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Could Final Fantasy remake 7 greatly suffer from episodic release?

13ruce

Banned
I bet Nintendo could remake Ocarina of Time, Majoras Mask and Twilght Princess with wii u tech demo graphics within the time Square is done with it these 3 episodes.

Heck even throw in Mario 64.

Sony could remake all ratchet and Clank games god of war etc in that time frame.


Microsoft can remake banjo etc in that timeframe.

It's just big mismanagement and incompetence really i am sre any other dev could remake a game from the ground up in atleast 1/4th the time the whole ff7 remake will take time wise. Wich is probably 8 to 10 years lol.

I might sound a bit salty but yeah i waited long enough for KH 3 already lol.
 
I bet Nintendo could remake Ocarina of Time, Majora's Mask and Twilght Princess with wii u tech demo graphics within the time Square is done with it these 3 episodes.
Argh...don't make me wish for things that won't happen anytime soon please. I really need this on my Nintendo Switch!
 

LowSignal

Member
I'm tired of things being announced far to soon in advance. I think it can suffer from being episodic IF there isnt a set date for each episode that is set in stone.
 

Celcius

°Temp. member
Since the first episode is PS4 exclusive for a limited period of time, I'm just hoping that Steam gets episode 1 before episode 2 comes out and then episodes 2 & on are released simultaneously on all systems.

I do wish they'd just wait and release it all at once even if it is multiple episodes instead of a single game, but I understand that they want to start making a profit as soon as they can instead of just having the game in development for about a decade like FFXV.
 

takriel

Member
I'm tired of things being announced far to soon in advance. I think it can suffer from being episodic IF there isnt a set date for each episode that is set in stone.
This is why Sony's E3 2015 did nothing for me. I knew this game would still be several years away from release. It was just a giant cocktease. Every studio could do this. Create a CG trailer for one of their flagship titles that barely even started development and show it off at E3 for quick hype.
 

Koozek

Member
When they get out of Midgar for the first time. Just make Rufus the final boss at the end of the bike/car/helicopter chase.
Breh, I can't tell if you're joking or not, lol. What would newcomers think of it if they bought part 1 of this legendary hyped remake they heard about everywhere and then the whole thing is just ~25 hours of a few reactors, a slum, sewers, and the Shinra building in the same city? oO And then wait 2 years for the next $60 game for a slice of the actually exciting journey? How many would even care about the other parts after that?

They have to have a piece of overworld exploration after leaving midgar showing off "wide-linear" sections. The whole game can't just be in a dark, drab city. This ain't no Batman game. I think this would make more sense:
I'm looking at these 3 lists with the main plot points of each CD, right now, trying to divide it in 3 parts with
Aeris'
death being the finale of the second part. Disc 3 in the original is ultimately just the last dungeon and remaining sidequests and stuff.

http://jegged.com/Games/Final-Fantasy-VII/Walkthrough/Disc-1/
http://jegged.com/Games/Final-Fantasy-VII/Walkthrough/Disc-2/
http://jegged.com/Games/Final-Fantasy-VII/Walkthrough/Disc-3/


Maybe let Part 1 end at being thrown into Corel Prison? Though, it might be too much for one game until then. So maybe until the boss battle on the ship ride from Junon? This way it would end on a big battle and you'd have enough locations to fill one game if you flesh out Midgar and the overworld parts to pad out the game a bit. They probably want a ~25h main story per game. So like this roughly:


Part 1:
Midgar
Including Sector 1, Sector 8, Tifa’s 7th Heaven and the No. 5 Reactor.

Sector 5 Slums
The meeting in the Church and Aeris’s House.

Wall Market
Gaining entry into Don Corneo’s Mansion and the Honey Bee Inn.

Sewer and Train Graveyard
Traversing through the Sewer, Train Graveyard and the battle at the Sector 7 Pillar.

Sector 6
Back to Aeris’s House, through the Wall Market and ascending the Plate Section up to the Shinra Building.

Shinra Building
Floors 59 through 70 and the motorcycle chase.

Kalm
Including the flashback scenes in Nibelheim, the Shinra Mansion and the Mount Nibel reactor.

Chocobo Farm
How to capture a Chocobo, cross the swamp and avoid the Midgar Zolom.

Mythril Mine
Crossing paths with the Turks.

Junon
The town under Junon, the parade and sneaking on to the Cargo Ship.

Cargo Ship
Traveling from Junon to Costa del Sol.

Costa del Sol
Arriving off the Cargo Ship on the way to Mount Corel.​


Part 2:
Mount Corel
The Corel Reactor, Mount Corel and passing through North Corel on the way to Gold Saucer.

Gold Saucer
The first trip to Gold Saucer.

Corel Prison
Getting thrown into the Corel Prison after the massacre at Battle Square.

Gongaga
Traveling to the ruined reactor and Gongaga Village.

Cosmo Canyon
The first visit to Cosmo Canyon including the Cave of the Gi.

Nibelheim
Returning to Cloud and Tifa’s home town as well as the Shinra Mansion and Mount Nibel.

Rocket Town
Meeting Cid and escaping in the Tiny Bronco.

Gold Saucer
Traveling through North Corel, retrieving the Keystone and the Date Scene.

Temple of the Ancients
Retrieving the Black Materia and meeting with Sephiroth.

Bone Village
Including how to dig up the Lunar Harp for the Sleeping Forest and traveling through the Corral Valley.

Forgotten Capital
The Forgotten Capital, Forgotten City and the end of Disc 1.​


Part 3:
Forgotten Capital
The Forgotten City and the Corral Valley Cave leading to the Icicle Inn.

Icicle Inn
Traveling from the Forgotten Capital and snowboarding into the Great Glacier.

The Great Glacier
Where to find all of items and Materia hidden throughout the Great Glacier and the path to the Base of Gaea’s Cliff.

Gaea’s Cliff
Climbing from the Great Glacier up to the Whirlwind Maze.

Whirlwind Maze
Traveling through the Whirlwind Maze to find Sephiroth in the Northern Crater.

Junon
Barret, Tifa, Cait Sith and Yuffie escaping capture and execution at the hands of Shinra.

Mideel
Finding and rescuing Cloud from the Mideel clinic.

Mount Corel
Returning to North Corel and the Mount Corel Reactor to retreive the first Huge Materia.

Fort Condor
Defending Fort Condor from the Shinra assault to collect the second Huge Materia.

Mideel
The battle against Ultimate Weapon and rescuing Cloud from the Lifestream.

Underwater Reactor
Traveling through Junon to reach the Underwater Reactor in search of the third piece of Huge Materia.

Underwater Submarine Battle
Destroying the fleeing Red Submarine to retrieve the Huge Materia.

Rocket Town / Cosmo Canyon
Returning to Rocket Town to recover the fourth and final piece of Huge Materia and then returning them all to Cosmo Canyon.

Forgotten City & Diamond Weapon
Taking the Key to the Ancients into the Forgotten City and the battle against Diamond Weapon near Midgar.

Midgar
Parachuting into Midgar to stop Hojo from using the Sister Ray cannon.

Northern Cave
The split paths in the the Nothern Crater Cave that lead to the final battle against
Sephiroth.

Sephiroth
The final battles against Jenova, Bizarro Sephiroth, Safer Sephiroth (the One-Winged Angel) and the end of the game.


Does this sound feasible? Part 3 would have backtracking in already finished areas, which could, in addition the dev teams gaining experience and know-how during the first two episodes, speed up development.
 

Lindsay

Dot Hacked
I really don't like the trilogy idea. 2 games at most. Much of Discs 2/3 were places from Disc 1 just with some different events going on. If they could get all of the Disc 1 stuff in one game, then the turnaround time between the second "half" being released drops substantially imo.

Maybe you're right, I suppose the scales would be entirely different. But that was also like 15 years ago and games can be a lot bigger as far as setting scale and detail goes, too, right?
I mean just thinking of XV and like what I've seen my roomie playing of BotW -- those are pretty huge locations. But I'll admit I'm not really savvy on what would or wouldn't fit on one game disc and I know the entire world of FF7 would probably be a LOT bigger if to scale.
But I still think it's within reason to look at .hack as an idea for how data could be transferable and having at least some places accessible again in later game parts. Maybe not everything, but certain on some things?
Yeah I think like ya said stuff will carry over and that you'll be able ta go back and revisit places from the first game (gotta fill in those later Enemy Skill materias!). Its just that they'll have loads to make between releases, far far more than they ever had to with .hack. Now those games were released 3-6 months apart, FF7 sadly will prolly be much longer but that does at least give 'em more time to work.
 

Jotakori

Member
Yeah I think like ya said stuff will carry over and that you'll be able ta go back and revisit places from the first game (gotta fill in those later Enemy Skill materias!). Its just that they'll have loads to make between releases, far far more than they ever had to with .hack. Now those games were released 3-6 months apart, FF7 sadly will prolly be much longer but that does at least give 'em more time to work.

Oh yeah, sorry for misunderstanding! I didn't mean time-wise when I compared to .hack, though. I'm totally with you, there's no way they'll be released just months apart. I'm fully imagining it'll be 1-2 years at least between each release. Which... ugh, hurts my soul to think about a bit LOL
 

BocoDragon

or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
Oh yeah, sorry for misunderstanding! I didn't mean time-wise when I compared to .hack, though. I'm totally with you, there's no way they'll be released just months apart. I'm fully imagining it'll be 1-2 years at least between each release. Which... ugh, hurts my soul to think about a bit LOL
Just because this is Square, I wouldn't be surprised in the least if there's an episode that takes 3+ years to release since the last one xD.

Episode 2 comes out two years after 1
Episode 3 comes out three years after 2
5 year lifespan for the trilogy? I find it very plausible lol
 

JudgeRAW00

Neo Member
I don't have much faith in the ability of Square to produce a front to back great JRPG these days. I think no matter how the FFVII remake is done it has an uphill battle. They don't want to just remake Final Fantasy VII, they want to change it, and 'expand' upon it. I think the expanded FFVII universe shows that they don't even understand their own characters. Whenever Cloud pops up, whether its Advent Children or Kingdom Hearts, he always acts like someone just died. They don't really get why people fell in love with FFVII and its cast of characters. So I dont have much faith in Square to get this right.
 
You're right that was a bad example. It just annoys me that we get to hear about games so early on now, FF7R, Shenmue 3, GTSports, GoW, etc. 4 years after the launch and 1 year after the first hardware upgrade we're soon getting GTSports, Shenmue 3 might not even arrive this generation for all we know, FF7R is split up into episodes and might not all end up on PS4, GoW arrives soon unless there is a delay. I get that the hype for upcoming games is what sells the console early on but I think it has gotten out of hand tbh. Within a year of the release is enough, unveil at E3 and release it at the latest at the start of next year. Why do I need to know about games before that?

Appeasing to Investors and a big console install base = games getting greenlit.. now why do we need to care about this? We don't. But that's the nature of the business.

I don't have much faith in the ability of Square to produce a front to back great JRPG these days. I think no matter how the FFVII remake is done it has an uphill battle. They don't want to just remake Final Fantasy VII, they want to change it, and 'expand' upon it. I think the expanded FFVII universe shows that they don't even understand their own characters. Whenever Cloud pops up, whether its Advent Children or Kingdom Hearts, he always acts like someone just died. They don't really get why people fell in love with FFVII and its cast of characters. So I dont have much faith in Square to get this right.

To be fair, people have a lot preconceived notions on these characters since the OG game didn't have va..so we all have in our minds cloud was a badass and confident..maybe he was mopey all the time? Just something to think about. A lot of projections of characters we have from back in the day that could very well be wrong.
 

JayEH

Junior Member
I don't have much faith in the ability of Square to produce a front to back great JRPG these days. I think no matter how the FFVII remake is done it has an uphill battle. They don't want to just remake Final Fantasy VII, they want to change it, and 'expand' upon it. I think the expanded FFVII universe shows that they don't even understand their own characters. Whenever Cloud pops up, whether its Advent Children or Kingdom Hearts, he always acts like someone just died. They don't really get why people fell in love with FFVII and its cast of characters. So I dont have much faith in Square to get this right.

I think they understand Cloud in other media is not the cloud from 7.

“The voice actors have almost finished voice recording of the main story. Fans may have the image of the Cloud from Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children, but since this is the ‘prime’ Cloud from before Advent Children, the performance may feel fresh.”
 
Episodic release wil be fine.

Original game was split into discs. Basically the same deal

Actually, if that's the case and each episode will be of "full game" size, might as well just wait until all episodes are completed, press each episode on a disc and release the game as a multi-disc game (or if you are buying it digitally, release it all as one big space-eating pack). People seem so against the multi-disc thing nowadays, but I gotta admit, if it works, it works. Might have to pay a little more, but hey, this is what people want, no? They'll shell out the bucks for it!
 

plufim

Member
Yes. Mainly because at this rate there's no way it'll all be on the same system. And i suspect when you change systems you see a significant drop off in sales.
 

AdropOFvenom

Neo Member
It needs to all be released in a span of 6-12 months for it to work.

If it takes 3-4 years it will absolutely suffer from the format, it'll simply lose all the momentum from one entry to the next, people who havent idolized the game for 20 years will begin to forget plot points, things that were never meant to be 'endings' of a game will be forced to play that role, which has some issues on its own.
 

AdropOFvenom

Neo Member
Lots of stuff is getting condensed.

Part 1 WILL only be Midgar though.

It makes sense. Has the perfect end point.

Wasn't Midgar about 6 hours? Unless they find a lot of additional filler/backstory to add, that seems like a bad start when you're pitching each chapter as "Full game length".
 
Lots of stuff is getting condensed.

Part 1 WILL only be Midgar though.

It makes sense. Has the perfect end point.

Expand on other sectors as well, plus I'm quite curious how recruiting yuffie and Vincent will play it out this time around.

People need to remember certain things will play it out different with new scenarios being added.
 

HeelPower

Member
Square should downgrade their visual goals and focus on good art and style over raw asset complexity and realism.

Persona 5 was made by a smaller team ,and ''technically'' is less impressive than FFXV,But it ended up being much more interesting to look at and has a far greater variety of locations and interesting character models.

Pretty sure FF7Remake can be made into 1 game if they don't aim for real time fucking CGI.

They're probably still polishing up the intro Sequence to make it look like AC in real time...Sigh.
 

Slater

Banned
There's always Tabata on deck saying "put me in coach"

Lol, for all the jokes about him I REALLLLY doubt he would ever touch it even if they offered, he always sounds sorta sad they kicked him off whatever he was working on to help with Versus/XV in the first place.

He probably wants to fix XV as much as he can and then launch into that new IP as far away from all the Nomura drama he never asked for as fast he can
 
I might be jaded, but I don't trust episodic content that much for big projects like this.

Bad Example: Sin. Loved that game. Sin Episodes 1: liked it, never got another one. Wasted my money.

Pretty good example: Half Life Episodes. This was sold to me as a cost and time efficient way to play the games without having to wait forever. Now- the series that I kinda grew up with and have a ton of good memories is stuck in limbo with a cliff hanger- a bad one at that- with no relief in sight.

Not that I don't know what happens in FF7, I'd just rather it not share that kind of fate. I already purchased a PS3 long ago on the idea that it was coming to that system. I'd kinda hate if it came out and was never finished.

Loosely related:I will be eternally grateful that Duke Nukem Forever came out. It has some lumps but closed a chapter of waiting in my world haha. I pre ordered that game- had the receipt until it faded, then bought it at launch. Worth it overall.
 
Consumers and fans will. Square Enix? Not so much.

vi5oWaJ.png
 

ffvorax

Member
FFVII -> 1997
FFVIII -> 1999
FFIX -> 2000
FFX -> 2001
FFXI -> 2002
---- something happens
FFXII -> 2006
FFXIII -> 2009
FFXIV -> 2010
---- something else happens
FFXV -> 2016
----- something even worse happen they need lot of time for an episodic game (ok we don't know actually how much content there will be, nor the release data)
FFVIIRemake:EP1 -> 2020?
 

JudgeRAW00

Neo Member

Appeasing to Investors and a big console install base = games getting greenlit.. now why do we need to care about this? We don't. But that's the nature of the business.



To be fair, people have a lot preconceived notions on these characters since the OG game didn't have va..so we all have in our minds cloud was a badass and confident..maybe he was mopey all the time? Just something to think about. A lot of projections of characters we have from back in the day that could very well be wrong.

I think its clear in the original game that Cloud isn't mopey and in constant mourning over... Something.
 

RPGam3r

Member
It's one continuous narrative though. They're not going to radically alter the story to the point you can skip one part and play another, so it's ultimately episodic either way.



It seems like this is going to be episodic in the same way the Trails games are and they've had great success with the bolded. Those games are made on an incredibly modest budget though and Falcom has their priorities straight in a way SE doesn't.

It can be done. Can SE do it? Who can say.

That's not episodic, unless we're now saying Gears, Halo, Mass Effect etc are now episodic releases. If those are than I have no concern for FF7R.
 

Sanjay

Member
FF7 remake is going to be episodic? How hard is it to remake a game. Surely can be done 3/4 years right. Its been 2 years now. Like it's a a remake, what are they wasting their time on.
 

Sillverrr

Member
I bloody hate episodic releases. DLC is bad enough these days: makes me think I'm never getting the full story day one, despite statements to the contrary. Don't think I've ever played an episodic game until the whole season was complete.

Whilst I can understand how Telltale, Life is Strange, etc., managed to produce episodes within a few months, I can't imagine how they'd split up FFVII, a game with presumably insane production values.

Edit: OK, so it'll become a full-fledged "trilogy" of games. Wait and see, I guess, but from my perspective that's a backwards step from having the whole cake and eating it, i.e. the original release.

FFVII will always be, to my mind, an epic single-player experience. I will probably wait for the whole thing, even if I'm in my 90s by then.
 
Japanese "episodic" means like a trilogy of directly connected full games with a save continuation feature between them like Trails in the Sky. People need to stop getting it confused with the western equivalent cash grab of hacking a single game into chunks to maximise profit.
 

ghostjoke

Banned
I think the data issues is the least of our worries with cloud saves and all being a thing now. Importing save data should be simple even across generations.

It should be simple, but I wouldn't want to be one of the first to try it out. The bigger issue is probably people trading in consoles if backwards compatibility isn't a thing and suddenly part 1 is unavailable unless they rebuy.

FFVII -> 1997
FFVIII -> 1999
FFIX -> 2000
FFX -> 2001
FFXI -> 2002
---- something happens
FFXII -> 2006
FFXIII -> 2009
FFXIV -> 2010
---- something else happens
FFXV -> 2016
----- something even worse happen they need lot of time for an episodic game (ok we don't know actually how much content there will be, nor the release data)
FFVIIRemake:EP1 -> 2020?

Graphics time and costs happened. With each new major entry requiring a new setting/story/gameplay mechanics, I imagine it hurt Square more than most. Thus the XIII trilogy and now the FFVII Remake episodes/trilogy. Logic would say that having the framework already laid for VII would help. Of course, Square has been hopping from industry trend to industry trend on a delay for the past while. They recently realised Yoko Taro and Platinum can be profitable. Going by previous trajectories, I half expected FFVII Remake - Part III to be a Yoko Taro/Platinum joint project.

This thing is so fascinating. It's like watching someone attempting to cross a ten mile long room of booby traps
 

fireflame

Member
On the other hand Nomura has showed he could save FF once, maybe he can turn the tables and find a way to build something that makes sense with the episodic release? Time will say if Nomura can be a new Kojima of some sort i guess.

A solution would be that each game you buy has some sort of hidden content and that when you play for example episode 3,, if you own episode 1 and 2 , you can somehow interconnect them to come back to places explored previously.

Or the last episode could be super massive in terms of space storage and take above 200 gb, including all the open world from previous episodes.
 
Expand on other sectors as well, plus I'm quite curious how recruiting yuffie and Vincent will play it out this time around.

People need to remember certain things will play it out different with new scenarios being added.

Yup, we even already have proof of it:

PvR5HIR.jpg


+ the Shinra grunt who recognizes Cloud
 

Bakercat

Member
It doesn't matter if this was episodic or not, the game is gonna be hated by the fan base that wanted it because it's not the true FF7 experience. Unless it's gonna be an exact copy of the original game with just better graphics it's gonna be hated by the community. I think it'll be a fine game when it comes out, but I never had nostalgia for the game since I didn't play it when it first came out, so I'll be looking at the game from a different angle than most.
 

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
Consumers and fans will. Square Enix? Not so much.

vi5oWaJ.png

This doesn't take into account time value of money. How long is the release cycle? Why are you not discounting future sales of future episodes by Square's cost of capital? Seems biased to me!
 
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