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(NPD) Next Generation Tie Ratio's Revealed

S

sonycowboy

Member
Thanks to Credit Suisse:

PS3 4.01
Wii 3.86 (not including Wii Sports)
360 6.85

Overall hardware units were up 26% y/y counting current and next gen consoles and handheld sales. The PS3 was up 285% sequentially and 137% y/y and the tie ratio improved to 4.01 from last month's 3.82. The Wii increased 89% sequentially and 106% y/y, with a tie ratio of 3.86, not including the Wii Sports title bundled with the system. The Xbox 360 was up 51% y/y and up 110% sequentially, while maintaining a strong life-to-date tie ratio of 6.85. NDS sales rose 67% y/y, while PSP increased 38%.
 
L

Leonsito

Member
Given that a lot of people buy Wii only for Wii Sports is a bit unfair not counting it for the tie ratios.

And, go 360 !
 
P

Penguin

Member
RSTEIN said:
must buy moar games \O.0/
Click to expand...
How many games does Wolverine star in?

Tie in ratio for Wii is kind of sad, but a good portion of people do pick it up for Wii Sports, but would hope would venture outside of that and Wii Play.
 
T

ToxicAdam

Member
Not much of a surprise here and will probably stay like this for the rest of the generation.


The big story of this generation is the demographic of user that the 360 has. They buy EVERYTHING. If a company is smart, they research who that user is and target them next generation.
 
B

botticus

Member
ToxicAdam said:
Not much of a surprise here and will probably stay like this for the rest of the generation.


The big story of this generation is the demographic of user that the 360 has. They buy EVERYTHING. If a company is smart, they research who that user is and target them next generation.
Click to expand...
Isn't MS doing that right now? Remains to be seen exactly how many of those people there are.
 
S

supermackem

Banned
Leonsito said:
Given that a lot of people buy Wii only for Wii Sports is a bit unfair not counting it for the tie ratios.

And, go 360 !
Click to expand...

Erm in the west it comes with the console free, so erm 100% tie in ratio.:lol
 
S

sonycowboy

Member
ToxicAdam said:
Not much of a surprise here and will probably stay like this for the rest of the generation.


The big story of this generation is the demographic of user that the 360 has. They buy EVERYTHING. If a company is smart, they research who that user is and target them next generation.
Click to expand...

Tie ratios grow EVERY MONTH.

Consider HW sales in a given month. Say 250k (outside of the holidays). Once your installed base say 8M is out there, it's automatic that the existing HW base buys more SW than the tie ratio.

That is: SW Sales For Month > Tie Ratio * HW Sales for Month.
 
G

gofreak

GAF's Bob Woodward
These are LTD?

If so, in half the time, Wii and PS3 have achieved well over half of 360's. Do people buy less in their second year, or did 360 have a relatively poorer first year?
 
F

FrankT

Member
gofreak said:
These are LTD?

If so, in half the time, Wii and PS3 have achieved well over half of 360's. Do people buy less in their second year, or did 360 have a relatively poorer first year?
Click to expand...

Logic fails. Averages over time.
 
C

Cool Hand Luke

Banned
Microsoft can't keep this up for the whole generation. If they do, the tie ratio for 360 will be out of this world. I mean, nearly seven games per console after two years? That has to be some kind of all time record.
 
J

Jokeropia

Member
Sho_Nuff82 said:
Bu bu but weeks of ownership.
Click to expand...
Yes? Average weeks of ownership is a pretty relevant stat if you wanna find out how prominent game purchasers the owners of a particular system are. It's the reason Xbox, Gamecube and PS2 still all have significantly better tie-ratios than the 360.
 
G

gofreak

GAF's Bob Woodward
Jtyettis said:
Logic fails. Averages over time.
Click to expand...

So this is weighted for time on the market? Not a simple average number of titles sold per system? That would explain it, but that wasn't very clear (to me, at least).
 
M

mr_bishiuk

Banned
Cool Hand Luke said:
Microsoft can't keep this up for the whole generation. If they do, the tie ratio for 360 will be out of this world. I mean, nearly seven games per console after two years? That has to be some kind of all time record.
Click to expand...


Especially when you factor in the fact the RROD issue must have had a big negative impact on the ratio
 
S

sonycowboy

Member
gofreak said:
These are LTD?

If so, in half the time, Wii and PS3 have achieved well over half of 360's. Do people buy less in their second year, or did 360 have a relatively poorer first year?
Click to expand...

Tie ratio's don't increase linearly over time. 360 launched with essentially a 4 tie ratio and has been going up more rapidly than any system in history. That being said, it's not actually selling record amounts of SW, as the PS2 sold more due to much higher HW sales over the same period. But the rate at which 360 sells SW relative to the HW base (that is, the tie ratio) is unparalleled.
 
M

mr_bishiuk

Banned
sonycowboy said:
Tie ratio's don't increase linearly over time. 360 launched with essentially a 4 tie ratio and has been going up more rapidly than any system in history. That being said, it's not actually selling record amounts of SW, as the PS2 sold more due to much higher HW sales over the same period. But the rate at which 360 sells SW relative to the HW base (that is, the tie ratio) is unparalleled.
Click to expand...

So it it almost 7 titles per console per year then? If so i'm gobsmaked!
 
G

gofreak

GAF's Bob Woodward
sonycowboy said:
Tie ratio's don't increase linearly over time.
Click to expand...

That answers my question. And I suppose it makes total sense given that at the end of any given year, after year one, not every owner will have had the system for its lifetime (but perhaps just a few months or whatever). Early adopters may have lots of titles, but newer owners obviously won't etc.
 
I

Imperial Hot

Banned
I have been wondering what the tie ratio was for the 360. It seems that all my friends, that are casual players, have been buying a lot more games for their 360 than they have for other consoles.
 
V

Visualante

Member
Considering the price of Wii software and the fact that it has be positioned as a family system more than a gamer's system- that's terrible.
 
A

AirBrian

Member
mr_bishiuk said:
Especially when you factor in the fact the RROD issue must have had a big negative impact on the ratio
Click to expand...
Has it been confirmed that returns are not counted? I always thought returns/exchanges did not affect sold-through sales since the first, broken console is effectively being returned to inventory (and then written off).
 
B

Blimblim

The Inside Track
mr_bishiuk said:
So it it almost 7 titles per console per year then? If so i'm gobsmaked!
Click to expand...
Every single Xbox 360 owner has on average 7 titles. They may have bought that console 2 years ago, or 1 month ago.
 
M

mr_bishiuk

Banned
AirBrian said:
Has it been confirmed that returns are not counted? I always thought returns/exchanges did not affect sold-through sales since the first, broken console is effectively being returned to inventory (and then written off).
Click to expand...

No but many people have bought 2nd units instead of sending there's back.

Also many people like myself have upgraded to Elites and Falcons to avoid the RROD.
 
H

HK-47

Oh, bitch bitch bitch.
Wow some people dont understand tie ratios.

Its a little disheartening to see the Wii lagging. I guess Wii Fit has a big chance to increase the ratio since its targeting the people who just bought Wii for Wii Sports. Them not pricing BBA Wii as a budget game in the US looks really foolish right now.
 
M

mr_bishiuk

Banned
Blimblim said:
Every single Xbox 360 owner has on average 7 titles. They may have bought that console 2 years ago, or 1 month ago.
Click to expand...


AAHHHHh that makes sense now,

Now I see why the ration is so incredible on 360, the console has sold what 1.5m consoles over the last 3 months, a significant proportion of the total US sales but yet the ratio has held up high.

This then explains why the Wii is lower than the PS3 as it is always constantly adding huge amounts of new users with no game library and therefore are bringing down the average.
 
Xisiqomelir

Xisiqomelir

Member
Last-gen ratios plz

EDIT:

ToxicAdam said:
The big story of this generation is the demographic of user that the 360 has. They buy EVERYTHING. If a company is smart, they research who that user is and target them next generation.
Click to expand...

Is this really the best overall strategy? Surely trying to achieve mass-market appeal like the NES/Wii/PS2/DS is better than microspecializing. You'll be able to sell all genres of software instead of the more limited selection that a narrower demographic buys.
 
G

gofreak

GAF's Bob Woodward
Visualante said:
Considering the price of Wii software and the fact that it has be positioned as a family system more than a gamer's system- that's terrible.
Click to expand...

'Families' don't buy games in my experience. Mom and pop might enjoy wii sports, but translating that into getting THEM to actually go to a store and buy a game is another matter, versus depending on whoever introduced the system into the house (often a gamer) to buy the games. That's the way it is with most Wii owners I know anyway. They're really the only ones buying the games, even if their families and parents etc. like a go on it now and then.

It might also partially explain the puzzling numbers on some 'gamer games' in Japan recently, for example - I tend to buy Wii games I think the family will enjoy rather than solitary experiences that only I'm likely to be engaged by. The only real exception so far has been Mario Galaxy.
 
A

AirBrian

Member
mr_bishiuk said:
No but many people have bought 2nd units instead of sending there's back.

Also many people like myself have upgraded to Elites and Falcons to avoid the RROD.
Click to expand...
Well I would wager that the number of people who have picked up a second 360 is pretty insignificant as a percentage and not much of a factor here. I'm sure the percentage is higher on GAF, but most people are not going to just spend another $400 when you can simply return your broken item at none to little cost.
 
V

Visualante

Member
gofreak said:
'Families' don't buy games in my experience. Mom and pop might enjoy wii sports, but translating that into getting THEM to actually go to a store and buy a game is another matter, versus depending on whoever introduced the system into the house (often a gamer) to buy the games. That's the way it is with most Wii owners I know anyway. They're really the only ones buying the games, even if their families and parents etc. like a go on it now and then.
Click to expand...
Then the marketing is failing at selling software to the types of people who feature in said adverts. The whole plan was to convert a family unit into gaming consumers- the games are there on the shelves. Are they honestly satisfied with the length of the average Wii title?
 
K

Kiriku

SWEDISH PERFECTION
Sonycowboy, do you have any tie ratios for handhelds? I'm curious to see exactly how bad PSP is doing, but I'm actually more interested in seeing how the DS is performing. I recall GBA having a pretty low tie ratio (compared to consoles), so I'm wondering if DS is moving along the same path?
 
M

Mudo

Member
I never really thought about how many 360 games I have so I went and counted. I have 13 right now, but have owned at least that many more than I've since gotten rid of. I don't know much about tie ratios so 7 didn't "wow" me (7-ish) but good to know it's doing well.
 
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