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Sony announces Q2 results

S

Saiyar

Unconfirmed Member
REMEMBER CITADEL said:
That can't be denied, Microsoft really needs to try a lot harder in continental Europe. Hell, that's where I live and Microsoft is the only out of the big three not officially present on the Croatian market.

However, UK is the biggest market in Europe (for a while UK alone was even bigger than Japan) so it can - and does, when you look at the overall European numbers - practically make up for all the losses on the continent.
Click to expand...

The UK market was ahead of Japan in software units for the first six weeks of 2009. It is now just over half the size of the Japanese market in terms of revenue.

If the UK keeps falling at the rate it whas been it will only be a little bit bigger than the French and German markets at the end of this year.
 
J

jcm

Member
REMEMBER CITADEL said:
No, I was using only the sales numbers. I compared them to the shipping data only at the very end, which was the whole point of my post.

It might be incomplete, but it's the actual NPD and MediaCreate data plus Nintendo's internal numbers for Europe, so it's the best we have and probably quite representative of the actual situation.
Click to expand...

What countries are covered by Nintendo's Europe? What were sales outside the territories you have numbers for? What were retail levels at the beginning of the quarter? At the end? What are retailer expectations for the beginning of the next quarter?

The reconciliation you're trying to do is impossible, and shipments can fluctuate for lots of reasons. Individual quarterly shipment numbers aren't particularly revealing. They're useful only over time, and for looking at trends. If you're right that Sony is overshipping, then the next quarter or the next will reveal that.

You can stuff the channel for a quarter, maybe even two, but at some point it's going to catch up with you unless retailers move the machines.
 
G

gundamkyoukai

Member
People forget that currency effects the market , so even if the UK is number 1 now that there money is worth less it make things harder for all companies.
 
R

REMEMBER CITADEL

Banned
Lagspike_exe said:
No it doesn't.
Click to expand...

The numbers speak for themselves. Xbox 360 is losing hard on the continent, yet whenever we get numbers for the whole of Europe (including this graph from Nintendo), it's slightly behind or slightly ahead of the PS3.


jcm said:
What countries are covered by Nintendo's Europe? What were sales outside the territories you have numbers for? What were retail levels at the beginning of the quarter? At the end? What are retailer expectations for the beginning of the next quarter?

The reconciliation you're trying to do is impossible, and shipments can fluctuate for lots of reasons. Individual quarterly shipment numbers aren't particularly revealing. They're useful only over time, and for looking at trends. If you're right that Sony is overshipping, then the next quarter or the next will reveal that.

You can stuff the channel for a quarter, maybe even two, but at some point it's going to catch up with you unless retailers move the machines.
Click to expand...

And I'm denying none of that. I'm just giving you an interesting observation which, as far as we know, is factually correct. What you take out of it is up to you.
 
Paracelsus

Paracelsus

Member
MS doesn't really bother marketing their titles here. I don't really understand why they don't try.
Click to expand...

They prefer to increase sales where they know they can than keep fighting an uphill battle. Just look at Japan.

it's slightly behind or slightly ahead of the PS3.
Click to expand...

"Slightly behind", "slightly ahead".

Could somebody please split the graph into smaller segments? It would be easier to figure out exactly how big is the weekly gap.
 
Cornbread78

Cornbread78

Member
the-little-train-that-could.jpg


Go Sony!
 
M

mintylurb

Member
REMEMBER CITADEL said:
The numbers speak for themselves. Xbox 360 is losing hard on the continent, yet whenever we get numbers for the whole of Europe (including this graph from Nintendo), it's slightly behind or slightly ahead of the PS3.
Click to expand...
That's interesting. I've only followed the u.k numbers where the x360 does very well. It'll be nice to see the numbers for the whole of euroland. Do you happen to have euroland sales numbers for 2007, 2008 and 2009?

Mandoric said:
-snip
Click to expand...
Mandy. Is that Sakura from CCS? I haven't seen Sakura avatar in ages! CCS is orin's fav animu along with queens blade. ;0
 
N

NHale

Member
REMEMBER CITADEL said:
And I'm denying none of that. I'm just giving you an interesting observation which, as far as we know, is factually correct. What you take out of it is up to you.
Click to expand...

Something to be factually correct, must be supported by facts not by suppositions and incomplete data.
 
yurinka

yurinka

Member
Majine said:
That is a huge gap between PS3 and 360.
Click to expand...
Well, if the 4th quarter follows the trend and considering we have holydays + GT5, I think Kinect has to work really, really well to fight to compensate this.
 
R

REMEMBER CITADEL

Banned
mintylurb said:
That's interesting. I've only followed the u.k numbers where the x360 does very well. It'll be nice to see the numbers for the whole of euroland. Do you happen to have euroland sales numbers for 2007, 2008 and 2009?
Click to expand...

No, no actual numbers for each year. From time to time we get LTDs from GFK or just statements indicating which platform is ahead and by how much. Of course, if we know overall shipments and numbers for other territories, we can approximate LTDs for Europe.

Before PS3 slim launched, Xbox 360 was allegedly ahead by one million (in sales, not shipments). Since then PS3 has been selling better (Nintendo's graph can give you a good indication of actual sales differences), and since the 360 slim spike didn't last, I'd say PS3 is currently ahead, but not by more than 2-3 million.


NHale said:
Something to be factually correct, must be supported by facts not by suppositions and incomplete data.
Click to expand...

It's as factually correct as it can be. It's certainly better than basing one's observations on no hard sales data whatsoever.
 
L

Lagspike_exe

Member
yurinka said:
Well, if the 4th quarter follows the trend and considering we have holydays + GT5, I think Kinect has to work really, really well to fight to compensate this.
Click to expand...

Kinect won't even come close to boosting 360 in the same way GT5 will do for Playstation. Not even close.
 
Paracelsus

Paracelsus

Member
Lagspike_exe said:
Kinect won't even come close to boosting 360 in the same way GT5 will do for Playstation. Not even close.
Click to expand...

We don't know that. GT5 should work wonders in Europe but mostly nobody in America (and Japan) cares about it that much. Kinect launch line up sure doesn't target existing owners and if the preorder musings are right then it's going to give quite the boost to 360 hw, at least during holidays.
 
L

Lagspike_exe

Member
Paracelsus said:
We don't know that. GT5 should work wonders in Europe but mostly nobody in America (and Japan) cares about it that much. Kinect launch line up sure doesn't target existing owners and if the preorder musings are right then it's going to give quite the boost to 360 hw, at least during holidays.
Click to expand...

For some reason, I thought his post referred to EU territories. Sorry, my mistake, that's what I was thinking...
 
J

Jokeropia

Member
dolemite said:
Looking at 2009 results for the Wii, it looks like Nintendo is already late for the pre-Christmas reinvigoration, the next quarter results will be damn low compared to 2009.
Click to expand...
The bump prior to week 41 you see for last year was the pricedrop. The holiday boost starts around November.

28l.jpg
 
S

spwolf

Member
REMEMBER CITADEL said:
That can't be denied, Microsoft really needs to try a lot harder in continental Europe. Hell, that's where I live and Microsoft is the only out of the big three not officially present on the Croatian market.

However, UK is the biggest market in Europe (for a while UK alone was even bigger than Japan) so it can - and does, when you look at the overall European numbers - practically make up for all the losses on the continent.
Click to expand...

except it doesnt, since if you look at info from Nintendo, PS3 outsould 360 easily in western europe total, this year.

You can get 360 for quite cheap in Sophos lab, compared to PS3 :)
 
S

spwolf

Member
Lagspike_exe said:
Is Sophos lab still doing those towel RRoD fixes that last 3 days? :lol
Click to expand...

dunno, they didnt want to sell me Move the other day saying how Sony didnt develop any games for it and all gamers in USA are in uproar :lol
 
mckmas8808

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
yurinka said:
Well, if the 4th quarter follows the trend and considering we have holydays + GT5, I think Kinect has to work really, really well to fight to compensate this.
Click to expand...


I have a feeling that's not going to happen for the 360.
 
M

Majine

Banned
dolemite said:
Is GT5 even coming out in 2010? It's the end of October and there is still no word from Sony so I have my doubts.
Click to expand...
I don't trust anyone anymore until I have the game in my hands.
 
P

-Pyromaniac-

Member
dolemite said:
Is GT5 even coming out in 2010? It's the end of October and there is still no word from Sony so I have my doubts.
Click to expand...
I absolutely positively do not see Sony passing up a chance for a christmas release.
 
F

Firewire

Banned
Paracelsus said:
We don't know that. GT5 should work wonders in Europe but mostly nobody in America (and Japan) cares about it that much. Kinect launch line up sure doesn't target existing owners and if the preorder musings are right then it's going to give quite the boost to 360 hw, at least during holidays.
Click to expand...

Just under 20 million copies of the GT series have sold in N.A. and just under 10 million in Japan.

To say that no one in N.A. or Japan "cares about it that much" is just fucking stupid.
 
C

Chris1964

Sales-Age Genius
Lagspike_exe said:
I know that. I used France, Germany and Spain as a reference because there is known data for those countries.
Click to expand...
Do you want Italy top 20? (January-May 2010)

01. [WII] Wii Fit Plus
02. [WII] Wii Sport Resort
03. [NDS] Pokemon Argento Soulsilver
04. [WII] New Super Mario Bros.
05. [NDS] Pokemon Oro Heartgold
06. [WII] Mario Kart
07. [PS3] God of War III
08. [PS2] Pro Evolution Soccer 2010
09. [WII] Wii Play
10. [PS3] Dante’s Inferno
11. [PS3] Final Fantasy XIII
12. [PS3] Pro Evolution Soccer 2010
13. [WII] Wii Fit Plus
14. [PS3] Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2
15. [PS3] Fifa 10
16. [PS3] Assassin's Creed II
17. [PS3] Heavy Rain
18. [NDS] New Super Mario Bros.
19. [NDS] Professor Layton e lo scrigno di Pandora
20. [NDS] Mario e Sonic ai giochi olimpici invernali

Firewire said:
Just under 20 million copies of the GT series have sold in N.A. and just under 10 million in Japan.

To say that no one in N.A. or Japan "cares about it that much" is just fucking stupid.
Click to expand...
Gran Turismo isn't anymore what it used to be in Japan.
 
R

REMEMBER CITADEL

Banned
spwolf said:
except it doesnt, since if you look at info from Nintendo, PS3 outsould 360 easily in western europe total, this year.
Click to expand...

Yes, this year it's been up everywhere, including UK, thanks to last September's price drop and the launch of PS3 slim. It wasn't like that before and you can see that after the launch of 360 slim both consoles enjoyed very similar sales. Now that's changed with the arrival of Move, and it's probably going to continue thanks to GT5 and Sony's strong Q1 line-up. Unless, of course, Kinect hits it big in Europe.

Sophos and their incompetence are unfortunately hard to avoid if you wish to be a 360 owner over here :-/
 
G

gundamkyoukai

Member
Chris1964 said:
Gran Turismo isn't anymore what it used to be in Japan.
Click to expand...

The last console GT did sell over million in Japan .
While GT 5 Prologue sold over 500 k so it's still stupid comment to make.
If GT 5 sell as much as GT 4 i think Sony would be happy since few IPs are down on console.
 
C

Chris1964

Sales-Age Genius
gundamkyoukai said:
The last console GT did sell over million in Japan .
While GT 5 Prologue sold over 500 k so it's still stupid comment to make.
If GT 5 sell as much as GT 4 i think Sony would be happy.
Click to expand...
Since you want to talk with numbers:
Every new Gran Turismo entry is declining in sales.
GT5 Prologue had 2 versions and the second was bundled with PS3.
 
G

gundamkyoukai

Member
Chris1964 said:
Since you want to talk with numbers:
Every new Gran Turismo entry is declining in sales.
GT5 Prologue had 2 versions and the second was bundled with PS3.
Click to expand...

Same thing can be said for allot of games , the point is to say no one cares about GT in Japan and NA is stupid.
That's like saying no cares about FF even thought it's selling less.
 
S

SolidSnakex

Member
People were saying that GT's popularity wasn't what it used to be before GT4 was released also. That's now the second best selling game in the series.
 
M

Mandoric

Banned
Chris1964 said:
Since you want to talk with numbers:
Every new Gran Turismo entry is declining in sales.
GT5 Prologue had 2 versions and the second was bundled with PS3.
Click to expand...

Saying "every new" when there's been a total of, er, one since sales peak is a little silly. :lol Though I do think LTD will suffer from installed base and the limited time remaining in the generation.

An interesting comparison would also be of retail copies of Prologue--the number for 5 to beat is 1.4m shipped, meaning 3.5m or more GT5P bundles sold.
 
A

AranhaHunter

Banned
I like Chris1964's numbers and posts about past games, but not so much about predicting the future as he has been wrong plenty of times before there.

With that said, I kinda agree with him in the sense that I'm having a hard time seeing GT5 hitting 1 million in Japan. I hope to be wrong about that though, hopefully we'll get a release date soon because the delay pissed me off.
 
G

gundamkyoukai

Member
Mandoric said:
Saying "every new" when there's been a total of, er, one since sales peak is a little silly. :lol Though I do think LTD will suffer from installed base and the limited time remaining in the generation.

An interesting comparison would also be of retail copies of Prologue--the number for 5 to beat is 1.4m shipped, meaning 3.5m or more GT5P bundles sold.
Click to expand...

Well GT highest number in Japan is GT 1.
If you go by PD shipped numbers it would be GT 1 , GT 3 , GT 2, GT 4 in Japan .
If GT 5 comes out in Xmas i expect that to be Sony best quarter maybe for PS3 ever.
Nothing helps sales\numbers like a new GT game.
 
T

TheExecutive

Member
Dreams-Visions said:
once this generation ends and the story is written, the historians will not be kind to Sony and the loss of its iron grip on the gaming industry.

the very notion that the words "Sony" and "3rd place" are even in the same sentence is baffling to me when I step out of the moment and look at the last 15 years of gaming. It's almost incomprehensible. Then again, I said the same about Nintendo. Before the N64 came out.
Click to expand...

And yet I think sony is set up beautifully for next generation. I agree with you though, they took a huge hit this hardware cycle and deserve to be criticized for it.
 
M

Mandoric

Banned
gundamkyoukai said:
Well GT highest number in Japan is GT 1.
If you go by PD shipped numbers it would be GT 1 , GT 3 , GT 2, GT 4 in Japan .
If GT 5 comes out in Xmas i expect that to be Sony best quarter maybe for PS3 ever.
Nothing helps sales\numbers like a new GT game.
Click to expand...

Ah, yeah, I read his post as referring to a ww decline.
 
T

TheExecutive

Member
mr_nothin said:
The big invisible elephant in the room is Kinect though...
Should be interesting to see how it turns out
Click to expand...


Do people generally agree that kinect would boost 360 hardware sales though? It will be interesting to see how it turns out. I would think that every stand alone kinect sold would possibly be a sale for a second 360 in the home... meh what do I know though?
 
J

JWong

Banned
Chris1964 said:
Since you want to talk with numbers:
Every new Gran Turismo entry is declining in sales.
GT5 Prologue had 2 versions and the second was bundled with PS3.
Click to expand...
* Gran Turismo – 10,850,000
* Gran Turismo 2 – 9,370,000
* Gran Turismo 3 A-spec – 14,890,000
* Gran Turismo 4 – 10,980,000

Care to explain those figures? Because it seems like GT3 and 4 had an increase.
 
M

Mandoric

Banned
JWong said:
* Gran Turismo – 10,850,000
* Gran Turismo 2 – 9,370,000
* Gran Turismo 3 A-spec – 14,890,000
* Gran Turismo 4 – 10,980,000

Care to explain those figures? Because it seems like GT3 and 4 had an increase.
Click to expand...

New figures--4 is actually 11,060,000 shipped now. :lol
 
A

AranhaHunter

Banned
JWong said:
* Gran Turismo – 10,850,000
* Gran Turismo 2 – 9,370,000
* Gran Turismo 3 A-spec – 14,890,000
* Gran Turismo 4 – 10,980,000

Care to explain those figures? Because it seems like GT3 and 4 had an increase.
Click to expand...

I think Chris mean Japanese numbers, not WW

Mandoric said:
New figures--4 is actually 11,060,000 shipped now. :lol
Click to expand...

Those numbers are outdated too btw, PD should update their numbers sometime soon.
 
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