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Overwatch |OT8| Our love will last Pharah-ver

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antitrop

Member
I love how you can always hear Zens voice standout from the rest of the cast, it can't just be me imagining things right? I can always here a Zen in action, be it him shouting 'Behind you', saying 'Peace be upon you' or even just shooting things.

Death is whimsical today.
 
EMP is like the most suicidal Ult in the game.
This is mystifying to me. You put a transloc nearby. You run in stealthed. You ult. You tap E. You run back and pick off everything your team hasn't already killed.

I think there are maybe a dozen ults in the game that are more dangerous to get off.
 

antitrop

Member
This is mystifying to me. You put a transloc nearby. You run in stealthed. You ult. You tap E. You run back and pick off everything your team hasn't already killed.

I think there are maybe a dozen ults in the game that are more dangerous to get off.
I haven't run into a Sombra disciplined enough to do that, though. I think it takes way more trust in your team to Translocate out as soon as EMP goes off than soloqueuers have. They always try to follow up on their own ult, usually by themselves, and just die, baiting the rest of their team in for a follow-up that doesn't exist.

I don't think EMP is bad, I just think its usefulness is above the average player's abilities.
 
I think Sombra can pretty much be summed up as a perception vs reality character, which is the reason I will never open up my big dumb mouth about a character until they are officially in the game.

Looking at her kit, I can't believe that she is not a must pick to break choke points on maps like Eichenwalde, Hanamura, etc.

It's because in reality you have to decide on where to use the translocator. You can put it near your team, go invisible, and if you get seen you can escape. But if you do make it into the backline you have to wait about 20 seconds for a new translocator so that you can actually go attack the enemy team from behind. If you don't want to use the locator before trying to break into the backline then any form of poke damage hitting you immediately gets you revealed and you are 100% dead.

Whereas Tracer can zoom right in, and hide to recharge blinks, which is much quicker, and maybe even get a fast pick. Sure if Sombra can get completely set up in the back line build an ult while taking attention from the enemies, that's great, but it doesn't happen very often.

I don't think her gun is that bad, the range is much better than you'd expect, and she is certainly capable of getting a pick on a squishie if played correctly.

I still think that she is capable of so much that any buff is a huge risk to her becoming a broken character. She has a niche, I know it, we just have to discover what it is.

Like what it you just get way behind the enemy, hack a kit, and get set up. Then every time and enemy spawns you harass them, run away to get health, come right back and finish them off. That could be useful.

Weird fucking character, faster and more simple for character release next time Blizz.
 

Akuun

Looking for meaning in GAF
"Do not be discouraged, everyone begins in ignorance." This robo monk has some of the greatest (if incredibly mellow) burns out of the cast.
I like his pre-fight talk with Zarya.

"Watch your back, Omnic."
"I will watch yours, as well."

I really like Zen. Too bad I can't aim for shit with his orbs.
 

Meccs

Member
Observation after playing something other than OW: I think Paladins payload where you have one capture point and the team that captures it has the payload is better design as having a set attacking or defending team.
 
I like his pre-fight talk with Zarya.

"Watch your back, Omnic."
"I will watch yours, as well."

I really like Zen. Too bad I can't aim for shit with his orbs.

I really like playing Zen. Maybe it's the lousy level I play at but he does a great job shredding Pharah.

I've actually been getting a few Pharahs with Zarya lately too (when there aren't any capable teammates). It feels like her range has been increased quite a bit in the last few weeks. I could be imagining it though.
 

Apathy

Member
Is the patch live? There's some sort of live maintenance going on right now.


I miss being able to aim.

From the launcher:

General
-Decreased the volume of passing cars with the oasis background in the Hero Gallery

Bug Fixes

Heroes
-Fixed a bug that was allowing Mercy to resurrect players that had fallen off the map to their death

Maps
- Fixed a bug to prevent the garden point on Oasis from being contested.capped from the second-floor walkway above
-Fixed a bug that allowed sombra to reach unintended locations on several maps
 
I really like playing Zen. Maybe it's the lousy level I play at but he does a great job shredding Pharah.

I've actually been getting a few Pharahs with Zarya lately too (when there aren't any capable teammates). It feels like her range has been increased quite a bit in the last few weeks. I could be imagining it though.

Yea, I mean Zen is effectively a sniper that can heal and debuff. Quite the powerhouse for being classified as support
 

antitrop

Member
- Fixed a bug to prevent the garden point on Oasis from being contested.capped from the second-floor walkway above

That was a bug? Seemed intentional to me. Oh, well.

Contesting the point from that walkway was so obvious, I have no idea how the map got through internal testing AND the PTR without anyone noticing that.
 
Maps
- Fixed a bug to prevent the garden point on Oasis from being contested.capped from the second-floor walkway above
-Fixed a bug that allowed sombra to reach unintended locations on several maps

Hope that fixes the Mei glitch too.

Yea, I mean Zen is effectively a sniper that can heal and debuff. Quite the powerhouse for being classified as support

In this tank meta, he's so good. Especially if they don't run Zarya or Winston. But everyone wants the passive Lucio heals. If our team has more flankers than tanks, I go Zen.
 

ohkay

Member
I prefer high skill ceiling characters because they're more fun over time, but maybe they should add one with a low skill floor since Ana and Sombra are both relatively difficult to play
 
I prefer high skill ceiling characters because they're more fun over time, but maybe they should add one with a low skill floor since Ana and Sombra are both relatively difficult to play

I like high skill ceiling characters too, their next character can have a high skill ceiling while still having relatively simple mechanics (Zen, Zarya come to mind). I feel like they just made Ana and Sombra do too much and as a result they're either OP (ana) or a master of none (sombra)
 

hypernima

Banned
I prefer high skill ceiling characters because they're more fun over time, but maybe they should add one with a low skill floor since Ana and Sombra are both relatively difficult to play

Odd, I find Ana relaxing to play. Compared to Lucio.
 

Mupod

Member
Before I played this game, I thought Zenyatta seemed like a really lame design. But after using him for a bit I realized he was awesome, I call this the E.Honda effect. I actually think he has the coolest firing/reload cycle in an FPS ever.

My favorite thing that happened in Overwatch is double healer becoming standard practice after Zen was buffed to be a real character and not Widow bait. I never thought I'd willingly play support in most matches but he's actually starting to pull ahead of Zarya in playtime for me.

I really like playing Zen. Maybe it's the lousy level I play at but he does a great job shredding Pharah.

I've actually been getting a few Pharahs with Zarya lately too (when there aren't any capable teammates). It feels like her range has been increased quite a bit in the last few weeks. I could be imagining it though.

Pharah is a tough opponent for Zenyatta since she can pick you off even when you're behind your allies. Zenyatta doesn't have any defenses against her other than killing her first and he can't deter with hitscan shots like Ana can. But through necessity I've gotten decent at picking them off.

The thing is this means that Pharah is usually afflicted with Discord because she's my priority target, but then I watch McCree and Soldier run around never looking up. Drives me nuts.

Death is whimsical today.

no, it's DEATH DEATH DEATH DEATH (too many messages)
 

antitrop

Member
no, it's DEATH DEATH DEATH DEATH (too many messages)
Yesssssssss

Before I played this game, I thought Zenyatta seemed like a really lame design. But after using him for a bit I realized he was awesome, I call this the E.Honda effect. I actually think he has the coolest firing/reload cycle in an FPS ever.
I didn't like Zen when I first started playing the game, but that was a time where he did less damage, had less health, and moved like a snail during Transcendence. His buffs were good.

His fire/reload animations are top-fucking-notch, for sure.
 
I still think people try too much to set up perfect stealth ambushes with Sombra way too much. Transloc gives you an insane amount of flexibility, and it lets you overextend to a silly degree, way past anything Tracer or Genji can do; you can chase down wounded enemies and stragglers better than anyone.

You don't have to throw it down on a hacked health pack every time, and in fact that's inefficient and you'll end up wasting valuable engagement time.

It just needs to be somewhere that's safer than where you will be in the next 3-13 seconds.
 
Observation after playing something other than OW: I think Paladins payload where you have one capture point and the team that captures it has the payload is better design as having a set attacking or defending team.

Paladins actually has a lot of design advantages over Overwatch. The horse mechanic, for instance, is a visually very silly but extremely elegant way to minimize the trickling in problem for a low player count game.
 

ohkay

Member
Odd, I find Ana relaxing to play. Compared to Lucio.
But the average person without much time on supports would probably do a better job healing by passively sitting on Lucio's heal aura than using Ana.
Same, but I've been playing that crazy aggressive Lucio style long before DSPStanky made it cool.
I play him super aggressive too, and it's part of the reason why I find it hard to understand why people find him boring. When you go in hard as Lucio, it's extremely fun
 

Jellie

Member
Hope that fixes the Mei glitch too.



In this tank meta, he's so good. Especially if they don't run Zarya or Winston. But everyone wants the passive Lucio heals. If our team has more flankers than tanks, I go Zen.
You run Lucio for speed boost not healing. Has been nerfed a lot but it's still good since nothing else does anything similar. Interesting that the support class have 3 of the top 5 best abilities which defined the meta at some point.
I prefer high skill ceiling characters because they're more fun over time, but maybe they should add one with a low skill floor since Ana and Sombra are both relatively difficult to play
Would be interesting for GAF to discuss which are highest or lowest skill ceilings.
 

AbaFadi

Banned
Would be interesting for GAF to discuss which are highest or lowest skill ceilings.

Zarya and Genji probably have one of the highest skill ceilings imo. Both of them require a lot of play time to maximize their potential. There are other characters such as Ana as well.
 
You run Lucio for speed boost not healing. Has been nerfed a lot but it's still good since nothing else does anything similar. Interesting that the support class have 3 of the top 5 best abilities which defined the meta at some point.

Would be interesting for GAF to discuss which are highest or lowest skill ceilings.

On a good team, I'd agree. But in pubs / my plat level, it's crucial to have a Lucio to top off the tanks when you happen to get an Ana grenade. But when I play Luc I keep the speed on as much as possible.

In terms of skill ceiling, we talking about mechanical or game sense / contribution?

Cause you can clearly tell a bad Mercy from a good one by how hard they are to kill and how much time they spend flying.

So I'm really trash at 1v1. Besides working on my aim, what else can I do to get better?

Play dumb. Seriously, a lot of times 1v1s are decided by who hits first and keeps the damage on.
 

Jellie

Member
Zarya and Genji probably have one of the highest skill ceilings imo. Both of them require a lot of play time to maximize their potential. There are other characters such as Ana as well.
Yeah genji and ana definitely. Would put a few above zarya though she does have a high ceiling. Lucio and Tracer have slightly higher IMO.
 

ohkay

Member
My controversial choice for highest skill ceiling: Reinhardt. Even though he's not mechanically the most challenging, I feel like there's so much more you need to pay attention to as him than anyone else, especially when there's so much risk/reward involved in playing him and your performance can make or break the match. You have to space and position yourself properly, know when to shield, when to swing, when it's safe to charge, etc.
 

antitrop

Member
My controversial choice for highest skill ceiling: Reinhardt. Even though he's not mechanically the most challenging, I feel like there's so much more you need to pay attention to as him than anyone else, especially when there's so much risk/reward involved in playing him and your performance can make or break the match. You have to space and position yourself properly, know when to shield, when to swing, when it's safe to charge, etc.

No lies. For a character that people joke about "holding down RMB, win", there's so much that goes into playing him, mentally.
 
No lies. For a character that people joke about "holding down RMB, win", there's so much that goes into playing him, mentally.

I love when people get close to my shield expecting me to back away.

I outdamage you, and now you're in my range. Let's dance.

The Rein v. Rein matchup is also hilarious.

Then you get moments like last night where a Roadhog ulted to keep me in the air so I couldn't land my Earthshatter :(
 
So I'm really trash at 1v1. Besides working on my aim, what else can I do to get better?
It depends on the hero and their hitbox, but even a little more unpredictability in your movement works wonders. Do some simple strafing back and forth. Don't jump. Throw in the occasional crouch.
 

Jellie

Member
On a good team, I'd agree. But in pubs / my plat level, it's crucial to have a Lucio to top off the tanks when you happen to get an Ana grenade. But when I play Luc I keep the speed on as much as possible.

In terms of skill ceiling, we talking about mechanical or game sense / contribution?

Cause you can clearly tell a bad Mercy from a good one by how hard they are to kill and how much time they spend flying.



Play dumb. Seriously, a lot of times 1v1s are decided by who hits first and keeps the damage on.
I could see it helping with grenades but I still prefer speed boost. Great to engage with especially with this meta where it's w+m1.

Overall ceiling.
 
Reinhardt was Giant Bomb's Overwatch Character of the Year for a reason, you know.
From the launcher:

General
-Decreased the volume of passing cars with the oasis background in the Hero Gallery

Bug Fixes

Heroes
-Fixed a bug that was allowing Mercy to resurrect players that had fallen off the map to their death

Maps
- Fixed a bug to prevent the garden point on Oasis from being contested.capped from the second-floor walkway above
-Fixed a bug that allowed sombra to reach unintended locations on several maps

Dunno how I missed this, thanks!

Glad to hear they patched the Sombra exploit.
This is mystifying to me. You put a transloc nearby. You run in stealthed. You ult. You tap E. You run back and pick off everything your team hasn't already killed.

I think there are maybe a dozen ults in the game that are more dangerous to get off.

That's Sombra's strategy (attack, immediately blink away) for everything, and it's awful. Half of playing her is dealing with downtime or maintenance, the other half is set-up, and a wee corner of her actual playstyle is engaging the enemy. She's a hero designed around disengaging the enemy and it's weird in a game that's all about the opposite.

As I see it, her ult is best for Symmetra ult busting (or, it will be once turrets die from it) or disabling Torb's turret. Any flanking character, be it Genji, Tracer, or even Pharah or something, can make a Rein turn around--you don't need an ult for that. Like, disabling a choke point is only great if the enemy team was going to get rolled over anyways.

Since they reworked Symmetra due to her cooldown maintenance (shielding allies), I'm certain they'll do the same for Sombra down the road. (For healthpacks, teleports, AND hacking enemies. Lowering the cooldown on her hack is only the first step.)
 

Akuun

Looking for meaning in GAF
You run Lucio for speed boost not healing. Has been nerfed a lot but it's still good since nothing else does anything similar. Interesting that the support class have 3 of the top 5 best abilities which defined the meta at some point.

Would be interesting for GAF to discuss which are highest or lowest skill ceilings.
I find Lucio relaxing when you play more passively. His gun can still get kills if you aim and lead well, and it's good because most people ignore his shooting anyway. It's a way to contribute to the party while still doing some damage yourself. Of course, you can go crazy aggressive too, but he can still contribute pretty well by staying back.

For highest skill ceiling, I'd probably say Ana, Genji and maybe Tracer. Characters who require a lot of aim, positioning and decision making to make their characters effective. Genji and Tracer's movement requires a lot of skill to keep up with while also aiming well.

Near the bottom I'd probably put Bastion, Torb, Junkrat, and then maybe Reaper and Mercy. Mercy and Reaper are noticably higher because both of them need good spatial awareness to position and move well.

Even the simpler characters can have a huge skill range because of movement and positioning. People like to make fun of Mercy for being a character that takes no skill, but you can really tell a good one from a bad one.
 
If we're talking in terms of "learning the nuances of their abilities and playstyle," rather than pure mechanical skill:

Tier 1: Ana, Genji, Reinhardt, Sombra
Tier 2: Lucio, Mei, Tracer, Zarya, Zenyatta
Tier 3: Mercy, Roadhog, Symmetra, Winston
Tier 4: Hanzo, McCree, Pharah, Reaper, Soldier 76, Torbjorn
Tier 5: Bastion, D.va, Junkrat, Widowmaker

Tier 1: Cooldowns, prioritization, game sense, opportunism, reaction, positioning, teamwork are all essential. You have to keep track of everything.
Tier 2: You have key abilities and cooldowns that require judicious management. Learning when and where to use them requires a high-level game understanding and lots of practice.
Tier 3: There's some complexity to what you do, but you're kind of a one-trick pony and just need to understand how to do that one thing as well as possible.
Tier 4: The basic execution of what you do is straightforward to understand, but positioning is vital and it's easy to play badly and blame it on your luck or your teammates.
Tier 5: You think this hero has hidden depth because you main them.
 

antitrop

Member
I find Lucio relaxing when you play more passively. His gun can still get kills if you aim and lead well, and it's good because most people ignore his shooting anyway. It's a way to contribute to the party while still doing some damage yourself.

It's also a good way to accidentally wake up sleeping Nano Boosted targets. :p
 
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REERsQa.gif
 

Jellie

Member
I find Lucio relaxing when you play more passively. His gun can still get kills if you aim and lead well, and it's good because most people ignore his shooting anyway. It's a way to contribute to the party while still doing some damage yourself. Of course, you can go crazy aggressive too, but he can still contribute pretty well by staying back.

For highest skill ceiling, I'd probably say Ana, Genji and maybe Tracer. Characters who require a lot of aim, positioning and decision making to make their characters effective. Genji and Tracer's movement requires a lot of skill to keep up with while also aiming well.

Near the bottom I'd probably put Bastion, Torb, Junkrat, and then maybe Reaper and Mercy. Mercy and Reaper are noticably higher because both of them need good spatial awareness to position and move well.

Even the simpler characters can have a huge skill range because of movement and positioning. People like to make fun of Mercy for being a character that takes no skill, but you can really tell a good one from a bad one.
The dink dink dink dink when you get a quadruple headshot with Lucio is sublime. I like how he can have such different play style and none of them are wrong .
If we're talking in terms of "learning the nuances of their abilities and playstyle," rather than pure mechanical skill:

Tier 1: Ana, Genji, Reinhardt, Sombra
Tier 2: Lucio, Mei, Tracer, Zarya, Zenyatta
Tier 3: Mercy, Roadhog, Symmetra, Winston
Tier 4: Hanzo, McCree, Pharah, Reaper, Soldier 76, Torbjorn
Tier 5: Bastion, D.va, Junkrat, Widowmaker

Tier 1: Cooldowns, prioritization, game sense, opportunism, reaction, positioning, teamwork are all essential. You have to keep track of everything.
Tier 2: You have key abilities and cooldowns that require judicious management. Learning when and where to use them requires a high-level game understanding and lots of practice.
Tier 3: There's some complexity to what you do, but you're kind of a one-trick pony and just need to understand how to do that one thing as well as possible.
Tier 4: The basic execution of what you do is straightforward to understand, but positioning is vital and it's easy to play badly and blame it on your luck or your teammates.
Tier 5: You think this hero has hidden depth because you main them.
Would put Lucio and Winston up a tier. Lucio because you need to know when to speed boost which can be for numerous different reasons (engage, disengage, avoiding ults, chasing down an enemy etc). Also have to react to the enemy ults with sound barrier and know when to use it to engage or save key teammates in a fight. Positioning not so much since the range is so big but you still need to make sure your auras affect everyone or as many as possible.
Winston is one of the heroes who requires good cool down management the most. Pop the shield too early and you won't have your jump back in time to get out. Jump in at the wrong time and you're dead. Using your shield to cut off healing especially to a nanoboosted target is really good too.
 
If we're talking in terms of "learning the nuances of their abilities and playstyle," rather than pure mechanical skill:

Tier 1: Ana, Genji, Reinhardt, Sombra
Tier 2: Lucio, Mei, Tracer, Zarya, Zenyatta
Tier 3: Mercy, Roadhog, Symmetra, Winston
Tier 4: Hanzo, McCree, Pharah, Reaper, Soldier 76, Torbjorn
Tier 5: Bastion, D.va, Junkrat, Widowmaker

Tier 1: Cooldowns, prioritization, game sense, opportunism, reaction, positioning, teamwork are all essential. You have to keep track of everything.
Tier 2: You have key abilities and cooldowns that require judicious management. Learning when and where to use them requires a high-level game understanding and lots of practice.
Tier 3: There's some complexity to what you do, but you're kind of a one-trick pony and just need to understand how to do that one thing as well as possible.
Tier 4: The basic execution of what you do is straightforward to understand, but positioning is vital and it's easy to play badly and blame it on your luck or your teammates.
Tier 5: You think this hero has hidden depth because you main them.

This is pretty damn accurate imo .
I'd probably swap tracer and Winston's places though.
 
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