George Oscar Bluth II
Banned
Yeah, I don't think they wanted you to laugh at that. I had a very responsive audience (laughed at all the jokes) and no one laughed at that moment.
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In 2017, Peter Parker isn't really an underdog anymore
- Thread starter Elegant Weapon
- Start date
George Oscar Bluth II
Banned
I legit watched someone defend that and say it wasn't a joke, and that Bonesaw has a husband who really did make it for him.
Where did I see this? Cousin was watching that dumb Screen Junkies fight shit.
BladeoftheImmortal
Member
Lol. What's this?
CrazyDiamond
Member
These threads are giving me deja Vu from when Batman Begins came out and then later when Dark Knight blew up. You had a whole lotta people who couldn't just come out and admit that they liked the Burton movies better, they had dress their opinions up with statements about how the new movies are a betrayal of the character and how the old movies were more​ accurate to the comics despite that not really being true.
The only true Batman is Snyder's Batman who fucking murders people like he destroys ab workouts.
I feel that Holland's Peter strikes a good balance between the two, though Andrew's Peter wasn't in the extreme other direction mind you.
Still can't believe this was an actual line in the movie.
People want Peter to go back to being the loser because that's what resonated with them when first discovering the comics.
A social outcast speaks to the types of people who were usually into the medium back then and even now to a degree. Saying "hey you're an outcast and could be just like Spider-Man' meant a whole fucking lot to people too.
Removing the tragedy of losing Uncle Ben is also a mistake, because losing someone that close to you helps relate. Peter is the everyday man we all wanted to be growing up. He was someone you could see yourself as.
Elegant Weapon
Member
I know Peter Liz started liking Peter after he went with Betty but this post hardly refutes that the character has carried guilt over the death of Ben, Gwen & her father, his worry over his Aunt or money issues. From reading this, you'd think the only think I wrote in the OP is that Peter doesn't get beat up enough.
But they didn't remove Uncle Ben. People just know that Parker lost his uncle and they didn't want to rehash it all again for the third time in 15 years.
Well seeing as most of your posts in here have been about either A) Him not being bullied enough B) About him being able to be a well-adjusted human, which you don't find realistic or C) About a whole buncha nothin
You may as well have only talked about how you perceive the bullying
MHWilliams
Member
For more milestones:
By #25, he spends half his time deflecting Liz and Betty. He graduates highschool by #28. #30, Gwen Stacy wants him purely because he doesn't play attention to her at all. By #34, his college crew hates him because he's been outright snubbing all of them. Five issues later, that comes tumbling down. By #39, he's drawn by John Romita and is damned smokin'.
You seemed to focus on his bullying. The core of these early issues is the inability to balance Peter Parker's life with the more responsible Spider-Man's life. Which is something Homecoming covers, again and again. He's Spider-Man because of Ben's death. He doesn't tell Aunt May about his double life, because of his worry. And Gwen simply doesn't exist.
But again, the point is the social outcast part is A) far overstated and B) frequently in early Spider-Man, a direct result of Peter's actions, not people hating him just to hate him. If anything, most of the group tends go out of their way to include Peter. If you had a friend like him, you'd probably hate him.
By #25, he spends half his time deflecting Liz and Betty. He graduates highschool by #28. #30, Gwen Stacy wants him purely because he doesn't play attention to her at all. By #34, his college crew hates him because he's been outright snubbing all of them. Five issues later, that comes tumbling down. By #39, he's drawn by John Romita and is damned smokin'.
You seemed to focus on his bullying. The core of these early issues is the inability to balance Peter Parker's life with the more responsible Spider-Man's life. Which is something Homecoming covers, again and again. He's Spider-Man because of Ben's death. He doesn't tell Aunt May about his double life, because of his worry. And Gwen simply doesn't exist.
But again, the point is the social outcast part is A) far overstated and B) frequently in early Spider-Man, a direct result of Peter's actions, not people hating him just to hate him. If anything, most of the group tends go out of their way to include Peter. If you had a friend like him, you'd probably hate him.
Imperial Bishop
Banned
What is Peter an outcast for? Being smart?
And they never removed the death of Uncle Ben. They just don't talk about it, because how often do you bring up the death of loved ones in conversation?
"Hey we're having a good Thai dinner. It's really delicious. It's a real shame your uncle was tragically shot."
Elegant Weapon
Member
Ah, you guys think this is a Raimi vs MCU thread, it's not. I just gave the director props for his depiction of early Peter Parker.
This thread is about Peter Parker, as a nerd in 2017, no longer reading as any kind of underdog considering social political factors.
This thread is about Peter Parker, as a nerd in 2017, no longer reading as any kind of underdog considering social political factors.
Beer Monkey
Member
They fucking played "The Underdog" by Spoon in the movie.
I rest my case.
I rest my case.
I don't think you ever truly answered why he should be an underdog in media depictions
I was being sarcastic, should've added a /s to the end of my post.
My bad. People have been bringing that point up seriously lately lol.
George Oscar Bluth II
Banned
So I guess everyone who discovered the comics started at issue #1 if being an outcast is what they relate to because that shit sure didn't last long.
Nah, people relate to Spidey because he's the every man, not because he's some loser dweeb with glasses. He's got school/jobs and relationships to worry about, and has to find a balance between his personal life and being Spidey. That's what people found compelling.
MHWilliams
Member
So, given the panels I offered, what should they have changed to make him more underdog?
Isn't this literally the catharsis of his emotional arc in Homecoming?
Won't he will he!
You wanna know the only place I've seen the sentiment of relating to Peter because he's a fucking loser outcast come from? Here. The perception is weird.
The same man who in a not long time span goes from having Liz want him, to Brant, to Gwen, to MJ, with a few in between, and Black Cat as Spider-Man
But he ain't supposed to be an actual adjusted human?
George Oscar Bluth II
Banned
Makes you think
And these two women were fawning over Peter like you wouldn't believe!
(It's from Spider-Man: Blue but I don't care. Dude's a babe magnet either way)
Elegant Weapon
Member
For more milestones:
By #25, he spends half his time deflecting Liz and Betty. He graduates highschool by #28. #30, Gwen Stacy wants him purely because he doesn't play attention to her at all. By #34, his college crew hates him because he's been outright snubbing all of them. Five issues later, that comes tumbling down. By #39, he's drawn by John Romita and is damned smokin'.
Romita drawing Spidey as a classically buff hero was a major disservice to the character. If Tom Holland was built like linebacker, this is one of the things I would have a major problem with.
don't pretend I didn't make these points in my OP because you don't like them or you don't like people critiquing the new movie. You can be a jerk off in another post
Peter Parker is also a grown ass man in 2017
MHWilliams
Member
Liz and Betty too.
Ditko seemed disinterested in the lanky, creepier Spider-Man around issue 17. I'll never know if that was his choice of Lee capitalizing on Spider-Man becoming more popular.
Well adjusted people don't display trauma 24/7. At all. I live in a single parent home, I got used to it pretty fucking quickly.
In CW, his guilt about the death of Uncle Ben was touched upon. When May was worried post deli explosion, same thing.
He'a 15. What the fuck does a 15 year old really have to do outside of school or school related things they're gonna spend their money on besides dates or some shit? He lives in an apartment in Queens with his single Aunt while dumpster diving for scraps to build shit. Just becausd he's poor doesn't mean he has to be fucking Tiny Tim. Poor people can dress nicely and eat food and use public transport.
Make valid critiques beyond bullshit and maybe this topic would be something beyond everyone saying you're bad and you should feel bad
......PETER MUST BE THAT CREEPY PHOTOGRAPHER GUY FROM '13 REASONS WHY'
BECAUSE THIS IS WHAT THE AUDIENCE WANTS TO PROJECT THEMSELVES ONTO
You may be on to something
Lol, that's the exact reason I mentioned it. It's ridiculous.
I was being sarcastic, and I guess I didn't do a good job at conveying that.
Glass Rebel
Member
The criticism for Holland's Peter rings as hollow as some for Maguire's. As good as the first two are, the worst thing Raimi's movies did for the character is sell this image of an awkward character who is ridden by guilt. If you want a Spider-Man who's centered around Uncle Ben's death, Raimi gave you three of that. It was one of its strengths but also a weakness. I never got the impression that Tobey-Man wanted to actually be a superhero; Ben's death wasn't only the impetus to don the costume, it was the driving force. Holland on the other hand actually wants to be Spider-Man.
George Oscar Bluth II
Banned
So Peter gotta be Bruce Wayne now
"MY UNCLE IS DEEEEAAAAD"
"MY UNCLE IS DEEEEAAAAD"
PETER MUST BE THAT CREEPY PHOTOGRAPHER GUY FROM '13 REASONS WHY'
BECAUSE THIS IS WHAT THE AUDIENCE WANTS TO PROJECT THEMSELVES ONTO
Oh fuck this guy
ALL MY FATHER FIGURES ARE DEAD
PUSH ME TO THE EDGE
There is no pleasing some people. A friend of my said that the lack of Uncle Ben almost ruined the movie. I have no idea why some people want to get beaten over the head again and again over Uncle Ben/ The Waynes are dead! Isn't this sad!!!
Tiny Tim, lolol, i need to go to bed
Professor Beef
Banned
The closest thing to a joke I heard from Spidey's mouth in 3 Raimi movies was in #2 during the bank scene.
Ock: "You're getting on my nerves."
Spidey: "I have a knack for that."
The video games had him joking more, apparently.
Spider-Man: "Shocker, you look good! Have you been re-upholstered?"
Elegant Weapon
Member
For more milestones:
By #25, he spends half his time deflecting Liz and Betty. He graduates highschool by #28. #30, Gwen Stacy wants him purely because he doesn't play attention to her at all. By #34, his college crew hates him because he's been outright snubbing all of them. Five issues later, that comes tumbling down. By #39, he's drawn by John Romita and is damned smokin'.
You seemed to focus on his bullying. The core of these early issues is the inability to balance Peter Parker's life with the more responsible Spider-Man's life. Which is something Homecoming covers, again and again. He's Spider-Man because of Ben's death. He doesn't tell Aunt May about his double life, because of his worry. And Gwen simply doesn't exist.
But again, the point is the social outcast part is A) far overstated and B) frequently in early Spider-Man, a direct result of Peter's actions, not people hating him just to hate him. If anything, most of the group tends go out of their way to include Peter. If you had a friend like him, you'd probably hate him.
When did I ever write or imply that people hated Peter just to hate him? I said he wasn't a social outcast. Guess what, constantly flaking on your friends is something that would make someone a social outcast. That's shown in the panels you posted & referenced, but not the film.
