shinshoryuken
Member
I was gonna reply to him but Dayam! I'll just let you handle him...
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The Automotive Discussion Thread
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I was gonna reply to him but Dayam! I'll just let you handle him...
AlphaSnake
...and that, kids, was the first time I sucked a dick for crack
I can so fucking proudly say I was one of the very first people in the entire world...to sit in the 2013 SRT Viper, feel its clutch, and row its gears.
Oh. My. God.
Oh. My. God.
BoobPhysics101
Banned
The new Viper is just... wow. How was dat gearbox?
Grover Cleveland
Member
I think there will be some people who are disappointed with those numbers knowing that you can buy a more powerful Mustang and slightly (by an itsy-bitsy amount) less powerful Corvette (with more torque).
But 640 HP in a N/A engine? Hot damn.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I mean, there's only so powerful you can get and still be drivable.
ClassyPenguin
Banned
I think the mustang is one of the most hideous cars on the market.
AlphaSnake
...and that, kids, was the first time I sucked a dick for crack
Clutch is firm, but so positive. Throws are extremely short, but extremely accurate, and you always know what gear you're in.
On the other hand, I sat in the BRZ: awful clutch, decent gearbox communication, though surprisingly decent quality interior in loaded form. I was properly shocked, because the few manual transmission cars on the floor like the facelifted S4, TT-RS, the Mustangs (Shelby and Boss) and especially the Viper had some pretty solid feeling clutches. I damn near tore through the firewall when I put my foot down on the BRZ's clutch. I call that a noodle clutch, and this was the epitome of that. It's on another left of soft I haven't experience since driving an A5 2.0T in stick.
When a rep came up to me and asked me what I thought, I blatantly said "it looks nice...but the power is not for me. It needs a turbo."
Btw, don't ever try to track an Audi TT-RS. The foot-well is so narrow and the pedals are so poorly aligned, that heel-and-toeing feels damn near impossible. With my toe on the brake, the heel of my leg kept hitting the side of the foot-well instead of the pedal.
Oh, oh...Benz interiors are super lollerz of cheapness and creaky plastic. It's pretty criminal to pay that kind of money when a Suzuki Kizashi in the next booth had better fit and finish and better feeling materials.
Grover Cleveland
Member
You'll get no arguments from me there.
I generally hate Mustangs.
They make loud vroom-vrooms though.
BoobPhysics101
Banned
Holy shit, I found N-Bomb's favorite shirt:
lmao
ClassyPenguin
Banned
I like the Falcon though. It's just that I'm not into the retro styling of the Mustang. Underneath, it's a beast, though.
I don't get the massive rotary hate. Did they kill your mother or something?
I don't get the massive rotary hate. Did they kill your mother or something?
Glad that you personally know people who drive their cars. Drive them a ton, apparently.
I'm not knocking high-revving engines one bit - I have a Celica GTS right now, and it's just as peaky as an S2000. But you know what? Most of the time we spend in our daily drivers, the revs are in the 2000-4000 range, where these engines are just STARTING to build any kind of power. Great on a track, not as useful on the road - this is one reason why someone smart would pick a V8 to swap in to something.
It's also a reason you'd turbocharge something with a weaker low end (like a rotary!) - if you've ever seen a dyno graph of a 20B, the torque curve is like a shelf that runs for almost 2000 RPM. Again, not knocking high-strung engines, but there's something visceral about stomping on the gas and just being pushed back in your seat without having to wait 3000 RPM.
Damn right I'm condescending. Go look back at the attitude you've been copping and realize why.
AlphaSnake
...and that, kids, was the first time I sucked a dick for crack
True story: Dude's behind me during the Viper unveil were talking about how much rotaries suck and how problematic they are. LOL.
I found it funny since we just had that convo yesterday here.
GAF > World > GAF
I found it funny since we just had that convo yesterday here.
GAF > World > GAF
Holy shit, I found N-Bomb's favorite shirt:
lmao
I'd totally wear that if it wasn't so crass!
ClassyPenguin
Banned
I have this shirt though:
BoobPhysics101
Banned
Ok, you drive a Celica GTS. LOL. Explains a lot. ;P
I know all about power curves and their usage for daily driving vs track. The thing is, S2000 has 90% of peak torque available @ 2500 RPM. Dat flat torque band. Not all high-revving cars have no low end power.
And meh: I can get better torque and drivability out of something like an Evo engine... and that revs to 7500 RPM. Also, there are supercharged S2000's with incredible low-end torque AND smooth, linear increases of high RPM horsepower:
Again, your rotary crap falls flat. You can super/turbocharge engines like the S2000's and give them low end, and they'll STILL get better mpg, be more reliable, hold more power, make more power, and be easier to maintain.
twinturbo2
butthurt Heat fan
Even better, it has a traditional stick shift! You can turn off the stability control!
David Incorporated Esq.
Member
Really? The clutch and shifter felt solid? I never had a chance to drive the SRT-10 but the one time I sat in it the clutch felt like a foot-long leg press and the shifter had the most uncomfortable, awkward pattern I'd ever experienced. If they turned that around it could bode pretty well for the feel of the rest of the car.
Uggo car in my opinion, but I've never cared for the proportions of the vipers so I'm biased.
And I wonder if you'd be able to remove an assist spring from the BRZ to improve the clutch feel. Fuckin' hate those clutch springs.
twinturbo2
butthurt Heat fan
PICS OR IT NEVER HAPPENED.
AlphaSnake
...and that, kids, was the first time I sucked a dick for crack
Vipers are known to have very low assistance in their clutches, so they feel like a work out. This one was firm, but not excruciating - then again, I drive a 370Z and a lot of people say we have very firm clutches, so I'm possibly just used to this sort of feeling. Travel didn't seem terribly long, either...but rather, just right.
One problem I see arising is people with big or fat hands getting their fingers pinched by the car's adjustable seat. The buttons to adjust the seat are right where the chassis' structural beam runs along side of the tub/monocoque. That beam, much like a Lotus Elise, runs right next to the driver, so you sit really low in the car. So the bottom of the seat where the buttons are and the beam are parallel, practically.
Again, the space between is hardly a few millimeters...I hope it was just a pre-production thing for demo purposes though. The interior's center console was in demo mode as well, and was not interactive.
Ok, you drive a Celica GTS. LOL. Explains a lot. ;P
I know all about power curves and their usage for daily driving vs track. The thing is, S2000 has 90% of peak torque available @ 2500 RPM. Dat flat torque band. Not all high-revving cars have no low end power.
And meh: I can get better torque and drivability out of something like an Evo engine... and that revs to 7500 RPM. Also, there are supercharged S2000's with incredible low-end torque AND smooth, linear increases of high RPM horsepower:
Again, your rotary crap falls flat. You can super/turbocharge engines like the S2000's and give them low end, and they'll STILL get better mpg, be more reliable, hold more power, make more power, and be easier to maintain.
My next project is actually swapping an EJ207 into my Impreza, that thing will kick all kinds of ass.
I can say though that of all the engines I've owned, a rotary, various inline 4s, an inline 6, and now a boxer 4 (tho it's just the crappy N/A 2.2L), the rotary was definitely the most fun.
Because of the aforementioned detonation risks, they ran rich from the factory, so I'd get these wicked backfires whenever I let off the gas. It was so smooth, too. That lack of vibration was eerie-awesome sometimes.
Believe it or not, an S2000 was actually on my shortlist of cars to get this spring.
Just going by the recent auto show in Toronto, the best cluth/shifter combos of the show were the Civic Si, the Miata, and the Corvette. Everything else felt wobbly, rubbery, weak, soft, or too hard. The Dodge Challenger has the most ridiculous shifter EVER.
BoobPhysics101
Banned
Is it an old Impreza RS coupe? Because the RSTI conversions of those are AMAZING.
You should've got an S2000. You'd be cured of your rotary disease forever, sir.
And meh: I can get better torque and drivability out of something like an Evo engine... and that revs to 7500 RPM. Also, there are supercharged S2000's with incredible low-end torque AND smooth, linear increases of high RPM horsepower:
Read that graph wrong at first
Any clue what kit that is?
MiniBossBattle
Member
Will the US ever get Holden or Falcons?
BoobPhysics101
Banned
Read that graph wrong at first
Any clue what kit that is?
SOT supercharger. I don't know if they make it any more. It's a roots blower. That was on 8 psi of boost.
stop making me sad
We got a holden with a pontiac badge (G8) before pontiac was sent to the afterlife.
The GTO too.
and you get the Caprice now (police only though).
Its pretty much confirmed after the next model cycle the commodore will move to a global (probably fwd/awd) platform anyway. It'll be likely next-gen Impala = Commodore
Noise Pollution
Banned
Also some Chevy dealerships are getting away with selling the new Caprice to civilians. Personally I don't think Australia will ever let one of thier platforms be anything but rwd.
Did they say what chassis the new impala is built on yet?
The Impala is Epsilon II, like the Buick LaCrosse and Cadillac XTS.
Mini show floor report:
Viper:
I will say it now. CAR OF THE SHOW! Same engine as previous Viper but 640hp and 600ft/lbs. It is also MUCH lighter. 3190~ lbs dry weight. Almost as good hp/lbs ratio as F12 Ferrari. A lot of carbon fiber was used (hood, roof, trunk, and some internals). The chassis is the same but it is far more rigid (they are not just saying that, I saw the image of the raw frame an it looks pretty different from last gen. + there is now an X brace over the engine). Pirelli engineered tires specifically for this car. 295F/355R I believe. MUCH MUCH MUCH better interior. IMO this is the biggest improvement. It is classy. I would say between a Ford GT and R8 in terms of quality. Ferrari sourced seats! Styling wise, I like the detail work. The car gets better the closer you get to it. Definitely modern retro. Finally there will be two models, and I am happy to say Dodge/SRT gets it. GTS will have a nicer interior and more luxury, and slightly calmer styling, but be more expensive over the base. The base base has a more aggressive hood and is a little more "hard core" bare bones as described, in other words, Viper. There will also be a "track pack" option lessening the weight. ZR1 you have been put on notice. This easily trounces it in just about every category.
ALMS:
Oh the ALMS car looks great. Talked to ALMS President Scott Atherton. GT field will continue to grow. Nobody should be leaving in the immediate future. Lotus+Viper+Maybe Aston back again+maybe even MORE in the future (they are working on Audi). Prototype is kinda a mixed back. He wants Toyota to race here (it would be competitive with some minor tweaking), but Toyota does not want to commit and they think NASCAR is enough (booooo). Mentioned the ESPN3 crapshoot show but wanted to be respectful and not bitch. All I said was get John Hindaugh from the ESPN3/Euro broadcast to do the ABC/ESPN2 recaps. That is all. Probably does not give a crap what I think, but I would watch the recaps if he announced them.
That is all for now. Bed.
Viper:
I will say it now. CAR OF THE SHOW! Same engine as previous Viper but 640hp and 600ft/lbs. It is also MUCH lighter. 3190~ lbs dry weight. Almost as good hp/lbs ratio as F12 Ferrari. A lot of carbon fiber was used (hood, roof, trunk, and some internals). The chassis is the same but it is far more rigid (they are not just saying that, I saw the image of the raw frame an it looks pretty different from last gen. + there is now an X brace over the engine). Pirelli engineered tires specifically for this car. 295F/355R I believe. MUCH MUCH MUCH better interior. IMO this is the biggest improvement. It is classy. I would say between a Ford GT and R8 in terms of quality. Ferrari sourced seats! Styling wise, I like the detail work. The car gets better the closer you get to it. Definitely modern retro. Finally there will be two models, and I am happy to say Dodge/SRT gets it. GTS will have a nicer interior and more luxury, and slightly calmer styling, but be more expensive over the base. The base base has a more aggressive hood and is a little more "hard core" bare bones as described, in other words, Viper. There will also be a "track pack" option lessening the weight. ZR1 you have been put on notice. This easily trounces it in just about every category.
ALMS:
Oh the ALMS car looks great. Talked to ALMS President Scott Atherton. GT field will continue to grow. Nobody should be leaving in the immediate future. Lotus+Viper+Maybe Aston back again+maybe even MORE in the future (they are working on Audi). Prototype is kinda a mixed back. He wants Toyota to race here (it would be competitive with some minor tweaking), but Toyota does not want to commit and they think NASCAR is enough (booooo). Mentioned the ESPN3 crapshoot show but wanted to be respectful and not bitch. All I said was get John Hindaugh from the ESPN3/Euro broadcast to do the ABC/ESPN2 recaps. That is all. Probably does not give a crap what I think, but I would watch the recaps if he announced them.
That is all for now. Bed.
BoobPhysics101
Banned
Let's carpool there! And talk shit on rotaries.
@ 12 PSI you'd be looking at 400+ whp and almost 300 ft-lb of torque.
Spaceman Spiff
Member
I wasn't too keen on the new Viper the other day looking at those leaked Forza shots, but after today's media coverage I'm completely sold-- grainy, low-res, off-screen shots don't do a car justice, who knew? It's an almost perfect combination of the SRT10's proportions and the old GTS's curves and agression, and just fan-fucking-tastic, though I definitely prefer the hood vents on the base SRT.
Thanks for this.
More factory entries in the GT field is a tantalizing prospect, especially Audi even if it's only a very distant possibility. I'm assuming they would run a modified R8 LMS if they ever decided to jump in.
Prototype news is a bit of a bummer, but honestly, who watches ALMS for the prototypes? GT is where the fun is. Man, I can't wait for the Viper to show up mid-season.
Agreed on the broadcasting comments. Hindhaugh and Shaw's race commentary on ESPN3 is ace.
Thanks for this.
More factory entries in the GT field is a tantalizing prospect, especially Audi even if it's only a very distant possibility. I'm assuming they would run a modified R8 LMS if they ever decided to jump in.
Prototype news is a bit of a bummer, but honestly, who watches ALMS for the prototypes? GT is where the fun is. Man, I can't wait for the Viper to show up mid-season.
Agreed on the broadcasting comments. Hindhaugh and Shaw's race commentary on ESPN3 is ace.
Internals needed for that much boost? I am guessing no which makes it even sadder. I make that whp and more wtq, but my tq curve isn't nearly as flat. Turbo kits from places like full race make it seem a lot cheaper to make a honda fast than a vw.
BoobPhysics101
Banned
Nope. S2000 has forged internals. Once you get to 400-500 whp you might want to change the head gasket and lower compression, but other than that, it's fine.
S2000 engine is very similar to the E36 M3 and E46 M3 in torque curve and linear horsepower increase. And yes, it is very cheap to make a Honda fast. VW's aren't built for speed, aftermarket isn't good, aftermarket parts aren't as good. S2000 is much more expensive to make fast than regular Hondas, though. The parts are pricier, and you have to be careful with the rear diff/axles once you get past 300 whp. But you can transplant R200 or Ford rear suspensions in to hold the power. :')
But I'm a Buddhist philosopher I dislike no cars.
Also I'm in SGV so I don't know where you coming from but we can take my Hipster/Green friendly Prius.
Wait I thought VW had really good aftermarket, especially in Euro-land.
BoobPhysics101
Banned
But I'm a Buddhist philosopher I dislike no cars.
Also I'm in SGV so I don't know where you coming from but we can take my Hipster/Green friendly Prius.
Wait I thought VW had really good aftermarket, especially in Euro-land.
I'm in Riverside so I'd have to drive West to get to LA anyways, so that'd probably work.
Compared to Honda and BMW, I don't think VW's aftermarket is really very great. Off the top of my head Honda and BMW (maybe Subaru too?) seem to have the biggest aftermarkets of any car brands.
Nah not really. FSI guys are stuck with oem injectors (s3/rs4) and a marginally stronger hpfp, so dumb shit like extra set of injectors is required for anything decent power wise...although a couple guys broke 500whp recently.
TSI...well stuck at a bit over 400whp on pump until there is a hpfp solution...later this year I hope. Can run a MBC and crazy boost (30+ psi) for more power, but gonna get fuel cuts, and it won't run all that well.No custom tunes.
1.8t/vr6 have a bunch more options, but they have been out for how long now.
Hopefully that Golf RS talk turns out to be real.
Nope, it's an old L sedan. Actually a bit lighter than the coupe, but not as stiff. Just waiting on getting some quotes back (I guess it's race season now)
Viperbah
Member
I picked up an 04 (has the ls1 not ls2) a couple months back. They have some issues but overall it's a solidly built car. You won't believe the g8 or GTO comes from GM.
Used to have a 06 GTO and drove it for 3 years. Compare its seats with the Corvette from the same year and you'd be surprised at the quality difference, Vette seats are junk. I was very satisfied with it, except for the shifter which was the worst I have ever experienced. I would have bought an auto if it didn't only have 4 speeds. Sold it when I found out GM was getting rid of Pontiac.
Yeah, I am pleased with only a 2K jump from the Premium to Limited.
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