Dear FASA -- Every Designer / Producer / Person Involved (Shadowruin)

[flarkminator]

You should be absolutely and utterly ashamed of yourselves. I swore I was just going to ignore this aborted fetus of a game while I was at E3 yesterday, but damnit if Microsoft didn't have at least 6 booths in the 360 section and more booths of it in the Games for Windows section. They were everywhere, and my eyes were eventually drawn to it -- oh how I wish I hadn't looked. Now I had come to the terms with the fact that most likely this game would be an fps -- but I assumed it would be like Dues Ex, or god forbid like Hexic.

But what in the name of all that is holy and sacred do I discover?

A counterstrike clone? What the hell is WRONG with you people. No I'm serious here -- every person I have talked to and I do mean EVERY person has been either confused or disgusted by this news. That means that I know there are people on your team disgusted by this! Get off your asses and do something about it. Did you not GET the Memo?!



Here let me send it to you again, just in case you missed it.



I don't know who the brainchild behind this is, but whoever he is needs to be sat down and explained what it means to "build a diverse game portfolio." Ya see, Microsoft obviously understand this notion, or should I say, Rare apparently understands this concept. It’s amazing, and by amazing I obviously mean, it’s Shakespearianly tragic to watch a company with a license with SO much back-story, and depth wasted on…

Counterstrike

Counterstrike? I have to keep pinching myself when I say this.

Look at companies like Mythic, and Relic, at least they have the Balls to take a complex and complicated mythos and fan-base like Warhammer and attempt to do them JUSTICE. Now granted I'm not saying that Shadowrun can hold a candle to Warhammer cuz really it just can't =). However, you could at least try and treat Shadowrun with some respect. You have the opportunity to bring an experience to the 360 that is unique, and you are BLOWING IT. When I look up uninspired in the dictionary I hope that it now contains screenshots of your tragic game.



I hope that not a single person buys your game, as I will surely tell every person I know to avoid it like the black plague. I’m done with you.

Dear Microsoft,
I hope you too realize as I have that this is a wasted opportunity. I would rather Peter Molyneux have the liscene at this point for it would be better for Peter to shoot for the stars and fall short then for FASA to lay around in the Mud like the unholy pig of a developer they are. I realize that Shadowrun fans are not the target market, I mean how COULD they be. Just look at the game, and fan reactions all over the internet. But if you're aiming for the fps crowd you're still goign to miss your mark. I'll be too busy playing Gears of War to give two shits about this game, so do yourselves, and your immense pocket books a favor and stop this game before it gets any further.

[Ramirez]

[iapetus]

I would rather Peter Molyneux have the liscene at this point

Cold.

[SatelliteOfLove]

Well played, man. 5 stars.

[Mrbob]

Yeah I watched the behind the scenes footage on the marketplace and found out this is a multiplayer only title?

WHAT.

THE.

FUCK.

[Nostrildamus]

For a next-gen Shadowrun game, this is the worst case scenario fully realized.

Who the hell green-lighted this crap?

[puebla]

cancel the game MS, or give it to Bethesda.

[flarkminator]

For a next-gen Shadowrun game, this is the worst case scenario fully realized. Who the hell green-lighted this crap?

I can almost imagine the company meetings for this game. It has got to be the most depressing collection of people

[Mama Smurf]

It's Shadowruin.

[sky]

Get off your asses and do something about it.

Unfortunately, only a small handful of people make the big decisions...

[flarkminator]

Cold.

I'm completely honest though. Peter Molyneux is one thing, and he is consistant as far as this is concerned, he always shoots for the stars. He may not always make it, but at least the guy TRIES. I would much rather see that. This game just STINKS of lazy developers

[bishoptl]

Look at companies like Mythic, and Relic, at least they have the Balls to take a complex and complicated mythos and fan-base like Warhammer and attempt to do them JUSTICE. Now granted I'm not saying that Shadowrun can hold a candle to Warhammer cuz really it just can't =).

YEAH WHAT HE SAID

Seriously though, there are a lot of glum people around the office - everyone was looking forward to delving into a Deus-Ex-style universe rich with Shadowrun lore. No longer. :\

[flarkminator]

It's Shadowruin.

Haha, yeah thats much better. Wish I could edit my title now =)

[Funky Papa]

I chuckled.

But if you're aiming for the fps crowd you're still goign to miss your mark. I'll be too busy playing Gears of War to give two shits about this game, so do yourselves, and your immense pocket books a favor and stop this game before it gets any further.

I pretty much said the same thing on a previous thread. I can't understand the logic behind their reasoning, in its current state this game will not please the FPS players, much less the Shadowrun fans. It is bound to bomb.

[Scytale]

Huh?

I was thinking an online sandbox Shadowrun game would be perfect.

Create you character - go online, join a clan and fight over virtual turf - earning EXP and buying upgrades that improve your character.

Will you survive a trip to the decker shop? Who will you run into along the way?

Sounds like a great game. Attacking enemy clan / gang systems via the matrix - disabling the power systems in a building of theirs and then attacking while the lights are out, etc.

I think you guys could be missing out on one of the best games ever made.

[Jive Turkey]

It's Shadowruin.

I almost replied with "OH NO IT ISN'T" and then I saw the little "i" hiding in there.

Shadowruin indeed.

[PhatSaqs]

Mad, rousing, fucking applause.

[Mrbob]

I can almost imagine the company meetings for this game. It has got to be the most depressing collection of people

Did you watch the Live Marketplace trailer? They all seem to be pumped up about the game. Maybe it will be good??

[SaotomeMtl]

*Crosses fingers for Shadowrun 2*

FASA Studios definitely rolled 0 successes in developing this game.

[flarkminator]

Did you watch the Live Marketplace trailer? They all seem to be pumped up about the game. Maybe it will be good??

Classic case of not seeing the forest through the trees. If you work on anything long enough you tell youself its great.

[blackadde]

fuck shadowrun, give me a proper mechwarrior game. :(

[scooby_dooby]

You should be absolutely and utterly ashamed of yourselves. I swore I was just going to ignore this aborted fetus of a game while I was at E3 yesterday, but damnit if Microsoft didn't have at least 6 booths in the 360 section and more booths of it in the Games for Windows section. They were everywhere, and my eyes were eventually drawn to it -- oh how I wish I hadn't looked. Now I had come to the terms with the fact that most likely this game would be an fps -- but I assumed it would be like Dues Ex, or god forbid like Hexic. But what in the name of all that is holy and sacred do I discover? A counterstrike clone? What the hell is WRONG with you people. No I'm serious here -- every person I have talked to and I do mean EVERY person has been either confused or disgusted by this news. That means that I know there are people on your team disgusted by this! Get off your asses and do something about it. Did you not GET the Memo?! Here let me send it to you again, just in case you missed it. I don't know who the brainchild behind this is, but whoever he is needs to be sat down and explained what it means to "build a diverse game portfolio." Ya see, Microsoft obviously understand this notion, or should I say, Rare apparently understands this concept. It’s amazing, and by amazing I obviously mean, it’s Shakespearianly tragic to watch a company with a license with SO much back-story, and depth wasted on… Counterstrike Counterstrike? I have to keep pinching myself when I say this. Look at companies like Mythic, and Relic, at least they have the Balls to take a complex and complicated mythos and fan-base like Warhammer and attempt to do them JUSTICE. Now granted I'm not saying that Shadowrun can hold a candle to Warhammer cuz really it just can't =). However, you could at least try and treat Shadowrun with some respect. You have the opportunity to bring an experience to the 360 that is unique, and you are BLOWING IT. When I look up uninspired in the dictionary I hope that it now contains screenshots of your tragic game. I hope that not a single person buys your game, as I will surely tell every person I know to avoid it like the black plague. I’m done with you. Dear Microsoft, I hope you too realize as I have that this is a wasted opportunity. I would rather Peter Molyneux have the liscene at this point for it would be better for Peter to shoot for the stars and fall short then for FASA to lay around in the Mud like the unholy pig of a developer they are. I realize that Shadowrun fans are not the target market, I mean how COULD they be. Just look at the game, and fan reactions all over the internet. But if you're aiming for the fps crowd you're still goign to miss your mark. I'll be too busy playing Gears of War to give two shits about this game, so do yourselves, and your immense pocket books a favor and stop this game before it gets any further.

No shit. Fire whatever 'genius' was behind this great idea. What a joke.

Lets turn a potentially amazing RPG into fuckin counterstrike. Better yet...lets try and compete with the other 25 FPS that will be available, and have completely shit GFX.

Who the fuck decided 360 needs ANOTHER fps? I mean, I could understand a FPS RPG, that's a totally untapped genre with a ton of potential, but fuck COUNTERSTRIKE. It would be funny if it weren't so damned stupid.

And if anyone from MS or FASA is reading this, ask yourselves this, have you seen a SINGLE positive reaction to this concept from gamers? Do you actually think your counterstrike clone will be able to compete with the likes of GOW, BIA and COD3? Get a fuckin clue and create an RPG so you're not competing again 20 other games with superior GFX.

[trmas]

Yep, this sucks. Just another stupid FPS game.

[Funky Papa]

Do you know what's truly tragic? If Shadowrun Generic FPShit bombs, the odds of seeing another Shadowrun game will be next to zero.

This game is an error. Somebody press the reset button ASAP.

[PanopticBlue]

Not only is this game a horrible disgrace to Shadowrun, the graphics are fucking abysmal.

I approve of this thread, send to FASA now.

[distantmantra]

Huh? I was thinking an online sandbox Shadowrun game would be perfect. Create you character - go online, join a clan and fight over virtual turf - earning EXP and buying upgrades that improve your character. Will you survive a trip to the decker shop? Who will you run into along the way? Sounds like a great game. Attacking enemy clan / gang systems via the matrix - disabling the power systems in a building of theirs and then attacking while the lights are out, etc. I think you guys could be missing out on one of the best games ever made.

None of that is in the game Microsoft is making.

Outside of Mistwalker and Halo 3, Shadowrun was enough to make me buy a 360... but this bastardization of the franchise has really pissed me off.

[Y2Kev]

I saw a pile of like...rubble that was textured to look like a pile of bones.

I lol'd.

[flarkminator]

What the hell is with putting you in the jungle? I guess they figured if they were goign to rape the franchise might as well throw the whole Cyberpunk thing out of the window too.

[Pedigree Chum]

FASA should just stick with making Crimson Skies sequels.

Oh wait, we'll never get those.

Thanks MS :(

[ronito]

Flarkminator you are a gentleman I hold in high esteem. Good show chap!

[Shogun]

Putting aside my rage for using the license for, well really nothing at all, the game doesn't seem all that terrible if I forget that it's a shadowrun game. It seems more like Quake Superheroes Mod than anything else, it's just stupid that they took a great license and made something that isn't like it at all.

[blazinglazers]

*golf clap*

c a n c e l t h i s g a m e .

[distantmantra]

What the hell is with putting you in the jungle? I guess they figured if they were goign to rape the franchise might as well throw the whole Cyberpunk thing out of the window too.

One of the project managers working on the game made up some bullshit excuse about how they moved the setting from Seattle to Santos, New Mexico due to the fact that it occurs in 2020 before the Matrix and before Seattle becomes the center of the known-world in 2050.

I don't buy a word of it.

Creating a generic temple is much cheaper than an urban cityscape.

[CountZeroInt]

"What the hell is with putting you in the jungle? I guess they figured if they were goign to rape the franchise might as well throw the whole Cyberpunk thing out of the window too."

I've seen about 4 maps and this is the first jungle one I've seen. The description of maps is on the website, they are varied.

I think you guys need to take a chill pill and go watch the video interview at GameSpot. They delivered with Crimson Skies, what makes you think they're suddenly going to make a crappy game with Shadowrun?

How much did you actually play it? Or did you just walk by and watch? Counterstrike clone doesn't even make any sense. Counterstrike you are stuck to the ground. This game you are literally flying all over the place. It's about 100x faster paced than Counterstrike/Rainbow Six ever were. The only game that comes close to this in speed is Tribes.

I can't wait till they release a demo of this so rabid and bitter Shadowrun fans will be drowned out by MrAngryFace going "OH GOD THIS GAME ROCKS"

[flarkminator]

One of the project managers working on the game made up some bullshit excuse about how they moved the setting from Seattle to Santos, New Mexico due to the fact that it occurs in 2020 before the Matrix and before Seattle becomes the center of the known-world in 2050. I don't buy a word of it. Creating a generic temple is much cheaper than an urban cityscape.

*Phoenix Wright head banging gif*

[sangreal]

They should really just rename this game. I'm not a Shadowrun fan, but its clear this game has pretty much nothing to do with Shadowru

[therapist]

eesh
i dont like rpgs , the only few i really liked were zelda (snes only - didnt like 64 ones for some reason) , grandia and shadowrun on SNES (because the genesis version wasnt even the same game)

but a counterstrike clone? eesh.

i for one have been sick of counterstrikes tired-ass gameplay for a few years now.

but why turn an rpg into a shooter ? this is confusing to me.

why not name it something else , or not use the shadowrun license , you need no story for counterstrike , so why make it seem like its a sequel to shadowrun?

god damn bs.

[demon]

"What the hell is with putting you in the jungle? I guess they figured if they were goign to rape the franchise might as well throw the whole Cyberpunk thing out of the window too." I've seen about 4 maps and this is the first jungle one I've seen. The description of maps is on the website, they are varied. I think you guys need to take a chill pill and go watch the video interview at GameSpot. They delivered with Crimson Skies, what makes you think they're suddenly going to make a crappy game with Shadowrun? How much did you actually play it? Or did you just walk by and watch? Counterstrike clone doesn't even make any sense. Counterstrike you are stuck to the ground. This game you are literally flying all over the place. It's about 100x faster paced than Counterstrike/Rainbow Six ever were. The only game that comes close to this in speed is Tribes. I can't wait till they release a demo of this so rabid and bitter Shadowrun fans will be drowned out by MrAngryFace going "OH GOD THIS GAME ROCKS"

You're still trying to justify the resurrection of the Shadowrun franchise for a fucking multiplayer FPS, and an ugly as hell one in a genre saturated with infinitely better games at that.

And calling it 100x faster than Rainbow Six doesn't exactly pique my interest in the game. R6's (for PC) slow, methodical and tense gameplay is what makes it my favorite series ever.

[flarkminator]

I've seen about 4 maps and this is the first jungle one I've seen. The description of maps is on the website, they are varied. I think you guys need to take a chill pill and go watch the video interview at GameSpot. They delivered with Crimson Skies, what makes you think they're suddenly going to make a crappy game with Shadowrun? How much did you actually play it? Or did you just walk by and watch? Counterstrike clone doesn't even make any sense. Counterstrike you are stuck to the ground. This game you are literally flying all over the place. It's about 100x faster paced than Counterstrike/Rainbow Six ever were. The only game that comes close to this in speed is Tribes. I can't wait till they release a demo of this so rabid and bitter Shadowrun fans will be drowned out by MrAngryFace going "OH GOD THIS GAME ROCKS"

I actually did play it, but barely. I didn't want to vomit on the nice clean 360 displays.

I'm not even that big of a shadowrun fan. You don't understand why I'm upset. Let's just say that this game is fun when it finally ships. I still won't buy it, because like I said, I'll be too busy playing Gears of War, and many other much better looking, and more interesting FPS games.

This had the chance to be something "different" instead of something the same.

It's funny that you should bring up Rainbox 6, because that game aboslutly rapes Shadowruin in every way shape or form. That was one of the most interesting demo's I saw on the show floor (it wasn't playable -- at least not to just exibit only folks). Seriously, my roomate nailed it when he said that the new Rainbox six reminds him of 24. Its more of a 24 game than the 24 game was haha. But enough of a side track... Back to hating on Shadowruin.

[flarkminator]

Putting aside my rage for using the license for, well really nothing at all, the game doesn't seem all that terrible if I forget that it's a shadowrun game. It seems more like Quake Superheroes Mod than anything else, it's just stupid that they took a great license and made something that isn't like it at all.

I've tried that. I wiped all thoughts of Shadowrun from my mind, and I was still left with games like Gears of War, Rainbox Six: Las Vegas, that seem just so much more interesting and don't feel like I'm getting cheated out of 60$.

[White Man]

This is exactly the reaction I knew GAF would have when they finally saw the game. I tried to warn the people that I talk to on instant messenger!

[Azih]

There is one possibility. The only possibility that even makes any sort of half assed sense.


Suppose... suppose that the people at FASA decided that instead of throwing the rich complexity of the entire Shadowrun universe at dumb as bricks mainstream gamers they would ease the uncultured noobs into the mythos with a simplistic stripped down FPS game and then when they're used to 'Shadowrun for braindead drooling Dummies' they'd start expanding the background into a more sophisticated, complicated world with gameplay depth to match?


Even so, A SUB PERFECT DARK ZERO LEVEL FPS IS NOT THE WAY TO DO IT. PDZ didn't sell and neither will your abortion of a design geniuses. At least make it a Half Life 2 type scripted FPS. PLEASE! PLEASE! PLEEEEAAASE!

[distantmantra]

This is exactly the reaction I knew GAF would have when they finally saw the game. I tried to warn the people that I talk to on instant messenger!

If I give you a bomb, would you *accidentally* leave it somewhere in the Shadowrun development offices? Make sure it goes off at night when noone is around, but it needs to wipe this piece of shit from the face of the planet.

I typically don't get upset about games, but this pisses me off.

[flarkminator]

This is exactly the reaction I knew GAF would have when they finally saw the game. I tried to warn the people that I talk to on instant messenger!

*shakes head slowly*

[Exis]

That pretty much sums up how I feel..

I don't overly like trashing things but this looks to be an abortion of a title, and the killing of something that I was really looking forward to.

-Exis

[Sinatar]

Huh? I was thinking an online sandbox Shadowrun game would be perfect. Create you character - go online, join a clan and fight over virtual turf - earning EXP and buying upgrades that improve your character. Will you survive a trip to the decker shop? Who will you run into along the way? Sounds like a great game. Attacking enemy clan / gang systems via the matrix - disabling the power systems in a building of theirs and then attacking while the lights are out, etc. I think you guys could be missing out on one of the best games ever made.

Just out of curiousity... Are you aware that not a single thing you mentioned there is actually in the game. Not one.

[Confidence Man]

Here is a response from someone at FASA from their forums (which is nothing more than every single person being pissed off):

There have been a number of posts about why isn’t Shadowrun an RPG. Rather than answer all of them separately I thought starting a new thread with some information on that would work best. Why a shooter rather than an RPG?: The Shadowrun universe is a huge, rich place. I knew the universe was what first drew me into the game long ago. So far the Shadowrun universe has spawned four editions of an RPG, a tactical board game, an action figure game, a console adventure game and a collectible card game, not to mention a number of novels and short stories. It long ago stopped being just an RPG. We decided to make a tactical FPS because we wanted to add to that portfolio in a new way and expand the world into a completely new arena. The game we are making is all about teams of people of different awakened races. Some have magic, some have technology, some have both and each team has a goal they are trying to accomplish. If that doesn’t sound like a team of shadowrunners I don’t know what does. Why 2020 instead of 2050?: As a team we we’re all excited about exploring a time before magic had become integrated. This is about a world still struggling in the first throes of a massive change. There are no dragons on the boards of major corporations, there are no Yetis performing in nightclubs, the Matrix has not yet arrived. This is the beginning of the story. We are going to explore changes that had already been set by 2050. Why Santos instead of Seattle?: Seattle is the center of the Shadowrun universe in 2050. But this isn’t 2050. This is about exploring new territory and the events surrounding the city of Seattle are well chronicled already. The Ghost Dance has happened, Mt Rainier has erupted. By 2020 Seattle is a treaty city surrounded by the Native American Nations. Setting our game in Santos enables us to tell the story we want without changing the events around Seattle. That’s all fine but I wanted an RPG!!!: FASA Studio (though called FASA Interactive back then) took over the Battletech franchise on PC and consoles in 1996. In the time we were shepherding that franchise we developed Battletech as the sim it originally was on PC in Mechwarrior IV and Mechwarrior IV: Mercenaries. We also developed the Mechcommander series of RTSes and the Mechassault series of third person action games. I guess what I am saying here is just because our first Shadowrun game isn’t an RPG don’t think that’s all we’re going to be doing. My first point was that the Shadowrun universe is huge, capable of supporting a broad portfolio of games. This is just the first salvo. I hope this answer many of your questions and I look forwards to answering more as we get closer to launch. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Community Manager: FASA Studio Thank You For Playing

At least it seems like there's hope for an RPG after this.

[flarkminator]

Just out of curiousity... Are you aware that not a single thing you mentioned there is actually in the game. Not one.

Haha, I figured I'd let him find out on his own that his simple dreams are all but crushed under the neanderthalic boot that is fasa.

[Funky Papa]

At least it seems like there's hope for an RPG after this.

FASA will be lucky if MS doesn't close it after the game bombs like a mofo.

I could understand an action-adventure game instead of a RPG. Not my favourite project for the franchise, but if that could serve to bring us some RPG goodness everything would be fine. This, however, doesn't have a single chance. FPS gamers will be playing other titles, casuals won't see the appeal and the fans are already looking for torches and pitchforks. It has the word BOMB written all over it.

[Outdoor Miner]

Good post and amen.

If I could spike their drinks with cancer I would.