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GTA V is Getting Hammered By Steam User Reviews. "Save Open IV" Petition over 40k
- Thread starter bud23
- Start date
They didn't literally, but I take those "lolcrybabies" posts as saying essentially that.
I also didn't say "most people", just "people", and what I was trying to say was "some people", unless I'm misusing that.
Obviously, you aren't one of them, and my post wasn't talking about those, such as yourself, who would put in the effort in explaining your opinion, and I respect that even if I disagree. I have no idea how best to reward modders for their effort, but I don't think PC modding would have been this big if not for free mods. As someone whose job was always threatened with "free work for exposure" as well as undercutters, I understand how "working for free" is bollocks, but I honestly don't know how to improve the situation without destroying a part of what is good.
I'd like to add that during the Bethesda Paid Mod Saga Episode 1, some of the top modders came out against paid mods, and they are the people who know far more about that side of gaming than I do.
EDIT: As for the whole OpenIV thing... I think it's more a case of miscommunication between publisher and developer. If it is indeed, as people said, restricted to offline mode, I really don't see why the need to ban it, those who are messing around with mods probably aren't going to put money in whatever they're selling online.
Alexander DeLarge
Member
I agree. This isn't just some fringe community. People have been modding these games for a decade and a half now. In regards to multiplayer, they've been creating multiplayer alternatives before GTA even had multiplayer (with 200 player count servers, custom gamemodes on custom maps and everything).
I don't see the problem with negatively reviewing the game as a result of this. It's the only long-term action people can take that the publisher and the press will notice. A lot of people (justifiably) feel like they were stabbed in the back. Sure, it's easy to say "just vote with your wallet" but we weren't the ones buying shark cards in the first place and that's the dumbest thing about this whole situation. Take Two and Rockstar are ruining a good thing and rocking the boat over literally nothing. They have nothing to gain from this.
I don't see the problem with negatively reviewing the game as a result of this. It's the only long-term action people can take that the publisher and the press will notice. A lot of people (justifiably) feel like they were stabbed in the back. Sure, it's easy to say "just vote with your wallet" but we weren't the ones buying shark cards in the first place and that's the dumbest thing about this whole situation. Take Two and Rockstar are ruining a good thing and rocking the boat over literally nothing. They have nothing to gain from this.
TOS and EULAS are not legally binding.
Ploid 3.0
Member
It's good for informing PC players not to expect to mod the games. GTA on PC is very popular for modding, just like Skyrim. ENB (Graphic mod) and GTA4 go hand in hand, second to Skyrim maybe. Modders made GTA4 look so good no one expected GTA5 to top it, and maybe with mods it did by now, but that's out the window. The only reason I was interested in GTA5 PC was for mods, I even waited before buying it to let the mods mature, I almost went for it with the police RP mod going on, thank goodness I waited a bit.
Rockstar has been screwing GTAV since GTAO launched. So many no fun allowed changes to it that it made me stop out of frustration. My character is sitting on millions, and I don't even see why people would buy the shark cards (maybe things were added later). GTAO was a mess when I played, event lobbies failed frequently, and usually were empty. The popular missions for money were even hard to get started. I found good missions that I had fun soloing and they removed the replay mission button so it was too much effort to go back to it after completing, then they nerfed the rewards for replaying the same mission. Mods helped Rockstar games in my eyes, especially GTA4 (modless is so boring and annoying to control even on foot).
FloweryMarston
Member
As someone who really loved the games from rockstar, I have been extremely disappointed with the company in a long time, from this type of practice, to the way they treat their employee (no matter where you are in the chain either, they screwed over even leslie benzies), these statements that Take Two wants to get more money from players, and the focus on online microtransactions really soured me on them.
And if people think that rockstar wouldn't ever lie about modding, they threw modders under the bus for discovering the sex minigame in san andreas and accused them of including it in the game to avoid all of the headache that would soon follow.
I really don't understand why people are so against others voicing their opinion about this.
And if people think that rockstar wouldn't ever lie about modding, they threw modders under the bus for discovering the sex minigame in san andreas and accused them of including it in the game to avoid all of the headache that would soon follow.
I really don't understand why people are so against others voicing their opinion about this.
That says more about Street Fighter than those games tbh
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Blanket statements like this are almost always wrong. This one is. You can't really believe this. Services like steam would fall apart if they couldn't hold users to certain criteria when using their service. Same goes for games.
Retro Edge
Member
Yeah you're right, where are the times where we ignited some cars to draw attention.
Right?
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Doesn't change the fact that steam reviews are trash. Just a long line of examples where reviews aren't reliable to judge the actual game. You'll find examples of players with 2-4 thousand hours played in a game and not recommending it. It's gotten worse over time too.
Caayn
Member
Depends on the country. Where I live they are binding up till a certain point and they never overrule the law.
Retro Edge
Member
Sure, I understand that this is abusing the review system but what else do you expect players to do? Write an e-mail to Rockstar? As if that would change something....
Rockstar is fighting dirty, let's fight back dirty.
No its perfect. Having power over evil corps feels good, they are like our bitches now.
If they can significantly damage the revenue of a company that fucks with consumers rights it means they work perfectly.
Sad Affleck
Member
It's great that gamers are taking a stand against these bullshit practices.
unknownhero
Member
the real test is memory.
sadly, they might forget if RDR2 hits the pc or when gta VI releases.
OminoMichelin
Member
What's funny is that they say that it is an excessive action, while simultaneously implying that it is not effective.
If you think that the average consumer doesn't read steam reviews, I've got a bridge to sell you. Plus, this is a massive hit on the goodwill for T2 and R*, which will impact their future games. They are the ones who stand to lose the most from this.
Btw, I AM going to vote with my wallet by not buying this game.
I think that the decision to effectively ban mods might be a move to introduce paid mods sanctioned by T2 in the future. I have no proof of this, but even if I was right on the money, this would be a phenomenally dumb move on their part.
MaddenNFL64
Member
It was expected, but still fucking depressing to see.
People do what they can with the tools available to them.
It sucks considering how many funny mods ive seen for this game and other GTA games over the years....but i don't think Take2 cares a single whiff about consumer outrage about this.
How many sales have they made on GTA5? Any people upset to them are like ants who don't matter, especially on PC
How many sales have they made on GTA5? Any people upset to them are like ants who don't matter, especially on PC
Anything that *could* negatively effect their favorite developer or *somehow* cause a series they like to receive less sales makes people lose their dam mind, regardless how shitty the company may act.
Grim Patron
Member
Happy to see the wel informed consumers who stand for their rights stick it to rockstar for trying to push the well informed base with this nonsese anti consumer practice that not only harms the install base but also harms the GTA brand as a whole with a stain.
I don't think that this is only Take2 fault. Rockstar is to blame too.
Freeman76
Member
Such an ignorant way to see things. If anything deserves a negative review it's the company, not the game. This doesn't affect the quality of the original game in anyway and people posting negative reviews of it just look fucking stupid imo.
chugen
Member
ok im just going to modify my review of the company then
OminoMichelin
Member
*gingerly waits for a way to review a company so that it sends a loud message*
PhantomThief
Banned
And where do people go to voice their concerns?
It absolutely affects the quality of the game. Many people only even bought the fucking game because of mods. The game is objectively worse now. I wouldn't recommend GTAV without it. I wouldn't recommend for anyone to throw money at pieces of shit that threathen legal action, stalk and harass modders in their own homes either. That is not a company that anyone with morals should be supporting.
The toilet where their negativity belongs, obviously .
Chinbo37
Member
NEOGAF constantly surprises me with this. When people come to the defense of corporations doing shitty things because "they can its their product".
People, you mean.
I know it's a common thing to say here, but this isn't restricted to gaf nor a gaming thing, I have seen this kind of behaviour in plenty of forums and communities.
It does very factually affect the quality of the game for the worse.
Look up gtav mods on youtube. All these things are a reason to buy and play the game. Not having these anymore makes the game objectively inferior.
Which is doubly so iffy and disgusting because a lot of people already bought the game partially for these mods.
Paasei
Member
All those people who somehow never noticed that GTA:O is just a system to get as much money from you as humanly possible.
DLC FOR FREE! Lol, yeah right, takes 1 million hours to be able to afford everything or 500 euro's worth of Shark Cards.
Don't get me wrong though, the Online part of the game is fun, but ONLY when you have a couple friends and just fool around, go racing or just do some heists.
I like the idea, but I just don't see how giving a bad rating to a game on Steam is going to have any effect on it's sales. Most people, if not all, already have the game by now.
It's the same as holding hands and sing near a beautiful campfire soon after something terrible has happened somewhere in the world.
DLC FOR FREE! Lol, yeah right, takes 1 million hours to be able to afford everything or 500 euro's worth of Shark Cards.
Don't get me wrong though, the Online part of the game is fun, but ONLY when you have a couple friends and just fool around, go racing or just do some heists.
I like the idea, but I just don't see how giving a bad rating to a game on Steam is going to have any effect on it's sales. Most people, if not all, already have the game by now.
It's the same as holding hands and sing near a beautiful campfire soon after something terrible has happened somewhere in the world.
Dick Justice
Banned
The game continues to sell quite steadily. Having an effect going forward would be good enough. As much as people want to keep recycling the tired old rhetoric of "well they already sold a lot lol", publishers do care a lot about review scores and word of mouth, especially if the game in question is still being purchased on a regular basis, and requires a steady stream of players to purchases their in-game currency.
The best thing they could do, apart from this, is to stop playing the online part all together. As I said in another thread, I was on the fence of buying it because of the mods (I already bought a preowned copy for 360 and I am not that interested in a performance upgrade) but now T2 can screw themselves.
ShironRedshift
Member
Was just going to comment on the same thing. Odd how do msny are calling it extreme, while simultaneously arguing that it's not effective and people shouldn't bother. If it's a wasted effort, then what exactly about it is extreme? Which is it?
Just consumers using one of the few tools available to them to make their voices heard that actually makes it clear what exactly they have a problem with, unlike other methods such as just voting with your wallet by itself which leaves the exact problem unclear to publishers. Plus, since MetaCritic/OpenCritic exist, there's no harm and nothing lost by these tactics since it's super easy to still find real reviews if that's what people are interested in.
It's a win-win situation for everyone. Well, except Take-Two, but that's the whole point in the first place. So I can't understand the concern with these type of tactics. Definitely seems better than just doing nothing and just reluctantly accepting it anyway. And even if the chance of T2 changing their minds is low, there's absolutely no chance of change if people say nothing at all. And a low chance is infinitely better than no chance at all.
VibratingDonkey
Member
Some seem to be under the impression that giving a negative review over this is disingenuous, or misusing the system. That we're just protesting the publisher, not evaluating the game.
But we're doing both. Implying that we don't actually value mods, is irrational and insulting.
Mods is a significant part of the reason why some of us bought this game, to me it was the entire reason. Imagine how you would feel about your favorite part of a game getting removed.
"But it's not an official part of the game." So? All that means is there are no grounds for refunds or lawsuits. The removal of value, of features, content, etc. remains.
But we're doing both. Implying that we don't actually value mods, is irrational and insulting.
Mods is a significant part of the reason why some of us bought this game, to me it was the entire reason. Imagine how you would feel about your favorite part of a game getting removed.
"But it's not an official part of the game." So? All that means is there are no grounds for refunds or lawsuits. The removal of value, of features, content, etc. remains.
Hairsplash
Member
Having the people who downvoted the game... bought the Game?. if so... " any publicity is good Publicity"
In any case, this "boycott" would only affect Online "sales" so, R* or take-two... is laughing all the way to the bank.
In any case, this "boycott" would only affect Online "sales" so, R* or take-two... is laughing all the way to the bank.
texhnolyze
Banned
Lots of people haven't passed that stage of life yet. Age doesn't matter.
When was your "awakening" (stopped being emotionally attached to wealthy companies)?
Immortal Technique
Member
What are user reviews there for in the first place?
are they
a) to register your satisfaction/dissatisfaction to the publisher
or
b) to help your fellow users?
are they
a) to register your satisfaction/dissatisfaction to the publisher
or
b) to help your fellow users?
texhnolyze
Banned
They are not mutually exclusive.
Immortal Technique
Member
I'm pretty sure those two things are very much in conflict right now. People are leaving negative reviews while conceding the game is not a bad game.
Same is happening with Paradox games and that bothers me way more than this. GTA is something that people recognize, they know that these are revered games. Rockstar is in very good place financially. These reviews are only on this one game that is on multiple platforms and sells like hot cakes. And honestly not even 20% of the "rioters" are going to skip future Rockstar games (unless they had no interest in the first place) even though they are trying to get others vote with their wallet. In the Paradox situation developers like the ones at Obsidian are getting bombed with downvotes, these are small studios some of them only developing on PC. And the spamming of downvotes is done to many different games.
People should complain absolutely, but I'm personally in favor of this approach http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1392594
Knee jerk reviews and hyperbole makes user reviews worthless.
Edit: Sony seems to get a lot more of defenders than Paradox and Rockstar.
SirMossyBloke
Member
I have no idea why people have an issue with voicing their concerns through Steam reviews.
The way I see it is I go Steam, find a game I'm interested in and notice there's a ton of negative reviews. It immediately makes me check out why people are hating it. So I read the reviews and see what's up, and at that point I can decide for myself whether the negativity bothers me personally and I either buy it or I don't.
What this is doing to GTA V is letting others know there's a serious issue with the game. They can decide for themselves whether mods not being allowed is something that affects them. For some it will, so they don't buy it. If people don't give a shit about mods they'll still buy it.
Where's the issue?
The way I see it is I go Steam, find a game I'm interested in and notice there's a ton of negative reviews. It immediately makes me check out why people are hating it. So I read the reviews and see what's up, and at that point I can decide for myself whether the negativity bothers me personally and I either buy it or I don't.
What this is doing to GTA V is letting others know there's a serious issue with the game. They can decide for themselves whether mods not being allowed is something that affects them. For some it will, so they don't buy it. If people don't give a shit about mods they'll still buy it.
Where's the issue?
Immortal Technique
Member
And the people who just see the reviews are 'Overwhelmingly shit' and just move on? I know I've done that. Clearly I shouldn't trust that aggregate at all, right? And there's the problem.