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PSY・S
Member
(12-24-2016, 03:13 PM)

Originally Posted by M_Night

This is insider gold. I like his transparency.

S-E head honchos should listen to this guy instead of silencing him. Specifically about the ridiculous amount of rewrites and pointless redesigns.

we need more loose lips
ackl
Member
(12-24-2016, 03:14 PM)
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Originally Posted by M_Night

This is insider gold. I like his transparency.

S-E head honchos should listen to this guy instead of silencing him. Specifically about the ridiculous amount of rewrites and pointless redesigns.

I think S-E should not have switch Versus to a mainline title. If it remained as it was I don't think there would be this much rewrites and redesigns.
Setsu00
(12-24-2016, 03:15 PM)
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Originally Posted by PSY・S

she designed jihl?

Yes.
sensui-tomo
Member
(12-24-2016, 03:16 PM)
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Originally Posted by 13ruce

Wait a sec a western guy made those characters so it's not even a japanese dev/artist who perved up Cindy, mind is blown.

Cant be real because "especially in the west where "just make something cool" doesn't really fly since we like to use our brains when it comes to designing characters. " (when compared to eastern devs)
(not quoting this person but someone else in another thread... )
DiipuSurotu
(12-24-2016, 03:17 PM)
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Originally Posted by PSY・S

she designed jihl?

Yes. She designed everyone in FFXIII except the playable characters, Serah, Cid, and Barthandelous.

She may have designed Snow, too (an interviewer mentions that she designed all team NORA and then they start talking about Snow so it's unclear if Snow was included in that team NORA statement or not).
raven777
Member
(12-24-2016, 03:17 PM)
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Originally Posted by PSY・S

she designed jihl?

god I really like Jihl's design... shame how she was used in the game..
Servbot24
[CIA SLOWLY TAKES OFF HOOD]
(12-24-2016, 03:18 PM)
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Originally Posted by DarkLordMalik

The story kept changing even when Nomura was incharge. Lmao.

How else could a story possibly be made? It story didn't change it would always be nothing.
M_Night
"And I tell you, you are SOLDIER, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell will not prevail against it." Gospel of Cloud, 16:18
(12-24-2016, 03:19 PM)
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Originally Posted by Primethius

There is nothing in this post I agree with except the last line. So I'll just agree to disagree.

She came off as a filler character designed to pad the games length that was disregarded to tie up a plot string introduced that honestly, didn't even matter much.

I remember with XIII the go to character to highlight the wasted potential in that game was Jihl Nabaat. In XV you can point out around 10 key characters that just felt like absolute fluff. Emperor Aldercapt, Verstael, Ravus, Areana, Cid, Iris, Cor, Jared (LOL), Loqi, General Glauca. Even Regis....all those father son flashback scenes were absent, so that killed his impact too.

It's really, really disappointing. Especially when these characters were teased so much right up until even 2015..... :(
Primethius
Member
(12-24-2016, 03:25 PM)
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Originally Posted by M_Night

I remember with XIII the go to character to highlight the wasted potential in that game was Jihl Nabaat. In XV you can point out around 10 key characters that just felt like absolute fluff. Emperor Aldercapt, Verstael, Ravus, Areana, Cid, Iris, Cor, Jared (LOL), Loqi, General Glauca. Even Regis....all those father son flashback scenes were absent, so that killed his impact too.

It's really, really disappointing. Especially when these characters were teased so much right up until even 2015..... :(

Yep, and I really enjoyed the games ending still despite everything else leading up to that point.

I'm in the boat of, the game needed to cut back instead of keeping all these useless characters from its several iterations throughout the development cycle.

Sometimes you need to pare back. And with FFXVs ending being the highlight of the story, I would've loved more screen time on the main party, his dad or even Ardyn instead of Araneas optional dungeon or the one of two cutscenes Cor was in (this hurts me the most, cause the Shogun is so cool) and so on and so on.

FFXV is a treasure trove of missed potential :/
Garlador
Member
(12-24-2016, 03:34 PM)
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Originally Posted by Servbot24

How else could a story possibly be made? It story didn't change it would always be nothing.

I remember reading an old interview on FFIX where they mention they finalized the main story and character arts and all the narrative before a single character model or CG scene was made. That way the whole team could be on the same page, with the same clear goals and end point in mind, instead of developing a bunch of random and wasteful content that wouldn't even be used or was missing if they developed on the fly.

A lot of titles since have now been deep in development before undergoing massive story, gameplay, or character shifts, and it really is a messy, wasteful approach to development that would sink a less wealthy or successful studio.
DiipuSurotu
(12-24-2016, 03:38 PM)
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Originally Posted by Garlador

I remember reading an old interview on FFIX where they mention they finalized the main story and character arts and all the narrative before a single character model or CG scene was made. That way the whole team could be on the same page, with the same clear goals and end point in mind, instead of developing a bunch of random and wasteful content that wouldn't even be used or was missing if they developed on the fly.

A lot of titles since have now been deep in development before undergoing massive story, gameplay, or character shifts, and it really is a messy, wasteful approach to development that would sink a less wealthy or successful studio.

What's ironic is that this didn't stop them from changing the ending 7 times. :p
SilentRob
Member
(12-24-2016, 03:39 PM)
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Originally Posted by Neff

I doubt Cindy's cosplayers and female fans feel the same way.

Soo...ff a girl likes it it can't be fanservice designed to sexually attrack young males? If that's not your point then I don't see what this has to do with anything.
Jarmel
place a shoe on my head
to reduce lag compensation
(12-24-2016, 03:42 PM)
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So is an artbook coming out with Ferrari's character designs in it?
Meowster
Member
(12-24-2016, 03:43 PM)
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Aside from Cindy, I preferred his designs for the most part.
DiipuSurotu
(12-24-2016, 03:44 PM)
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The big news here IMO is that he says there won't be many new characters in FFVII:R. But maybe he's just talking about the first episode so far.
rhandino
Banned
(12-24-2016, 03:46 PM)

Originally Posted by DiipuSurotu

The big news here IMO is that he says there won't be many new characters in FFVII:R. But maybe he's just talking about the first episode so far.

That's because Genesis is not a new character per se =P
BumblebeeCody
(12-24-2016, 03:47 PM)
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Originally Posted by ArkhamFantasy

Gentiana is one of my favorite character designs ever.

Gentiana and Ardyn have cool designs.
Gbraga
Junior Member
(12-24-2016, 03:47 PM)
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Originally Posted by rhandino

That's because Genesis is not a new character per se =P

Can't wait!
DiipuSurotu
(12-24-2016, 03:48 PM)
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Originally Posted by rhandino

That's because Genesis is not a new character per se =P

😱
Garrett Hawke
Member
(12-24-2016, 03:48 PM)
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Originally Posted by Nudull

Classy way to handle criticism. :P

triggered by criticism!

remember, artistic integrity = number of bobbies on display

more bobbies = more integrity
TGO
Member
(12-24-2016, 03:49 PM)
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Originally Posted by Mieu

I don't understand the "hate" on Cindy's design.

She's a stereotype country girl engineer
The Daisy Duke, the female from those reality garage shows they have on TV ie, a danielle christie.
People don't like it in life and they don't like it in their games.
Last edited by TGO; 12-24-2016 at 03:56 PM.
CRUNT
Member
(12-24-2016, 03:54 PM)
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Cindy is the best part of FFXV screw the haters.
HeelPower
Member
(12-24-2016, 04:06 PM)
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Originally Posted by raven777

god I really like Jihl's design... shame how she was used in the game..

Still more developed with better on screen actions than anything in XV.

Never thought there would come a day where I would reminisce on how Jihl is a well utilized character.

lol XV is such a mess.
yunbuns
Member
(12-24-2016, 04:09 PM)
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Originally Posted by HeelPower

Still more developed with better on screen actions than anything in XV.

Never thought there would come a day where I would reminisce on how Jihl is a well utilized character.

lol XV is such a mess.

This seems like a reach. She literally only antagonizes Sazh and then dies from my memory. That's it. She was nothing special outside of having a nice design.
rhandino
Banned
(12-24-2016, 04:10 PM)
I don't think that the biggest problem of Cindy is the garbage outfit (Well, it is a problem because it looks really trashy) but more how the game treats her like a sex object every chance it gets... she is just a few notches below Quiet from MGSV



It could have worked if there was other more compelling and important female characters or some kind of subversion, like she was all sexy and perky during the game but you find how that completely changed during the events of the World of Ruin but nope! we can't have that.

Aranea design is really great tho and I like Ardyn but I think it was too busy and kind of looked iffy when he was next to more normal dressed people.

Originally Posted by yunbuns

This seems like a reach. She literally only antagonizes Sazh and then dies from my memory. That's it. She was nothing special outside of having a nice design.

She treated people like disposable tools that could be discarded at any moment but the joke was on her when she gets killed by the Primarch because she outlived her usefulness to that point

Her boss fight in XIII-2 was really fun!
Last edited by rhandino; 12-24-2016 at 04:13 PM.
Crankshaft
Member
(12-24-2016, 04:12 PM)
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Originally Posted by HeelPower

Still more developed with better on screen actions than anything in XV.

Never thought there would come a day where I would reminisce on how Jihl is a well utilized character.

lol XV is such a mess.

Lolwut? Jihl and "developed" should not be used in the same sentence. She shows up a few times and dies like a chump.
LordKasual
Member
(12-24-2016, 04:12 PM)

Originally Posted by M_Night

This is insider gold. I like his transparency.

S-E head honchos should listen to this guy instead of silencing him. Specifically about the ridiculous amount of rewrites and pointless redesigns.

I'm sure SE knows by now how stupid it is.

It's a bit tactless to complain publicly like this, it looks more like he's saving face than anything. But I can't say he's wrong for it. I liked his designs in this game, would enjoy seeing more.

Originally Posted by HeelPower

Still more developed with better on screen actions than anything in XV.

Never thought there would come a day where I would reminisce on how Jihl is a well utilized character.

lol XV is such a mess.


Jihl? What the fuck hahaha

You should stop reminiscing because i think you're hallucinating.

Jihl is probably the most egregious example of a wasted character i've ever seen in a Final Fantasy game. We didn't even get to fight her, we got robbed by the ugly clockface man.

It is astounding how quickly people forget about things when they just want to hate on something new man
Last edited by LordKasual; 12-24-2016 at 04:17 PM.
Rabid Dwarf 76
Member
(12-24-2016, 04:13 PM)
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Originally Posted by Dark_castle

Did he comment on Cidney's glorious design?

FTFY.
raven777
Member
(12-24-2016, 04:13 PM)
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Originally Posted by DiipuSurotu

The big news here IMO is that he says there won't be many new characters in FFVII:R. But maybe he's just talking about the first episode so far.

I mean his is just gonna redesign most of the old cast.. I don't see remake having many brand new characters. They could add few characters from compilation like Cissnei and Genesis but they won't be considered 'new characters'.
luminous
Junior Member
(12-24-2016, 04:17 PM)
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Red-framed glasses Gentiana is the only real loss during FFXV's development. Stella who?
Ferr986
Member
(12-24-2016, 04:20 PM)
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Originally Posted by HeelPower

Still more developed with better on screen actions than anything in XV.

Never thought there would come a day where I would reminisce on how Jihl is a well utilized character.

lol XV is such a mess.

Your hate on XV is clouding your memories about Jihl lol
Rabid Dwarf 76
Member
(12-24-2016, 04:38 PM)
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Originally Posted by Zakalwe

Cindy's design is literally there to titillate. Down to the gratuitous sexy animations when she services the car.

It'a just backwards. No not need for it. She should have been more like Kayley from Firefly who is very attractive but not sexualised at all.

Serious question. Why titillation such a bad thing?
Adaren
Member
(12-24-2016, 04:39 PM)
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Jihl is actually really comparable to (XV spoiler) Luna. Neither one is the least developed character in their game, but both die earlier than expected, just when it seems like their role is ramping up.

We can nitpick about which one is worse, but I think the real takeaway is that both are disappointing.

I guess that means that we're getting a Luna boss battle for XV-2. Nothing sells DLC like fridges characters.
Dimmle
Member
(12-24-2016, 04:45 PM)
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Is everyone glossing over the bit where he confides that Umbra was at one point meant to turn into a human ninja?
B-Dex
Member
(12-24-2016, 04:50 PM)
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Originally Posted by rhandino

I don't think that the biggest problem of Cindy is the garbage outfit (Well, it is a problem because it looks really trashy) but more how the game treats her like a sex object every chance it gets... she is just a few notches below Quiet from MGSV



It could have worked if there was other more compelling and important female characters or some kind of subversion, like she was all sexy and perky during the game but you find how that completely changed during the events of the World of Ruin but nope! we can't have that.

Aranea design is really great tho and I like Ardyn but I think it was too busy and kind of looked iffy when he was next to more normal dressed people.

She treated people like disposable tools that could be discarded at any moment but the joke was on her when she gets killed by the Primarch because she outlived her usefulness to that point

Her boss fight in XIII-2 was really fun!

Nothing about Cindy is as overt as that Quiet gif.
Neff
Member
(12-24-2016, 04:54 PM)
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Originally Posted by SilentRob

Soo...ff a girl likes it it can't be fanservice designed to sexually attrack young males? If that's not your point then I don't see what this has to do with anything.

That's not what I said.
Radical Edward
Member
(12-24-2016, 04:54 PM)
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Originally Posted by Mieu

I don't understand the "hate" on Cindy's design.

Because you're not a white knight
HeelPower
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(12-24-2016, 04:58 PM)
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Originally Posted by Ferr986

Your hate on XV is clouding your memories about Jihl lol

Originally Posted by LordKasual


Jihl? What the fuck hahaha

Originally Posted by Crankshaft

Lolwut? Jihl and "developed" should not be used in the same sentence. She shows up a few times and dies like a chump.

Originally Posted by yunbuns

This seems like a reach. She literally only antagonizes Sazh and then dies from my memory. That's it. She was nothing special outside of having a nice design.

She uses a child to track his father down.

She lets Sazh watch as his son turns to crystal,then provides video evidence that Vanille was involved in his son's accident.She then encourages Sazh to have his revenge which then pushes him to the brink of Suicide.

This all clearly happens on screen in well voiced,well directed cutscenes.

Tell me ONE side character has done this many significant actions ON SCREEN in FFXV.

Ardyn himself barely does as many things in XV!!!!

Its you guys who refuse to give XIII any credit ,because you decided you hate the game six years ago.
Zakalwe
Member
(12-24-2016, 04:59 PM)
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Originally Posted by Radical Edward

Because you're not a white knight

Quit that.

Her design and the use of it is nowhere near the worst, but it is pointless. She could have been made sexy without being objectifying.
FlutterPuffs
Member
(12-24-2016, 05:00 PM)
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We should stop arguing about FFXIII.

The only redeemable thing from the game is the amazing music.
Monocle
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(12-24-2016, 05:01 PM)
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Originally Posted by Rabid Dwarf 76

Serious question. Why titillation such a bad thing?

It's bad when it plays into damaging stereotypes and trends, such as the sexist double standard in popular media's presentation of female characters. Have you considered why, if you take set of random female characters, and a set of male ones, it's mostly the women who are dressed in impractical erotic outfits? Why is it that women are constantly cheapened by being treated as sexy props, even when they're working professionals going about their daily lives?

This reflects a wider social trend of female objectification that attacks women's worth by reinforcing, over and over again, the idea that women's main value is their sex appeal. Apart from anything else they can offer, they've got to be hot.

Presentation matters. If there were a trend where black people were constantly treated like beasts of burden, and in 9/10 of the games you played it was the black guy who had to carry all the backpacks and do all the heavy lifting, and the camera took special opportunities to show humorous vignettes of the black character struggling with his load, would you be OK with that insulting stereotype, which blatantly supports an unequal view of black people?

Originally Posted by Radical Edward

Because you're not a white knight

There are better strawmen to express your indifference to gender issues. Try harder.
Last edited by Monocle; 12-24-2016 at 05:04 PM.
FlutterPuffs
Member
(12-24-2016, 05:05 PM)
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Originally Posted by rhandino

I don't think that the biggest problem of Cindy is the garbage outfit (Well, it is a problem because it looks really trashy) but more how the game treats her like a sex object every chance it gets... she is just a few notches below Quiet from MGSV



It could have worked if there was other more compelling and important female characters or some kind of subversion, like she was all sexy and perky during the game but you find how that completely changed during the events of the World of Ruin but nope! we can't have that.

Aranea design is really great tho and I like Ardyn but I think it was too busy and kind of looked iffy when he was next to more normal dressed people.

She treated people like disposable tools that could be discarded at any moment but the joke was on her when she gets killed by the Primarch because she outlived her usefulness to that point

Her boss fight in XIII-2 was really fun!

She... really isnt.

The only time she was treated 'sexually' is Prompto's crush on her, that's it.
Blackleg-sanji1
Goten Enthusiast
(12-24-2016, 05:09 PM)
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Originally Posted by HeelPower

She uses a child to track his father down.

She lets Sazh watch as his son turns to crystal,then provides video evidence that Vanille was involved in his son's accident.She then encourages Sazh to have his revenge which then pushes him to the brink of Suicide.

This all clearly happens on screen in well voiced,well directed cutscenes.

Tell me ONE side character has done this many significant actions ON SCREEN in FFXV.

Ardyn himself barely does as many things in XV!!!!

Its you guys who refuse to give XIII any credit ,because you decided you hate the game six years ago.

Your hate for Xv is too damn strong If you think for a sec Ardyn didn't do anything and let alone more than her and 13 is in my top five
Violet_0
(12-24-2016, 05:09 PM)
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so I look at the Cindy concept art in the op and I'm pretty sure her pants don't cover the part that they should, it doesn't make sense to me anatomically otherwise. I mean, the anatomy in that pic is pretty iffy in general
Ploid 3.0
Member
(12-24-2016, 05:12 PM)
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The only one I don't like is the mechanic. He didn't seem to design the main party members so that's in the clear too.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
(12-24-2016, 05:13 PM)
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Originally Posted by B-Dex

Nothing about Cindy is as overt as that Quiet gif.

This could be the start of a cheap porno. Especially since she's very blatantly doing nothing that resembles a mechanic working on a car.



Originally Posted by Radical Edward

Because you're not a white knight

Oh fuck this logic, I'd legitimately rather be a white knight than someone with so much of a lack of critical thinking that I can't see the problem with a character that could unironically be named tits mcgee with no one batting an eye because of how fucking sexist, contradictory, and offputting her character design is that. Cidney, like Quiet, is a character that you cringe at near constantly and calling people especially who have an issue with being pandered to with fap material for a 14 year old white knights is just absolutely stupid.
Lunafreya Nox Fleuret
Member
(12-24-2016, 05:13 PM)
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So the original date was 2014? HAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAH sorry, I had to laugh a bit. What a mess.
WrenchNinja
Member
(12-24-2016, 05:14 PM)
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Originally Posted by Rabid Dwarf 76

Serious question. Why titillation such a bad thing?

Because the game already lacks any good female characters
Asd202
Member
(12-24-2016, 05:17 PM)
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Originally Posted by Lunafreya Nox Fleuret

So the original date was 2014? HAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAH sorry, I had to laugh a bit. What a mess.

I wonder what was the original date form KH3 lol.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
(12-24-2016, 05:17 PM)
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Originally Posted by FlutterPuffs

We should stop arguing about FFXIII.

The only redeemable thing from the game is the amazing music.

Somehow that game had better facial animation than FFXV. That's legitimately astounding. :|

Originally Posted by Monocle

It's bad when it plays into damaging stereotypes and trends, such as the sexist double standard in popular media's presentation of female characters. Have you considered why, if you take set of random female characters, and a set of male ones, it's mostly the women who are dressed in impractical erotic outfits? Why is it that women are constantly cheapened by being treated as sexy props, even when they're working professionals going about their daily lives?

This reflects a wider social trend of female objectification that attacks women's worth by reinforcing, over and over again, the idea that women's main value is their sex appeal. Apart from anything else they can offer, they've got to be hot.

Presentation matters. If there were a trend where black people were constantly treated like beasts of burden, and in 9/10 of the games you played it was the black guy who had to carry all the backpacks and do all the heavy lifting, and the camera took special opportunities to show humorous vignettes of the black character struggling with his load, would you be OK with that insulting stereotype, which blatantly supports an unequal view of black people?


There are better strawmen to express your indifference to gender issues. Try harder.

Thank you.

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