I said there is no proof either way.
3) it's wrong to call me a defender- Not because it's disrespectful. But because it's inaccurate. I am in no way defending MS' or anyone else's actions. I'm merely pointing out the fact that no one is actually providing evidence to support the the notion that MS' alleged plans actually exist. You use the word "defender" as a cop out because there is a lack of evidence support your affinity to Sweeney's allegations.
4) that 'evidence' is purely circumstatial. You can justifiably SPECULATE that those things COULD lead to Sweeney's prophecy coming true... But it doesn't prove ANYTHING. They could also just as easily lead to no change in the status quo at all.

5) the question isn't whether or not other big publishers have physical releases. The question is whether PC publishers must participate in retail WITHOUT a partner to 'prove they care'. The fact is, MS is bringing their game to Steam AND to retail AND on a disc AND with collector materials. That is more than can be said for the vast majority of PC titles. Your woefully flawed argument is that choosing to I nvolving Nordic is a sign of MS' indifference (despite the apparent quality of the offering), when in reality it's completely immaterial. Your argument is further weakened by your notion that MS working alone and throwing a DLC code in a retail box would be better way to show they care than working with a partner that could help deliver a more substantial offering.

You have been the one straw manning all day...

And then you finish it off by cycling back to your false notion that I don't want to here what Sweeney has to say. Tim Voicing suspicion is a great thing for everyone. Tim making damning allegations without a shread of proof... Is in poor taste (to say the least). It has nothing to do with his messages nuance or complexity.
Last edited by Trup1aya; 08-11-2016 at 08:58 PM.

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