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ironmang · Sep 25, 2017

FranF said:
"Toxic masculinity" is comparing a man being upset with his girlfriend dancing with a stranger for 20 seconds to a woman feeling jealous about her fiancé paying to be surrounded by naked strippers

I mean I probably would feel some kind of way if I were the OP, but, perspective.

First off, we weren't trying to throw a party with strippers LOL. We were just going to go to a baseball game, eat some steaks, go out drinking, then come home the next day.

Earthbound64 said:
That's one of many ways to give examples of it.

Another is the idea that a guy should be upset/jealous with his girlfriend dancing with a stranger for 20 seconds at all to begin with.
That very notion is toxic masculinity, without needing to compare it to anything else.

Drunk girlfriend dancing with a stranger that's shown interest in a club is not something most men would be ok with. Even if you reverse the situation I highly doubt that's something women would be ok with either.

What's the buzzword to explain the reverse situation? I just figured "boundaries" was the explanation for both.

Astral · Sep 25, 2017

Sorry if it has been answered already, but did the dancing involve grinding or something sexual?

Nekofrog · Sep 25, 2017

ironmang said:
First off, we weren't trying to throw a party with strippers LOL. We were just going to go to a baseball game, eat some steaks, go out drinking, then come home the next day.

Drunk girlfriend dancing with a stranger that's shown interest in a club is not something most men would be ok with. Even if you reverse the situation I highly doubt that's something women would be ok with either.

What's the buzzword to explain the reverse situation? I just figured "boundaries" was the explanation for both.

Yeah cause they're insecure little fuckboys. It's called toxic masculinity for a reason.

cromofo · Sep 25, 2017

Nekofrog said:
Yeah cause they're insecure little fuckboys. It's called toxic masculinity for a reason.

You're being unreasonable. "Toxic masculinity" has nothing to do with not wanting your girl to dance with other men.

Exploratory · Sep 25, 2017

Nekofrog said:
Yeah cause they're insecure little fuckboys. It's called toxic masculinity for a reason.

What the

fuck

are you talking about? How many women do you know would be totally fine with their drunk boyfriend leaving them at a club to dance with a girl who's shown clear interest in them? What? It has NOTHING to do with masculinity.

_Ryo_ · Sep 25, 2017

I believe I already said I wouldn't care. I forgot to mention I"m not too into monogamy right now and would probably had tried to seduce other dancers as well. Hmm. That may be important.

But further replies in the thread though do indeed make it seem like you drastically overreacted and you are fighting your own jealousy and insecurities.

Vermillion · Sep 25, 2017

Nekofrog said:
Yeah cause they're insecure little fuckboys. It's called toxic masculinity for a reason.

I feel like most women would feel exactly the same.

Meier · Sep 25, 2017

If you have an issue with her dancing with other people that you don't know, maybe it's not a good idea to go clubbing as it is conducive to that sort of thing. Or more realistically you'll probably just have to learn to deal with it especially if it's just innocent.

cromofo · Sep 25, 2017

Meier said:
If you have an issue with her dancing with other people that you don't know, maybe it's not a good idea to go clubbing as it is conducive to that sort of thing. Or more realistically you'll probably just have to learn to deal with it especially if it's just innocent.

Or maybe talk to her, since they're in a relationship or something.

_Ryo_ · Sep 25, 2017

Communication is the most important part of any relationship and you should definitely talk to her, in a respectful way, when you are both sober. If it's not something you can live with and she wants to keep doing it, then try to find a solution, if she wants to keep doing it regardless, and you're going to continue to not like it, it's time to move on.

John Rabbit · Sep 25, 2017

Nekofrog said:
Yeah cause they're insecure little fuckboys. It's called toxic masculinity for a reason.

If you're not comfortable with your partner dancing with others of your attracted sex and you've discussed this with them, that's entirely reasonable.

If you use it as an excuse to gaslight them and reduce their autonomy in the relationship, that's toxic.

sn00zer · Sep 25, 2017

I dont understand why anyone goes to gaf. Ever self help thread can be summarized as such.

Go to the doctor.
Go to a therapist.
Talk to the them and not to gaf.
Do the thing but consider having back ups.

dreamcastfan · Sep 25, 2017

My advice is, if being drunk puts you in a situation you don't like, well.. don't get drunk.

schwabdizzle · Sep 25, 2017

Put a ring on it........two years and the time clock start ticking.

tonysidaway · Sep 25, 2017

sn00zer said:
I dont understand why anyone goes to gaf. Ever self help thread can be summarized as such.

Go to the doctor.
Go to a therapist.
Talk to the them and not to gaf.
Do the thing but consider having back ups.

If only somebody would say it would work better if you ran Linux, we'd have the makings of a party.

tonysidaway · Sep 25, 2017

cromofo said:
You're being unreasonable. "Toxic masculinity" has nothing to do with not wanting your girl to dance with other men.

Kinda does. Why is it your business what another human being does of their own free will?

Dunno if toxic femininity is a thing, but being over-possessive isn't an exclusively male trait, from what I hear.

If your partner dances with other people and you don't like it, you learned something about them, and you both get a chance to learn how to be a grown-up. Be honest, be loving. Don't use the c-word. That's "cheating", by the way. Being honest and loving is not cheating.

Anticol · Sep 25, 2017

Maddness said:
So your girl dances for 20 secs with 2 random dudes and you're going to bounce? Sounds like you aren't that confident in your ability to retain a relationship with her. Sounds like one of those hard look in the mirror moments trying to fool yourself to me.

M8 I havent read the whole thread but if OP discussed this beforehand with her gf and she still did it right in front of him after he stated he felt uncomfortable with her doing it and she goes and grinds a guy like nothing well I cant blame him to be upset and if she does this in front of him it is possible for her to do worse stuff behing his back.

If this was the other way around and she was the one getting upset I am sure the reaction would be different.

cromofo · Sep 25, 2017

tonysidaway said:
Kinda does. Why is it your business what another human being does of their own free will?

Dunno if toxic femininity is a thing, but being over-possessive isn't an exclusively male trait, from what I hear.

If your partner dances with other people and you don't like it, you learned something about them, and you both get a chance to learn how to be a grown-up. Be honest, be loving. Don't use the c-word. That's "cheating", by the way. Being honest and loving is not cheating.

It's a relationship between two people. A level of understanding and boundaries above just another human being.

If your partner dances with other people and you don't like it, you learned something about them, and you both get a chance to learn how to be a grown-up.

Uh no, you should talk to your partner and tell them it's something that bothers you and then assess and decide further - like a real grown up. At least that's how I see it.

Don't use the c-word. That's "cheating", by the way.

Dude what

Byakuya769 · Sep 25, 2017

tonysidaway said:
Kinda does. Why is it your business what another human being does of their own free will?

Dunno if toxic femininity is a thing, but being over-possessive isn't an exclusively male trait, from what I hear.

If your partner dances with other people and you don't like it, you learned something about them, and you both get a chance to learn how to be a grown-up. Be honest, be loving. Don't use the c-word. That's "cheating", by the way. Being honest and loving is not cheating.

Parody or reality? Trump broke our universe.

Pilgrimzero · Sep 25, 2017

I never thought Im my life I would see someone compare their relationship to Mario and Peach.

Regiruler · Sep 25, 2017

FreeMufasa said:
Random question but I'm curious. When you gaffers think of dancing together with someone, what comes to mind? If possible post a gif

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPHr9ghVyNU

NoRéN · Sep 25, 2017

tonysidaway said:
If only somebody would say it would work better if you ran Linux, we'd have the makings of a party.

Linux doesn't get drunk and dance with randos and gets viruses.

Linux.

Earthbound64 · Sep 25, 2017

NoRéN;250007325 said:
Linux doesn't get drunk and dance with randos and gets viruses.

Linux.

Well, sure - considering it's sat in the corner all alone with no one interacting with it.
It's probably sudoing itself.

Mammoth Jones · Sep 25, 2017

_Ryo_ said:
Communication is the most important part of any relationship and you should definitely talk to her, in a respectful way, when you are both sober. If it's not something you can live with and she wants to keep doing it, then try to find a solution, if she wants to keep doing it regardless, and you're going to continue to not like it, it's time to move on.

This. Wtf. Explain. I'm adult enough to concede when I'm insecure about something and yup I'm insecure about another dude dancing with my wife. I'm just not cool with it. I'll never be OK with that shit.

Now did I go to my wife and say "you're not allowed!"? No. I just explained my feelings and she respects them. I didn't demand she behave a certain way. She chose on her own to be easy with that shit.

It's not that hard.

NoRéN · Sep 25, 2017

Mammoth Jones said:
This. Wtf. Explain. I'm adult enough to concede when I'm insecure about something and yup I'm insecure about another dude dancing with my wife. I'm just not cool with it. I'll never be OK with that shit.

Now did I go to my wife and say "you're not allowed!"? No. I just explained my feelings and she respects them. I didn't demand she behave a certain way. She chose on her own to be easy with that shit.

It's not that hard.

You would be surprised. For some people a thought of a serious, one on one conversation is scary. Passive aggressiveness is easier for them as it's similar so social media posting. It's quick and doesn't require much thought.

tonysidaway · Sep 26, 2017

Regiruler said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPHr9ghVyNU

I bought a copy of Bayonetta 1 to see what the fuss was about, but I couldn't make it through the tutorial to play the game. I like what I saw of the graphic design.

I'm also still stuck on one of the potatOS levels of Portal 2, which is officially my favourite game ever.

Oh where were we? Dancing. Yes. Dance the night away.

But don't forget who's taking you home, and in whose arms you're gonna be,
So darling, save the last dance for me.

tonysidaway · Sep 26, 2017

Mammoth Jones said:
This. Wtf. Explain. I'm adult enough to concede when I'm insecure about something and yup I'm insecure about another dude dancing with my wife. I'm just not cool with it. I'll never be OK with that shit.

Now did I go to my wife and say "you're not allowed!"? No. I just explained my feelings and she respects them. I didn't demand she behave a certain way. She chose on her own to be easy with that shit.

It's not that hard.

This person gets it. Listen to them.

Earthbound64 · Sep 26, 2017

NoRéN;250009626 said:
You would be surprised. For some people a thought of a serious, one on one conversation is scary.

And thank goodness that's the case - otherwise we wouldn't have nearly as many interesting threads here.

tonysidaway · Sep 26, 2017

cromofo said:
It's a relationship between two people. A level of understanding and boundaries above just another human being.

Whilst I agree that there is an understanding and there are boundaries, I honestly see no role here for coercion.

Speaking of which:

Uh no, you should talk to your partner and tell them it's something that bothers you and then assess and decide further - like a real grown up. At least that's how I see it.

It seems we both agree on how to be an adult. If I've failed to express myself as well as you have, I apologise.

Dude what

I had said: 'Don't use the c-word. That's "cheating", by the way.'

I don't think that word should be in any adult lexicon. It's not a word a husband should use about a wife, or vice versa. You cannot build trust and love when you designate certain autonomous conduct as cheating.

But what do I know?

tonysidaway · Sep 26, 2017

NoRéN;250007325 said:
Linux doesn't get drunk and dance with randos and gets viruses.

Linux.

#include <openssh>

OpenBSD is pandering to Linux, smugly, while reminding him that she's one of the main reasons why he doesn't get viruses.

Skeeter49 · Sep 26, 2017

If it really bothers you, maybe cut back on the drinking and see if it's still an issue.

Or just talk to her and make sure it's just her trying to have fun, and not with any intentions that are sexual or anything.

tonysidaway · Sep 26, 2017

backslashbunny said:
Are you talking about in this instance only, or do you believe that no spouse/s can ever use the word "cheating" to describe the behavior of their partner/s, regardless of what the behavior is?

Like, do you truly believe there's no such thing as cheating on your husband/wife?

That's a good point. For some time on this thread I've been emphasizing best practice. I have no experience of a toxic relationship, only a very beneficial one lasting over three decades in which two quite normally horny people somehow got themselves into a state of monogamy without even trying.

So I should admit that I don't know shit about dishonest people. I seem to have effectively weeded them out of my life during my teens.

So yeah, you got me. I cannot help anybody who fears that they may be betrayed. That's a real weakness of any advice I might give. You need to have the ability to develop trust in your loved one. And that means you don't risk using words that might bruise them.

I called my wife a bad word only once, in an argument, and I will always regret it.

Skeeter49 · Sep 26, 2017

Crossing Eden said:
We JUST had a thread asking about why gaming is still considered uncool in 2017.. :|

And now we have factual proof. OP gave us a blessing.

Earthbound64 · Sep 26, 2017

tonysidaway said:
That's a good point. For some time on this thread I've been emphasizing best practice. I have no experience of a toxic relationship, only a very beneficial one lasting over three decades in which two quite normally horny people somehow got themselves into a state of monogamy without even trying.

So I should admit that I don't know shit about dishonest people. I seem to have effectively weeded them out of my life during my teens.

So yeah, you got me. I cannot help anybody who fears that they may be betrayed. That's a real weakness of any advice I might give. You need to have the ability to develop trust in your loved one. And that means you don't risk using words that might bruise them.

I called my wife a bad word only once, in an argument, and I will always regret it.

This is a good post.

Good people will be good without the need for fencing.
Not-so-good people will be not-so-good no matter how much you try to cage them.

Escape Goat · Sep 26, 2017

Crankshaft said:
Was alcohol involved? Were inhibitions dropped?

Panties were dropped.

tonysidaway · Sep 26, 2017

backslashbunny said:
So you're saying, because you've never personally experienced being cheated on, you believe that it's wrong for anyone to ever use that word about their partner's behavior, regardless of whether or not the person feels as if s/he has been cheated on?

I've already owned up to the fact that I can only suggest best practice. Because, you know...

There is a reason for my point. That is that, once you use the C-word in a relationship, you can't ever take it back.

Also, you seem to believe that a word, if hurtful, should never be used in a relationship, regardless of whether or not it is true?

I think that is up to the relationship and the particular person. But honesty and respect is pretty important, and words are cheap. Both of them can last a lifetime. The individual calculus in any particular relationship is far beyond my capacity to compute. A word, once unleashed, will ricochet forever, hurting both innocent and guilty, assailant and victim.

Speaking of assailants, I think I would hate to be in a relationship where I felt that I or anyone else I cared for were at risk. To those who feel they may be in danger and do not trust their partners, I would encourage you to seek external help with a view to achieving safety for you and all your loved ones.

pigeon · Sep 26, 2017

tonysidaway said:
I've already owned up to the fact that I can only suggest best practice. Because, you know...

There is a reason for my point. That is that, once you use the C-word in a relationship, you can't ever take it back.

Wait, why not?

tonysidaway · Sep 26, 2017

pigeon said:
Wait, why not?

Because you have just expressed distrust in a most unambiguous way. If you accuse a partner you trust of cheating, at best you are abusing them. If you don't trust them, tell them so and listen carefully to their response.

If you use the C-word, though, maybe it's time to work out if you have a relationship or a transaction. Is there trust or not?

Jason's Ultimatum · Sep 26, 2017

LookAtMeGo said:
OP's girl when hes on the dancefloor and when hes off the dancefloor

This is actually very true lol.

tonysidaway · Sep 26, 2017

backslashbunny said:
You're still not answering my questions. I'm asking you if what I think you're saying is what you are saying, and why you believe those things.

I'm not sure this is appropriate for public discussion. I'll gladly answer in PM if you like.

Loki · Sep 26, 2017

Loki said:
Something which I think a lot of folks are either ignoring or glossing over is that fact that he didn't say she just danced with a random guy - she intentionally went over to a guy who was previously trying to hit on her and who was clearly into her after he had left the group after realizing she wasn't single. I'm not necessarily saying that that makes it verboten, but it does color the action a bit imo. It's different than going over to a random guy who you had no previous contact with and who has expressed no overt interest in you.

Again, people are overlooking/glossing over the above.

SDBurton · Sep 26, 2017

Omegasquash said:
Right but man you never know what can happen.

I mean, when I was at the airport with my girl we hit up the bar past security and some dude had the audacity to buy a drink and have it sent to her when I was right there.

Then all of a sudden she left me outright, went over to him and ducked underneath his table and blew him like, right there. Then she went on a week long vacation with him, got knocked up, and here I am raising his kid.

All because I didn't like, pee on her to mark my territory of something.

This sort of thing happens. It's really real life. It can happen to you too, OP.

Or OP is over reacting a bit. Cool off. The way you handle these kinds of things can make you look better or worse. This...ain't gonna end with you looking better unless you shrug it off.

Why in the world are you in this position right now? Like, I'm surprised not many others touched on this post because holy shit...

Not trying to give you grief in any means but I'm insanely curious as to how this developed.

If this was a joke then hey, you got me.

FreeMufasa · Sep 26, 2017

LookAtMeGo said:
OP's girl when hes on the dancefloor and when hes off the dancefloor

Looooooool

Sai-kun · Sep 26, 2017

SDBurton said:
Why in the world are you in this position right now? Like, I'm surprised not many others touched on this post because holy shit...

Not trying to give you grief in any means but I'm insanely curious as to how this developed.

If this was a joke then hey, you got me.

Bruh
Really
Lmao

wandering · Sep 26, 2017

SDBurton said:
Why in the world are you in this position right now? Like, I'm surprised not many others touched on this post because holy shit...

Not trying to give you grief in any means but I'm insanely curious as to how this developed.

If this was a joke then hey, you got me.

Dude

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