Exactly so. Open world format is fine as long as it's a vessel for a linear story.
Open worlds where the designers are just "we'll leave it to the players to make believe it's a good game", that's what I really dislike.
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IGN interview with FF15 director
- Thread starter Lifejumper
- Start date
Exactly so. Open world format is fine as long as it's a vessel for a linear story.
Open worlds where the designers are just "we'll leave it to the players to make believe it's a good game", that's what I really dislike.
It's not just about him being Co-Director. It's a situation where the creator of the game was overtaken eight years later by a guy who joined two years ago, and who became Co-Director just a year prior.
It's not new for SE, but it's certainly unexpected and surprising. It's not something you anticipate, and it being followed up with Nomura's removal a year later doesn't look good.
You also said Nomura was a creative director during that time, which is false. He was still the main director.
MultiJhonny
Banned
That's why I love the car. Since it is on the rails it seems like it is your advancement to stay on track for the game and the story, where you can pull over to go do something in an area and stuff. The car will help keep players on track
I think the way they talk about it might give that impression but I'm fairly positive the game will be close to something like Dragon Age with large zones.
Because they were really long in XII? No other FF game has gaps between story development as large as XII has. The entire trip from Dalmasca to Archades is about five to six straight hours of walking around and fighting monsters, with a single cutscene in the middle to break it up
TheGreatLugia
Banned
It was clearly planned in 2012 for Tabata to eventually take over. That's why they had him personally reveal FFXV at E3.
That's the way I see it as well.
I'm not undermining his role. He was obviously a big deal, and probably had more power than Tabata at that point when he just joined. Nomura was the Director but he was also responsible for the creative direction of his game, something that a creative director would have control over.
Just because both Tabata and him were directors, it doesn't mean that they were working on the exact same thing. Tabata was clearly working on the gameplay elements since it's completely revamped now.
Your pessimism is palpable.
I'm still hoping that the demo isn't complete shit.
Even if it's good, I walked away from the FFXIII demo thinking it would be a spectacular game, and it wasn't. It was an OK game, a sup-par "Final Fantasy".
Let's see if a happy accident comes along and makes FFXV everything we really want it to be.
MultiJhonny
Banned
Nevermind
RickyRozay
Member
as long theirs no reference to FFXIII In any positive way I'll keep believing.
threelights
Member
If it took that long to you then that's because you got sidetracked. I don't see that as being any longer than something like the waterways -> palace -> waterways at the beginning of the game. It just has less cutscenes and more freedom because you're not going through a completely linear path.
Dark_castle
Junior Member
People being snide about Tabata wanting people to say FF15 is their favorite, I mean duh. Which creator would say "Yeah it's alright" describing their product?
I said that about 13. My mistake for going on a media blackout. This game looks really good, and it seems to be much closet to the series roots. Having a real world map and air ships alone make me cautiously optimistic
MultiJhonny
Banned
Yeah I know. Its ridiculous, I like that he has this confidence about him. He isn't cocky just super confident in him and the team and I really like that about him.
badcrumble
Member
Eh, I could see it happening in KH3. A lot of the framework is there in preexisting games, and it might be preferable to having multiple different campaigns. Wouldn't be that different from the way that KH2's drive forms or BBS's d-links are functionally like playing a totally different person on a temporary basis. But the idea of that working is kinda predicated on everyone engaging in fundamentally similar melee combat (everyone in KH wields the same weapon basically).
The original FF Versus XIII idea of every character having a fundamentally different gameplay paradigm, all in one game, was never going to work well. Especially shooting at enemy weak points and shit (plus Noctis having *different* gun gameplay somehow).
Right but he was not the Creative Director at that time, which is the way you made it sound. He was in charge of the entire game. Nomura is Creative Director in games like Theatrhythm, Crisis Core, etc.
brandonh83
Banned
He doesn't have to say anything. A simple "I hope people enjoy it" or something instead of adding even more hype to something that already has enough hype to dent a blast door. I don't think he's committed a sin or anything and it's nice to see optimism, but at the same time it's... dangerous.
No, I see what you're saying. The map they showed there was definitely what I expected even. The visual quality they're aiming for wouldn't work too well if they weren't doing zones.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
If they made a modern FF that doesn't come with the relative flaws of FFX (sort of linear, sometimes dopey characters/story), FFXII (open and wonderful but totally unfinished) or FFXIII (all the things)... Then I could see it being a favorite FF game.
I don't need a perfect game... But just an FF in the modern era (post-FFX) that is open and more or less feature complete will be a revelation.
I don't need a perfect game... But just an FF in the modern era (post-FFX) that is open and more or less feature complete will be a revelation.
MultiJhonny
Banned
I didn't realize I was linking dualshockers so I just went away with the image link.
But yeah especially if it is supposed to be 10x bigger at least and on a 1:1 scale. I am curious, if airships are in, how would they work.
Tabata basically already said they would have to make a separate map that would function as an overworld type thing. But it sounded like they didn't plan for it so it may not be in. I wouldn't mind if they just did something similar to XII and had it be a fast travel thing.
Lifejumper
Member
They should not include the airship if it was never in their original design plans.
Hibiki Kurosawa
Member
Yep, the perfect counterpoints. These two did story telling mixed with "open" world exactly right.
QuiteWhittle
Member
Versus XIII in 2006 had a huge, classic world map.
Versus XIII in 2007 and 2008 was slated to have seamless environments.
Versus XIII in 2010 was slated to be near seamless and open-field with minimal loading.
It looks like, to me at least, FFXV is just following along that same line of progression. Maybe the popularity of open-world titles this decade emboldened them but I think Versus/XV would've traveled down that path regardless.
IIRC, Tabata lifted those classic FF feel comments wholesale from ancient Nomura interviews too.
MultiJhonny
Banned
Yeah that could work, he did say that he would address airships after the demo is out so I think they are in, one way or another, because if they were cut I think he would just say it.
I think it will be a huge step for FF, honestly (as long as its good) it could be the next VII in terms of importance, since this will be a good amount of firsts for FF, and with the battle system it will bring in a lot more fans especially from the west, since I see a lot of people on various places over the web and in real life, wanting to try FF but they never wanted to because they find turn base boring. So I could see it ushering in a great amount of new fans. But it will inevitably end up alienating some FF fans no matter what happens.
Well... technically Nomura always talked about it but we'll never know if it was working in any of those PS3 builds. Once they switched to a FF12-style map back in 2010 that idea was likely out the window.
badcrumble
Member
I think they could get away with an airship with some clever LoD/scaling work, given that the world already streams pretty well. We'll see. I don't really expect to see a full planet globe-style world map in the vein of the classic FFs ever again.
In the first iterations the world map was huge yes, but it was also top-down like PS1-era FFs.
Something less tacky than shiny blue dots to denote these would be nice though... maybe road signs. Would fit nicely into the road trip mentality.
That's actually what I've always thought. MGS is doug the same and I think it's the best progression for the genre.
Even still though, they'll have to use that space well of ots a waste.
threelights
Member
Type-0...
Right, they need to prove that they're putting actual things to do in these big zones otherwise what's the point? Tales of Zesitiria also went the "open world" route but its zones are pretty dull despite being so huge.
SE's done big zone stuff in their MMOs but I'm interested to see how they plan on applying that to a single player game where fans expect quests and things of that nature to be more than just go here and gather X item, etc.
Exactly. I said this in another thread, but there are bound to be "collectathon" quests because that's just the nature of the beast. And there's an audience for that stuff. Not sure what about the past few years has people thinking that type of design is restricted to MMOs; completion it's will eat that up.
That being said, they'll need some actual small narrative quests of substance to make each zone with running around. At least to the point people actually see a good portion of the area. Dragon Age did well with that.
Re: airship: people also keep bringing up the airship without remembering that despite being transportation all over the world map, it didn't bring you everywhere. Everything from mountain ranges restricting movement (FFIII) to not being able to land on forests/sand (and having an entire continent covered with forests e.g.) still helped define what you could or couldn't do with an airship. In many ways the world maps of final fantasy were very restricted and opened up in an almost metroidvania way (lol) depending on which world map vehicles you had access to.
However if Tabata is saying "we're still considering it" it's either likely that that kind on utility-esque metroidvania gating isn't written into the story, or they have a Plan B should airship navigation not pan out due to technical limitations.
Probably I shouldn't say any more on the subject though. Internet and mis-quoting and jumping to conclusions and all that.
However if Tabata is saying "we're still considering it" it's either likely that that kind on utility-esque metroidvania gating isn't written into the story, or they have a Plan B should airship navigation not pan out due to technical limitations.
Probably I shouldn't say any more on the subject though. Internet and mis-quoting and jumping to conclusions and all that.
NoctisVsStar
Member
fair enough..i mean N4G might say "insider Falk says this! bla bla"
threelights
Member
Dungeons, hunts and minigames are the make or break imo.
The story will be good because the Nomura/Nojima duo is awesome, and the gameplay I already came to terms that will be bad because Tabata doesn't know what to do there.
You mean, LR's composer?
FFXV Composer confirms airships are deleted
Go_Ly_Dow
Member
wow. straight from the art directors mouth of FFVII-G Bike. taking this to my gaming blog.
"FFXV downgraded: Airships cut due to technical limitations of XboxOne"
Go_Ly_Dow
Member
I hate my life
it gets me clicks and $$$
threelights
Member
I hate my life
Lightning Returns composer says that working at Square is "hateful".
To be fair, Nomura was also infatuated with the "seamless" buzzword the exact same way Tabata is. It's just how the game was conceived and how it should be in their eyes.
And I'm pretty sure Nomura said he had an airship working after they reworked the world map. I dunno how to take any word as absolute for the game at this point though, lol.
And I'm pretty sure Nomura said he had an airship working after they reworked the world map. I dunno how to take any word as absolute for the game at this point though, lol.
Let's not joke about that.
Muscle Wizard
Banned
It's getting a ton of coverage because the developers are now willing to share what they're working on.