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Beatmania IIDX INFINITAS (PC, JP-only) AlphaTest

D

dangerskew

Member
djSyndrome said:
What licensing issues? Other than covers (Take On Me, Fantasy) or full transplants (Our Song), I'm assuming Konami owns the rights to everything they produce in-house. Unless JASRAC has a say in this :\
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For older styles you're totally right, but recent (Tricoro onward) arcade releases show Konami has been relying on outside artists much more than before for music. Many of these artists are doujin and such though, so it could just be commission deals where Konami owns whatever they make for the game. I really don't know.
 
D

djSyndrome

Member
dangerskew said:
For older styles you're totally right, but recent (Tricoro onward) arcade releases show Konami has been relying on outside artists much more than before for music. Many of these artists are doujin and such though, so it could just be commission deals where Konami owns whatever they make for the game. I really don't know.
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Didn't consider that - great point.

If we're lucky Konami will 'release' this in Japan but turn a blind eye to anyone internationally who wants to brave the waters and join up.
 
C

Curry-Hakase

Member
BEMANI is the only good thing left at Konami.

dangerskew said:
For older styles you're totally right, but recent (Tricoro onward) arcade releases show Konami has been relying on outside artists much more than before for music. Many of these artists are doujin and such though, so it could just be commission deals where Konami owns whatever they make for the game. I really don't know.
Click to expand...

Oh man I would love the Touhou X BEMANI songs to be on this as well.
 
T

Teknopathetic

Member
I'd like to think Konami's mobile Bemani efforts were successful enough outside of Japan for them to consider having a localized version.
 
F

Falk

that puzzling face
Teknopathetic said:
I'd like to think Konami's mobile Bemani efforts were successful enough outside of Japan for them to consider having a localized version.
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The optimist in me wants to think that Konami is at least aware of Steam because Metal Gear, etc.

The realist in me is all EHEHEHEH
 
D

dog$

Hates quality gaming
Well then.

I think the biggest issues are controller support and, as far as those of us in not-Japan are concerned, international regions. I'm sorry, but if I can't use my Dao with this version of the game, I can't justify buying it. I can't afford and rationalize buying a new official Konami table if it's the only one which they allow to properly work.

Of course, saying all that is moot if Konami decides that they do not want to support the global fan base.

Pricing has potential to be a deal killer as well, but honestly, in consideration of those of us who have spent several hundreds to play the series in the past, I think a prohibitive schedule would have to be laughably excessive for it to impact sales.

I do have to wonder how this bodes for the future of the series in arcades; or, at least, this is being done with the intent to allow the series to subtly transfer to PC only and let the AC releases taper off.

We'll see. My mood ring is at Copula Yellow about this for now.
 
D

djSyndrome

Member
The theme background is a rotating graphic of planet Earth. Surely Konami wouldn't troll the rest of the world by making this Japan-only.
oh wait
 
F

Falk

that puzzling face
I mean, considering the game -has- to have keyboard support, wouldn't a DAO be at the very least guaranteed work the way it does in bms/emulation?

Also I'm pretty sure the exact reason that the game doesn't (seem to) advertise the latest few Styles is so there's a continued incentive for people to keep going to arcades.

Who knows, considering how connected everything is maybe Konami has enough play data/statistics to determine that letting older tracks go on a slightly different (technically more consumer-friendly) form of monetization is OK as far as arcade activity is concerned.
 
H

Hazaro

relies on auto-aim
It's pretty rare to have releases come out of nowhere to be something a ton of people wanted and never thought would actually happen. Just need to see how Konami fucks it up now.
 
D

dog$

Hates quality gaming
Falk said:
I mean, considering the game -has- to have keyboard support, wouldn't a DAO be at the very least guaranteed work the way it does in bms/emulation?
Click to expand...
Maybe? What if they program in a way to check to the USB serial numbers of the connected devices and don't allow any unrecognized devices to be used? (Hell, what if they go out of their way to confirm the IDs of the various PS2/USB adapters and the Dao/Rainbow/&c. USB controllers and specifically block them?) I've already seen one post "over there" of someone who tried using Joy2Key and having very poor results.

As far as further AC support, my main concern about it would be for the series to continue its steady evolution and consistent quality which it has basically managed to maintain to date. I just wouldn't want a migration to PC-only result in them letting things stagnate or become too lazily made for the series to be tarnished as an ultimate result.
 
F

Falk

that puzzling face
It's a very careful balancing act.

On one hand, gaming peripherals, by their very design, have to be made with a consumer budget in mind. Heck, that's the entire reason PS4/XB1 aren't cutting-edge in terms of hardware. Too high a barrier to entry and you might as well not even bother.

On the other hand music game community is niche enough and hardcore enough to go nuts on splurging.

An undertaking on PC ultimately has to cater to both. The game simply won't survive trying to market solely to us crazies with multiple DAOs.

I'm honestly thinking it's going to be "an affordable KOC v2 or keyboard" only, and then DAOs/other 3rd party controllers will eventually find their own workaround to properly hook into keyboard support.

The fact that it's one official client to support instead of dozens of different emulators each with their own quirks will probably help with that last.
 
Deft Beck

Deft Beck

Member
I am happy about this, but I do echo the concern about controller support and international availability.

Konami would be crazy to throw BMS players under the bus and force them to buy proprietary controllers. That would burn away any goodwill they have regarding that part of the fanbase. It would also disrespect the BMS authors influenced by IIDX who have ended up in the official game.

I'd like to think that the development of this game was a response to the international community's efforts to mirror the eAmuse network outside of Japan, as well as other equivalents in Japan/other parts of Asia. With this new game, I hope Konami develops a reasonable model that compliments the arcade experience available in Japan/Asia and provides an accessible alternative for international fans.

Or, they could pull a Konami.
 
T

twentytwo22

Member
I submitted the survey saying that if it is anything other than retail version + DLC songs then there is no way I would ever play it.

Arcade style? Nope, this is a home version.
F2P model? (Sounds like they aren't going this way, but still...) Nope.
 
K

Kumubou

Member
I think dedicated controllers are going to be one of the big sticking points, although I don't think a higher MSRP is going to be as big of an issue. It's not like they are trying to sell the game and controllers to anyone but the core playerbase.

Maybe they should get MarkMan on the line. :V I kid (or do I?!), but I think having a partnership with a dedicated hardware manufacturer would make the most sense. I don't know if they would move enough units to get their interest, though. I think the boutique producers that are already on the market (like Dao or Virgoo) would be willing to deal, but it's an open question if Konami would ever be willing to deal with them or if they could get a cheaper product out (even the low-end controllers from DJ Dao start at $170), or if they could scale up production.

However, there's a relatively high floor on the cost of the controllers for a reason -- they tend to take a lot of abuse. Anyone who has played enough Rock Band or Guitar Hero and had the stock instruments stop working in relatively short order can see where the build quality issue comes from. It's a small miracle that the KOCs work as well as they do, especially since their main issue seems to be with design flaws and not with overall build quality.

twentytwo22 said:
I submitted the survey saying that if it is anything other than retail version + DLC songs then there is no way I would ever play it.

Arcade style? Nope, this is a home version.
F2P model? (Sounds like they aren't going this way, but still...) Nope.
Click to expand...
Their mobile Bemani games (jubeat, Reflec Beat, Pop'n Rhythmica, etc.) are all free to download and just sell DLC songs (loooots of them) straight-up, with no other restrictions. It's shockingly tame for a mobile release.

Then again, some of the recent events in their arcade games have gotten grindy enough to effectively be like a lot of mobile games nowadays. ;_;

Hazaro said:
It's pretty rare to have releases come out of nowhere to be something a ton of people wanted and never thought would actually happen. Just need to see how Konami fucks it up now.
Click to expand...
I don't think there's a ton of people who would actually want this -- IIDX is a super-hardcore game in a genre that's a fairly small niche to begin with. It's just that the people who do want it are absurdly dedicated.
 
Danny Dudekisser

Danny Dudekisser

I paid good money for this Dynex!
Kumubou said:
I don't think there's a ton of people who would actually want this -- IIDX is a super-hardcore game in a genre that's a fairly small niche to begin with. It's just that the people who do want it are absurdly dedicated.
Click to expand...

Preeeeetttty much. The game's impenetrable for newcomers, unless they're already a pretty hardcore gamer. But, like you said, the game's fans are pretty dedicated -- if Konami does a good job with it, it's pretty much a "price is no object" scenario for me as far as buying the controller, music, etc.
 
F

Falk

that puzzling face
I've said it multiple times, but the problem with music games is, while the fanbase is there, it's also very, VERY diluted. That's why arcades don't work (outside of Japan and a few SEA countries). That's why retail is hard to justify, even with to-door distribution like Amazon (forget about brick-and-mortar)

Digital distribution very, very strongly alleviates a lot of these problems, since it no longer matters how diluted a fanbase is, just total numbers. All physical logistics/overhead are suddenly no longer an issue.

It's also why many succesful rhythm game franchises (both bemani and otherwise, like Cytus, etc) exist on mobile.
 
F

Falk

that puzzling face
That's... disappointing.

Didn't seem like the previous test was cracking under network strain or anything either.
 
T

The Bankslammer

Member
cj_iwakura said:
Mind breaking down where to go?
Click to expand...

Oh, yeah, for sure.

Just make sure you're logged in with your Konami ID, then hit this big green button. Then from there hit the big blue button (the reminders on the page are just for making sure you're using your latest email address and don't have emails from Konami blocked and that you can use the DirectX diagnostic tool, dxdiag, to find all appropriate information). I can't go back to the survey itself unfortunately, but given the examples it gives you for each, it should be pretty straightforward as to which box is for what spec. And if not you can always just copy it into a translation program. You only need to fill in the ones checked with the red star. Then it'll take you to a confirmation page, and hit the button on the right to submit. After that you should be set.

cj_iwakura said:
:/ That, I don't have.
Click to expand...

Oh, that's no problem, it's not something that requires an e-Amuse pass or anything. You can just create a new one and the process should even be in English. I think it's okay if you register with the US as your region? Pretty sure I did.
 
S

StarCreator

Member
I just signed up for eAmusement Cloud. From my iPad. In Japanese, because if you don't set your region to Japan you are locked out of Paseli features.

Looks like I need to actually go back to my PC for the Infinitas signup though.

Here are the survey questions:

テスト環境の参考とするため、ご使用のPC環境についてご記入ください。
「※」の項目は入力必須となります
※応募はお一人様1回限りとなります
※例として表示されているものは、プレー動作を保証するものではありません
※入力内容に不備がある場合、応募の対象とならない場合がありますのでご注意ください

設問1：
PCメーカー名・型番 (例：自作PC)

設問2：※
OS (例：Windows 7 Pro 32bit)

設問3：※
CPU (例：Intel Core i5-2500 3.3GHz)

設問4：※
メモリ搭載量 (例：4GB)

設問5：※
ビデオ機能 (例：Intel HD Graphics 3000)

設問6：※
ディスプレイ(メーカー・型名) (例：三菱 RDF223H)

設問7：※
ディスプレイ解像度 (例：1360×1024)

設問8：
ディスプレイ周波数 (例：60Hz)

設問9：
サウンド機能 (例：オンボード)

設問10：
キーボード (例：PS/2 108キー日本語キーボード)
 
K

Kumubou

Member
Got signed up with relatively little issue, but I did use a JP Konami ID that actually has some games of IIDX and SDVX on it (at Round 1 in the US, but still) in case they're actually trying to filter this sort of thing. Who knows.
 
S

StarCreator

Member
Kumubou said:
Got signed up with relatively little issue, but I did use a JP Konami ID that actually has some games of IIDX and SDVX on it (at Round 1 in the US, but still) in case they're actually trying to filter this sort of thing. Who knows.
Click to expand...

Mine has IIDX and GitaDora; SDVX wasn't in yet when I last visited =/

Pretty sure it was still IIDX Spada too...
 
cj_iwakura

cj_iwakura

Member
Kumubou said:
Got signed up with relatively little issue, but I did use a JP Konami ID that actually has some games of IIDX and SDVX on it (at Round 1 in the US, but still) in case they're actually trying to filter this sort of thing. Who knows.
Click to expand...

Wonder why there's no GOLI avatars.
 
K

Kumubou

Member
cj_iwakura said:
Wonder why there's no GOLI avatars.
Click to expand...
Accept Rasis as your new overlord.

StarCreator said:
So it's been pointed out to me this FAQ page is there: http://p.eagate.573.jp/game/eac2dx/infinitas/p/common/info/iidx_faq.html

I'm not sure if it was there during the previous alpha test, but it has this to say about controllers:

  • They will not stop anyone from attempting to use a controller, but they will not provide any support.
  • They have no plans to produce a controller.
Click to expand...
All they really need is good DirectInput support and the community would handle the rest. They don't need to make controllers.
 
F

Falk

that puzzling face
No controller is a really ballsy move, but I guess it's understandable.

Although pretty much implying zsxdcfv is just about as ballsy. That typically has way more ghosting issues and there's a reason many other PC music games went for something with the keys spread further apart.
 
M

mothball

Member
D

dangerskew

Member
Not making a controller isn't ballsy, it's just the choice that requires the least amount of effort on Konami's part. They know toprankers play BMS at home to practice using arcade style controllers made by third-parties, slightly modifying their arcade software to work on PC's gives Konami the chance to make some amount of money from that without spending a whole lot.

And yes, I know that calling BMS a way to practice at home for AC IIDX is an oversimplification.
 
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