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The Unofficial Tales of Translation Updates Thread: Fans bring us what Namco can't
- Thread starter Firestorm
- Start date
CielTynave
Member
Maybe he realized no one gives a shit any more.
Posted by Cless on 12/21/2012
The major issues with Tales of Phantasia have seemingly been ironed out for good, and having just successfully completed a run through the game on real console hardware with all features intact, the patch has, at long last, reached the beta testing stage.
If you've never read the forum since the previous site update, this is probably slightly confusing, as I said we'd be putting out a feature-incomplete patch that would receive no traditional beta test. As the expected target time (early September) neared, Habilain suddenly started submitting fixes to the issues. I put the gimped patch on indefinite hold, as I'm sure you'd agree it's better to put out a feature-complete patch if it seems within reach.
Unfortunately, this wasn't smooth sailing. For every fix, something else got broken, for various reasons. It became a vicious cycle. After the initial expression of optimism, the cycle rearing its head brought frustration. I soon hit a breaking point and decided take a break from the community and keep quiet until I was absolutely certain things would actually be going somewhere. Seriously, I'd gotten incredibly fed up with the whole "well damn, a new bug that I can't fix myself has suddenly been encountered" delay cycle. And that actually would have happened a couple more times if I stuck around during the time of my absence. There's no news I've dreaded posting more than that crap. None.
So, just a little over a week ago, I finally had a build of the game without any known major problems that I couldn't fix by myself. After successfully completing the game from start to finish on that build, and being able to fix just about every significant issue I came across during that time, I felt it was time to return, beta this thing, and get it out the door, once and for all. I think any other technical issues with the patch would have to be quite obscure at this point.
Right now, I'm still committed a 2012 release.
Now, for a final little batch of screenshots:
The major issues with Tales of Phantasia have seemingly been ironed out for good, and having just successfully completed a run through the game on real console hardware with all features intact, the patch has, at long last, reached the beta testing stage.
If you've never read the forum since the previous site update, this is probably slightly confusing, as I said we'd be putting out a feature-incomplete patch that would receive no traditional beta test. As the expected target time (early September) neared, Habilain suddenly started submitting fixes to the issues. I put the gimped patch on indefinite hold, as I'm sure you'd agree it's better to put out a feature-complete patch if it seems within reach.
Unfortunately, this wasn't smooth sailing. For every fix, something else got broken, for various reasons. It became a vicious cycle. After the initial expression of optimism, the cycle rearing its head brought frustration. I soon hit a breaking point and decided take a break from the community and keep quiet until I was absolutely certain things would actually be going somewhere. Seriously, I'd gotten incredibly fed up with the whole "well damn, a new bug that I can't fix myself has suddenly been encountered" delay cycle. And that actually would have happened a couple more times if I stuck around during the time of my absence. There's no news I've dreaded posting more than that crap. None.
So, just a little over a week ago, I finally had a build of the game without any known major problems that I couldn't fix by myself. After successfully completing the game from start to finish on that build, and being able to fix just about every significant issue I came across during that time, I felt it was time to return, beta this thing, and get it out the door, once and for all. I think any other technical issues with the patch would have to be quite obscure at this point.
Right now, I'm still committed a 2012 release.
Now, for a final little batch of screenshots:
R_thanatos
Member
what version are they translating ? the full voice edition or the psx one ?
i'm confused by the screens
i'm confused by the screens
clay_ghost
Member
PSX.
Palette Swap
Member
Wasn't this version already translated 3 or 4 years ago? (with a Christmas release IIRC)
Given the number of untranslated Tales games, it seems a bit counterproductive to focus on stuff already translated.
AzureSkies
Member
This was the original translation of Tales of Phantasia that started work a long time ago. It's incredibly ambitious with it's features and Cless is a little bit of a perfectionist, so it doesn't surprise me that it has taken this long. But I'm seriously looking forward to playing it.
I just wish someone would put in the effort to translate Tales of Phantasia X (a PSP remake that was included with Tales of Phantasia: Narikiri Dungeon X)
Posted by Cless on 12/29/2012
Beta testing turnout has been smaller than I'd hoped. But things continue to be just fine as I do my second run through the game trying some things I didn't during my first. The patch is definitely still on track for 2012.
Anyway, the main purpose of this post is to help people prepare for the upcoming release. Back when we released the demo, there were some reports of people having problems getting the patch to apply. Apparently, even from people claiming to have used an original disc as a source. They probably received the XD3_INVALID_INPUT error. The fact is, the patch format we use, xdelta, requires the file being patched to be a 100% bit-for-bit copy of the one it was created from in order for it to function. It's a great deal more sophisticated than the old IPS format which is nothing more than a simple list of differences which doesn't support insertions or deletions.
Unfortunately, one of the quirks of the PS1 disc format to save space is to store streamed audio in Mode 2/XA sectors, which contain no error correction data at all. Therefore, damage to Mode 2/XA sectors is significantly more likely to result in bit reading errors and bad ISO dumps. Basically, ISOs that won't work with our patches.
So, if XA data can be messed up that easily, releasing a patch in a format requiring an exact twin may seem a tad awkward. Well, maybe. I personally like it because it ensures people will be playing the exact same copy I have. This helps eliminate tech support nightmares and the nightmares of tracking down bugs that may not even exist in a proper copy.
But none of that should matter too much anymore. I think I have landed on a solution to this for most people: PAR2. Traditionally, PAR2 has been used as a means to repair broken or incomplete downloads on Usenet, but we can use it here as a LEGAL solution to help ensure people with a bad dump of the game, regardless of how they obtained it, can still use our patch, and wind up with a functionally precise copy.
On the forum, I have posted a new patching instructions thread. If you had problems patching the old demo and/or just want to make sure the disc image you intend to patch will work, I encourage you to download the demo patch from the very outdated project page and test it with the new instructions. If it works out, you can be pretty much assured that the full patch we will soon be releasing will work just as well.
http://www.tales-cless.org/
Beta testing turnout has been smaller than I'd hoped. But things continue to be just fine as I do my second run through the game trying some things I didn't during my first. The patch is definitely still on track for 2012.
Anyway, the main purpose of this post is to help people prepare for the upcoming release. Back when we released the demo, there were some reports of people having problems getting the patch to apply. Apparently, even from people claiming to have used an original disc as a source. They probably received the XD3_INVALID_INPUT error. The fact is, the patch format we use, xdelta, requires the file being patched to be a 100% bit-for-bit copy of the one it was created from in order for it to function. It's a great deal more sophisticated than the old IPS format which is nothing more than a simple list of differences which doesn't support insertions or deletions.
Unfortunately, one of the quirks of the PS1 disc format to save space is to store streamed audio in Mode 2/XA sectors, which contain no error correction data at all. Therefore, damage to Mode 2/XA sectors is significantly more likely to result in bit reading errors and bad ISO dumps. Basically, ISOs that won't work with our patches.
So, if XA data can be messed up that easily, releasing a patch in a format requiring an exact twin may seem a tad awkward. Well, maybe. I personally like it because it ensures people will be playing the exact same copy I have. This helps eliminate tech support nightmares and the nightmares of tracking down bugs that may not even exist in a proper copy.
But none of that should matter too much anymore. I think I have landed on a solution to this for most people: PAR2. Traditionally, PAR2 has been used as a means to repair broken or incomplete downloads on Usenet, but we can use it here as a LEGAL solution to help ensure people with a bad dump of the game, regardless of how they obtained it, can still use our patch, and wind up with a functionally precise copy.
On the forum, I have posted a new patching instructions thread. If you had problems patching the old demo and/or just want to make sure the disc image you intend to patch will work, I encourage you to download the demo patch from the very outdated project page and test it with the new instructions. If it works out, you can be pretty much assured that the full patch we will soon be releasing will work just as well.
http://www.tales-cless.org/
Forget the Maya calendar. This is the TRUE sign of the apocalypse.
Yes; he mentions that in the news post.
R_thanatos
Member
i love how cless is kinda a perfectionnist ..he actually went from 99% complete ( february 2012 ) to 100% ( december 2012 )
Just incredible...
But the real news is that he actually stick to his goals and delivered ...
such a good guy.
Just incredible...
But the real news is that he actually stick to his goals and delivered ...
such a good guy.
Expect them in 2025.
charlequin
Banned
The Absolute Zero guy is working with him now. Average it out and expect them in like 2017.
Viola of the Abyss
Member
I can finally play this game. I hope it will be worth it waiting for so long!
It's fantastic. Play it on your PSP.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
Yeah, same. I can't go back to the older versions outside of the ToPX version anymore.
No spell freeze makes a difference!
BassForever
Member
Guess it's time to replay ToP PSX
Well, now that I'm back from my ban, I guess I can update this thing again...
Please focus on ToD PS2, Cless...
Posted by Cless on 1/6/2013
So, Tales of Phantasia's been out for a week (it's still a bit hard to believe even for me). And the burning question is... Where do we go from here? Which project's next? Actually, I'm not sure there's a clear-cut answer to that.
Well, first, there's the long-forgotten and not-especially-loved Tales of Phantasia: Narikiri Dungeon, so let's get it out of the way. This game has always been a pain to work on with all of its limitations. Nothing has been done with it in years. It's on hiatus and I have no idea when or if it'll be resumed. Perhaps many of its limitations could be overcome with some extensive program-code-level hacking, but there really isn't a whole lot of personal desire to go back to it at this point. The game has also since received a Tales of Destiny-esque ground-up remake for the PlayStation Portable, which is, in all likelihood, the better game by countless orders of magnitude.
So...that leaves Tales of Destiny: Director's Cut and Tales of Destiny 2. I think, for the time being, it'd be best to consider them becoming active simulatenously. There is quite a bit of crossover between them, not just because they are connected at a story level and share terminology, characters and things, but also because they're so similar on a hacking/technical level. A lot of things we can do with one can be applied to the other.
You might remember last year that I worked on some back-end restructuring for ToDC during some Phantasia downtime. That still needs to be finished up and it's what I intend to work on first. With just some light modification, most of that code can be recycled for ToD2. I think it makes the most sense to just concentrate on finishing that up for ToD
That being said, I did mostly finish up the restructuring of the main script and skit script stuff. What needs to be done now is the menu/interface text. I actually did get a head start on it during my recent community absence. The whole thing's actually a bit more complicated than the script stuff, mainly in regards to text strings whose pointers are embedded in the program code. In a nutshell, program-code-embedded pointers make it difficult to relocate their corresponding text strings terribly far from their original position, and with what I have planned, I need to be able to relocate them anywhere. I've devised a method to make doing this easier, and its implementation is mostly finished. I need to take it slow and careful though, because a mistake could be disastrous.
After that, IF I'm not forgetting anything, I'll just need to make new text dumping and insertion tools for the smaller things that remain. Shouldn't be a big deal. I suppose once we reach this point, the menu patch for ToD
Then comes the ToD2 stuff as mentioned before. There's not much more needing to be said about that project except that the translator situation hasn't changed since the December 2011 news update. I hope we can get that sorted out. I'll be looking into doing some additional ASM hacks on that game and will definitely be giving it a new font--I finally managed identify the font that ToD PS2 uses, and it's what I'll be implementing for some nice consistency between the projects.
As useless as this might be, I would like to remind people that none of this is going to happen overnight, even with ToP not being there to hold us back anymore. Don't expect frequent updates. And definitely don't freak out when we're not updating every week. Translating games isn't a job, nor is it our only hobby.
I've also decided I don't want to continue doing news in the same way we had been doing for ToP the last few years. No more short forum posts about every little thing we've done. No silly "twitter-like" thread to dump that kind of stuff into as that "to-do list" thread kind of became. We'll mostly be returning to the occasional, detailed front page update kind of setup.
Please focus on ToD PS2, Cless...
Brawly Likes to Brawl
Member
Great news. I heard wonderful things about NDX
charlequin
Banned
Always glad to get more updates from TH413. Knowing that he's involved in some way in the Hearts project actually leaves me feeling more confident in it someday being completed than I have in some time.
I think at this point though it's definitely time for someone to step up and tackle ToD2 and Rebirth; if Absolute Zero can finish everything nominally on their plate, those two would be the only two mothership games that can't yet be played in English.
I think at this point though it's definitely time for someone to step up and tackle ToD2 and Rebirth; if Absolute Zero can finish everything nominally on their plate, those two would be the only two mothership games that can't yet be played in English.
Why not just learn Japanese? Learning Japanese would be a much, much faster affair than waiting 5-10 years for another release. A friend of mine started back in 2007 and by the time 09' rolled around he was playing all sorts of JP games. He's a huge fan of Japanese media and plays everything from the most obscure visual novels to the latest JP-only releases. If you are a fan of Japan like him then I recommend it, because he seems to enjoy himself a lot.
It's not like I'm just waiting around for this single game while they work on it. There's plenty of other stuff to play.
And the idea of learning something like Japanese... not very realistic for most gamers outside of Japan. There are so many other things vying for my time in my life, and besides time I don't have the patience or perseverance for something like that.
Brawly Likes to Brawl
Member
There's already a team working on Rebirth.
Edit: NVM, site name is filtered. Just search "Tales of Rebirth Translation" on Google.
charlequin
Banned
Japanese is maybe the single hardest widely-spoken language for a native English speaker to learn. You're talking 2000+ hours of direct instruction plus study and conversational immersion to develop a solid working knowledge starting from nothing. Most people would be hard-pressed to develop even a workable knowledge of Japanese in five years unless they could devote a significant part of their life to it.
Learning enough to navigate menus and parse dialogue with a guide can definitely be worthwhile for many people, and it's an admirable effort (learning another language is a great thing no matter what inspires the choice to do so) but for the most part it's not going to be particularly equivalent to playing games with full comprehension.
Looks like throughhim413 is going to be giving monthly updates now. That's pretty exciting.
http://a0t.co/2013/11/03/updates-and-such/
http://a0t.co/2013/11/03/updates-and-such/
Nice to see some faint signs of life, I suppose...
http://forum.tales-cless.org/tales-of-destiny-directors-cut-(ps2)/so-still-no-menu-patch/
http://forum.tales-cless.org/tales-of-destiny-directors-cut-(ps2)/so-still-no-menu-patch/
The Tales of Hearts translation has been cancelled since Hearts R is going to have an official localization later this year.
http://a0t.co/2014/04/18/tales-of-heartbreak/
http://a0t.co/2014/04/18/tales-of-heartbreak/
Namco brings us what fans can't.
charlequin
Banned
Inferior versions of their game?
The SHADE.
A-at least they can now focus on other games, right? Tales of Phantasia X includes its direct sequel, no? That's new! For fan translations I mean.
Given the dubious nature of ToHR it does seem like it's more a translation that should be postponed rather than outright scrapped. Push people towards the legitimate official release, then tackle the very different DS game for those who still want to play that specifically.
Some people would just pass on the Vita version if they know DS version is coming. Now that it is canceled, it is either playing Vita version or not playing it at all.
Even if they want to restart the translation, they won't make any announcement until after the Vita version is out for a while. Just like Tales of Phantasia X translation now won't affect Tales of Phantasia GBA.