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SimCity Traffic and AI is broken, Sims are fake

Pachinko

Member
I hate to say it but I think this game is a true bred failure. For all the hype and talk about it's amazing features (and quite a bit of this game is pretty cool) it seems it's just a broken mess. Probably shouldn't have been released in this state.

They could simply go back and turn off the glassbox engine for sims , re-code something similar to how simcity 4 worked and then also give us some of the tools simcity 4 rush hour had- such as the ability to designate roads as 1 way only.

I imagine much of these problems showed up in testing, there's no way they couldn't have but with 3 years and millions of dollars invested in the game it was either release an unfinished mess (which they went with) or delay/possibly cancel until they can get it working right.

The only audience out there that finds the entire affair wholly appealing are the first time players. People who haven't played a single simcity game before they won't care as much about whats going on under the hood like longtime fans might, they wont' care about the small size either because they'll just fill it all up and move on to something else.

Unfortunately you've got people like me that have been playing this series since the spectacular SNES port of the original, the DOS release of 2000, eventually 3000 and most recently simcity 4. 20 or so years of brand recognition and faithfulness tossed aside to hook a new audience. It'd be one thing to try something like this and consider it a different brand- perhaps calling this game Simcity Online but EA marketing likely determined no one would be as interested in the game if it were called that.

Ultimately my only faint home here is that Maxis first fixes the server issues and then goes about fixing the glassbox engine so that maybe 6 months down the road (when they likely had planned to release the first of at least a half dozen expansion packs) the game will actually work like it's supposed to. The problem is that by then, I don't think anyone will give 2 shits about playing this game. It's release was sandwiched between a number of high profile franchises like tomb raider, metal gear and starcraft as well as bioshock infinite. I've already moved on to starcraft myself.
 

shira

Member
Saw this in another thread. Someone over on the EA forums has been doing some research in to the traffic issues in SimCity and they seem to have found a major issue with the game.

Traffic "AI"... This is why services and traffic are broken!





What a joke

Here's a video of the terrible horde mentally pathfinding in action


EDIT: Possible population padding also found

Did EA lie about theoretical population sizes?




=\
If you look too closely at any game they all have flaws
 

Retro

Member
I wonder how long it will take for them to be able to fix this sort of thing? Incredible.

Exactly as long as it takes to produce a couple $49.99 expansion packs.

If you look too closely at any game they all have flaws

That's like saying "Well, if you dig around in any restaurant eventually you will find a hair in your soup, so why raise such a fuss over this giant bowl of hair?"
 

jambo

Member
I hate to say it but I think this game is a true bred failure. For all the hype and talk about it's amazing features (and quite a bit of this game is pretty cool) it seems it's just a broken mess. Probably shouldn't have been released in this state.

Would not surprise me in the slightest if EA gave Maxis a deadline no matter what happened with the game. EA have a sordid history of releasing unfinished and buggy games.


If you look too closely at any game they all have flaws

Flaws?

Really?

REALLY?

.__.
 

Skyzard

Banned
Nope you have zero control of anything outside of your city. This particular city started with an entrance on the east and west sides with a high density avenue (the biggest possible street) linking the two.

Maybe relocate the businesses closer to the edges of the town where the big roads connect? Will still get traffic.. but doesn't sound like there is much else you can do :/

Hope they improve the game, I definitely appreciate the visual upgrade...but seems like it needs way more work :(
 

BearPawB

Banned
I have defended most of the other decisions made by Maxis...
This one just feels like they lied to me.

This is not what we were told/promised
 

Row

Banned
the population aspect is really jarring to be honest, as there's clearly no way you have those amounts of sims in the residential buildings you have. This is something that wasn't an issue in previous simcities.

I'm enjoying the game for the most part, but honestly would have preferred SimCity4 with these nicer graphics (and better performance)
 

joezombie

Member
The traffic modeling in sim city 4 was actually pretty fucked up too and wasn't fixed until an expansion and user mod. It wasn't as big a deal because sim city 4 was otherwise pretty great(well, performance was awful for the time)

Please just remake sim city 4
 

GetemMa

Member
I've been saying this from day 1. The DRM and server issues have completely distracted people away from the fact that the content of the game is not very good. The game repeatedly doesn't play by its own rules.

"Educate your citizens so they don't start fires and get sick all the time." - yeah, educate them to a university level. Apparently fire safety and germ theory aren't touched upon in SimCity until you hit undergrad. That requires that you build an elementary, a Dept of Education add on, a highschool, and a University. All of this costs incredible amounts of money. Until then your town is constantly burning down and citizens are getting sick all the time even if water and air are perfectly clean and the sewage system is managed perfectly and placed far away from housing.That is just the tip of the iceberg with this game. The frustrations are many and constant.

Oh EA, you've published a substandard game only to out do yourself by having the worst launch of any game, ever. I totally regret this purchase. I don't think I've regretted purchasing a game so much in several years.
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
Increasingly more glad I did not purchase this game.
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NMihmYf4WJI
If you look too closely at any game they all have flaws
eGc3Mmd5MTI=_o_robocop-1987---glitch-scene---french.jpg



Edit: crappy image, it's from this
 

Retro

Member
I can't wait for Caesar V, where all your plebs just walk around in circles at the marketplace while you're told that PLEBS ARE NEEDED

Yeah, that's never gonna happen. The people who left Impressions (Caesar I-III) and formed Tilted Mill (Caesar IV) are busy chasing after Zynga. The only game they have coming up is "Medieval Mayor" which looks like an iOS or Facebook game. Same problem as SimCity5; watered down for casual appeal.
 

Aaron

Member
So how do education levels work if all sims are the same? Is this why I keep hearing about everyone's reactors melting down due to low education?
Considering this news, I bet this isn't even tied to the sims at all. It's purely based on having a college. Makes sense that if you demolish the college your sims suddenly get stupid, and can no longer work the reactor they've been supposedly at for a dozen years. It's incredibly lazy design.
 

Acheron

Banned
List of devs I hate:

Chris Metzen
Mac Walters
Now: Ocean Quigley

Gabe don't fuck up Half Life 3 I'm losing every franchise I cared about.
 
The trouble is that the game treats "Sims" as no different than any other in-game resource, all of which use the terrible pathing/flow system. There are no real unique "Sims" at all. The "Sims" are a resource generated by certain buildings at certain times with certain building destinations, just like water or sewage or power.

It's just a bunch of interacting resources pathing between buildings. It's not SimCity at all, really.
 

luka

Loves Robotech S1
Yep, /v/ figured this out a while ago.

spark20130127193819.png

Heh. Remember this thing? That one guy who spent years and years calculating and planning the most efficient functional city that is mathematically possible in SC3k?

yeah..

Are people really asking for a game to run an agent for every citizen when there are 200k+ citizens in a city? I'm sure that'll have low system resources. No game I've ever played keeps track of the routines of 200k NPCs at the same time.

Considering that's the whole reason this game was so limited and stripped down compared to sc4 in the first place, yeah. I'd have hoped they would have gotten that right at least.
 

VALIS

Member
Wish I could get a refund, but I don't think Greenmangaming does them. Lesson learned, I'll do more new release PC games via Amazon now.
 
If you look too closely at any game they all have flaws
Oh for FUCKS SAKE, we learned about why this is a shitty way to program anything in my second programming class in college. Fuck. It's the same issue as sorting problems. There are a thousand ways they could have programmed pathing for sims, and they LITERALLY chose the worst one. A fucking first year programming student would make fun of this shit. This is kusoge level.
 

Acheron

Banned
Obviously the game wasn't going to simulate 200K agents that all were unique without requiring supercomputers. However, either scale the agents to the point it is possible or don't go down that pathway and do what you did for the last 4 iterations (a really snazzy spreadsheet).

If you can't execute on your vision, and you don't compromise on it then all you got is a pile of shit. I lived through previews where these agents were supposed to justify cuts because of "deeper" simulation, now I find out its worthless.
 
Considering this news, I bet this isn't even tied to the sims at all. It's purely based on having a college. Makes sense that if you demolish the college your sims suddenly get stupid, and can no longer work the reactor they've been supposedly at for a dozen years. It's incredibly lazy design.
That was also my assumption...

I think this officially wins my prize for worst modern gaming launch, and I didn't even buy the darn thing.
 

elfinke

Member
So what is really busting my balls as more and more flaws are exposed about Sim City, is what the hell were all the beta testers doing? Apparently they weren't even providing a realistic server stress test, as this week has shown.

I understand they were limited to 1 hour play sessions or something equally silly, but I would have thought that 1 hour would be enough to discern the population number screw up and quite possibly enough time to also test the most basic of pathfinding patterns (like the video posted above with the empty long route and congested direct route)? Were there beta testers providing this feedback and just nothing happened?
 
Doesn't surprise me that the game doesn't actually simulate hundreds of thousands of people, but when it starts impacting gameplay this noticeably, I'm surprised it went out the door in this state.

Surely they had to have noticed these issues before release?
 

GavinGT

Banned
I can deal with launch server issues, but being forced to make a single snaking road would drive me fucking crazy. I'm so glad I didn't buy this game, despite being insanely hyped for it.
 
So what is really busting my balls as more and more flaws are exposed about Sim City, is what the hell were all the beta testers doing? Apparently they weren't even providing a realistic server stress test, as this week has shown.

I understand they were limited to 1 hour play sessions or something equally silly, but I would have thought that 1 hour would be enough to discern the population number screw up and quite possibly enough time to also test the most basic of pathfinding patterns (like the video posted above with the empty long route and congested direct route)? Were there beta testers providing this feedback and just nothing happened?


Beta testers were enjoying the fact they could play the game before anyone else.
 

Uhyve

Member
Dat A Star algorithm at work.
You could quite easily weight road traversals according to congestion with A*, like 'one line of code' easy, no idea what the hell Maxis is doing.

I can image this.
"Okay guys work is over!"
*Everybody run outside and its not a need for speed race for the rich houses*
"I HOPE I GET A NICE HOUSE WITH A COOL WIFE TODAY!"
I wonder if they'd stay at work longer if you put the good houses further away than the bad houses...
 

eznark

Banned
I have never been more disappointed with a game I purchased. I am actually ashamed for having bought it.

Yeah, I was planning on passing on it because of the DRM issues. I wish some of the previews and early reviews had paid attention to what a broken fucking mess of a clusterfuck game Maxis had made instead of masturbating to their private server set-up.

It took me getting to about 30,000 population before I realized something was wonky with traffic and population counts. How long did Pitts play this game? 25 minutes?
 

DEO3

Member
Honestly 90 percent of this sounds so irrelevant that its like people are just stiring shit up about the game being bad at this point just because they saw an opportunity to shit on EA and Maxis.

I mean really, how do sims being fake about where they leave and all that truly affect the way you are playing the game?

like I said, 90 percent, because having to alter placement and all that due to this does suck.

But the other thing? its a grand-scheme game, I dont care if the guy who returns to the house one day has a different color shirt than the one who left.

Yup.
 
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