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Are we in the middle of a 3rd JRPG renaissance?

Z

ZombiePlatypus

Member
I have to agree on the lack of new IPs in the genre. Competent new entries that are Btier in scope and budget would help a lot. Hopefully Tokyo RPG Factory can start doing better. (But come to think of it, that SE is even trying to out together a group like TRPGF is a massive leap from gen 7)

As for the "JRPGs never went anywhere" posts, yes they did. They went to handhelds, or died an ugly death on mobile like Breath of Fire. Now I've had a lot of fun with entries in DS/3DS/Vita, but point is they left consoles. And as great and awesome as those handheld entries are, they're just not the same as a console JRPG experience. Not necessarily worse, just not the same. So yea, I was talking explicitly about the console scene, but maybe the context and wording of my original post didn't stress that enough?
 
T

TokiDoki

Member
Persona 5 alone already can carry the Jrpg for an entire generation , so you're not wrong there . Couple it with Nier Automata and hopefully Ni no kuni 2 , so yes , there is your renaissance .
 
I

IcyRhythms

Member
There will never be a time like the PS1 generation. It used to be I wouldn't even buy a game unless it was JRPG. (or wrestling lol)
 
L

LizardKing

Member
whyreggielie said:
Since Xenoblade Chronicles and Last Story, it has certainly felt like the JRPG is on a rise. The bro gen of the 360 days with an endless supply of shooters on consoles is starting to slow down as gamers grow fatigued of annual releases, it almost feels like the PS2 days. Its not quite PS1 level yet, but it is a great time to be a JRPG fan.

Actually its probably one of the best times to be a gamer this last year or two with all the amazing titles that have released.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I feel like the JRPG drought was between US releases of FF XII and Xenoblade Chronicles. It's kinda been over for a while. It was really just most of the 360/PS3/Wii era. However I get that they aren't AAA anymore. The games are still great but the genre isn't the forefront of the industry anymore and I don't really see that changing.
 
A

ArkhamFantasy

Member
Sir_Crocodile said:
No. The quantity is far lower and the quality in general is far lower.
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The reason why the quantity is lower is because those games aren't good enough to succeed in the modern market. The reason why Nioh, Nier, Persona, Ni No Kuni, and Xenoblade are able to succeed is because the quality of the game overcomes any obstacle that this genre might face in todays market. For instance, Star Ocean was very viable back in the PS1 and PS2 era, its not anymore.
 
F

Freddo

Member
TheRazielim said:
There will be no Renaissance. The waifu and animu culture has ruined any chance of that happening.
Click to expand...
Unfortunately, I agree. The biggest surprise from playing FF12 again after all these years is how mature and epic the story feels and the characters act (with the exceptions of Vaan). There are no constant jokes about panties or whatever that is the norm in the average JRPG of today, there are a few butt shots of Fran but that's kind of it.

Fanservice and immature bullshit really ruined my enjoyment of JRPGs, and I can't count that many JRPGs from the past decade I really enjoyed, while there are so very many of them from the mid-90s to mid-00s.

That said, The Alliance Alive for the 3DS looks extremely promising, sure hope it's released here in Europe.
 
S

Sir_Crocodile

Member
ArkhamFantasy said:
The reason why the quantity is lower is because those games aren't good enough to succeed in the modern market. The reason why Nioh, Nier, Persona, Ni No Kuni, and Xenoblade are able to succeed is because the quality of the game overcomes any obstacle that this genre might face in todays market. For instance, Star Ocean was very viable back in the PS1 and PS2 era, its not anymore.
Click to expand...

Ni No Kuni is a mediocre game at best though. Star Ocean is much better then it, as are dozens of mid market 16/32bit era rpgs.
 
Z

zMiiChy-

Banned
I think Disgaea 5 is a quality game.
Nothing ambitious, but it's the best entry in the series by far.

A great deal of QOL features that honor a players time, with the least amount of annoyances and stupidity present in it's story.

It performs very well for a game with a likely small budget, especially considering how early it launched on the PS4.

I don't care to debate the topic, but I'll just echo that FF15 is terrible and the remake of 7 will probably be as well.
 
M

MoonFrog

Member
Renaissance speaks to booming and flourishing and exploring new avenues.

I don't think that is the kind of JRPG time we live in.

We do live in a time where some high profile JRPGs have hit PS4 in short order and will continue to do for a little bit. And they've also done okay for themselves, both critically and commercially. So it is a good time for stationary console JRPG, sure. But hardly a renaissance.
 
P

potatohead

Member
Embarrassing thread is embarrassing. There is no indication of anything new or novel in the JRPG scene or a flourishing of quality.

I'm sorry OP but no. Maybe people even still or even less so than before appreciate just what we got in terms of quality and quantity of JRPGs before. It's nigh impossible to match without constant releases of incredible AAA quality RPGs that meet and exceed people's expectations.
 
N

night814

Member
meppi said:
Having a quick look through just my portable selection of the past 2 generations, I'd make a rather strong case that they never went away actually.



Just ignore the Yoshi and Kirby game. lol
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Yup, sounds like this guy is a console only gamer. The JRPGs went to the hand held systems when console development got too bloated for them. It still happens now, look at how long it took for p5 and FFXV to actually release from the time they started working on them. A lot of the games mentioned in the OP aren't out yet, so let's wait and see.
 
synce

synce

Member
I wouldn't call half of those JRPGs. FF7 is an action game, same as KH3 and FF15. And a lot of stuff is just fanservice now with no substance. Ni no Kuni 2 looks amazing though
 
A

aadiboy

Member
SNES to PS2 was a pretty consistent period of good JRPG releases. If we're in the 3rd renaissance then when was the 2nd?
 
L

Lynx_7

Member
In therms of cultural impact I don't think any other JRPG will ever match FF VII in the west.
Except Pokemon.

Well, actually, that depends on whether or not one would consider Dark Souls a JRPG and that's a can of worms better left unopened.
 
S

Some Nobody

Junior Member
True Fire said:
Anime was more popular in the 90s. It's just that after the anime/manga crash of the mid-2000s we've finally reached stability.
Click to expand...

This statement needs receipts. Maybe anime was more popular in Japan in the 90's, but certainly not in the West.

Also ITT: A bunch of people reminding me why all this retro BS keeps getting made and making money.

All I can say is that I'm enjoying this gen for J-RPGs way more than I did last gen. FF is back, DQ looks decent, Fire Emblem is going strong, Tales is trying to make itself quality again. All that plus the Kiseki series making me happier than I've been in years.

We aren't getting the same raw numbers we got back in the day, but that's because J-RPGS are kinda expensive to make given the numbers they sell. "Renaissance" is a strong word, but we're doing pretty good.

zMiiChy- said:
Not even close.
Persona 5 won't even be remembered that fondly in a year.
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Man, I do not give a fuck about Persona but WTF happened. For three years all I saw were people blowing this game, now it's out and suddenly its trash? Despite rave reviews? Is this another Dragon Age: Inquisition situation? (In that, GAF is wrong again as usual?)
 
Samanosuke Akechi

Samanosuke Akechi

Member
ab2a2eb6316a597cdfc345b68655b2bc--magazines-ps.jpg
 
redfox088

redfox088

Banned
The JRPGs of today aren't breaking much new ground. They re mostly safe regurgitations of old mechanics and narratives. Only Soulsbourne and Ni No Kuni stand out for me.
 
S

shark sandwich

tenuously links anime, pedophile and incels
Why are some people acting like Xbox 360 ruined JRPGs for a generation? Microsoft funded a shitload of JRPGs (and other Japanese games from Sega, Capcom, etc) for 360.

Blame xenophobic Japanese gamers for not buying Xbox 360 (lol, they claimed OG Xbox was "too big" for Japanese homes, then they bought the giant-ass PS3 over the much smaller 360). And blame Square-Enix for their complete inability to execute in a reasonable amount of time.
 
Z

zMiiChy-

Banned
Some Nobody said:
This statement needs receipts. Maybe anime was more popular in Japan in the 90's, but certainly not in the West.

Also ITT: A bunch of people reminding me why all this retro BS keeps getting made and making money.

All I can say is that I'm enjoying this gen for J-RPGs way more than I did last gen. FF is back, DQ looks decent, Fire Emblem is going strong, Tales is trying to make itself quality again. All that plus the Kiseki series making me happier than I've been in years.

We aren't getting the same raw numbers we got back in the day, but that's because J-RPGS are kinda expensive to make given the numbers they sell. "Renaissance" is a strong word, but we're doing pretty good.



Man, I do not give a fuck about Persona but WTF happened. For three years all I saw were people blowing this game, now it's out and suddenly its trash? Despite rave reviews? Is this another Dragon Age: Inquisition situation? (In that, GAF is wrong again as usual?)
Click to expand...
I think it's just an inevitable side-effect of the Persona series blowing up in popularity enough to reach mainstream awareness.

The older games in the series are beloved by it's fans, much more people were unaware of the series existence or reluctant to try it until Persona 5.

I personally don't think Persona 5 is unpleasant enough to be considered terrible, but it's far too underwhelming and flawed to be looked at in the same light as the original Final Fantasy 7.
 
Samanosuke Akechi

Samanosuke Akechi

Member
Some Nobody said:
But VIII is terrible, though.

Edit: I almost certainly own(ed) that issue of PSM. Man I miss magazines.
Click to expand...


I love VIII. It's my favorite FF ever actually. X is my second favorite. I just love the graphics, the cg cut scenes, the GF's, the overdrives. I have that very issue and demo disc. The pic is just from google images.

Me too. I recently started collecting a lot of them again a few years ago and amassed a big number of old egm, psm and opm issues from the late 90's and early 2000's.
 
ULTROS!

ULTROS!

People seem to like me because I am polite and I am rarely late. I like to eat ice cream and I really enjoy a nice pair of slacks.
I'd probably say we're in the Bronze Age of console JRPGs.

SNES - Renaissance
PS1 - Gold Age
PS2 - Silver Age
PS360 - The Downfall
PS4 - Bronze Age
 
R

RPGam3r

Member
Some Nobody said:
But VIII is terrible, though.

Edit: I almost certainly own(ed) that issue of PSM. Man I miss magazines.
Click to expand...

I owned that issue. Miss mags too.

With that said FFVIII is my favorite of the series, I grow tired of hearing how terrible any entry in the series is actually. I can't name a terrible mainline FF title.
 
H

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
ULTROS! said:
I'd probably say we're in the Bronze Age of console JRPGs.

SNES - Renaissance
PS1 - Gold Age
PS2 - Silver Age
PS360 - The Downfall
PS4 - Bronze Age
Click to expand...

You can't start off with a "renaissance" though, it means "rebirth".

Re (again) - Nascence (to start to develop/exist)
 
N

NintendosBooger

Member
RPGam3r said:
That doesn't make sense as there was a natural transition of JRPG from SNES to PSX. They didn't go away. They were great on SNES and then they were great in a much larger variety/quantity on the PSX.
Click to expand...

Sorry, but no one gave much of a shit about jrpgs in the west until FF7 changed the game, and that was in the PS1 era.
 
F

Freaking Limit

Member
NintendosBooger said:
Sorry, but no one gave much of a shit about jrpgs in the west until FF7 changed the game, and that was in the PS1 era.
Click to expand...

I'd be more inclined to say that FF7 marked the golden age of JRPGs. I'm not sure if we could say JRPGs ever had a true Renaissance vs just finding their footing. They kicked off with the SNES era, hit their stride from PS1-PS2, then crashed during the HD era. They are only recently making a real comeback in the eyes of players over the last few years. If JRPG makers get more adventurous in the next few years, then we may see a true Renaissance.
 
R

RPGam3r

Member
NintendosBooger said:
Sorry, but no one gave much of a shit about jrpgs in the west until FF7 changed the game, and that was in the PS1 era.
Click to expand...

That still doesn't explain your "fix" as it wasn't a "rebirth" of anything. SNES to PSX was virtually seamless, it didn't die off and then come back.

And I'm sorry but you're wrong, people gave a shit about JRPG prior to FFVII. No need being overly dramatic to get a point across.
 
H

Head.spawn

Junior Member
There hasn't been a Golden Age of anything lately.

Also, 3rd? I think you missed a few OP, probably enough that if you played them your opinion would be incredibly swayed into dropping that list.
 
Samanosuke Akechi

Samanosuke Akechi

Member
RPGam3r said:
That still doesn't explain your "fix" as it wasn't a "rebirth" of anything. SNES to PSX was virtually seamless, it didn't die off and then come back.

And I'm sorry but you're wrong, people gave a shit about JRPG prior to FFVII. No need being overly dramatic to get a point across.
Click to expand...


Exactly. Chrono trigger and super Mario rpg to name a few. Way before ffvii.
 
N

NintendosBooger

Member
RPGam3r said:
That still doesn't explain your "fix" as it wasn't a "rebirth" of anything. SNES to PSX was virtually seamless, it didn't die off and then come back.
Click to expand...

If I were to take that opinion as fact, which I don't, then one could only conclude there was no renaissance period since no genre ever "died" and every one of them underwent a seamless transition. Unless you can furnish a list of real-time 3D/cinematic jrpgs in the generation that preceded the PS1 along with any game from that era that revitalized Western interest in the genre on the same scale as FF7, I'll insist that a rebirth occurred in this time period.
 
H

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
If PS360 was really a downfall then we would be in the "first" Renaissance.
 
R

RPGam3r

Member
NintendosBooger said:
If I were to take that opinion as fact, which I don't, then one could only conclude there was no renaissance period since no genre ever "died" and every one of them underwent a seamless transition. Unless you can furnish a list of real-time 3D/cinematic jrpgs in the generation that preceded the PS1, I'll insist that a rebirth occurred in this time period.
Click to expand...

What opinion? The transition between SNES and PSX in terms of the JRPG genre? What death do you think existed there exactly, based on your comments I'm not sure I'm following you at all at this point. You want to say something is a rebirth simply bc it wasn't even possible (or barely possible) on previous generations? I'm talking about a genre not whether or not it was represented in 2D or 3D.
 
C

CuckFupertino

Banned
ZombiePlatypus said:
SNES and PS1 undoubtedly had some amazing stuff. (Hell, so did PS2), but things dried up after that on the console scene. Now, we're getting/have gotten:

Ni no Kuni 2
Persona 5
FFXV
Xenoblade 2
DQXI
Tales of Berseria
KHIII
Disgaea 5
World of FF
SMT Switch
Fire Emblem Switch
MAINLINE CONSOLE POKEMON
GODDAMN FFVII REMAKE
And other stuff

How do you think where we're at compares? Matching the highs of the previous golden eras or merely just an improvement over the dip from the previous gen?
Click to expand...

I've bolded all the games yet to release. Many of them don't have release dates and in Dragon Quest's case it's not been announced for the west.

OP you could be right but I'll believe it when I see it. Definitely possible one or more of these get cancelled or pushed to next gen.
 
M

MineralCraver420

Banned
No. We are, however, in the middle of a Japanese game renaissance, and some of those games are JRPGs. The Japanese renaissance is multi-factor, with established franchises getting series-best acclaim, quality breakout hits, the comeback of Nintendo, and the re-stabilization of the mid-tier.

The fact is, for a true JRPG renaissance to happen, Final Fantasy needs to hit its single-digit heights of quality again (I liked XV, but the last truly great FF was XII), a serious burst of new IP needs to happen, the low-budget scene needs to start releasing better and more experimental games, and
a Yoko Taro Final Fantasy even if it's a spinoff.
 
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