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Zeboyd Games announces Cosmic Star Heroine (Suikoden/PhantasyStar-inspired Unity RPG)
- Thread starter cj_iwakura
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A system very similar to that exists in Digital Devil Saga 1 and 2: the faster you complete the battle, the better your rewards (typically more currency/items/etc).
It makes you think when you enter a battle with every enemy as to how you'll dispatch them as quickly as possible, exploiting weaknesses and such. It's an excellent system.
The more and more I see stuff about this game, the more I want to play it.
Messofanego
Banned
"-No separate combat screen combat will occur directly on the same maps that you explore on"
That's interesting. It's turn-based, but the combat and exploring will be on the same screen? I don't know many RPGs, so what games have done this?
That's interesting. It's turn-based, but the combat and exploring will be on the same screen? I don't know many RPGs, so what games have done this?
Solbringer
Member
"-No separate combat screen combat will occur directly on the same maps that you explore on"
That's interesting. It's turn-based, but the combat and exploring will be on the same screen? I don't know many RPGs, so what games have done this?
Chrono Trigger.
"-No separate combat screen – combat will occur directly on the same maps that you explore on"
That's interesting. It's turn-based, but the combat and exploring will be on the same screen? I don't know many RPGs, so what games have done this?
Chrono Trigger. Final Fantasy XII. Surprising few overall.
Also that Alyssa sprite looks awesome.
Messofanego
Banned
Thanks. Never played Chrono Trigger, will remember to play that during a game drought.
You should! Hell, don't wait for a game drought. It's probably the best RPG of all time, and I'm pretty critical of old RPGs.
Messofanego
Banned
Right now working through my backlog
But yeah, most likely will play Chrono Trigger just before this game comes out.Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
robotzombie
Member
Everything about this is looking and sounding frigging amazing so far
You guys are pushing all the right SNES JRPG fan buttons...
You guys are pushing all the right SNES JRPG fan buttons...
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
A new design article is up!
An Idea for Making Ailment Abilities Useful in Cosmic Star Heroine - http://zeboyd.com/2013/07/15/an-idea-for-making-ailment-abilities-useful-in-cosmic-star-heroine/
An Idea for Making Ailment Abilities Useful in Cosmic Star Heroine - http://zeboyd.com/2013/07/15/an-idea-for-making-ailment-abilities-useful-in-cosmic-star-heroine/
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
That's something I'd need to try before I could say I really like the idea, especially with the MP system you mentioned previously. Sounds neat in theory at least, because I agree that status ailments tend to be less-than-awesome in a lot of games in situations where you actually want to use them.
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
True, which is why we're toying around with this idea rather than definitely going to use it. It's something that definitely needs to be tested in a few situations first to see how it feels when it's actually in the game.
SatelliteOfLove
Member
Goddammit, Evilore, bring back animated avatars!
If we did include a bathing scene, we'd make sure to only include the most hideous non-human characters in the game.
I like you.
How balanced this is depends on how big mana regen from victory is, how big mana pools are, and how reliable mana restoring consumables are. /formerraidhealer
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
I really like Spuuky's idea in your comments too. Use extra MP (or add MP to a standard attack) to use status ailments instead of requiring them to be their own action. That's part of the reason I don't really like using them under normal circumstances, it takes an extra turn that I could use to whack the enemy. And since normal encounters are (or should be) pretty short, that extra turn isn't worthwhile.
Improving the effects of ailments would also help make them worthwhile. If an enemy is asleep or paralyzed you should be able to deal more damage since the enemy can't move well (or at all), for example. I'm sure some games do this, but what I've played recently doesn't.
Improving the effects of ailments would also help make them worthwhile. If an enemy is asleep or paralyzed you should be able to deal more damage since the enemy can't move well (or at all), for example. I'm sure some games do this, but what I've played recently doesn't.
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
Yeah, there are all sorts of ways that we could make them more effective. Attacks that deal damage & inflict an ailment in one move (like Umi's Strike abilities in Cthulhu Saves the World), ailments that lead to combos (like taking more damage while under that effect or activating another ability), making ailments more powerful in general, making some battles last longer (thus encouraging the use of ailments rather than just quickly finishing the battle), etc.
We'll be looking into all sorts of methods.
I like the increased magic cost idea (especially if the game tells you "HI-RES: MP Cost -> 30" when you're about to use it), but as much as I like status effects (some of my favorite things in RPGs!), I think the idea that any can be used on ALL sounds a bit TOO good?
I'd personally prefer resistances still (Skeletons can't be poisoned, rock monsters can't be wounded, ghost can't be made to bleed, etc), but make it so that spells combo into, and out of, status effects.
Example:
- Fire scorches the skin, makes it raw.
- Paralysis seeps into raw skin easier, thus allowing 100% paralyze on applicable targets.
- Since paralyze is similar to Freezing, all Ice attacks on paralyze targets now get amped, from single target to AOE explosions.
It would make status useful, it would make them useful on small scale and large scale battles, and it would give them strategic uses on bosses, as well (minions normally stick by bosses, so burst-buffing a boss would help obliterate his minions).
The system could even be turned on the party, for hilarious, unexpected results:
You don't normally want to light you friends on fire... but casting fire + cure on a friend with turn into a healing blaze field, that cures AOE, like a sauna, while leaving a bit of toasty regen on afterwards.
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
Yeah, there are all sorts of ways that we could make them more effective. Attacks that deal damage & inflict an ailment in one move (like Umi's Strike abilities in Cthulhu Saves the World), ailments that lead to combos (like taking more damage while under that effect or activating another ability), making ailments more powerful in general, making some battles last longer (thus encouraging the use of ailments rather than just quickly finishing the battle), etc.
We'll be looking into all sorts of methods.
These sound a lot like what Larian is doing with Divinity: Original Sin. I.e., freeze an enemy. Then use a fire spell which melts the ice, but the enemy is wet and water is all over the ground around other enemies. Then you use a lightning spell which does extra damage to the wet enemy, plus hits the other enemies standing in the water.
Not only improves the freezing (or "wet") status ailments, but also adds a layer of strategy.
I also agree that some immunities should remain in place. Especially for bosses if there are powerful ailments like petrify, which in many games counts as a 1HKO when used on applicable enemies.
Possibly also have certain tough enemies or bosses with tough armor/shell/carapace that you would freeze, then burn, then freeze again to weaken their defenses against physical blows.
Haha, fun stuff. I didn't know there was another Divinity on the horizon either (just bought Divinity II: Dragon Knight Saga on that recent XBL sale, too..) But that sounds quite cool! I'll hope it comes to a console some day...
Such systems seems as if they'll perfecty compliment the Chrono Trigger-style co-op moves this game is already going for, too.
It's always great to think about how many little details haven't been explored much in many RPGs, or games in general...
prodystopian
Member
One thing that bothered me in FF games was that the game seemed to train me not to use them because most enemies were too easy (didn't need them) and, as you said, status effects didn't work against nearly every boss. When I came to a boss where they did work (or even worse, were nearly required to win), it felt like a trick rather than something that would be reasonable to come up with on my own.
Cornbread78
Member
That's what I'm talking about VITA version with trophies.... would be super nice...
It's called streamlining for an audience in order to attract. Surely you've wondered why countless Espers/Summons/Whatever were possible in fights, and yet a simple debuff was continually dismissed by the battle system.
It's also a large reason why many Western gamers who played the staple diet of Japanese RPGs in the SNES-PS1 eras, despite being afforded the opportunity to play games such as Wizardry and Ultima for many years, may have been a little confused and aggravated when it concerned the Dragon Quest series whilst trying to defeat a "tactical & gear check" boss fight.
Fortunately silly things like invulnerable status effects are slowly being eroded in order to champion tactical gameplay, but it's still a slippery slope at times.
prodystopian
Member
I understand why it's done, and I enjoy FF games. I was just lamenting the fact that it effectively taught the player not to use those things.
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
Cosmic Star Heroine logo revealed:
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
New design article - Cosmic Star Heroine stats, equipment, and Force Shield system.
http://zeboyd.com/2013/07/22/cosmic-star-heroine-stats-equipment-and-force-shield-system/
http://zeboyd.com/2013/07/22/cosmic-star-heroine-stats-equipment-and-force-shield-system/
Cosmic Star Heroine logo revealed:
I feel like it's the early 90's again and I'm looking at game ads in the back of PC-Engine Fan magazine, with the science fiction-y font plus the chrome and gradients. (And this is a good thing. This whole project is pressing all the right kinds of nostalgia buttons for me.)
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
Force shield sounds interesting. I suppose the "death protection" would have a variable amount of HP damage it would save you from. Maybe 20HP or something at the beginning but 200HP later on. Or maybe it would vary by force shield so later ones have better protection. Or maybe sacrifice protection for better buffs. I like the idea, game systems with lots of options are the best.
And the mention of turn-order being determined by cunning makes it sound like it will be fully turn-based rather than active.
And the mention of turn-order being determined by cunning makes it sound like it will be fully turn-based rather than active.
This is actually pretty brilliant. Kind of wish I thought of it myself.
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
I'm thinking the Death Protection would be a percentage of the character's Max HP and the actual percentage could vary from shield to shield.
Yeah, decided to go fully turn-based with this one since it feels like turn-based will work better with the various gameplay systems we have in mind. Plus, turn-based will let us speed things up in some ways - for example, I'd like to have things setup so that some attack animations (mostly regular attacks) can overlap other attacks (as seen in the Suikoden series & Radiant Historia) and that would be difficult to do with the kind of system we used in our last game (since it'd constantly be stopping to have you input the next character's move).
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
Hero of Legend
Member
Too much to ask for a Wii U stretch goal?
But seriously, I can't think of anything. Maybe more sidequests or something? Really, I'd just want extra funds to go to making the game bigger. Maybe a world map with flying vehicles at some point if that wasn't already part of the plan (or not if it changes things).
This sounds like way too much work. I'd rather they put that into improving what they already have.
Seconded for Wii U.
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
Leaning more towards PSN (and PC/Mac) than Wii U since we'd be able to get multiple platforms at the same time that way (PS4/Vita). Not saying that we won't do Wii U also but it'd probably come out at a later time since we don't want to stretch our debug efforts too thin by having too many platforms at launch.
chickdigger802
Banned
A port on ios that isn't kinda bad like your other outsourced ports would be neat too ^^;
Mental Atrophy
Banned
It's nice to see the art steadily improving but it might be time to start hiring real pixel artists.
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
Mobile is problematic in that RPGs in general don't seem to do as well there & the games that make serious money on mobile are almost always freemium titles. Doing a quality mobile port of a game that wasn't originally intended for mobile is a lot more work than your typical port - you typically need to make drastic changes to the interface and the controls, AND do a lot more optimization for stuff like memory use & storage space. In short, it's a lot of work for not much reward.
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
Yes, there will be leveling. In fact, I just posted a link to an article on the leveling system a few posts earlier:
http://zeboyd.com/2013/07/23/cosmic-star-heroine-lv-up-ideas/
And we might go ahead and start the player off at a higher LV to show that you're already skilled at the start of the game.
Interfectum
Member
This sounds like the perfect game to play on Vita. Can't wait man.
Eteric Rice
Member
If it's a Unity game, I hope it comes to the Wii U as well.
fur sure
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
Just posted an article about how my Unity RPG Engine work for Cosmic Star Heroine has been progressing.
http://zeboyd.com/2013/07/25/cosmic-star-heroine-unity-engine-status-report/
http://zeboyd.com/2013/07/25/cosmic-star-heroine-unity-engine-status-report/
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
Posted a brief teaser on the worlds in the game:
http://zeboyd.com/2013/07/30/the-worlds-of-cosmic-star-heroine/
http://zeboyd.com/2013/07/30/the-worlds-of-cosmic-star-heroine/
Fine Ham Abounds
Member
World 2 sounds like my kinda place.
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
Nice progress with Unity. I dabbled with it a while back but ran into two roadblocks. I'm super-out-of-practice with any sort of programming (I really should get back into it), and I am incapable of anything artistic so anything I made was basically just blocks and spheres moving around.
Worlds 1 and 2 both sound really good. Hopefully World 1 is fleshed out nicely and not just a hub. I hate that so many sci-fi settings in RPGs like this end up being teases more than anything, and actual gameplay dumps you in what might as well be a standard fantasy setting. coughstaroceancough
Worlds 1 and 2 both sound really good. Hopefully World 1 is fleshed out nicely and not just a hub. I hate that so many sci-fi settings in RPGs like this end up being teases more than anything, and actual gameplay dumps you in what might as well be a standard fantasy setting. coughstaroceancough
For the 16-bit level that they're aiming for, I thought the PA games looked pretty good. What improvements would they have to make for them to be considered 'real' pixel artists?
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