• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Best HDR implementation in games so far

lord pie

Member

For what it's worth, a game with really large internally rendered dynamic range (and ffxv has *huge*and highly realistic dynamic range) will often show this kind of thing. A primarily SDR game that had been converted often will not.

So for a moment assume an SDR TV caps out at 100nits of brightness (roughly right), whereas a high-end HDR tv can push 1000+ nits.

The game internally might be rendering parts of the image that will really be that bright - way over 1000nits; so with a good HDR TV, the game just sends that image 'raw' to the TV. If the TV can't handle 1000+ nits it'll have to either clip the bright parts, or 'tonemap' them.

When you tonemap an image, you compress the brightest parts to the limited available range. So as a hypothetical example, if the TV can only display 1000 nits, but it gets sent a signal up to 2000 nits then it'll need to compress it. The 2000nit (max) input becomes 1000 output (max), 1300 becomes 900, 800 stays 800. The top 1000nits of the input is compressed into the top 200 nits of the output.

By doing this you can still see some detail in the extreme highlights and you avoid clipping, but it will look washed out and low contrast in the extreme brights.

Point is, the TV chooses what it does.

However, with an SDR TV the game knows the hard limit is always ~100nits, so the *game* always performs a (much more aggressive) tonemap.

This is what you are seeing here: the SDR image is tonemapped by the game. The brights are all compressed to sdr's extremely limited range, so they lose contrast and saturation but they *aren't* clipped so are still visible (which the HDR captured image isn't - you can't see anything in the sky even though the HDR source has information there, it's all clipped to white and looks really bad).

That's how a proper HDR implementation with excellent source dynamic range being sent to the TV in an unfiltered way *should* look.
 
For what it's worth, a game with really large internally rendered dynamic range (and ffxv has *huge*and highly realistic dynamic range) will often show this kind of thing. A primarily SDR game that had been converted often will not.

So for a moment assume an SDR TV caps out at 100nits of brightness (roughly right), whereas a high-end HDR tv can push 1000+ nits.

The game internally might be rendering parts of the image that will really be that bright - way over 1000nits; so with a good HDR TV, the game just sends that image 'raw' to the TV. If the TV can't handle 1000+ nits it'll have to either clip the bright parts, or 'tonemap' them.

When you tonemap an image, you compress the brightest parts to the limited available range. So as a hypothetical example, if the TV can only display 1000 nits, but it gets sent a signal up to 2000 nits then it'll need to compress it. The 2000nit (max) input becomes 1000 output (max), 1300 becomes 900, 800 stays 800. The top 1000nits of the input is compressed into the top 200 nits of the output.

By doing this you can still see some detail in the extreme highlights and you avoid clipping, but it will look washed out and low contrast in the extreme brights.

Point is, the TV chooses what it does.

However, with an SDR TV the game knows the hard limit is always ~100nits, so the *game* always performs a (much more aggressive) tonemap.

This is what you are seeing here: the SDR image is tonemapped by the game. The brights are all compressed to sdr's extremely limited range, so they lose contrast and saturation but they *aren't* clipped so are still visible (which the HDR captured image isn't - you can't see anything in the sky even though the HDR source has information there, it's all clipped to white and looks really bad).

That's how a proper HDR implementation with excellent source dynamic range being sent to the TV in an unfiltered way *should* look.


Thanks for that post. It puts what I described in my follow up into technical terms. Does it work the same with dark areas?
This should also explain why I have to lower the brightness in FFXV but it's fine in some other games with minor HDR differences. Because my TV only does around 300 nits so a game like FFXV brings it to its limit similar to a SDR TV.


So in a way the screeshot function can work as a tool to get a more objective evaluation when we discuss quality of HDR use in games.


My guide would be:
- Switch game to SDR, take a screenshot (preferably something with high contrast, e.g. bright skies with shadow ground areas).
If the game doesn't have a HDR toggle option, disable HDR on your HDMI TV input and restart the game. In this case you should choose a spot right after a checkpoint for this SDR screenshot.

- switch to/restart in HDR mode. Take a screenshot of the same scene.

- While the game is still running in HD mode, select the screenshot in the PS4 OS and double-tap the PS button to quickly switch between screenshot and ingame.
Someone correct me if I'm wrong but the HDR TV mode should should display SDR content correctly, right?


Now the comparisons and conclusions:

- live HDR game vs. SDR screenshot: You have now a faster way to compare HDR and SDR of a game. The other advantage is that your TV display mode doesn't change so these differences don't come into play.

- switch between live HDR and live SDR game and look at the SDR screenshot to make sure both your TV modes are set up the same in terms of color temp etc.
Actually best would be to use a test image here to also make sure you don't have crushed blacks in either mode.

- live HDR game vs HDR screenshot: allows you appreciate some of the differences HDR makes, e.g the screenshot will have details missing in bright areas.

- HDR screenshot vs SDR screenshot: rule of thumb would be, the bigger the difference (note that also means the HDR screenshot will actually look messed up), the more work does the HDR mode do. If you check the live HDR game vs the SDR screenshot/live SDR mode, HDR should look better the bigger the difference in the screenshots is. Unless something else is going on.




Do you guys think this would allow us to better evaluate HDR quality / rank HDR games more objectively?
 
More "comparisons" (reminder again that the HDR can't and isn't supposed to look better here, it's about seeing how different they are and gauging the HDR implemention)
As described in the post above, I used the screenshots to compare to the actual game running in HDR.


Hustle Kings

SDR:
hustlekings_201701072iarct.png

http://abload.de/img/hustlekings_201701072iarct.png

HDR:
hustlekings_20170107208ody.png

http://abload.de/img/hustlekings_20170107208ody.png

As the screenshots reflect, HDR is not very noticeable in this game. Especially as it doesn't really have much bright lights. In the live HDR game, the light reflections on the balls are not overexposed and the black areas are not as crushed as the HDR screenshot would suggest. Basically on a HDR TV you get the pop of these effects for the whole image without sacrificing detail like you normally would.



The Witness

SDR:
thewitness_2017010722vtrph.png

http://abload.de/img/thewitness_2017010722vtrph.png

HDR:
thewitness_2017010722mkp38.png

http://abload.de/img/thewitness_2017010722mkp38.png

The game looking great in HDR is also reflected by the big differences in its screenshots. Like in FFXV, not just the the lows and ends are pronounced but the whole color palette changes. It's actually even more vibrant in the live HDR game compared to the HDR screenshot. I guess Blow wanted to have game more colorful than normal displays would allow for / while still not oversaturating the puzzles etc.


inFamous (First Light)

SDR, high contrast ingame:
infamousfirstlight_207tp35.png

http://abload.de/img/infamousfirstlight_207tp35.png

SDR. low contrast ingame:
infamousfirstlight_20baq1u.png

http://abload.de/img/infamousfirstlight_20baq1u.png

HDR, high contrast ingame:
infamousfirstlight_205xplw.png

http://abload.de/img/infamousfirstlight_205xplw.png

HDR, low contrast ingame:
infamousfirstlight_20jnohv.png

http://abload.de/img/infamousfirstlight_20jnohv.png

I've come around (a bit) on the use of HDR in inFamous, now that I better know how the settings work. First of all, SDR high contrast and HDR low contrast are pretty much the only valid combinations. In addition I had to increase the ingame brightness, while in all other games I did not had to change at all or lower it to not drown out the brightest details.
Even with the low contrast setting and adjusted brightness, HDR looks a bit too dark (this is supposed to be morning/daylight) although of course not as bad as in the screenshot above as the TV can display the black levels better. At night it looks pretty sweet with the neon powers especially.

I think this a case, where you can see major differences in the SDR and HDR screenshots, but the HDR implementation isn't always better because it's basically overdone.
This is painfully noticeable when looking into the direction of the sun:
SDR+high contrast
HDR+low contrast
It actually looks that bad on in the live HDR game as well, the ingame software-HDR effect is just too much when coupled with the HDR output. But ok, they just patched it in.


Uncharted 4

SDR:
uncharted4_athiefsendgyqe2.png

http://abload.de/img/uncharted4_athiefsendgyqe2.png

HDR:
uncharted4_athiefsendd2qta.png

http://abload.de/img/uncharted4_athiefsendd2qta.png

And again, the screenshots reflect well what people have described about the HDR in Uncharted 4. There's not a drastic difference between the modes and thus the screenshots. The usual increase in dynamic range, so you will see slight black crush and overexposed brights in the HDR screenshot. Still, this subtle use makes the lighting in the actual live HDR game look a bit more realistic, especially the skies with the cloudy parts. Just more pleasant to look at on the actual TV.


The Last Guardian

SDR:
thelastguardian_20170p5qhd.png

http://abload.de/img/thelastguardian_20170zcp6i.png

HDR:
thelastguardian_20170zcp6i.png

http://abload.de/img/thelastguardian_20170zcp6i.png


Similar to Uncharted, maybe a bit more obvious but also no color stuff etc. change like in FFXV/The Witness. Though this is also not the best area to test it, the differences might be larger in other areas.
 
HDR to me, is simply the old quote "beauty is in the eye of the beholder". It just looks like color saturation to my eyes. I totally don't understand the push for it. It's like they wanted to create another selling bullet point on the box.
 
HDR to me, is simply the old quote "beauty is in the eye of the beholder". It just looks like color saturation to my eyes. I totally don't understand the push for it. It's like they wanted to create another selling bullet point on the box.

I hope you are not basing this on my screenshots, they are not supposed to be a demonstration of HDR. You can only see it properly on a HDR TV and as usual the TV settings should be calibrated just for HDR.

In many patched games the color/saturation won't even change that much really as they just increase the dynamic range. The games that do change a lot for HDR, also in terms of colors etc., look over-saturated in screenshots but look great on the HDR TV.


I think the best way I can describe HDR is that to most people, high contrast images look more pretty. However, if you use effects like overexposure, increasing contrast on the limited colors and cutting off blacks to make the image pop more, you will lose details and gain nasty image artifacts. I think especially if you've been working on your own photos, you've learned to avoid overusing that look because of that.
But now thanks to HDR-capable displays, you can have both the amazing looking pop and the perfect image quality. On top of that, with good implementation the lighting looks more natural as the TVs can get much more bright and the good ones deliver some really bright skies etc (and again, without losing detail).
 

ghibli99

Member
Yep, FF15 by far. It looks so natural. The morning sunlight is really something.

Forza Horizon 3 looks like there's something wrong with my TV. Maybe it's been improved over time, but at launch it was disappointing. :(
 

farisr

Member
Best: FFXV, Forza Horizon 3, The Witness
Noticeable: Deus Ex MD (took a lot of tinkering)
Subtle differences: Uncharted 4. The biggest one I saw was the sand on the beach in the "at sea" chapter (the little area to the left here, https://youtu.be/DR7f8Z3t6_Q?t=127). Coincidentally, this also seems to be the location they were showing off HDR with to the press initially, so it may very well be that they specifically added in HDR detail to this particular environment. The last chapter also seemed to have some general improvements (indoors)
Worst: inFamous First Light

The thing with FFXV is, it seems washed out when you switch from HDR to SDR, but it's actually not. Whenever I want to show my friends HDR (and this is a key title for that), I show them a trailer for FFXV, and then boot up the game with HDR turned off. Looks exactly like the SDR trailer. (I do this exactly for this reason, people otherwise think the SDR in game is purposely bad or something is glitching when switching back from HDR). Then, I turn HDR on, and the difference is apparent. It's not saturation or anything, there's more details apparent, the brights are brighter, the darks are darker, and there are more colors showing up in between as well (so not a matter of increasing the contrast and lowering the brightness or something)

Protip for Final Fantasy XV. Go to Galdin Quay, wait for midnight in game, and make a save there on the pathway/dock that leads up to the restaurant. You get the moon up in the sky, the darkness of night, the lights of the restaurant, the water etc. Just a really good place and time to see the difference immediately.
 

III-V

Member
Odd to hear people saying The Witness. There was a whole thread on how the HDR implementation is broken, with Jonathan Blow chiming in and acknowledging they botched it.

It was my thread, and he stopped in, acknowledged that it was busted and they patched in a fix a few weeks later...

And it is basically the best HDR implementation to date - its incredible.

EDIT: and OP, if you are getting black crush in Infamous, it is bc that HDR implementation is also busted on some TV's - although I thought they planned a patch awhile back. On my set, X800D it looks incredible.

OP, basically the APL should not change between SDR and HDR. Like you know, you should get some really nice specular highlights. If you are seeing much change in APL in an 'average' scene in game (i.e. not staring into a bright light source, etc.) you may need to make some game specific adjustments.

Realize that the quality of the HDR implementation is directly linked to the skill of the developer in its implementation. There can be bugs, like bad metadata functions (like in The Witness - that was my guess at it) but that is something that is just a mistake. If the game has a boring HDR implementation, there is not much you can do about it - that is how it was mastered.

I've never seen actual HDR, but if I set my Samsung JU6500 to dynamic, then FFXV looks like how I imagine HDR would look, just with more jutter, overblown brights, and a small amount of noticble input lag.
hue hue hue shoulda been first reply
 

Frozone

Member
Upgrade for last year? Well, I'd prefer the best graphical hardware that is clearly noticeable would definitely be VR.
 

b0bbyJ03

Member
Didn't see anyone mention it on the first page (could have missed it) but the RE7 demo looks fucking fantastic in HDR. Played it on an OLED and the dark areas looks amazing. Also looking out windows with bright lights looks insane. Adds a lot of realism to the look of the game. It's a show piece for sure. Can't wait to play the full game
 
HDR to me, is simply the old quote "beauty is in the eye of the beholder". It just looks like color saturation to my eyes. I totally don't understand the push for it. It's like they wanted to create another selling bullet point on the box.

TV settings might amplify that negatively, similar to accidentally ending up with crushed blacks. I had to recalibrate my settings to a 4K Blu Ray of The Revenant and I achieved a much more natural IQ for everything.

With these TV's and this massive jump in clarify, color spectrum etc it's taking some acclimating to see that such deep blacks actually do still have gradiation and that the color vibrancy isn't just color slider turned up too high etc. A similar acquiescence happened watching the first 45 minutes of Revenant where I kept trying to figure out if I was giving myself a soap opera effect or if I was short changing myself on clarity and realism by trying to degrade my picture down to traditional "filmic" look that I was used to. Things that were telltale signs of doing the wrong thing on 1080p can be signs of doing the right thing when this greater resolution, dynamic brightness and extreme color range are all working together.

Just my experience. It's really incredible at times and I can't imagine seeing fire, light, foliage, shadow etc any other way again, going back to how it was. That would be sad.
 
Ratchet and Clank is the best implementation of HDR imho from the titles I have experienced. I doubt the pic does it justice but it looks sooo good in person.


beBQx2U.jpg
 

III-V

Member
HDR to me, is simply the old quote "beauty is in the eye of the beholder". It just looks like color saturation to my eyes. I totally don't understand the push for it. It's like they wanted to create another selling bullet point on the box.

This is just not the case. When HDR is viewed in person you will see thing - colors, brightnesses, shadow detail that are simply not possible to show with SDR mastering. It is literally nothing you have ever seen before on a TV - and done well, it is quite stunning.

HDR is not BS, its not a bullet point, its not a sales pitch.


EDIT: If you are viewing HDR screenshots in an SDR display, the color brightnesses and saturations that cannot be shown in SDR will simply LOOK like oversaturated vivid mode screens. Brightnesses will be mapped into areas where all color information is clipped to as far as your set can handle, whites will all be clipped and blown out.

Double EDIT: The post above mine is a prime example. In R&C, those little light will be bright green in HDR (and SDR) but viewing the HDR image on a SDR display (likely just taking the photo even) maps those bright greens into bright white - as in all that color is getting clipped and all we can see is white.
 

Kamina

Golden Boy
HDR to me, is simply the old quote "beauty is in the eye of the beholder". It just looks like color saturation to my eyes. I totally don't understand the push for it. It's like they wanted to create another selling bullet point on the box.
Dude, did you ever see HDR irl? These Screenshots don't work, you have to see it for yourself. While it is not a night and day difference. It is simly an incredibly awesome way of adding extra lighting realism. After seeing propperly set up HDR there is no turning back.
 

razzel

Member
Love HDR in movies, but I just don't see the wow factor in games. FH3 is the most obvious offender for me, as I am always messing with the settings for that game. So much so it's a chore to play it lol.

When I thought I finally had it figured out I bought Blizzard Mountain and the colors looked soooo muted. I was like screw it and gave up haha.
 

b0bbyJ03

Member

I thought I could use these two pictures to illustrate how HDR should work for those that haven't seen it and don't know what to expect. If u take a look at the top picture, which represents SDR, here you'll notice that the area where the light hits the ground you can see all the grass and details of the ground clearly. In the picture below it, which is supposed to represent HDR (even tho you're looking at it on an SDR screen) the ground looks a lot brighter, but if u look closely you'll see that all the detail in the ground is clipped (meaning the display can't show the detail because it doesn't have enough contrast at that brightness to display the subtleties). Well, on an HDR screen you'd get all the detail you'd get with the top picture, with the contrast of the bottom picture (the ground would light up much brightest than your SDR display), yet you'd still see all of the detail. The tv has a much higher range to work with. It's not just that it's brighter or more saturated, as I've seen some people claim.
 
This is just not the case. When HDR is viewed in person you will see thing - colors, brightnesses, shadow detail that are simply not possible to show with SDR mastering. It is literally nothing you have ever seen before on a TV - and done well, it is quite stunning.

HDR is not BS, its not a bullet point, its not a sales pitch.


EDIT: If you are viewing HDR screenshots in an SDR display, the color brightnesses and saturations that cannot be shown in SDR will simply LOOK like oversaturated vivid mode screens. Brightnesses will be mapped into areas where all color information is clipped to as far as your set can handle, whites will all be clipped and blown out.

I'd have to disagree here. And I bought a TV that most websites go nuts over. HDR is a selling point. The implementation just anything to write home about or spend extra money for. Its nice but not necessary.
 

III-V

Member
I'd have to disagree here. And I bought a TV that most websites go nuts over. HDR is a selling point. The implementation just anything to write home about or spend extra money for. Its nice but not necessary.

I don't mean to say they aren't using HDR to sell sets, obviously. If you are thinking HDR is not a big deal, then I am not sure what to tell you that I haven't already detailed in-depth.

It is a huge looming monster of an upgrade to almost every aspect of image quality. Its not going anywhere and it is the future. Right now, we are witness to its infancy. The functionality it provides isn't in any way a 'subjective' better its is 'objectively' better in every aspect.

As I said before, it does require that the content provider understands how to properly implement these new dynamic ranges, in color brightness, color saturation, white brightness and near black level detail.
 
I got a 4k hdr LG, but i didn't note any diference, i put hdr setting on in ps4 and tv, is there anything that ir really a diference on ff15 that anyone can note?
 

Frozone

Member
Dude, did you ever see HDR irl? These Screenshots don't work, you have to see it for yourself. While it is not a night and day difference. It is simly an incredibly awesome way of adding extra lighting realism. After seeing propperly set up HDR there is no turning back.

I suspect that the "extra" lighting realism you are mentioning is the fact that the common techniques for tone mapping in games isn't very complex (i.e. probably using the absolute basic algorithm like high contrast). Writing out the true values computed by the shader and bypassing this operator and forwarding the results to the framebuffer with values > 1 and having the HDR TV actually display those values is what's making the difference. I just don't see paying for another TV and hoping that my favorite games be patched just to get this "extra lighting realism".
 
Initially I was upset that I haven't jumped in on a new 4k HDR set but having to tweak setting for every individual game sounds like a massive pain in the arse.
 

EvB

Member
I suspect that the "extra" lighting realism you are mentioning is the fact that the common techniques for tone mapping in games isn't very complex (i.e. probably using the absolute basic algorithm like high contrast). Writing out the true values computed by the shader and bypassing this operator and forwarding the results to the framebuffer with values > 1 and having the HDR TV actually display those values is what's making the difference. I just don't see paying for another TV and hoping that my favorite games be patched just to get this "extra lighting realism".

Unfortunately the HDR metadata that is used is so basic it's going to wildy vary between game anyway.

Only being sending data that tells the TV:

  • The value of the brightest pixel in the entire game
  • the average brightness of all pixels on screen and then averaged across the entirety of the content.
  • information about the screen the content was mastered on

Now in a movie this is easy to calculate, but if half of your film is in bright light and the remaining part of the film is in daylight, then both types of image are going to be compromised by the other.
in a game it's even mroe difficult because of the lack of predictability in terms of what a player will see and do.

Because it is just these 2 numbers, each TV manufacturer can choose to do what they wish with this data, so the HDR effect may vary between each and every model of TV.
in HDMi 2.1 we will get more numbesr to play with, these numbers can change with each scene or level or even better with each frame.
 

Soodanim

Gold Member
HDR might be nice when it trickles down to the mid-range and I get to experience it. I'll see you all then.

I did take a look at a HDR Samsung that had some looped advertising footage running, but it's hard to tell in shops. The displays are all so saturated, so while it looked quite nice I wasn't blown away like I'm supposed to be and I think I need actual comparisons. I wouldn't be surprised if I actually saw HDR footage on an SDR set.
 
Ratchet looks amazing, definitely one of the best, but for my money TLG is one of the worst, it really didn't benefit from HDR at all, literally 1 or 2 bits at the end of the game and that was all we were gonna get.

I do however have pretty high hopes for Resident evil 7's HDR implementation, the demo showed a tiny taster of what it can bring, and Capcom have put some nice calibration tools in which gives me reason to believe they've put some good work in here.
 

lt519

Member
The Witness looks crazy good in HDR. Same with FFXV.

When I switch back and forth I sometimes wonder if something is wrong with my TV and PS4 in SDR mode, like it is that stark of a difference. It's almost not believable, like is there something wrong where the PS4 is trying to output SDR still and the TV is trying to display it in HDR (which I know isn't true since the TV acknowledges the different content and adjuss settings accordingly). Maybe my SDR settings are less than ideal.

But then some games like Infamous and R&C the difference is much much more subtle to me and I'm not sure that it is really an improvement.

I dunno, it is a technology that when I watch something like Grand Tour I'm totally floored by. But when I play games sometimes I'm floored and sometimes I'm not. I got a great deal on the KS8000 (after selling my old TV got the 60" for $550) but I'm not running around telling all my friends its something they gotta buy.

It's a frustrating to get the settings right, exactly why I don't play PC games, but hopefully some of the new games nail it.
 

DeVeAn

Member
I don't know. I played First Light with HDR and reflection were greatly improved. Colors became muted. Turn HDR off and colors pop more. I have a X800D. Uncharted seem to be muted as well. I thought colors would be better with more detail in dark areas but, the two games I mention look muted in color.

FF15 looks fantastic though. The brightness going max burns my eyes though lol.
 
Hitman got patched to support HDR :)

Judging by what I've played so far, it falls in the category of games with a subtle implementation (these games probably were only later optimized for HDR?). Slightly more noticeable than in Uncharted 4.

I thought the Italy level would be best suited to check the differences.
Hitman has an ingame toggle for HDR and a brightness setting. Well actually, they label it as intensity which is more correct I think. What this seems to do is setting how bright the brightest whites should be. Which would explain why I see barely a difference with the highest setting (apart from the test square disappearing), my TV's max brightness caps out too early. Seems like a good setting to have in any HDR game considering the various max brightness capabilities in current TVs in order to avoid drowning out whites (I think this is basically a similar setting and test image like in FFXV, just not very noticeable ingame).

Comparing screenshots taking with the PS4 also confirm a rather subtle difference
(as before, the HDR image is not representative for what it actually looks like - even though it's pretty close here anyway - it's just to gauge how big the difference is)

SDR:


HDR:


The clouds etc. can be made brighter in HDR without losing detail on an HDR TV. Colors changed quite a bit as well, I think they actually become a bit more muted in HDR which is a first for my settings.
Btw these games with subtle HDR differences and a HDR toggle option are good to calibrate the SDR and HDR modes settings on your TV, you want them to look very similar here to assure that your settings are correct for other games.


Indoors I thought the HDR effects were rather nice though:

SDR:


HDR:


(see the increased contrast from the brighter windows, mimicking more closely reality)

here's HDR with the intensity setting all to the max:

I assume this and the adjusted HDR setting are identical because the brightness from outside is not bright/white enough to be drowned out.


btw The sun looks a bit weird depending on the setting, like, it darkens similar to infamous and you can see the outline as if it was a moon.



Oh and I took another comparison from R&C:

SDR:


HDR:


I think this one, even though the HDR is subtle in this game, works well to illustrate a key difference regarding the brightness. The size of the sun looks bigger here in the HDR screenshot, but on the TV the size is the same as in the SDR screenshot. However, that sun is now much brighter on the TV.
 

Taggen86

Member
Resident evil 7 on pc and final fantasy on ps pro have the best hdr implementations I have seen yet, where HDR is much better than SDR. TLOU and U4 have minor improvements. Playing on a 2015 oled. Really looking forward to horizon and mass effect. I really hope they bring some hdr calibrations tool for us with oled tvs that are not as bright as newer leds. The tools in re7 were really good.
 
The Witness causes insane image retention on my OLED with HDR enabled...
Like even spending a minute on a puzzle leaves a big yellow box in the middle of the screen that takes a little while to disappear.
 
HDR is more of a problem for me because while it doesnt blow my socks off when on, it has indeed spoiled me, with it turned off , the games look like bland turd. now this shit is starting to bother me in sdr games, im forcing bt 2020 color range in watchdogs and i was playing rebel galaxy yesterday and i literally stopped and looked at the screen wondering why it looks so bland even with all the colors....
not good. forcing hdr completely destroys the image in games that dont supoort it so theres that.

i spent a good 20-30 hours with fxv on a non hdr tv and i was fine. got the hdr and the game looked mostly the same (it was very different but i couldnt tell unless i compared side by side)
, now if i turn ot off it looks worse than it would on a 1080p tv.
offcourse its all just perception in the end
 

III-V

Member
The Witness causes insane image retention on my OLED with HDR enabled...
Like even spending a minute on a puzzle leaves a big yellow box in the middle of the screen that takes a little while to disappear.

probably seared into your retinas after HDR lol love it
 
Rachet, The Last Guardian, and FFXV are my favorites so far I think. Rachet's HDR grabbed me right away I remember.
Looks like I need to get around to trying it on The Witness eventually once the onslaught of games slows down a bit.

Can't wait to see it in Horizon: Zero Dawn, given that game's visuals/art style and lighting I think it's going to be quite the demo material. Like those night scenes with the green-ish lighting, and all of those shots of sunlight coming through clouds or fog.
 
Just played a bit of Horizon and switched around the settings. Looks amazing with or without HDR.
But it's not the next flagship for HDR imo. Not as subtle as Uncharted but not another FFXV either. Maybe around TLG levels (so, pretty good/ok).
Might change my mind when I see more environments as will be easier to judge thanks to the manual switch option unlike TLG.
 

SEGAvangelist

Gold Member
Just played a bit Horizon and switched around the settings. Looks amazing with or without HDR. But it's not the next flagship for HDR imo. Not as subtle as Uncharted but not another FFXV either. Maybe around TLG levels.

I think it looks very good, but the HDR implementation is a bit aggressive gamma-wise.
 
Ok wow, so the worst HDR game currently is No Man's Sky.
But in the sense that something is literally broken, so hopeful they will fix that (like it happened with The Witness?).

The game looks horrid and broken in HDR.
Colors are oversaturated to the point that the icons give you eye-cancer. Also, everything looks off and there are big graphical glitches. On my first boot up I had basically some extreme case of color banding, even extending to the PS4 menu/my dynamic Horizon theme when you switch to it. Though that didn't show in a screenshot I took and when I launched the game again it didn't happen again

However, there are other graphical bugs that you can even see in screenshots (taken in HDR-mode, but can be seen on any display), e.g. check the text in that yellow box:
(which means it's not something related to a specific TV/settings)

the whole game looks so much worse now, somehow?! especially surfaces.
If I had to described it compared to how the game looked before: it's like a GPU on life-support. I can't play the game like this.


Please fix HDR :(
And add a HDR toggle option just in case. And a "brightness" adjustment just for HDR, e.g. cockpits are too dark now and I noticed e.g. the stars in the galaxy view lost most of there details from being too bright.
 
Top Bottom