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Edzi
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:25 PM)
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Can someone give me a rundown of the post patch tanks? I've got a lvl 60 DARK, WAR, and a low level gladiator and I need to decide which one will be most fun for stormblood. I've played a bit with WAR over the weekend, but not enough to really get a feel for the changes.

As far as healers go, it's kind of sounding like AST is the only fun option? SCH seems kind of boring now, so I'm considering going to AST full time and just abondoning my lvl 50 SCH.

For DPS, SAM and red mage have won me over.
ebil
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:27 PM)
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Originally Posted by Atolm

Finished MSQ. The final Battle will cause massive amounts of pain among the casual players.

That's a good thing after the pushover that was the final battle in Heavensward. It'll also be outgeared very quickly, which will make it much easier by virtue of having more HP and DPS.

RIP Trial Roulette for a few days though.
Aeana
Medal Princess
(06-19-2017, 08:27 PM)
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In what way is SCH boring? That will affect any recommendations I can give.
MogCakes
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:28 PM)
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Are there any 70 DRGs here? How is the endgame rotation looking so far?
Dreamwriter
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:29 PM)
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Originally Posted by Razgriz-Specter

One last question,
since my purchase included early access can I even visit the new locations or do I need to wait for the story stuff to open it up tomorrow when I also have HS?

You can’t get to the new Stormblood locations until you have completed the Heavensward and post-Heavensward storylines, similar to how you can’t get to the new Heavensward locations until finishing the “Realm Reborn” quests. Square wrote the story in such a way that it wouldn’t be feasible for Eorzeans to travel to the new lands in each expansion (for example, Ishgard has been fighting a war for 1000 years and doesn’t trust foreigners or allow them into their cities), and each storyline ends giving a reason why they can suddenly access the new lands in the next expansion.
Last edited by Dreamwriter; 06-19-2017 at 08:33 PM.
Itchy//Tasty
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:30 PM)
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People are playing this? Haven't been able to even get into the game for three days. You've got until next month, S-E! Then I'm unsubbing, lol. This is my big summer game, too.

Shiva server, EU by the way.
iammeiam
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:30 PM)
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Originally Posted by Haly

Which minions? I need to know so I can farm at 70 before prices crash.

Dress-up Yugiri from one of the EXDR dungeons was like 15 mill of that, which has to end up tanking because people are going to be grinding it for like 3 months minimum. The baby monkey that I don't remember where we got it. I think was another 5mill. The bombfish minion ended up going for only like 400, but it made sense since it was in the first couple dungeons.

Originally Posted by Edzi

As far as healers go, it's kind of sounding like AST is the only fun option? SCH seems kind of boring now, so I'm considering going to AST full time and just abondoning my lvl 50 SCH.

WHM will likely be more fun in dungeons than AST, because the AST dps 'rotation' at this point is pretty awful. Everyone is under geared so mass pulls hit tanks pretty hard which keeps it active now, but long-term WHM will probably be more fun. Haven't done much with SCH because I thought it felt meh in dungeons at 60 anyway.
Last edited by iammeiam; 06-19-2017 at 08:32 PM.
Haly
One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
(06-19-2017, 08:31 PM)
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Originally Posted by iammeiam

Dress-up Yugiri from one of the EXDR dungeons was like 15 mill of that, which has to end up tanking because people are going to be grinding it for like 3 months minimum. The baby monkey that I don't remember where we got it. I think was another 5mill. The bombfish minion ended up going for only like 400, but it made sense since it was in the first couple dungeons.

Thanks.

Shit now I wish I had my PLD up to bar. Can't grind EXDR on a dps lul.
Malick[AI]
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:31 PM)
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Originally Posted by Aeana

In what way is SCH boring? That will affect any recommendations I can give.

The best part about 2.x and 3.x SCH was doing other stuff while your fairy took care of the low level healing. With Cleric stance borked and pet health kind of gimped it is just not as fun.
HelloNewman
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:32 PM)
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Got Sam and RDM to 60 I prefer RDM though now I can do MSQ which I've been looking forward to since Friday.
DarKshodaN
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:33 PM)
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Originally Posted by Itchy//Tasty

People are playing this? Haven't been able to even get into the game for three days. You've got until next month, S-E! Then I'm unsubbing, lol. This is my big summer game, too.

Shiva server, EU by the way.

i am already lvl 70 with my bard on shiva eu, guess i was lucky?
Haly
One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
(06-19-2017, 08:40 PM)
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I loved Azim, I don't get people's complaints.

The quests were a bit on the milquetoast side but not much different from any other quests. It's such a rich flavorful area and DAT ENDING.

Literally KHAL DROGO.
Last edited by Haly; 06-19-2017 at 08:42 PM.
Lunafreya Nox Fleuret
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:40 PM)
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Originally Posted by Frumix

Lakshmi EX dead.
She's even easier than Susano to execute (though a bit harder to learn) but both so bad at their job that I could learn and farm them with EU pugs in 3-4 pulls.

Don't know how I feel about this.

Are they easier than any primals we faced in Heavensward? Yikes.
Aeana
Medal Princess
(06-19-2017, 08:41 PM)
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Originally Posted by Malick[AI]

The best part about 2.x and 3.x SCH was doing other stuff while your fairy took care of the low level healing. With Cleric stance borked and pet health kind of gimped it is just not as fun.

On the "things to do while not healing" front, AST is probably the most boring right now. Card management helps a bit of course, but it has one DoT and one direct damage spell otherwise. And the extra crown of swords or whatever if you happen to get it.
studyguy
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:42 PM)
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Mini Turtle is also best minion StormsBlood
Razgriz-Specter
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:42 PM)
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Originally Posted by Dreamwriter

You can’t get to the new Stormblood locations until you have completed the Heavensward and post-Heavensward storylines, similar to how you can’t get to the new Heavensward locations until finishing the “Realm Reborn” quests. Square wrote the story in such a way that it wouldn’t be feasible for Eorzeans to travel to the new lands in each expansion (for example, Ishgard has been fighting a war for 1000 years and doesn’t trust foreigners or allow them into their cities), and each storyline ends giving a reason why they can suddenly access the new lands in the next expansion.

Thank you
wamberz1
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:43 PM)
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Originally Posted by Haly

I loved Azim, I don't get people's complaints.

The quests were a bit on the milquetoast side but not much different from any other quests, but it's such a rich flavorful area and DAT ENDING.

Literally KHAL DROGO.

People were complaining? It's the part of the expansion!
studyguy
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:44 PM)
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Originally Posted by Silav101

Nope to either questions, due to the differences in stances for PLD. Thankfully, swapping no longer interrupts your combo, but on PLD, it costs both mana and a GCD, which introduces the following considerations. Also note that you can also just DROP the stance, which costs no mana or GCDs:

- Will I need to swap into Shield Oath within the next few GCDs due to losing aggro or damage from enemies? If yes, then just drop the stance, instead of swapping, and put it back on when needed. You can even argue that there is no point in dropping it all, for the small gain in damage.

- Can I do at least 9 GCD attacks before having to swap back into Shield Oath? If yes, then swap to Sword Oath.

The introduction of the Oath gauge also puts even more emphasis on knowing when and where to swap stances, because it now powers Sheltron, which is even more powerful than it already was.

If you want to maximize your damage as a PLD, it helps to do a couple of aggro combos in the pull (and ask for help from your DPS and off-tank via their enmity reduction / transfer skills), and then swap to Sword Oath and do as many DPS rotations as you can.

This sounds like 3.0 era PLD.

I'm not entirely sure if 4.0 era PLD should ever drop an oath since we immediately lose the ability to Shelltron which is pretty critical to our Holy Spirit rotation. Also intervention is tied to it to boot so idk. It's gonna be interesting seeing how people parse the numbers. If Riot Blade can regen MP quick enough to full before Requicast is back up, then I suppose it doesn't really matter.
Last edited by studyguy; 06-19-2017 at 08:47 PM.
Mr Nash
square pies = communism
(06-19-2017, 08:45 PM)
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Not really digging the changes to stance dancing as warrior thus far. Feels kind of clunky managing rage and getting ready to lose 50 just for changing stances. =\
ithorien
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:46 PM)
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Left the game very shortly after 2.2 landed; as Samurai was my first job (and RDM was my wife's) to 75 in FFXI, it felt almost obligatory.

Problem is, I am as lost as one can be. Out of all the MMOs I've played, this is the one I remember the least. Aside from the guide found on reddit to get caught up to 3.0, does anyone suggest any other useful material or full guide to get back into it?
Relaxed Muscle
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:48 PM)
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- Gets in after a 1400 queue

- Does one Frontline, to rest from PotD

- Get's 90k

- New queue is 2700

Leason learned, stick to PotD
studyguy
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:48 PM)
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Originally Posted by Mr Nash

Not really digging the changes to stance dancing as warrior thus far. Feels kind of clunky managing rage and getting ready to lose 50 just for changing stances. =\

I mean this has basically been PLD since the jump with the gigantic MP penalty/GCD waste. The other two tanks have been largely free of consequences for dropping into a DPS stance.

idk, feels like it was overdue.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
(06-19-2017, 08:51 PM)
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Originally Posted by katagai

The massive jump puzzle required to even reach that spot.

I gave up after an hour. It's not a jump puzzle. It's nitpicky bullshit to find the perfect way to clip around shit.
Aeana
Medal Princess
(06-19-2017, 08:53 PM)
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Originally Posted by studyguy

Mini Turtle is also best minion StormsBlood

It's Ghido, man!

I feel like people who don't know who he is don't deserve to have him.


I've lost the roll 4 times. :( Damn it.
Atolm
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:53 PM)
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Originally Posted by Aeana

In what way is SCH boring? That will affect any recommendations I can give.

I'm SCH70.

The job lost quite a bit because know in regards to its function as DPS as it only has 2 DotS and 1 party buff. Shadow Flare has been nerfed because it's an off-gcd. Aetherflow has been nerfed as well and you need the Shroud of Saints-like role skill up to sustain mana.

On the other hand it has gained two great abilities, one that procs when the target is below 50% which makes it invaluable for tank busters, and the other is the Fairy-chain. It's VERY potent and she can solo heal a tank even through the most brutal stuff as long as you have the ticks (each is 10 points from the Fairy bar).

I'm going to level AST as well but I wouldn't say SCH is worse now.
studyguy
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:54 PM)
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Originally Posted by Aeana

It's Ghido, man!

I feel like people who don't know who he is don't deserve to have him.


I've lost the roll 4 times. :( Damn it.

Rolled a 99 on him the first time I ran the dungeon.
feelsgoodman

I've lost the baby bombfish twice though :/
RK9039
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:54 PM)
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Originally Posted by studyguy

I mean this has basically been PLD since the jump with the gigantic MP penalty/GCD waste. The other two tanks have been largely free of consequences for dropping into a DPS stance.

idk, feels like it was overdue.

Stance dancing made sense for Warrior because of stacks of wrath/abandon. Now it's just stupid.
studyguy
Member
(06-19-2017, 08:56 PM)
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Originally Posted by RK9039

Stance dancing made sense for Warrior because of stacks of wrath/abandon. Now it's just stupid.

Why did it need to work that way though? I keep seeing that point, but again two tank classes with largely no penalty for jumping to and from DPS seems just the kind of shit that tilts the scales heavily in their favor. That was always the problem. Now we're all dealing with stacks in one form or another in largely the same fashion.
RK9039
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(06-19-2017, 08:58 PM)
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Originally Posted by studyguy

Why did it need to work that way though? I keep seeing that point, but again two tank classes with largely no penalty for jumping to and from DPS seems just the kind of shit that tilts the scales heavily in their favor. That was always the problem. Now we're all dealing with stacks in one form or another in largely the same fashion.

They should have just gotten rid of the stance swapping penalty for Paladin then.

I don't mind the beast gauge overall, getting 50 points ain't so hard to do.
neoemonk
Member
(06-19-2017, 09:00 PM)
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Originally Posted by Unknown Soldier

The best part about being the tank is that nobody ever starts it without me. :D

DRK was my first tank. Ever, in any game.

I struggled at first. I didn't know it was an advanced tank class. I didn't learn cross class skills because I didn't know I had to, I honestly just figured I would be provided with what I needed.

For a while tanking was really stressful, and I almost quit the game because of it.

I stuck with it, mostly because I have friends IRL that play, and eventually I turned a corner. I don't know if I got better or just stopped caring, but man, tanking is the best. Just keep the mobs on you and everyone else can deal with whatever. I love it.

Of course, now I have to learn everything again because of the ability changes, but that's ok.
Squishy3
Member
(06-19-2017, 09:01 PM)
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The level 65 dungeon is amazing.
Ozigizo
Member
(06-19-2017, 09:01 PM)
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I ordered digitally from the Square Enix store. Where is my expansion code? I only received the early access one.
scy
(06-19-2017, 09:02 PM)
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Originally Posted by Haly

Which minions? I need to know so I can farm at 70 before prices crash.

It helps that one of the minions was a waifu minion (Yugiri); last I checked though, prices dropped to 10M range since more people are getting EXDR access.

Originally Posted by Edzi

Can someone give me a rundown of the post patch tanks? I've got a lvl 60 DARK, WAR, and a low level gladiator and I need to decide which one will be most fun for stormblood. I've played a bit with WAR over the weekend, but not enough to really get a feel for the changes.

Can only comment on WAR so far and the day-to-day is fine. By and large a lot of regular play is the same as always except with a new oGCD to use, better mobility, and Infuriate resets. Gaining Rampart helps smooth a lot of things over as well. The stance dance penalty is awkward and clunky still but you can typically work around it. It's just an unfortunate jank that doesn't increase depth or add real choice.

Inner Release and tweaking out the 6x Fell Cleave (+1x Upheaval) is a thing; it's satisfying to get off and, realistically, we're still defensively in around the same spot as before (+ Rampart!). But it's also this weird thing of setting up an Infuriate to reset later some ~10 GCDs in advance that makes for a slightly weird setup time to adjust to. Threat feels awkward in that you're trying your damned best to avoid Butcher's Block for fueling more Fell Cleaves so you tend to suffer a bit. Edit: Left out the biggest downside, losing Bloodbath is a really big deal when it comes to massive pulls or even just for self-sustaining through DPS loops. Your health feels more like it just drops off in pulls rather than the down-and-up yo-yo effect that Bloodbath let you do. Your self-maintenance took a really big hit and it sort of sucks to deal with since nothing really makes up for it, not even more Storm's Path use.

Basically, my summary is the more I just do things then the more fluid it feels; Upheaval as oGCD threat / damage is neat, Onslaught feels fun for a lot of the PBAoE or "get to this side of the room and back" mechanics, and the Infuriate feedback loop is just a nice bonus use of your skills. The more you try to get the most out of Inner Release / Deliverance, the more tightly wound up everything feels and you start to really hate the idea of switching stances at any non-zero value (WHY GAME, WHY DO I HAVE 5 METER LEFT) and you're stuck with a bit more preplanning and setup than you used to before. Your sense of agency with your health management is significantly lower now but you do have better access to mitigation skills; healers may like you more for hits but I feel less responsible for my own HP which lends itself to more GCDs spent healing vs letting me deal with some of it.

tl;dr: More tools than before, maximizing use of stuff feels clunkier; better access to cooldowns for hits, require more active healing as HP sponge.

Originally Posted by studyguy

Why did it need to work that way though? I keep seeing that point, but again two tank classes with largely no penalty for jumping to and from DPS seems just the kind of shit that tilts the scales heavily in their favor. That was always the problem. Now we're all dealing with stacks in one form or another in largely the same fashion.

Because you spend a GCD (and resource) to trigger a mitigation effect; swapping stances on WAR just enabled better healing on them but on it's own didn't actually set anything off. Losing meter is a pretty harsh penalty here since it's generally worth more than a single average GCD for high values? It basically puts you in a spot of you should never switch when you're actually facing a resource loss and it significantly delays changing stance into Inner Beast by several GCDs (and/or having Infuriate ready).

Also, to conserve space here, Riot Blade is more than enough to cover MP between Requiescat cycles. You also don't need Sheltron / Shield Block at all to do a 5x Holy Spirit inside a Requiescat window.
Last edited by scy; 06-19-2017 at 09:17 PM. Reason: I might actually be done editing.
R0ckman
Member
(06-19-2017, 09:03 PM)
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Originally Posted by studyguy

Mini Turtle is also best minion StormsBlood

Where do you get?
studyguy
Member
(06-19-2017, 09:04 PM)
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Questions what are fellow tanks taking as side skills?

Currently rolling: Rampart, Conval, Provoke, Reprisal, punching dudes in the fucking mouth to silence


Ultimatium seems largely useless to me with it's pitiful range.
Low Blow is just a cheaper version of shield bash to me.
Shirk/Awareness will likely come into play for endgame however.

Originally Posted by R0ckman

Where do you get?

1st dungeon boss chest by pure luck
Last edited by studyguy; 06-19-2017 at 09:12 PM.
Caim
Member
(06-19-2017, 09:14 PM)
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Originally Posted by studyguy

Questions what are fellow tanks taking as side skills?

Currently rolling: Rampart, Conval, Provoke, Reprisal, punching dudes in the fucking mouth to silence


Ultimatium seems largely useless to me with it's pitiful range.
Low Blow is just a cheaper version of shield bash to me.
Shirk/Awareness will likely come into play for endgame however.


1st dungeon boss chest by pure luck

I'm using the same thing as you but Awareness instead of Interject.
hosannainexcelsis
Member
(06-19-2017, 09:17 PM)
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Oh man, the people who show up in the level 60 weaver quest. I love this game.
theifofdreams
Member
(06-19-2017, 09:18 PM)
Can anyone point this returning player to a good BLM guide? I'm coming back in at lol 48 and have no idea on how to manage my spellcasting lol.
Aeana
Medal Princess
(06-19-2017, 09:19 PM)
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Originally Posted by Atolm

I'm SCH70.

The job lost quite a bit because know in regards to its function as DPS as it only has 2 DotS and 1 party buff. Shadow Flare has been nerfed because it's an off-gcd. Aetherflow has been nerfed as well and you need the Shroud of Saints-like role skill up to sustain mana.

On the other hand it has gained two great abilities, one that procs when the target is below 50% which makes it invaluable for tank busters, and the other is the Fairy-chain. It's VERY potent and she can solo heal a tank even through the most brutal stuff as long as you have the ticks (each is 10 points from the Fairy bar).

I'm going to level AST as well but I wouldn't say SCH is worse now.

FWIW, I knew about the SCH changes. I probably should have phrased my question differently. I wanted to know what s/he found boring about SCH, because the grass isn't necessarily greener on the other sides.
Jinko
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(06-19-2017, 09:19 PM)
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Originally Posted by Malick[AI]

The best part about 2.x and 3.x SCH was doing other stuff while your fairy took care of the low level healing. With Cleric stance borked and pet health kind of gimped it is just not as fun.

It's really not much different, I find it much better not having to jump in and out of cleric stance non stop,as long as your fairy skills are macro'd up you can still do two things at once.

You do burn through mana much more aggressively but this may be that we've all been used to top tier gear.
Last edited by Jinko; 06-19-2017 at 09:22 PM.
brandonh83
Banned
(06-19-2017, 09:20 PM)
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I haven't finished Heavensward yet, is there any reason for me to buy SB? Thinking about getting it just to get access to the new classes as I'm super close to giving up on how to learn Dragoon.
Last edited by brandonh83; 06-19-2017 at 09:22 PM.
Sandfox
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(06-19-2017, 09:22 PM)
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Originally Posted by brandonh83

I haven't finished Heavensward yet, is there any reason for me to buy SB yet? Would I be able to get the new classes?

The new classes are available even if you haven't finished Heavensward.
Squall ASF
Member
(06-19-2017, 09:22 PM)
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Originally Posted by brandonh83

I haven't finished Heavensward yet, is there any reason for me to buy SB yet? Would I be able to get the new classes?

Yes, you simply need to have a level 50 character and have beaten ARR's story to use the new classes. They can be picked up in Ul'dah.

I'm still working on ARR's story and plan on using Samarui as soon as I beat the final dungeon so will have it for the post ARR patches on.
brandonh83
Banned
(06-19-2017, 09:23 PM)
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Thanks :) wondering if I'd have a better/easier time playing Samurai or Red Mage.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
(06-19-2017, 09:23 PM)
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Originally Posted by Jinko

It's really not much different, I find it much better not having to jump in and out of cleric stance non stop,as long as your fairy skills are macro'd up you can still do two things at once.

You do burn through mana much more aggressively but this may be that we've all been used to top tier gear.

It's different just because you are no longer managing the stance dance AND 4 dots all at once.

It's really boring now on the hybrid side of things and all I have to say is the fights from this point on better be vastly more heal intensive


If I just wanted to cast two dots and some nukes I would have been playing a whm this whole time
Last edited by QisTopTier; 06-19-2017 at 09:25 PM.
RPGCrazied
Member
(06-19-2017, 09:25 PM)
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So I just bought the potion to skip the end of HS campaign, but its not in my mail. Man, if I just wasted $25....

Is it not instant or something?
Jinko
Member
(06-19-2017, 09:26 PM)
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Originally Posted by QisTopTier

It's different just because you are no longer managing the stance dance AND 4 dots all at once.

It's really boring now on the hybrid side of things and all I have to say is the fights from this point on better be vastly more heal intensive

Sure as I said, but stance dance was a pain in the ass IMO, shame we lost aero seemed pointless to remove it but meh, it's a healer class :P

Originally Posted by RPGCrazied

So I just bought the potion to skip the end of HS campaign, but its not in my mail. Man, if I just wasted $25....

Is it not instant or something?

You need to restart the game probably.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
(06-19-2017, 09:27 PM)
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Originally Posted by Jinko

Sure as I said, but stance dance was a pain in the ass IMO, shame we lost aero seemed pointless to remove it but meh, it's a healer class :P

What you found a pain I found dynamic and fun and had me learn to time things better. The "it's a healer class" line is silly because duh of course it is I heal a good chunk of the time too I enjoyed having to learn basically two playstyles at once to be effective
RPGCrazied
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(06-19-2017, 09:31 PM)
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Originally Posted by Jinko

Sure as I said, but stance dance was a pain in the ass IMO, shame we lost aero seemed pointless to remove it but meh, it's a healer class :P



You need to restart the game probably.

I did, a few times in fact.

And under payment history I see

Jun. 19, 2017 Tales of Adventure: Heavensward Credit Card/Debit Card USD 25.00

mre
Golden Domers are chickenshit!!
(06-19-2017, 09:32 PM)
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Originally Posted by iammeiam

Dress-up Yugiri from one of the EXDR dungeons was like 15 mill of that, which has to end up tanking because people are going to be grinding it for like 3 months minimum. The baby monkey that I don't remember where we got it. I think was another 5mill. The bombfish minion ended up going for only like 400, but it made sense since it was in the first couple dungeons.



WHM will likely be more fun in dungeons than AST, because the AST dps 'rotation' at this point is pretty awful. Everyone is under geared so mass pulls hit tanks pretty hard which keeps it active now, but long-term WHM will probably be more fun. Haven't done much with SCH because I thought it felt meh in dungeons at 60 anyway.

speaking of WHM, do you know if we've gotten any answer as to how plenary indulgence works yet?

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