Project Offset - Shadowing Dev Blog

[Salazar]

It's only a very short blog, and I'm not sure how technically interesting or revolutionary it is - but I am a drooling fanboy for this game and this proves it exists and is moving. The boxes and goblin models do look good, too. Bit of a goddamned tease, really. Anyone with graphics know-how want to pass comment / judgement ?

http://www.projectoffset.com/blog.php?id=83

I’ve recently been working on a new feature for the Offset Engine: real time ambient occlusion. I took some ideas from Crysis and some other developers (most notably Inigo Quilez…thanks Inigo!) who have been working on similar techniques and made a few improvements over those approaches that makes the effect much more convincing, IMO. For those not familiar with the term, ambient occlusion is a way of approximating global illumination by computing how much a point is occluded by other geometry in the scene (good overview at http://www-viz.tamu.edu/students/bmo...7/ambocc/)It’s not quite ready for prime time yet, and currently requires quite a bit of tweaking to get it looking good in different situations, but I thought I’d show you some WIP comparison screenshots (attached). It works as a post process and requires no precomputation, and works with moving and deforming objects. It currently requires deferred rendering to be turned on, though I may be able to get around this dependency As you can see from the comparison shots, it improves the quality of the rendered scene significantly! The first shot showing the boxes is lit in a very boring way intentionally (a single sky light placed in the editor) to highlight the benefit of the technique.

[~Devil Trigger~]

k

[AndoCalrissian]

Looks good, but they really need to show more of the game. Show a multiplayer match from a couple of different viewpoints (i.e. different classes, mounts).

[FunkyMunkey]

k

*sigh*

Anyways, I'm glad other devs are taking steps to actually show off their games. It's amazing how some devs just let a game slip by and then are surprised by disappointing sales.

[Zilch]

Realtime ambient occlusion is something that would definitely set 'next-gen' games apart from 'last-gen' ones. I wonder if X360 or PS3 will be able to handle engines with this feature.

[Jackson]

*sigh* Anyways, I'm glad other devs are taking steps to actually show off their games. It's amazing how some just let a game slip by and then are surprised by disappointing sales.

nine times out of ten marketing or lack there of has nothing to do with the developer

[FunkyMunkey]

nine times out of ten marketing or lack there of has nothing to do with the developer

But no attempts at blogs or showing-off by the devs is baffling to me nowadays. Especially in the age we live in.

[kenta]

Realtime ambient occlusion is something that would definitely set 'next-gen' games apart from 'last-gen' ones. I wonder if X360 or PS3 will be able to handle engines with this feature.

I'm 99% sure Killzone 2 has ambient occlusion, I want to say that one presentation PDF on the game's engine was the first time I'd heard the phrase

Edit: Looks like it was indeed in that PDF but listed as a "planned feature"

[WHOAguitarninja]

Wow that really does look nice. I've said in the past that AO needs to be this gen's "big graphics trick" and it seems some developers are starting to respond in their games (Crysis, The new Splinter Cell, I think Halo 3 had it on the characters). It adds a LOT to the look without being overly standoutish.

[LCGeek]

Realtime ambient occlusion is something that would definitely set 'next-gen' games apart from 'last-gen' ones. I wonder if X360 or PS3 will be able to handle engines with this feature.

Ubsifot is trying it with the new SC game I believe other devs have problem is this method of rendering needs a lot of power the more complex a scene and not even pc currently have enough to keep the same object complexity and do it this without issue in rendering.

[Kittonwy]

It's only a very short blog, and I'm not sure how technically interesting or revolutionary it is - but I am a drooling fanboy for this game and this proves it exists and is moving. The boxes and goblin models do look good, too. Bit of a goddamned tease, really. Anyone with graphics know-how want to pass comment / judgement ? http://www.projectoffset.com/blog.php?id=83

When are they finally going to show this game?

[Salazar]

When their secret publisher decides the time is right, I guess. A bunch of people seem to think GDC, but I don't think anybody's telling. Non-disclosure seems to mean what it says, which is probably good for the game but sucks in general.

[~Devil Trigger~]

im just tired of Tech porn from them

[Zilch]

Wow that really does look nice. I've said in the past that AO needs to be this gen's "big graphics trick" and it seems some developers are starting to respond in their games (Crysis, The new Splinter Cell, I think Halo 3 had it on the characters). It adds a LOT to the look without being overly standoutish.

Absolutely. It's good to see some devs are trying to incorporate it.

Maybe GI or FG next gen? Please?

[killakiz]

He alludes to deferred rendering which i have only heard being used with PS3 development, i can dream cant i?

[LCGeek]

Absolutely. It's good to see some devs are trying to incorporate it. Maybe GI or FG next gen? Please?

Global Illumination well true is so far off still for games we are at the point we have a lot of hacks and approxmiations but the power is still lacking. B3D has a next gen gpu topic discussion, actually discussion on the next generation not this one, on the subject it highlights problems current related to console and pcs in rendering along with a solid idea of what could happen based on the past.

[Ether_Snake]

Yeah I like such articles, I'm hoping the guys at Project Offset will show more of their tech, I like it. The game itself will be shown when it is ready to be shown.

[Barry Lightning]

they need to just sell the tech already to highest bidder and then go get nice plush jobs somewhere. this thing is going to get old fast, lest they continually "update" it to stay afresh :/

[Salazar]

they need to just sell the tech already to highest bidder and then go get nice plush jobs somewhere. this thing is going to get old fast, lest they continually "update" it to stay afresh :/

I'd consider making a kickass (and perhaps now high budget) game a nice plush job.

[M3d10n]

BTW, does someone has a good link to an article or something on Crysis' ambient occlusion techniques?

[Mario]

But no attempts at blogs or showing-off by the devs is baffling to me nowadays. Especially in the age we live in.

In a lot of cases, developers with publishing deals are restricted from doing even that, even if its your own IP.

[civilstrife]

Yeah, this is going to be one of those games that if it comes out, will end up looking average compared to what's out there already. It's the S.T.A.L.K.E.R effect.

[Ether_Snake]

Yeah, this is going to be one of those games that if it comes out, will end up looking average compared to what's out there already. It's the S.T.A.L.K.E.R effect.

Why would it? They don't have to make final assets until much later in production. All they need to work on are SFX, Shaders, AI, Physics, and Lighting. The quality of the graphics will be a result of that, and it doesn't take a lot of time to model and texture. If their planning sucks tho, which is the case pretty much across the board in the industry, then yes the graphics won't be as nice as they could be. But I doubt that is the case.

The only aspect which I think they absolutely need to invest time in over the obvious mentioned above is animations. Battlefield 2 still has some of the best FPS animations out there, and we are due for something better considering this game will have hand-to-hand combat.

EDIT: Oh and they are looking for a 360 programmer, so a 360 version is for sure. There is also a lot more info than I remember on the game's story.

It seems to be a description of each possible character choice (two choices, crossing story?).

Haidar the Warrior

The persuit Redemption

This is the story of a Haidar a loyal servent to an evil king. You have justified your actions your entire life but on this day you have commited crimes not worthy of forgiveness. Your story starts inside a temple in the heart of the mountains where a massacre has occured. You have stolen an artifact of great importance and are in route back to Abinden Castle. You will experience the aftermath of a village destroyed by goblins, witness the fall of your own kingdom and have the future placed on your shoulders.


A Goblin's tale

The pursuit of revenge

This is the tale of Jöktan, a goblin motivated by revenge for the years of attacks the humans have brought upon them. As a goblin, you will arrive on shore by ship, destroy and capture a fishing village, then further invade and eventually bring down the great Abinden Castle. You will become the hero of your people.

[AndoCalrissian]

When are they finally going to show this game?

It does have a short trailer showing supposed gameplay, but I don't think we can be sure if it's real gameplay or not.

Check it out here.

EDIT: On second thought I think it probably is actual gameplay.

[Ether_Snake]

Errr actually there is loads more info about the game than I knew about!

[miyuru]

So is this like self-shadowing but it involves all objects in the scene or...?

[AndoCalrissian]

Errr actually there is loads more info about the game than I knew about!

That's interesting. Not sure what I think about that. It seems odd that there's always one class that trumps another rather than a class being balanced against all of the other classes with pros and cons.

[AndoCalrissian]

So is this like self-shadowing but it involves all objects in the scene or...?

It's like shadowing that takes into account how light and shadow interact with objects and reflect/block. So instead of just having something in shadow or out of shadow, you have light from another direction or that's been reflected off of other surfaces filling in part of that shadow.

It's like if you turn on an overhead light and then hold your hand underneath it a few inches over a table. The shadow underneath your hand isn't completely black because light is bouncing off of other surfaces in the room and coming in beneath your hand.

The closer you move your hand to the table, the darker the center of the shadow becomes. This is because even though the same amount of light is hitting your hand from the direct source (the light) and the reflection of the source (walls and other objects reflecting light), less can get directly beneath your hand due to the angle.

At least, that's the concept I think.

[Ether_Snake]

So is this like self-shadowing but it involves all objects in the scene or...?

Hmm it's more complex than that. It has nothing to do with lights actually.

Imagine that a scene is by default 100% bright. Now take a ball and bring it close to the wall. The surface of the ball will "occlude" the ambient "lighting" and hence the surface of the wall, causing a darkened area on the wall. It's not a shadow, it's surfaces "occluding" global illumination. Imagine everything is emanating negative light, which is only visible when surfaces are close to one another:p

All in all, the reason this is highly desired in video games is not only because of the adde realism "feel", but especially because it enables everything objects to feel as if they were really present, not floating. It blends everything together nicely.

EDIT: I'll post a demonstration in a sec.

[Ether_Snake]

Notice how lighting itself has nothing to do with the AO pass (the shadows casted by the light are not taken into account during the calculation). And notice how the surfaces' relation to one another is causing "occlusion".




And on a more complex scene, showing how it helps to "blend" everything together (around the brick and the edge of the mouth, around the wooden poles where they touch against the wall, etc., basically wherever surfaces are closer to one another, notice how the mouth surface seemed to be floating without AO, not really touching the bricks):

[Brimstone]

Here is a more detailed breakdown of the classes.

Player Classes All of the characters in our game share the same core combat mechanic but each has been specialized into well known fantasy genre classes such as Warriors, Wizards, and Assassins. These classes not only differentiate a character’s play style, keeping the single player fresh, but they also create key battlefield roles that player’s can assume in multiplayer matches; encouraging teamwork and cooperation. The Wheel of Power: Every class has a Boon and a Bane. For instance, Wizards are vulnerable to stealth and backstabs, Engineers can see those in stealth with their goggles giving the Engineer the advantage. This balancing act helps to solidify a team-oriented system designed to promote cooperation when facing multiple opponents - no one hero is superior to every opponent on the battlefield. The following diagram further illustrates the power offsets defined by classes Warriors charge to the front lines of battle wielding powerful, two-handed axes or swords while donning protective armor capable of sustaining immense punishment. The Warrior's battle-cries fuel his rage where lesser soldiers would have been overcome by fatigue and injury. His mighty strength enables him to tear through shields and slam into enemies with concussive effects. Races: Human, Satyrii Weapon Set: Repeating Crossbow & Two Handed Sword Skills Cry of Deadly Rage Shield-Breaking Blow Boomerang Shoulder Slam Engineers supply invaluable support to their allies with additional ammunition, the repairing and construction of key objectives on the battlefield and the ability to deploy traps. The goggles these soldiers wear also enable them to see through the dark magic of Wizards and the stealth of hiding Assassins. Races: Dwarf, Goblin Weapon Set: Blunderbuss & Two Handed Axe Skills Create Ammunition Place Trap Goggles Naphtha Grenade Paladins revive fallen comrades and heal injuries while relying upon their protective shields to defend them from projectiles. Their massive flails and heavy hammers have been blessed to purify the corruption of Darkness and their ability to manage groups of enemies makes them invaluable in large encounters. Races: Human, Satyrii Weapon Set: Flail & Heavy Crossbow Skills Light of Truth Heal Holy Armor Mezmerize Assassins may vanish into their surroundings and perform swift kills from behind. Their trusty grappling hook enables them to reach vantages perfect for their long-range sniping attacks. Coating their blades with a Mana-draining toxin, even the most powerful of Wizards have reason to fear Assassins. Races: Dark Elf, Wood Elf Weapon Set: Long Bow & Twin Daggers Skills Grappling Hook Poison Gas Bomb Stealth Spellbane Thistle Poison Wizards wield the awesome powers of the arcane to channel deadly spells that may deluge an open field with piercing shards of ice, immolate foes in torrents of flames, enshroud their surroundings in an unnatural darkness or shock enemies in an array of surging energies. The Wizard's powerful staves focus elemental rage upon large groups but require the expenditure of precious Mana with every spell cast. Races: Human Weapon Set: Fire Staff, Ice Staff, or Dark Staff Skills Deflection Sphere Gust of Wind Veil of Darkness Enchant Weapon Mounts Bestial Mounts in our game will be utilized as vehicles, serving both transport and combat roles. We seek to create a dynamic between mounted and infantry players in a way similar to the Battlefield™ games but we will expand on this interaction by treating the mounts as intelligent creatures, giving them allegiance to their controlling faction and allowing them to emote pain, fear, and rage in combat. Siege Troll Siege Trolls will be the "tanks" in our game. Thick-skinned and largely resistant to infantry attacks, Siege Trolls will dominate infantry engagements, destroy villages, and tear down castle gates Razorback The Boar mount can be thought of as an Armored Personel Carrier (APC). It is a four passenger, medium speed gunning platform with a powerful trample attack and at least half cover for all of its occupants. The driver will primarily be responsible for driving the beast, executing it's trample/goring attacks, and providing a stable platform for his gunners. Two of the passengers will have gunning positions with repeating heavy crossbows and a third passenger will occupy the upper basket, utilizing their ranged weapons and class abilities. Battle Lizard The Battle Lizard will be a fast attack beast and will provide a more traditional, single person mount for our players. It will be nimble and allow riders to use their ranged and melee weapons, class abilities, and the Lizard’s powerful bite attack while mounted.

[Hyoushi]

im just tired of Tech porn from them

So what are you doing in this thread again?

[Salazar]

I'll take as much tech porn as this generation is willing to give me, to be honest. In this particular case, with a game that appears to have skated on stupidly thin ice for ages and is still mysterious, any sign of life let alone development is awesome.

Hell, I'd kill dolphins for even Surfer Girl-level info about this game.

[RTS83]

I always thought that this game was going to be a free-roam RPG a la Morrowind/Oblivion...

No mention of a continent on the website, and the inclusion of online multi-player tells me this will have levels.

That depresses me, the fantasy genre needs to be sandbox...its because of the graphics I bet...too big for a DVD9 (I know...I know...) I wish they'd cancel the 360 version and make the Morrowind I always wanted on the PC/PS3 (maybe on the PS3)

[Falagard]

Screen space AO is the new big thing, similar to how parallax mapping was the new big thing a couple years ago. Crysis recentlyi published a small paper about SSAO and everyone is jumping on getting it working.

I've been working on it myself as seen in this thread:

http://www.ogre3d.org/phpBB2/viewtop...er=asc&start=0

Should be possible on both the 360 and PS3 though I'm not sure about using it in practice as it does have quite a performance hit.

It's being used in Little Big Planet and is one of the things that makes that game "pop".

[Salazar]

That depresses me, the fantasy genre needs to be sandbox...its because of the graphics I bet...too big for a DVD9 (I know...I know...) I wish they'd cancel the 360 version and make the Morrowind I always wanted on the PC/PS3 (maybe on the PS3)

A fantasy FPS with balanced attention to single and multiplayer is so much more desirable and intriguing than a clone RPG. As for wishing they'd cancel the 360 version - nope. I do wonder why there isn't a PS3 version listed, and I certainly wouldn't begrudge it, but gtfo.

[Ether_Snake]

For those who still don't understand that the website itself provides info on the game:p

1.)
What kind of game is Project Offset (working Title)?
Project Offset (working title) is a action game within a fantasy setting containing FPS elements. At its core, the game relies more on player skill and coordination than equipment & ranks.

2.)
What platforms will this game be released on?
As of this writing, Project Offset (working title) is planned for released on windows-based PCs and Xbox 360

3.)
When will this game be released?
The official date for this project has not been announce at this time.

4.)
Is Project Offset (working title) a Massively-Multiplayer On-line Role-Playing Game (MMORPG)?
No. Project Offset (working title) is a single-player/multiplayer action game.

5.)
I want to join the team! How do I submit my application?
Current position openings may be found here. Simply follow the instructions listed below the position(s) you are applying for.

6.)
"(Working Title)"? What Gives?
Project Offset is the code name for the game currently in development. Its true name has not been officially announce and, upon its official announcement, will replace the working title currently displayed.

7.)
Will Project Offset (working title) be Mod-Friendly?
As with all PCs titles, game modifications (mods) help add to a game's longevity. Offset Software realizes this and will release tools to help potential mod-makers create new material for extended play.