Support NeoGAF

DrROBschiz · Mar 31, 2015

Adam Scott Aukerman said:
I've paid very little attention to this project since it was announced (mostly because it interests me and I'd rather just play it 'when it's done' instead of salivating over it repeatedly or playing it in an unfinished state), but even so I can't help but shake the feeling that they've set the bar far too high for this.

For 77m, they could probably just about fund three, highly produced (but perhaps moderately scoped) games. Get that first one out there within a couple of years, rake in loads more cash and build from there would surely be a more sensible alternative strategy?

But then what the fuck do I know? Although I could make a safe guess that working with this level of expectation must be ball-crushingly worrisome.

Yeah man

Based on all the other crowdfunding tragedies we have seen. It makes sense to build something small and complete FIRST and then expand on it later

Then again. Destiny basically shipped as a skeleton and was called out for it.... yet it still was very successful and makes lots of money

For a first product... sure it gets critically slammed for good reason but it IS a functioning and fun product.

AS much as people hate on Destiny its still a better setup to build off of.

I suppose this opinion could be thrown in my face somehow though. I PERSONALLY prefer to know nothing and have a complete game released within months of its first announcement

Fusion Pizza · Mar 31, 2015

Does it even have a release date anymore? I've been paying very little attention to it.

KKRT00 · Mar 31, 2015

dancrane212 said:
It is a bit concerning watching the "Letters to the Chairman" segment they release every week. I understand that the Star Citizen component will be this big evolving world where features will be added overtime but it feels (at least from the videos I've watched) the scope gets bigger every week I tune in.

Not saying Chris Roberts should be dismissing folks suggestions or anything but maybe he could be a bit more reigned in when talking about things that are really far off.

No, it doesnt.

---

DrROBschiz said:
Based on all the other crowdfunding tragedies we have seen. It makes sense to build something small and complete FIRST and then expand on it later

That was the Chris Roberts plan, but it changed, because they got much more money than they hoped for, so they completely expanded on development.
People really dont realize that they have over 300 developers working on it!

Damaniel · Mar 31, 2015

I'm convinced that the gaming utopia that everyone expects from this game for some strange reason will never come to pass. It's far too big a project for far too small a team, and the glacial pace of the release of game 'modules' is just proof of that. (Plus, the idea of $10000 microtransactions on top of a non-free game just rubs me the wrong way. At least don't offer those microtransactions until there's something more to do than walk around your $10000 collection of ships.)

Daedardus · Mar 31, 2015

Oh boy.

I think anyone who follows development closely knows they are actually working on the game. The game is going to be huge, of course it takes time to work on stuff. They are so open with development (videos, shows, daily site updates, forum comments, they attend every major gaming sjow) that there even is too much stuff getting shown. Even I can't follow anymore with every new mechanic they show.

They also cut back on actively promoting the funding. Nowadays they just go with it and the money rolls in regardless. Keep in mind that you can also buy into the game for the price of half a modern game, so you don't have to spend 1000 dollars. Those are mostly spent by people who do have a huge income and wanted to revive the space sim genre. I think those people still believe in the succeeding of the game and don't regret spending the money.

HK-47 · Mar 31, 2015

Damaniel said:
I'm convinced that the gaming utopia that everyone expects from this game for some strange reason will never come to pass. It's far too big a project for far too small a team, and the glacial pace of the release of game 'modules' is just proof of that.

Maybe I'm not paying attention but that sounds like bullshit hyperbole to make the people anticipating the game seem like hype frothing rubes rather than anywhere near the truth.

texhnolyze · Mar 31, 2015

This thread is already epic haha.
Ignorance is bliss indeed.

DrROBschiz · Mar 31, 2015

KKRT00 said:
No, it doesnt.

---

That was the Chris Roberts plan, but it changed, because they got much more money than they hoped for, so they completely expanded on development.
People really dont realize that they have over 300 developers working on it!

I feel like that is a classic mistake with corwdfunding

Build the original vision first and deliver it...

Who knows though. Chris Roberts may just pull this off.

Dr. Kaos · Mar 31, 2015

Wired said:
Those who frequent the game's forums respond to such criticism by circling the fanwagons.

I can see those fanwagons being circled right now in this thread

I loved Wing Commander 3/4 as a teenager. I even spent hours pasting adhesive pieces of paper over my keyboard, with the different functions they had so I understand the enthusiasm over the game.

However, I could see from day one that this kickstarter was too ambitious, and the incredible, some would say rapacious way Roberts started selling virtual polygons for hundreds and thousands of dollars to starry-eyed people completely repulsed me.

The IT guy in the article spent 22 THOUSAND DOLLARS on tens of virtual ships in a game in development. I'll just let you digest that for a moment. A middle class dude, not a millionaire. That's about 500 times the price of a AAA PC game. He did it because he has an urge to collect, something that can be taken advantage of (pokemon, beanie babies, amiibos, etc.)

I have no faith that the promises Roberts has made will be fulfilled. The game is made as 4 different games from 4 different studios and they are HOPING to put all those together for a single game? What the fuck? This has never been done before.

The whole thing is bonkers

Damerman · Mar 31, 2015

Adam Scott Aukerman said:
I can't help but shake the feeling that they've set the bar far too high for this.
.

well, what if i told you their ambitions are even greater for after the game ships... like seamless planetary landing and take off.

Enco · Mar 31, 2015

The amount of people donating 3 or 4 figure amounts are crazy. Lol at paying for in game ships in a game that won't release for years and has little chance of living up to expectations.

The day this game is released as a bomba will see the Internet explode. If it ever releases.

Feels like the game is too big to succeed. I hope I'm wrong but I don't expect anything decent.

Azih · Mar 31, 2015

No matter how worthy or not Star Citizen may be. They've become incredibly efficient whale hunters to the point of being exploitative. It creeps me out.

KKRT00 · Mar 31, 2015

Damaniel said:
I'm convinced that the gaming utopia that everyone expects from this game for some strange reason will never come to pass. It's far too big a project for far too small a team, and the glacial pace of the release of game 'modules' is just proof of that. (Plus, the idea of $10000 microtransactions on top of a non-free game just rubs me the wrong way. At least don't offer those microtransactions until there's something more to do than walk around your $10000 collection of ships.)

Bullshit.
Can people who have not idea what they are talking about in regards of actual development of this game, stop throwing their assumptions as facts?
Thank You

---

Dr. Kaos said:
I have no faith that the promises Roberts has made will be fulfilled. The game is made as 4 different games from 4 different studios and they are HOPING to put all those together for a single game? What the fuck? This has never been done before.

The whole thing is bonkers

What? All big games are made like that.

Dictator93 · Mar 31, 2015

Megalodactyl said:
Does it even have a release date anymore? I've been paying very little attention to it.

Their release date schedule actually leaked like 1.5 weeks ago... they also have commented on their release dates rather openly.

in 1-2 weeks FPS launches. With a months time the scoial module launches. The summer sees AC 2.0s release. October 2015 is the date set for the first episode of Squadron 42.

Etc. etc.

epmode · Mar 31, 2015

DrROBschiz said:
Yeah man

Based on all the other crowdfunding tragedies we have seen. It makes sense to build something small and complete FIRST and then expand on it later

Then again. Destiny basically shipped as a skeleton and was called out for it.... yet it still was very successful and makes lots of money

For a first product... sure it gets critically slammed for good reason but it IS a functioning and fun product.

AS much as people hate on Destiny its still a better setup to build off of.

Destiny's development was very troubled and the skeletal state of its release was not by design. Activision was attempting to salvage what they already spent on the game without pushing back the release. Luckily for them, it looks like it worked.

Basileus777 · Mar 31, 2015

Seeing how many millions they can extract from whales for preordering DLC is more interesting than whatever the game will end up. It's a strange social experiment.

RK9039 · Mar 31, 2015

Dictator93 said:
Their release date schedule actually leaked like 1.5 weeks ago... they also have commented on their release dates rather openly.

in 1-2 weeks FPS launches. With a months time the scoial module launches. The summer sees AC 2.0s release. October 2015 is the date set for the first episode of Squadron 42.

Etc. etc.

Can't wait to try that FPS module, I'm going to re-install it soon.

Toxi · Mar 31, 2015

How about we wait for the fucking game to release before judging whether it's half-finished and buggy?

ElyrionX · Mar 31, 2015

Jesus christ. DONATING $20k for a game's development? Does Chris Robert even have any skin in the game?

hobblygobbly · Mar 31, 2015

The only thing I don't understand is why are people buying ships if everyone will be able to get them when it releases? Ever since they began doing that I couldn't understand - I feel like I'm missing some info about it yet I can never find out what buying a ship now does for you. That ship will be available for everyone in the game any ways?

When the initial campaign ran I put down money and that's it.

Dictator93 · Mar 31, 2015

RK9039 said:
Can't wait to try that FPS module, I'm going to re-install it soon.

The weird thing was the schedule said FPS launches on both April 1st and on April 15th. I have no idea what that is about. I just assume between now and then.

ElyrionX said:
Does Chris Robert even have any skin in the game?

I don't know what this means, but I like the way you think.

BannedEpisode · Mar 31, 2015

I find it very difficult to imagine that this game will deliver what people are expecting. Just based off what they are promising.

Free trial from pax looked nice, but that's not a game yet.

If it does, you can bet your ass that I'll be in line with 60 bucks ready to slap down.

Adam Scott Aukerman · Mar 31, 2015

Damerman said:
well, what if i told you their ambitions are even greater for after the game ships... like seamless planetary landing and take off.

Well everyone has their grand ideas for the future, that's just the creative process in action. It's the grand ideas you have for the project you're currently working on that are usually the problem!

Effect · Mar 31, 2015

darkwing said:
what are they doing with the money

A very valid question and one that will have you tar and feathered in the official forums if asked. I refuse to go there now because of the cult worship that takes place there. I already paid my money (on the low end) and can't get a refund (been denied every time I've asked and begged) so I have no choice but to see how this ends up but I really wish people would stop giving Roberts more money. Force the to actually produce something that will make money.

The whole process now is more about getting even more money from people then it is finishing a game or finishing something well. After all this time even the basic hanger module is still buggy. They actually made it worse from how it originally was just because I guess. I've actually kinda written the entire thing off as a loss at this point. If anything does come out I expect it to be a mess full of excuses.

dancrane212 · Mar 31, 2015

KKRT00 said:
No, it doesnt.

When I hear emails like "What about scanning for individual weapons on players when boarding my ship" and CR responds that it's a good idea and they'll look into it I get a bit cautious. I'm not talking major features but these little things add up, painting a picture of something the game may not be for a very long time if at all.

More_Badass · Mar 31, 2015

Dictator93 said:
The weird thing was the schedule said FPS launches on both April 1st and on April 15th. I have no idea what that is about. I just assume between now and then.

I don't know what this means, but I like the way you think.

April 1st. Come on, they probably have something played for April's Fools

ElyrionX · Mar 31, 2015

Dictator93 said:
I don't know what this means, but I like the way you think.

Meaning how much of his personal wealth has he put into the game?

Basileus777 · Mar 31, 2015

hobblygobbly said:
The only thing I don't understand is why are people buying ships if everyone will be able to get them when it releases?

When the initial campaign ran I put down money and that's it.

Why do people spent money on any F2P game? What's unique here is that people are spending thousands of dollars to preorder IAPs.

Damerman · Mar 31, 2015

Damaniel said:
I'm convinced that the gaming utopia that everyone expects from this game for some strange reason will never come to pass.

luckily there is no publisher who can shut them down... and the limit of their budget is as limited as the income of many hopefuls who want to see a revival in the genre... not to mention the growth PC gaming is seeing. Even if it takes 5 more years... 10 even... how the hell can you say "never come to pass" as if they are trying to program some kind of cosmic miracle... it's a video game... video games get made all the time.

DrROBschiz · Mar 31, 2015

epmode said:
Destiny's development was very troubled and the skeletal state of its release was not by design. Activision was attempting to salvage what they already spent on the game without pushing back the release. Luckily for them, it looks like it worked.

Add their AMBITIOUS pitfalls to the mountains of reasons why we should be wary of the promises of Star Citizen

I feel like if he was really serious he should have stopped taking money past the point of the amount NEEDED to actually make the FIRST game and then taken more later to either expand on it or build a sequel....

Maybe the game is actually coming together as intended but man... there is just something that happens to game developers when things are constantly changing and growing.

How many years of workdays do you expect 320+ employees to punch in on the same project before they burn out?

Sleeping Lesson · Mar 31, 2015

Having played a fair bit of Arena Commander, I already know the PVP/PVE dogfighting alone will be worth the purchase once it's optimized. Anything greater than that is just gravy.

KKRT00 · Mar 31, 2015

dancrane212 said:
When I hear emails like "What about scanning for individual weapons on players when boarding my ship" and CR responds that it's a good idea and they'll look into it I get a bit cautious. I'm not talking major features but these little things add up, painting a picture of something the game may not be for a very long time if at all.

They have scanning tech already on the planets, implementing on ships is not really a big deal.

Haunted · Mar 31, 2015

While I think that the amount of money some individual customers are spending on the game is ridiculous (though that applies to every whale out there), the article does have some level of misunderstanding about how crowdfounding works on this level.

People predicting that the game will "fail" when it releases are not getting it. The second this game is "released" (whatever arbitrary measure you want to use for that, btw), it's already a huge success. It built a company, it exists because of the backers. The day of release is the day Roberts has won.

That said, I feel like their best bet of silencing these dissenting voices that don't really understand what's happening and try to (unsuccessfully) apply their knowledge from other business models to this crowdfunded game in ongoing development, is to put out Squadron 42. It's a part of the game that's familiar to these people, they know how to deal with that. They understand it. They can judge it.

Felix Lighter · Mar 31, 2015

Damaniel said:
I'm convinced that the gaming utopia that everyone expects from this game for some strange reason will never come to pass. It's far too big a project for far too small a team, and the glacial pace of the release of game 'modules' is just proof of that. (Plus, the idea of $10000 microtransactions on top of a non-free game just rubs me the wrong way. At least don't offer those microtransactions until there's something more to do than walk around your $10000 collection of ships.)

They aren't $10000 microtransactions. They are ridiculously high backing levels with your typical backing rewards for people that have ridiculous amounts of money and want to back the development of the game.

hobblygobbly · Mar 31, 2015

dancrane212 said:
When I hear emails like "What about scanning for individual weapons on players when boarding my ship" and CR responds that it's a good idea and they'll look into it I get a bit cautious. I'm not talking major features but these little things add up, painting a picture of something the game may not be for a very long time if at all.

I've seen people who legitimately want you to have to shit in a toilet in your ship as a mechanic (this was a year or so ago), I thought it was a joke thread but nope. Some people who want really deep immersion/realism are a tad silly.

The Jackdog · Mar 31, 2015

Every thread about star citizen is the same now.

A bunch of people simply asking "what are they doing? where is this going? whats the endgame here?" and then a bunch of other people jumping on them saying YOU DONT KNOW OKAY.

And i dont know. But even after seeing all the awesome stuff they keep making, i still dont see how this is ever going to be an actual game

Dictator93 · Mar 31, 2015

Effect said:
A very valid question and one that will have you tar and feathered in the official forums if asked.

At this point in time it is a rather invalid question actually. THe game has two deal with 3 different countries' tax systems and fraud monitoring. Likewise... reading the article and knowing anything about game development shows you how they are spending their money (4 studios... ehem).

ElyrionX said:
They actually made it worse from how it originally was just because I guess.

How so? My Hangar works just the same as before except now I can enter my ship (which you originally even couldn't) and access other rooms and use the elevator.

The Jackdog said:
A bunch of people simply asking "what are they doing? where is this going? whats the endgame here?" and then a bunch of other people jumping on them saying YOU DONT KNOW OKAY.

Like I said above, at this point in time there is such a wealth of information about this game's development and goals that it is almost unacceptable for people to ask, "what are they doing?" Especially in a thread where the OP article explains what they are doing.

KKRT00 · Mar 31, 2015

ElyrionX said:
Meaning how much of his personal wealth has he put into the game?

He funded the prototype.

KyanMehwulfe · Mar 31, 2015

Azih said:
No matter how worthy or not Star Citizen may be. They've become incredibly efficient whale hunters to the point of being exploitative. It creeps me out.

have you checked out that Lord British game?

i went through their stretch goal funding and rmt backer sales recently and it's the most turned off i've ever been by whale-standardized pricing... just completely killed any interested i had in the game.

DieH@rd · Mar 31, 2015

mocoworm said:
Star Citizen - Fans have dropped $77m on this guys buggy, half-built game [WIRED]

Wut? Of course it is buggy.

The game is not done. It will probably not being done in 1.5-2 more years.

And that "half built" comment is hilarious. Majority of game parts are not playable by public, and will not be playable for a long time. Game development is not a short process.

More_Badass · Mar 31, 2015

The Jackdog said:
Every thread about star citizen is the same now.

A bunch of people simply asking "what are they doing? where is this going? whats the endgame here?" and then a bunch of other people jumping on them saying YOU DONT KNOW OKAY.

And i dont know. But even after seeing all the awesome stuff they keep making, i still dont see how this is ever going to be an actual game

If by "YOU DONT KNOW OKAY" means people breaking down exactly what the game offers right now and how open the developers have been.

TheExodu5 · Mar 31, 2015

They've gotten an average of $100 per backer?

Renekton · Mar 31, 2015

Dr. Kaos said:
The game is made as 4 different games from 4 different studios and they are HOPING to put all those together for a single game? What the fuck? This has never been done before.

Big software/IT projects have lots of outsourcing and separate vendors anyways.

For gaming, Mass Effect 3 had a different studio for the MP, DA:I team outsourced render work to the China studio, Ubisoft has several subsidiaries including in Singapore working on different parts of a product.

Damerman · Mar 31, 2015

Adam Scott Aukerman said:
Well everyone has their grand ideas for the future, that's just the creative process in action. It's the grand ideas you have for the project you're currently working on that are usually the problem!

what i'm saying is that if they wanted to go grander, they would. Their ambitions right now are absolutely feasible. they are running into issues, but they solve them... like double precision physics floating points which will allow for massive space maps.

if you back the game for just 30 bucks... you will see every inch of what the development team is up to...down to the bug smashing.

Solid Samus · Mar 31, 2015

DoktorEvil · Mar 31, 2015

Dr. Kaos said:
However, I could see from day one that this kickstarter was too ambitious, and the incredible, some would say rapacious way Roberts started selling virtual polygons for hundreds and thousands of dollars to starry-eyed people completely repulsed me.

The IT guy in the article spent 22 THOUSAND DOLLARS on tens of virtual ships in a game in development. I'll just let you digest that for a moment. A middle class dude, not a millionaire. That's about 500 times the price of a AAA PC game. He did it because he has an urge to collect, something that can be taken advantage of (pokemon, beanie babies, amiibos, etc.)

I have no faith that the promises Roberts has made will be fulfilled. The game is made as 4 different games from 4 different studios and they are HOPING to put all those together for a single game? What the fuck? This has never been done before.

The whole thing is bonkers

It's his money. Let him be as stupid as he wishes to.

Kickstarter as a concept is bonkers, but then again I'm not so delusional as to throw money at thoughts of ideas. I don't make enough to be that risky.

This all reminds me of how ambitious Too Human was and how Denis Dyack was tarred and feathered for his shit. He certained had more funding that 77 million though. At least this looks promising and based on what I'm reading on the site, is somewhat reachable.

The Jackdog · Mar 31, 2015

Damerman said:
what i'm saying is that if they wanted to go grander, they would. Their ambitions right now are absolutely feasible. they are running into issues, but they solve them... like double precision physics floating points which will allow for massive space maps.

if you back the game for just 30 bucks... you will see every inch of what the development team is up to...down to the bug smashing.

for some reason this sentence is strange to me.

"just give them money and youll totally be caught up to speed and have all the answers"

Shantom · Mar 31, 2015

Hey guys, I heard Take Two gave Rockstar an unlimited budget for GTAVI, but it isn't even half built yet! What are they doing with the money?

Par Score · Mar 31, 2015

Put in $30 on the Kickstarter, which is money well spent based just on the entertainment I've had with what's been released piecemeal already.

This game always seems to attract such bitter enmity, you'd think Chris Roberts had spent the 90s going around kicking peoples dogs rather than making some of the best Space Sims ever.

Seriously, we're getting a new Space Sim from Chris fucking Roberts, how is that not fantastically exciting?

DrROBschiz · Mar 31, 2015

Renekton said:
Big software/IT projects have lots of outsourcing and separate vendors anyways.

For gaming, Mass Effect 3 had a different studio for the MP, DA:I team outsourced render work to the China studio, Ubisoft has several subsidiaries including in Singapore working on different parts of a product.

For better or worse AAA developers are held strictly accountable in one way or another

This crowdfunded AAA approach has yet to prove a better setup but I guess its far more inclusive to fans..

Support NeoGAF

Star Citizen - Fans have dropped $77m on this guys buggy, half-built game [WIRED]

Member

Member

Member

Banned

Member

Oh, bitch bitch bitch.

Banned

Member

Banned

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Banned

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Banned

Member

Banned

Member

Member

Banned

Banned

Member

Member

Member

Member

Similar threads