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Transistor
Banned
(07-13-2016, 02:32 PM)
One of the biggest debates I see in games (mostly TPS and FPS, though) is whether or not people prefer health packs or regenerating health. I think I prefer the classic approach of health packs. It gives a little more challenge to a game if you actually have to care about being hit.

Although, I think the game that handled it the best was Resistance: Fall of Man



The health bar in Resistance is divided into quarters. Your health will fill up the quarter it's in, but it won't go higher without finding a health pack to restore it. Gave a good balance to the two types.

So, GAF, what's your favorite method?
Renekton
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:33 PM)
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I prefer Tap()
Shahed
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:33 PM)
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Depends on the way the game is laid out to be honest. Health regen would break the design of pretty much every health pack style game.
Transistor
Banned
(07-13-2016, 02:34 PM)

Originally Posted by Renekton

I prefer Tap()

<3
superjona
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:34 PM)
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I'm fine with both really, but I do agree health packs add an extra layer of challenge.
DrZeus
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:34 PM)
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Originally Posted by Shahed

Depends on the way the game is laid out to be honest. Health regen would break the design of pretty much every health pack style game.

This.
No preference really.
Theorry
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:34 PM)
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Regen.
GankzyMcfly
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:35 PM)
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Originally Posted by Shahed

Depends on the way the game is laid out to be honest. Health regen would break the design of pretty much every health pack style game.

Exactly what i was thinking, a game like darksouls would be completely different with auto health regen.
SomedayTheFire
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:35 PM)
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multiple regenerating blobs of health.
Octavianus
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:37 PM)
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Health packs or go away.
In Service
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:38 PM)
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Regen. I think packs help players who play more often and know the locations. I don't play as much as I'd like to and think Regen is a little more balanced for me.
SprachBrooks
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:39 PM)
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Originally Posted by Shahed

Depends on the way the game is laid out to be honest. Health regen would break the design of pretty much every health pack style game.

This is more which design do you prefer.

And for me, I'm all for health regen.
Nere
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:41 PM)
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A combination of both like Far Cry 2-3.
Mman235
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:41 PM)
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Setting aside any specific opinions about the mechanics, even if they don't use health packs my favourite shooters overwhelmingly have some sort of limit on health regen and potential longer-term consequences for taking damage. So that.
Social
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:41 PM)
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Originally Posted by GankzyMcfly

Exactly what i was thinking, a game like darksouls would be completely different with auto health regen.

I might be able to play it with health regen! Mod please :)
Chola
Banned
(07-13-2016, 02:42 PM)
FAR CRY 2 health system

Originally Posted by Shahed

Depends on the way the game is laid out to be honest. Health regen would break the design of pretty much every health pack style game.

I prefer games that are designed around the health pack system
His Majesty
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:43 PM)
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Not a fan of health regen, especially in RPG's with an alchemy system.
AcePartyN7
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:43 PM)
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Mass Effect 3 and Halo Reach were the best

EmilioLargo
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:44 PM)
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Originally Posted by Shahed

Depends on the way the game is laid out to be honest. Health regen would break the design of pretty much every health pack style game.

Couldn't have said it better. The last sentence vice versa as well.
Krappadizzle
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:45 PM)
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Depends on the game design. Health packs work better at providing tension and regeneration works better if you are more concerned with telling a story(generally, not the rule).


I loved how Doom, Halo 1 and The Last of Us did it. But again, it depends on the game.
Chobel
I shouldn't make bets because every time I do my tag gets worse
(07-13-2016, 02:45 PM)
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I like Dark Souls approach: no health regeneration but your estus flask (health packs) get refilled every time you rest at the bonfire (checkpoint).
Metal-Geo
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:45 PM)
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There are two variants of health packs though: those effective immediately and those you can keep in your 'inventory'.

F.E.A.R. is the first shooter I played (at least, which comes to mind) with the latter system. Felt good pushing the tab key with my pinky during a hefty fight.

Anyway, depends on the game. Health packs obviously make level design a bigger challenge for the developers.
PreFire
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:46 PM)
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Either or.

I really like the far cry fix your dislocated finger or inject yourself with medicine animations.

Health regen should only happen if the damage is done to your (if you have one) suit, like halo.

I'd like realistic damage in games. If you're shot in the leg, you limp. If you're shot in the hand, you can't use it. If you're shot in the chest, your character staggers while your aiming is impaired, until you bleed out.

In CS, I always hated dinking someone with a headshot, only to give them 91 damage out of 100.. And they could run around at full speed like nothing happened, and can still win the round lol. Clutch
AppleSeason
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:46 PM)
I'm going to say regenerating health, but pretty much because I am so used to it that I have problems with classic health + armor. Playing Doom (2016) I would get killed all the time because I kept forgetting that health was not regenerating. In the end, it changes completely the way you play the game.
etp_
Junior Member
(07-13-2016, 02:46 PM)
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I prefer F8 or F9...whichever is quickload.

Healthpacks all the way.
Shrike_Priest
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:47 PM)
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Walking health packs.

Doom had a great system. The problem with regen is that it encourages hiding/playing defensively. But classic health packs which are placed at specific places can be problematic too (having to trek back, accidentally running over them while almost at full health etc.). Doom encourages you to melee minions instead, which makes you keep eyes out for low level enemies and get to them asap if you're running low. It provides a great dynamic.

It's a great mechanic for a "pure" action game. But like others have said, it depends. I loved the Med-pack system in TLOU, but think that regen works great in Uncharted because finding safe spots to avoid fire is central to the gameplay.
Nosgotham
Junior Member
(07-13-2016, 02:47 PM)
Perfect dark zero did it best.

You only regenerated health from certain damage. Melee damage, damage sustained from falls etc...

Damage from being shot did not regenerate
Fata1moose
Banned
(07-13-2016, 02:48 PM)
I just want the information conveyed properly. I like Halo CE with health packs, I also like Halo 5 that shows both your regenerating shield as well as health. Then there's Halo 2/3 where the health bar is invisible, which is quite annoying. The trend of red jelly on the screen was pretty terrible, though we seem to be getting away from that.
GRaider81
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:48 PM)
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Not really a fan of regen. It makes games too easy.

Too many times ive hidden behind some kind of cover waiting for health to regen before heading back out.

Trying to survive long enough to find the next health pack is way more challenging
MikeyB
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:48 PM)
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Originally Posted by Chola

FAR CRY 2 health system



I prefer games that are designed around the health pack system



The buddy system for extra lives was also genius.
ASIS
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:49 PM)
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I find myself leaning towards Health packs more. But regen does have its place of course.
JaseC
gave away the keys to the kingdom.
(07-13-2016, 02:50 PM)
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Health packs, generally, but regenerative health can have its place, as has been mentioned.
Krauser Kat
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:51 PM)
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the new DOOOM is fantastic in this regard. Kill more kill faster get more health. Be a little bitch and you best not mess up.
tebunker
Banned
(07-13-2016, 02:51 PM)
I don't like either method to be honest, and if I was forced to choose I like the health recovery in Bloodborne and the Souls games.

I really do like the games where you heal by beating enemies. So i guess that is closer to the health pack side.

Honestly it just seems so weird to be playing a game like Wolfenstein and pick up a med kit and gain 40 health. It is a little too gamey. On the other side, sitting behind a wall for ten seconds after absorbing 30 rounds and getting fully healed seems weird too, unless the game world is built around it. Like I get you regen health in Destiny the fiction is built with it
mclem
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:52 PM)
I don't really have a preference, provided the games are balanced around the method they choose; both have merits, both have disadvantages.

I wrote a piece about something a bit similar when I was talking about a difference in design between the Wizardry games and Might and Magic:

Originally Posted by mclem

I recall reading an interesting observation about the differences between the early Wizardry titles and the early Might & Magic titles along these lines which I think reflects a difference in philosophy which ties in to the central theme of this thread. Both games are old enough that save-anywhere really wasn't an option, but - along a similar theme - there were notable differences in how the two games approached regenerating resources (HP, SP) combined with the nature of combat.

Might and Magic, each individual fight is potentially dangerous unless you're reasonably overlevelled; there's usually going to be mechanics that can wipe out your characters if you're not suitably careful to plan around them. You can expect to use up significant amounts of resources in any given fight. However, you can rest in most places in the environment, and doing so removes most status ailments and fully recharges health and mana; each fight will generally be approached with a full set of resources.

In Wizardry, however, the individual fights aren't really all that unpleasant. A nasty status element here, an occasional big hit there, but in general a fully-powered team will have little difficulty with a fight. However, you can't regenerate resources - in general - unless you're in a town. In other words, Wizardry is balanced around the accumulation of fights.

I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with either approach, fundamentally. Both require different skills, both are valid approaches to game design - and ultimately, both have benefits and pitfalls.

More importantly - and I need to highlight this - there's nothing inherently more noble about beating a game designed around conquering the accumulation of challenge and managing resources than there is about beating a game designed around conquering individual tailored challenges. Or indeed vice-versa!

I think there's a similar issue with health packs and regenerating health; Regenerating Health is similar to the Might and Magic approach, where an individual encounter should have the potential to kill you, but you'll generally come into them at full strength; health packs are effectively the Wizardry approach, where the individual encounters can be quite simple in general, but the dangers stem from the accumulation of attrition through many encounters until the next pickup comes into view.

Health packs encourage you to be careful with conserving health, good
Health packs getting me into a situation where the right tactic was to take a four-minute roundtrip through cleared area to collect a health pack I didn't need at the time, bad.

Regenerating health ensuring that a fight can always be balanced around the assumption you're on full health, good.
Regenerating health making running and hiding from threats an easy way to trivialise many fights because the AI can't adapt to it, bad.

Advantages and disadvantages. I think I would say that given the choice, I'd go for regenerating health, just because I tend to resent situations where the smartest tactic is tedious; at least with running and hiding, there's the stress of whether you're discovered!

On a more general note, I think regenerating health is easier to balance well. That doesn't necessarily make it better, as such, but it means I can go into such a game with a little more confidence.
The Praiseworthy
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:53 PM)
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Health Packs... I prefer my games with them.
JDB
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:54 PM)
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Depends on the game obviously.
Jintor
Lit himself on fire to get
a mod to tag him
(07-13-2016, 02:55 PM)
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packs all day erry day

regen can work but not to full, i don't like the playstyle it encourages. Halo's health+shields was a nice mix I thought
Chaos2Frozen
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:57 PM)
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Either,

1) Auto regen up to a set amount like 30% to ensure bare minimum fighting fit condition at all times. (Wolfenstein?)

2) Fix amount of healing items that automatic refill upon checkpoint or death. (Dark Souls)

3) Regen shield but not health (Halo)

4) Recover health from defeating enemies (MGR)
Regiruler
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:57 PM)
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Neither.

Go the Red Steel 2 route: absolutely no healing mid-encounter, but you get healed completely when battle ends.
cuube
Junior Member
(07-13-2016, 02:58 PM)
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I prefer estus flasks.
SMG
Member
(07-13-2016, 02:59 PM)
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A segmented bar where each block regens but is lost if depleted. Health packs to regain blocks. Butcher Bay was the first time I saw such a system and I still like it.
thelatestmodel
Junior, please.
(07-13-2016, 02:59 PM)
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Packs, easily. Regen just feels like cheating - go and hide in a corner for a bit and you're good to go. There needs to be some kind of consumable to keep things exciting.
Coriolanus
Member
(07-13-2016, 03:01 PM)
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Hmm. Health packs, mainly if they drop on enemy death. Simply because it promotes aggressiveness. You cannot sit back and pick off your enemies one by one, you must charge.

If the system is adaptive, dropping more health the lower yours is, a la Doom 2016, that is what i'd consider ideal.

Plus with packs there's no reason to spread jello all over the screen.
-

Goldeneye also had a good system.
Darkologia
Member
(07-13-2016, 03:01 PM)
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RegenPack hybrid
jroc74
Phone reception is more important to me than human rights
(07-13-2016, 03:01 PM)
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I have no preference.

Like some have mentioned some games do a good balance. I like the example in the OP. I like how The Old Blood and New Order does it too.

I like how Borderlands does it. Its a mix and you can actually set the game up to your preference. If you want health regen, depending on which game get a regen shield and/or regen class mod, artifact, use skill points on regen skills.

If you dont want regen, dont equip any of those regen things, use skill points on regen skills.
xVodevil
Member
(07-13-2016, 03:01 PM)
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Medkits, easily!
Chola
Banned
(07-13-2016, 03:06 PM)
MGS 3 healing system was pretty unique, you can fill only your stamina and the stamina slowly refill your health. Heal your wounds to regain health faster or let the game fill it at a snail's pace
ghostjoke
Banned
(07-13-2016, 03:08 PM)
It can depend on the game and the way it is designed. Regen has a place, but I prefer health packs overall. While regen in theory makes the difficulty a lot easier to plan, I find it more often than not turns the game into a strange puzzler where the main test is figuring out the most optimal way through, and the rest of the time is huddled in a corner waiting to give the gameplay another shot - might as well save scum at this point. This does work nicely in stealth games though. Human Revolution stealth v guns blazing really shows how how the system aids one type of gameplay and fails the other (or even just the bosses).

The health bar sections system is another thing that sounds good, but I always find myself just keeping the bar full and using them up when I just can't stand waiting around any longer, and at that point I'd rather just have a health pack stationed behind the enemy swarm. Works nicely in Far Cry until you're forced to get into a large gun fight and then you're back to hiding in corner sucking your thumb.

New Wolfenstein had a good system and then new DOOM took it to the next level. Regen can be good, just give it some depth.
Galactic Barret
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(07-13-2016, 03:10 PM)
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Usually, I prefer regen simply due to the handful of healthpack FPS' boxing me into a corner after/during enemy engagement, causing me to be killed right before a checkpoint.

I like the idea of enemies dropping health after defeat or the hybrid system; I don't want to sit in a corner waiting for my health to go back to full, but I also hate to have to scour a map looking for a medpack with a sliver of health and the imminent threat of death should I venture out of cover.

I did enjoy Max Payne 3's method of 'headshot for a health bonus', though. I abused the shit out of slow-mo dive for that very reason.

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