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What drove Sony to invest in VR?

SerTapTap

Member
There have been numerous stories on why Sony got into VR. Here's a well researched one on Polygon (for all the shit they get, their non-review, non-puff pieces can be really good).

Basically Sony experiments on weird stuff all the time. They already had a hand in most of the components for VR so they started experimenting on it (by they I mean a small group dedicated to such experiments). THen they decided to take it forward, and they were probably emboldended by the success of Oculus' kickstarter though it seems they started before that.

Also waiting to see if an idea pans out before entering the market is often basically the same as locking yourself out of that market entirely. See Intel and mobile chips. They waited, then it was too late, now they're laying off 12,000 people.
 

Juanivan

Member
[boots];202780691 said:
If you mean like the transition from 2D sprites to 3D polygons, I agree wholeheartedly
No, i meant 3D:

514-597x230.jpg


IN 3D!
 

HStallion

Now what's the next step in your master plan?
I believe they decided to get into it because it was the "Flavour of the Month".

Sorry guys, I don't see any real future for VR. I think it's just a fad. (Quote me on that if I end up being wrong)

Just to let you know VR is taking off in the arts community. Vive has several painting programs available and more art programs down the line. I have a professional artist friend who is setting up a studio for it.

Its already past the fad stage. This isn't including the fact doctors and scientists are starting to use the tech to help with their research.

The tech has an incredible potential that has nothing to do with gaming.
 
I believe they decided to get into it because it was the "Flavour of the Month".

Sorry guys, I don't see any real future for VR. I think it's just a fad. (Quote me on that if I end up being wrong)

Maybe read the thread before replying next time. You are factually incorrect here.
 
What definition of "fad" are we using?

Well, here's the obvious sign No.1.

We've got a small niche hardcore who thinks VR is bigger than it really is repeating the "THUH FYOOTCHER!" marketing lingo ad-naseum. At this point in time it's happened about as much as Fetch has happened. The most I've seen of discussion pertaining to VR outside of the gaming sphere is my uncle mocking that infamous magazine cover of Palmer derping out.

Right now we have no reason to believe that total HMD sales of all three major brands combined will hit the threshold of total Wii sales anytime within the next decade, beyond a few guys insisting "THE FUTURE!!!11!!!1!" with no hard data to back it up that this somehow isn't going to just be another string of failed peripherals.

Now, stuff like G-Sync? THAT is the future.
 
Just to let you know VR is taking off in the arts community. Vive has several painting programs available and more art programs down the line. I have a professional artist friend who is setting up a studio for it.

Its already past the fad stage. This isn't including the fact doctors and scientists are starting to use the tech to help with their research.

That sounds cool! Unfortunately I don't feel that it has longevity. (With maybe the exception of in the arts community)

The big issue that needs to be overcome in order for it to succeed it that the overall package needs to be move convenient than a Mouse, Keyboard and a screen.

Sure, the "Minority report"-style floating UI displays would be cool, but practical? No. Your arms are going to get tired after a couple of hours, and you'll find yourself back at your desk using the old and simple way much more effectively. That's a problem that is going to plague every aspect of VR. It's less practical to put on a helmet, it's less practical to have one helmet for each person wanting to observe etc.

I mean, I don't want it to fail, I just don't see how it's current incarnation actually provides me with any real benefit over what is currently available other than the "wow" factor, because as much as we all love to say "wow", after extended exposure it's just going to become a "meh".

Edit:
Maybe read the thread before replying next time. You are factually incorrect here.

What, so I'm not allowed to reply with my opinion anymore? Thread asked why, I genuinely think "FOTM" is why. Call it Bandwagoning, "Me too!"-ing or whatever, but that's why I think they did it.
 

[boots]

Member
No, i meant 3D:

514-597x230.jpg


IN 3D!

Oh...well I'm afraid I have to disagree vehemently instead.

VR has FAR more uses than 3D. Hell, I can see Sony being huge in the medical equipment industry with this tech

Edit - damn my fat fingers somehow posting my reply while I was typing it... >.<
 
What, so I'm not allowed to reply with my opinion anymore? Thread asked why, I genuinely think "FOTM" is why. Call it Bandwagoning, "Me too!"-ing or whatever, but that's why I think they did it.

Your statement regarding Sony jumping on the 'flavor of the month' was factually incorrect. They were working on Morpheus long before Oculus existed. The DS4 light bar only exists because they were planning on launching VR this gen all along. They announced Morpheus before the Facebook deal. All of these things had been stated itt before you made your comment regarding Sony jumping on the VR bandwagon.

Maybe you still haven't bothered to read the thread or click any of the links provided, because you seem to be doubling down. Who knows. I'm not going to debate someone who is going to willfully ignore the facts.
 

Melchiah

Member
Sony just copies things that seem like they could be a hit, to maintain their market leader position. It's the same with PS Move and the Kinect-like camera and such. It's just for the sake of making sure they're there if shit really hits off I think.

bQiSGX5l.jpg

A2w2bhxl.jpg

Ij2zbpQl.jpg


Who's copying who?
 

klaushm

Member
So judging by your OP - especially the bit about 'rushed' you haven't really looks that deeply into Sony's VR development? (..)

I'm pretty sure they were already looking into VR before Occulus happened, that just gave a good template for them to follow in combination with their existing HMDs. This isn't rushed, this is just a point where they can get consumer hardware down to enthusiast affordable prices. (...)

Sony's Magic Lab experiments with tech stuff all the time even if they are not asked to by Sony higher ups. (...)


There was actually an article not long ago with one of the lead directors for PSVR That pretty much answered your question. (...)

Those quotes are the answer you are looking for. You could say that they did it before ir was cool hehe.
 

Kayant

Member
Sony just copies things that seem like they could be a hit, to maintain their market leader position. It's the same with PS Move and the Kinect-like camera and such. It's just for the sake of making sure they're there if shit really hits off I think.
Probably the most wrong I seen in a post for a while. Companies have R&D for a reason.
 

Z3M0G

Member
They wanted to be first in the console space with VR. They could design to a single spec. They wanted PR for PS4. They're a company which produces both display technology and games. They had an HMD series.

Honestly, it makes nothing but sense.

Exactly. If anyone would be a big player, it would by Sony. They have always been involved with the establishment of new mediums.
 

Stillmatic

Member
Regarding some posts in the thread.

The facts:

- R&D on PSVR began long before Oculus Kickstarter was announced, with working prototypes.

- PSVR/Morpheus was officially announced before the Facebook buyout of Oculus.

- The Eyetoy was available at retail during the PS2 era, with many games released for it long before Kinect was a thought.
 
Regarding some posts in the thread.

The facts:

- R&D on PSVR began long before Oculus Kickstarter was announced, with working prototypes.

- PSVR/Morpheus was officially announced before the Facebook buyout of Oculus.

- The Eyetoy was available at retail during the PS2 era, with many games released for it long before Kinect was a thought.
Stop bringing in facts to this thread, can't you see some here are determined to make stuff up to paint Sony in a specific light??!?
 
Sony has been dabbling in head mounted video displays for over 10 years. Sony knows consumer electronics. Sony also started the EyeToy for the PS2, way before Kinect.

Developing VR is not just a risk for Sony but for all parties involved, Oculus, HTC/Valve, Samsung, etc. It is also not the flavor of the month.
 

HStallion

Now what's the next step in your master plan?
That sounds cool! Unfortunately I don't feel that it has longevity. (With maybe the exception of in the arts community)

The big issue that needs to be overcome in order for it to succeed it that the overall package needs to be move convenient than a Mouse, Keyboard and a screen.

Sure, the "Minority report"-style floating UI displays would be cool, but practical? No. Your arms are going to get tired after a couple of hours, and you'll find yourself back at your desk using the old and simple way much more effectively. That's a problem that is going to plague every aspect of VR. It's less practical to put on a helmet, it's less practical to have one helmet for each person wanting to observe etc.

I mean, I don't want it to fail, I just don't see how it's current incarnation actually provides me with any real benefit over what is currently available other than the "wow" factor, because as much as we all love to say "wow", after extended exposure it's just going to become a "meh".

Wow man you have some weird preconceived notions of what VR is. Have you actually used a VR headset because it sounds like you really have no experience with any of them if you think people are into it because of the "wow" factor. Yes that is the experience a lot of people have at first but the reason its not fading away is because it offers a truly new way to experience things. Hell even making people walk up to a "ledge" with a huge drop off in VR causes people to get nervous because their brain can't tell they aren't actually about to walk off a cliff. You don't get that from regular TV's.

That said you also don't seem to get what I mentioned when I said VR devices used by scientists and doctors. Your whole Minority Report example once again makes me wonder if you have ever used one of these devices because what you are talking about is more akin to Kinect, not VR.

When I said doctors were using VR to help with research, and I'm searching for the article, its because VR allowed them to get a much better spatial awareness of an organ they were going to be doing surgery on than just looking at pictures in their hands or scrolling through them with a mouse on a computer screen. Its something you can't really do with our tech as is and VR allows for some really interesting new applications and uses.

Other examples I've seen is architects talking about creating buildings in the virtual realm and using VR head sets to explore them and look for issues and to just get a better feeling for their work than they could just looking at CAD drawings or going over blue prints.
 

ps3ud0

Member
Regarding some posts in the thread.

The facts:

- R&D on PSVR began long before Oculus Kickstarter was announced, with working prototypes.

- PSVR/Morpheus was officially announced before the Facebook buyout of Oculus.

- The Eyetoy was available at retail during the PS2 era, with many games released for it long before Kinect was a thought.
Thank you - its embarrassing to see so many uninformed posts, but not surprising...

ps3ud0 8)
 

benny_a

extra source of jiggaflops
Regarding some posts in the thread.

The facts:

- R&D on PSVR began long before Oculus Kickstarter was announced, with working prototypes.

- PSVR/Morpheus was officially announced before the Facebook buyout of Oculus.

- The Eyetoy was available at retail during the PS2 era, with many games released for it long before Kinect was a thought.
Another one:

Sony was working on a Natal project (EyeToy successor) with the company that Microsoft purchased to productize into Kinect, wasting years of Sony R&D.
 

OBias

Member
Another one:

Sony was working on a Natal project (EyeToy successor) with the company that Microsoft purchased to productize into Kinect, wasting years of Sony R&D.

Microsoft did not purchase PrimeSense. Apple did, though.
 

benny_a

extra source of jiggaflops
Microsoft did not purchase PrimeSense. Apple did, though.
Oh then what I said is wrong. It wasn't the purchase that put a lock on it, it must've been some exclusivity agreement as I'm not talking about the timeframe of V2.
 

Applecot

Member
Did Sony really have to make an investment in a product that we still don’t know how it’s going to turn out? Why not wait and see how gamers adopt this tech on PC and then release a PS5 with VR in mind from the beginning?

Because that's not how investment works and Sony have been pushing the field a fair bit longer than the current major players doing VR.
 
Wow man you have some weird preconceived notions of what VR is. Have you actually used a VR headset because it sounds like you really have no experience with any of them if you think people are into it because of the "wow" factor. Yes that is the experience a lot of people have at first but the reason its not fading away is because it offers a truly new way to experience things. Hell even making people walk up to a "ledge" with a huge drop off in VR causes people to get nervous because their brain can't tell they aren't actually about to walk off a cliff. You don't get that from regular TV's.

That said you also don't seem to get what I mentioned when I said VR devices used by scientists and doctors. Your whole Minority Report example once again makes me wonder if you have ever used one of these devices because what you are talking about is more akin to Kinect, not VR.

When I said doctors were using VR to help with research, and I'm searching for the article, its because VR allowed them to get a much better spatial awareness of an organ they were going to be doing surgery on than just looking at pictures in their hands or scrolling through them with a mouse on a computer screen. Its something you can't really do with our tech as is and VR allows for some really interesting new applications and uses.

Other examples I've seen is architects talking about creating buildings in the virtual realm and using VR head sets to explore them and look for issues and to just get a better feeling for their work than they could just looking at CAD drawings or going over blue prints.

(FYI, replying in reverse)

Those sound like good applications of VR, to the degree that I could realistically see businesses/institutions purchasing and making use of the tech. However, I'd argue that these are very "business/educational oriented" markets, rather than a wider "consumer" market.

I feel that on a consumer level (i.e Games/Media), VR doesn't really offer enough for it to be viable. If we first look at the barrier to entry, there's not only a large cost involved (Which admittedly could go down with time) but there's also technical and physical barriers to entry, not to mention the fact that we (as a society) are lazy.

When you look at statistics about things like mobile applications, there is a direct correlation between the amount of "clicks" it takes to get into an application, and the actual usage of said application (In other words, the more clicks to get to it, the fewer people using it). We're living in a time when people (Mass market) will actually not bother downloading/opening something if they can't get it immediately after clicking. I'll hold my hands up and admit to not playing a particular game because I couldn't be bothered waiting for the console to turn on, or because I couldn't be bothered inputting my password when I went to purchase it. We have become fickle.

With those kinds of attitudes very prevalent in the wild, do you really expect people to be putting on headsets, adjusting focal lengths and clearing floor space years or maybe even months down the line, just to play a particular game? It boils down to it not being practical.

There was a very interesting design "ethos" at Nintendo when they were making the Wii. They said that Videogames were "useless". That meant that a consumer wouldn't bother spending time to learn something if they didn't actually need it. They said that people don't care so much that their washing machines are complicated and confusing because they need them, but with a game? Just return it or don't bother buying it in the first place. As much as they have made some pretty big mistakes over the past few years, I whole-heartedly agree with their sentiment in that regard, and I see it as a huge issue for VR to overcome if it is to appeal to the mass-market.

I'm kinda running out of time on my lunch-break here so I can't really talk about VR content to a great extent, but I'll try to summarise. I don't feel that the differences you get between a VR game and a not VR game are enough to justify the effort required to get VR "up and running", and I also feel VR will be much more limited in the types of entertainment it can provide that truly do provide a different experience. (e.g I don't see any real benefit to playing a 3rd person game in VR. The only appeal I can see is rooted firmly in 1st person experiences)

Like I said before, I don't want VR to fail, because it's cool, but I don't think that it's current incarnation is going to be the "second coming of christ" that people seem to say it will be. It's Niche.
 

MUnited83

For you.
They were already researching the technology and making prototypes. The reaction to Ocilis Roft convinced them that it could have big market appeal and atarted working on a comercial version.
 

benny_a

extra source of jiggaflops
Osvr is $300 and the only thing stopping it from being ps4 compatible is Sony.
Really? They have prepared a full rebased codedump that enables OSVR functionality in the SDK and works immediately and the only reason it doesn't work on my home PS4 is because Sony is blocking it?

Where can I read about this?
 

madmackem

Member
Edit:


What, so I'm not allowed to reply with my opinion anymore? Thread asked why, I genuinely think "FOTM" is why. Call it Bandwagoning, "Me too!"-ing or whatever, but that's why I think they did it.

How in the hell can it be bandwagon jumping when you have links in this very thread with proof that it is anything but. They didn't just think Ahhh VR will make one too that's not how r&d works at any big consumer electronics firm r&d takes years and lots of money.
 

kyser73

Member
But but but some on here said they bandwagon jumped last week and stuff. Haha.

Those pictures are all faked.

Richard Marks is a phoney and Shu first thought of PSVR in the tub with Cerny after Zukcerberg popped round to wave his money in their faces.

IT'S ALL A SCAM!!
 

Krejlooc

Banned
Really? They have prepared a full rebased codedump that enables OSVR functionality in the SDK and works immediately and the only reason it doesn't work on my home PS4 is because Sony is blocking it?

Where can I read about this?

I'm talking about the hdk, durr
 

Croatoan

They/Them A-10 Warthog
ITT: Typical VR thread shitters who have never tried a VR device calling it a FAD, FOTM, etc without ANY understanding of the devices themselves.


On topic, Sony got into VR because in 20 years it will be the way we consume all forms of entertainment.
 

Croatoan

They/Them A-10 Warthog
(FYI, replying in reverse)

Those sound like good applications of VR, to the degree that I could realistically see businesses/institutions purchasing and making use of the tech. However, I'd argue that these are very "business/educational oriented" markets, rather than a wider "consumer" market.

I feel that on a consumer level (i.e Games/Media), VR doesn't really offer enough for it to be viable. If we first look at the barrier to entry, there's not only a large cost involved (Which admittedly could go down with time) but there's also technical and physical barriers to entry, not to mention the fact that we (as a society) are lazy.

When you look at statistics about things like mobile applications, there is a direct correlation between the amount of "clicks" it takes to get into an application, and the actual usage of said application (In other words, the more clicks to get to it, the fewer people using it). We're living in a time when people (Mass market) will actually not bother downloading/opening something if they can't get it immediately after clicking. I'll hold my hands up and admit to not playing a particular game because I couldn't be bothered waiting for the console to turn on, or because I couldn't be bothered inputting my password when I went to purchase it. We have become fickle.

With those kinds of attitudes very prevalent in the wild, do you really expect people to be putting on headsets, adjusting focal lengths and clearing floor space years or maybe even months down the line, just to play a particular game? It boils down to it not being practical.

There was a very interesting design "ethos" at Nintendo when they were making the Wii. They said that Videogames were "useless". That meant that a consumer wouldn't bother spending time to learn something if they didn't actually need it. They said that people don't care so much that their washing machines are complicated and confusing because they need them, but with a game? Just return it or don't bother buying it in the first place. As much as they have made some pretty big mistakes over the past few years, I whole-heartedly agree with their sentiment in that regard, and I see it as a huge issue for VR to overcome if it is to appeal to the mass-market.

I'm kinda running out of time on my lunch-break here so I can't really talk about VR content to a great extent, but I'll try to summarise. I don't feel that the differences you get between a VR game and a not VR game are enough to justify the effort required to get VR "up and running", and I also feel VR will be much more limited in the types of entertainment it can provide that truly do provide a different experience. (e.g I don't see any real benefit to playing a 3rd person game in VR. The only appeal I can see is rooted firmly in 1st person experiences)

Like I said before, I don't want VR to fail, because it's cool, but I don't think that it's current incarnation is going to be the "second coming of christ" that people seem to say it will be. It's Niche.

The bolded just proves you have never played a Room Scale VR game. Please tell me how Space Pirate Trainer, Vanishing Realms, Holoball, Holopoint, Hover Junkers, or any roomscale game would be better on a traditional screen or even possible?

Third person games are missing the point of VR, though RTS will be big for VR and its technically third person.

The current incarnation isn't the second coming of christ, it is the beginning of a paradigm shift that will see VR become the dominate means of entertainment consumption. It has a long way to go but it is not a FAD and it isn't going away.
 

jroc74

Phone reception is more important to me than human rights
Consumer electronics company is making a consumer electronics device. It's what they do.

They wanted to be one the first names associated with the new medium.

it's da future.

And they already had a head start over their competition in regards to ergonomics due to their HMZ series.

And this is the mentality that brought us annual Assassin's Creed copy-paste jobs: Avoid risks at all costs.

Is it a risky move on Sony's part? Yes. But that's how it works. If you keep playing it safe forever, at some point someone else who took a risk with something new is going to come along and make you look old. The question you should be asking isn't "what if VR isn't going to take off?" but "what if it is and Sony didn't invest in it?"


All this.
 

benny_a

extra source of jiggaflops
It's a output device. Your question is nonsensical. Of course it can work with the ps4, should Sony allow it to.
Of course it can work with the PS4. You, however, posit Sony is stopping it.

I want to read how they are stopping the active integration of PS4 support. Please back up your statement, as is usual in a discussion forum.
 
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