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65536 · Jan 4, 2008

Livin_Lovin said:
Don't ever PC game. Ever. Your little heart will break.

A PC capable of running the latest games with their 12GB installs probably has at least 500GB in it though.

A PS3 that has games requiring 5GB installs can have as little as 20GB, which means you would have to start removing/reinstalling games all the time if you have more than three, possibly less if you're using it for music/movies/photos/ps1 games/PSN too. If required installs of this size start becoming the norm, the 360 with its non-standard hard drive looks like a better idea all the time.

There's nothing wrong with having optional installs, as long as they can be removed at any time without affecting things, but they should not be requited.

EDIT:

Livin_Lovin said:
Just wondering, do you rip CDs into mp3s? Or download anything off of the internet? 20 minutes isn't even a proper episode of Scrubs.

I can do other things at the same time as ripping a CD or downloading anything off the internet on a PC. The PS3 is stuck there doing nothing but the install. I bought consoles to get away from installing games.

DantesWrath · Jan 4, 2008

Orobi said:
Taken from the PS3 manual of DMC4:
Into the options menu, you can enable the motion sensor:
Motion Sensor
With the Motion Sensor ON, turn the controller left and right to move the camera.
To quickly set the camera behind your character, shake the controller vigorously.

That's kinda cool. I never use the right analog stick to move the camera because my thumb is always occupied, so this might prove useful with a little practice.

Steroyd · Jan 4, 2008

Xater said:
No ther is more aliasing and flickering shadows on the PS3. So they are not equal. :lol

Damn curse Capcom AND THEIR SHITTY PORTS!

cedric69 said:
:lol No, seriously :lol

What the fuck is this shit? Now being forced to sit in front of the TV is proper console gaming?

Yes? :lol :lol :lol

Jeff-DSA said:
PS3 Achievements don't mean much now, however, and I don't think many would argue in favor of them.

Wait wait wait... what tips you to choose the Xbox 360 version over the PS3 is Achievements yet the PS3 HAS achievements and they don't mean much now?

So you lied when you said...

Jeff-DSA said:
I would have liked to have seen an even experience on both platforms.

:lol

rockman zx · Jan 4, 2008

Maggot9 said:
damn capcom, still cant afford to use colour in your instruction booklets?

Thats from a pdf of the EURO booklet, the real booklet or the american booklet could be in colour.

Valkyr Junkie · Jan 4, 2008

The best part is that if the install was optional (as in you were presented an option after first boot; not that the option to install is buried deep in the options menu) not a single person would choose NOT to install the data. People are A) whining about nothing or B) weren't planning on getting the PS3 version anyways.

Malleymal · Jan 4, 2008

5 pages...

1 hour and some change

Defuser · Jan 4, 2008

This thread have reach the rock bottom of retardedness....
Seriously,will 25 mins of installation kill you?I bet you all spent time on GAF bitching is more than 25 mins...

andrewfee said:
I bought consoles to get away from installing games.

Did it kill your family or something? You're acting like it's a bad thing.

Steroyd · Jan 4, 2008

andrewfee said:
A PC capable of running the latest games with their 12GB installs probably has at least 500GB in it though.

A PS3 that has games requiring 5GB installs can have as little as 20GB, which means you would have to start removing/reinstalling games all the time if you have more than three, possibly less if you're using it for music/movies/photos/ps1 games/PSN too. If required installs of this size start becoming the norm, the 360 with its non-standard hard drive looks like a better idea all the time.

There's nothing wrong with having optional installs, as long as they can be removed at any time without affecting things, but they should not be requited.

Why would a PC have at least 500GB?

The 20GB PS3 got phased out remember?

Kintaro · Jan 4, 2008

Wow, this thread got hit with an Amazing Combo of Stupid.

Also, didn't Shane say that during the installation, there's a cool recap of events leading up to DMC4 that plays? STFU, eat some dinner and catch up on the story.

Livin_Lovin · Jan 4, 2008

Hellraizer said:
Yes and yes, however you cant compare a CD rip with a complete installation of a game, and my big concern is as I said, if this becomes a standard, then you will keep reinstalling a lot of games, when you run out of space (never had that problem with my music...)

I'm just concerned and absolutely not happy about such "features" on consoles and how this will look like in the future...

Probably the same...unfortunately

I'm sorry, but all "space" issues are pretty null to me as people have bitching about space since the 360 launched with a 20 GB HDD, 13 GBs of space and 1.5 GB demos. On every system, you have to manage space.

If you buy a bunch of VC games, you'll run out of space on the Wii. If you download a lot of movies and demos, you'll run out of space on the 360. In this case, if you want the game to run at maximum speed, you'll need to install it.

I can remember people bitching about memory card space when they learned that CDs on the PS1 could save files on the CD itself.

SolidSnakex · Jan 4, 2008

Steroyd said:
Wait wait wait... what tips you to choose the Xbox 360 version over the PS3 is Achievements yet the PS3 HAS achievements and they don't mean much now?

The 360 version adds to your gamerscore so you get to show your friends how awesome you are.

Danne-Danger · Jan 4, 2008

andrewfee said:
If required installs of this size start becoming the norm, the 360 with its non-standard hard drive looks like a better idea all the time.

Jesus, all that spinning must be making you dizzy.

ThirstyFly · Jan 4, 2008

5GB for a mandatory install is a bit excessive (especially for our 20GB brothers). I only have 6 games and I'm already at 5GB of installed game data, not including game saves, PS/PS2 virtual memory cards, demos or PSN games. And only one of those games had the install data actually optional (2.4GB for Time Crisis 4). Thankfully some of the games (Uncharted and CoD4) either had no install data, or it's so small it's not even worth mentioning.

While it may not seem like a huge issue now, think later on down the road when we all have bigger game libraries. Not all of us want to spend another $100 to upgrade an already expensive console (not to mention the absurd notion of even having to upgrade a console).

I personally have no problem with a 5GB install while I'm playing the game (yay, no loadtimes!), it would have been nice if it were optional so I could delete the install data when I'm finished with it, and still be able to actually PLAY the game without having to do another half hour install if I wanted to go back and replay a level or whatever.

How much initial space do you even have to work with on a 20GB system? I believe I only had around 55GB on my 60 when I first got it.

65536 · Jan 4, 2008

Steroyd said:
Why would a PC have at least 500GB?

The 20GB PS3 got phased out remember?

It's not like the 20GB PS3 doesn't exist though, I have quite a few friends that have them.

I don't see why any PC capable of running games like Crysis and Gears of War with their 12GB installs wouldn't have at least a 500GB drive. 3.5" drives cost nothing relative to what the rest of a system capable of running the latest games costs. Hell, what's the smallest drive you can buy today, outside of a raptor? I'd be surprised if it's any less than 250GB.

Valkyr Junkie said:
The best part is that if the install was optional (as in you were presented an option after first boot; not that the option to install is buried deep in the options menu) not a single person would choose NOT to install the data. People are A) whining about nothing or B) weren't planning on getting the PS3 version anyways.

If it said "do you want to play the game or spend 25 minutes installing before you play" I'd skip the install.

I installed Ridge 7 when I got it, and promptly uninstalled it as it was taking up space without providing much benefit.

xaosslug · Jan 4, 2008

Dave1988 said:
Graphics:
+Characters
+Beautiful animations and effects
- flickering shadows and edges
- sometimes too bright

:lol

Dave1988 said:
Controls:
+ Good controls
+ Camera
+ Lock On system
- A bit chaotic

err... wouldn't be DMC otherwise.

Dave1988 said:
Game design:
+ Non-stop action
+ Upgrade system
- Backtracking!
- No innovation
- Can become tedious

OK...

Dave1988 said:
Story/ Game world:
+ Beautiful Setting
+ Cool cutscenes
- Story somewhat chaotic
- Bland main villain

:lol :lol :lol

Lion Heart · Jan 4, 2008

SolidSnakex said:
Does Dante jump out your TV and stick a gun to your head whenever this is installing? Otherwise i'm pretty sure you aren't forced to sit in front of your TV as it installs.

Actually, There is a QTE that lasts the entire 25 min of installation and if you get one button wrong you have to start all over again.

McLovin · Jan 4, 2008

SolidSnakex said:
The 360 version adds to your gamerscore so you get to show your friends how awesome you are.

If its too high you might not seem cool, but something else :lol

RavenFox · Jan 4, 2008

Valkyr Junkie said:
The best part is that if the install was optional (as in you were presented an option after first boot; not that the option to install is buried deep in the options menu) not a single person would choose NOT to install the data. People are A) whining about nothing or B) weren't planning on getting the PS3 version anyways.

Well said.

Elbrain · Jan 4, 2008

I mean seriously why cant Capcom afford colored freaking pages for their instruction manuals I mean honestly. On the whole HDD install thing people need to stop bitching it's awesome that you have to wait for NO FUCKING LOADING after you install the freaking NO LOADING ON FAST PACED ACTION GAME IF YOU INSTALL!

professor_t · Jan 4, 2008

This is the worst thread ever.

Steroyd · Jan 4, 2008

SolidSnakex said:
The 360 version adds to your gamerscore so you get to show your friends how awesome you are.

Yeah but...now, when was it ever too late for the PS3 to have achievements, is what has me confused.

It's not like the 20GB PS3 doesn't exist though, I have quite a few friends that have them.

I don't see why any PC capable of running games like Crysis and Gears of War with their 12GB installs wouldn't have at least a 500GB drive. 3.5" drives cost nothing relative to what the rest of a system capable of running the latest games costs. Hell, what's the smallest drive you can buy today, outside of a raptor? I'd be surprised if it's any less than 250GB.

I don't see why anyone who buys a PS3 not to get the 80GB version bla bla etc etc, see how it works, I could pick the lowest spec'd HDD for a PC and lamblast it for it's 80-100GB hard drive or whatever after all it's not like 60GB PC's don't exist (they probably don't but I'm making a point

).

Livin_Lovin · Jan 4, 2008

andrewfee said:
It's not like the 20GB PS3 doesn't exist though, I have quite a few friends that have them.

I don't see why any PC capable of running games like Crysis and Gears of War with their 12GB installs wouldn't have at least a 500GB drive. 3.5" drives cost nothing relative to what the rest of a system capable of running the latest games costs. Hell, what's the smallest drive you can buy today, outside of a raptor? I'd be surprised if it's any less than 250GB.

If it said "do you want to play the game or spend 25 minutes installing before you play" I'd skip the install.

I installed Ridge 7 when I got it, and promptly uninstalled it as it was taking up space without providing much benefit.

I just want to bold this for a second. I own a laptop with a 120 GB drive that runs COD4 pretty damned well.

Oh, and you can still buy 40 GB HDDs. Although, I don't know exactly what you were grasping at with that point.

Oh, and for those bitching "I don't want to buy a bigger HDD. They're too expensive and not worth it!" 160 GBs for $60. Save yourself from buying Cruis'n and buy yourself something useful with that $60 hole now apparently burning in your pocket because 20 minutes is too much time to wait.

Defuser · Jan 4, 2008

xaosslug said:
OK...

Other than the devil arm + real time style switching, there is no innovation....

shintoki · Jan 4, 2008

Wow...There negatives are almost...wait are laughable :lol

badcrumble · Jan 4, 2008

Defuser said:
Other than the devil arm + real time style switching, there is no innovation....

Why revamp something that already works amazingly well? DMC3SE was the best third person melee action game of last gen bar none, and it'd be foolish to abandon such a successful formula. DMC4 is about DMC3-esque combat with DMC1-esque enemies and I really don't have a problem with that at all. Last time Capcom "innovated" with a favorite series of mine we got the craptastic Shin Onimusha.

xaosslug · Jan 4, 2008

Defuser said:
Other than the devil arm + real time style switching, there is no innovation....

oh, OK. So then, you want MORE innovation then? :lol

Livin_Lovin · Jan 4, 2008

badcrumble said:
Why revamp something that already works amazingly well? DMC3SE was the best third person melee action game of last gen bar none, and it'd be foolish to abandon such a successful formula. DMC4 is about DMC3-esque combat with DMC1-esque enemies and I really don't have a problem with that at all. Last time Capcom "innovated" with a favorite series of mine we got the craptastic Shin Onimusha.

Oh boy...

SolidSnakex · Jan 4, 2008

Steroyd said:
Yeah but...now, when was it ever too late for the PS3 to have achievements, is what has me confused.

What he meant though was that it adds to his gamerscore. People don't care about achievements as much as they care about showing off their gamerscore.

Livin_Lovin said:
Oh boy...

Oh boy what? Its the truth.

chun li's thighs · Jan 4, 2008

Dave1988 said:
Game design:
+ Non-stop action
+ Upgrade system
- Backtracking!
- No innovation
- Can become tedious

No innovation!? I would consider Dante being able to switch long range, short range, and styles all on the fly pretty innovative for the series. This reviewer is obviously a button masher and I call shenanigans on it. I guess it would seem all the same if you did nothing but hammer on sword button with no clue how to play a DMC game properly.

C- Warrior · Jan 4, 2008

xaosslug said:
oh, OK. So then, you want MORE innovation then? :lol

DMC4 should have been a first person shooter. Confirmed.

85/100 is alright, I guess if they gave DMC3:SE an 87, NG1 an 87, NG:Sigma 81 etc., it's pretty in-line with what I expect a AAA action game to be. Big surprise, the only action game they gave a 90+ to is god of fuckin war. ugh.

badcrumble · Jan 4, 2008

chun li's thighs said:
No innovation!? I would consider Dante being able to switch long range, short range, and styles all on the fly pretty innovative for the series. This reviewer is obviously a button masher and I call shenanigans on it. I guess it would seem all the same if you did nothing but hammer on sword button with no clue how to play a DMC game properly.

That too. Yes, the Devil Bringer feels like it might just be another Style, but Exceed is a totally new gameplay mechanic for the DMC series, and some of Dante's new weapons look really bizarre and quite different from what we've previously been used to.

xaosslug · Jan 4, 2008

chun li's thighs said:
No innovation!? I would consider Dante being able to switch long range, short range, and styles all on the fly pretty innovative for the series. This reviewer is obviously a button masher and I call shenanigans on it. I guess it would seem all the same if you did nothing but hammer on sword button with no clue how to play a DMC game properly.

bububu but it was a bit chaotic! :lol

The Faceless Master · Jan 4, 2008

Marconelly said:
Uncharted does something more clever that no other game has done yet on PS3, or maybe anywhere else. They have a 2GB swap file there and use it all the time, but creation of it is completely transparent, there are no install times ever, and it exists only while the game is running. How do they do it, I have no clue, though.

In any case, are any of you who are bothered by 20-30min install time (to get a load free game that you will play for hours) also bothered that you have to spend time to go to the store and buy the game, and then get back home? Is eating a lunch or posting on GAF while the game is installing an option for any of you?

that's basically how the cache on Xbox and Xbox 360 functions, except any game can do it, and many games do.

Dave1988 · Jan 4, 2008

C- Warrior said:
DMC4 should have been a first person shooter. Confirmed.

85/100 is alright, I guess if they gave DMC3:SE an 87, NG1 an 87, NG:Sigma 81 etc., it's pretty in-line with what I expect a AAA action game to be. Big surprise, the only action game they gave a 90+ to is god of fuckin war. ugh.

Figures...

Jeff-DSA · Jan 4, 2008

Steroyd said:
Wait wait wait... what tips you to choose the Xbox 360 version over the PS3 is Achievements yet the PS3 HAS achievements and they don't mean much now?

I mean the PSN doesn't integrate achievements in the same way that the 360 does. I like the whole achievement comparing aspect on the 360. I'm in a couple of fun achievement leaderboards with friends and groups and we enjoy it. Right now that doesn't happen with PSN. That's all I was saying.

Touchy, touchy.

But still, after reading up more on the control layout, I might go with the PS3 version since the 360 bumpers might blow for locking on.

Kyoufu · Jan 4, 2008

Anyone bitching about the install should get a 25 minute ban.

Jeff-DSA said:
But still, after reading up more on the control layout, I might go with the PS3 version since the 360 bumpers might blow for locking on.

Its not just the bumpers though. Those face buttons on the 360 pad will be a nightmare to mash.

Defuser · Jan 4, 2008

chun li's thighs said:
No innovation!? I would consider Dante being able to switch long range, short range, and styles all on the fly pretty innovative for the series.

xaosslug said:
oh, OK. So then, you want MORE innovation then? :lol

Real time style switching an improvement but not innovation. Can't say for the Devil Bringer though.

65536 · Jan 4, 2008

Elbrain said:
I mean seriously why cant Capcom afford colored freaking pages for their instruction manuals I mean honestly. On the whole HDD install thing people need to stop bitching it's awesome that you have to wait for NO FUCKING LOADING after you install the freaking NO LOADING ON FAST PACED ACTION GAME IF YOU INSTALL!

If I remember correctly, in Devil May Cry 3 the only time it loaded (with a proper loading screen) was in-between levels, which were fairly large.

5 second load screens are not annoying, a 25 minute install before I can play my game is.

Steroyd said:
I don't see why anyone who buys a PS3 not to get the 80GB version bla bla etc etc, see how it works, I could pick the lowest spec'd HDD for a PC and lamblast it for it's 80-100GB hard drive or whatever after all it's not like 60GB PC's don't exist (they probably don't but I'm making a point ).

This is console gaming, not PC gaming. You shouldn't have to have a required spec / amount of free space to play the game.

Livin_Lovin said:
I just want to bold this for a second. I own a laptop with a 120 GB drive that runs COD4 pretty damned well.

Oh, and you can still buy 40 GB HDDs. Although, I don't know exactly what you were grasping at with that point.

My point was that any system that can run the latest PC games that have massive 12GB installs is going to have plenty of hard drive space for that. No system that can run those games is going to only have a 40GB drive.

There are plenty of PS3s out there with a 20GB drive, so if games start having required 5GB installs, that's a big problem.

Livin_Lovin said:
Oh, and for those bitching "I don't want to buy a bigger HDD. They're too expensive and not worth it!" 160 GBs for $60. Save yourself from buying Cruis'n and buy yourself something useful with that $60 hole now apparently burning in your pocket because 20 minutes is too much time to wait.

So now the cost of Devil May Cry 4 is $120 if you have a 20GB PS3? Or $200 if you want rumble too. (DMC4/DS3 prices from videogamesplus)

Elbrain · Jan 4, 2008

chun li's thighs said:
No innovation!? I would consider Dante being able to switch long range, short range, and styles all on the fly pretty innovative for the series. This reviewer is obviously a button masher and I call shenanigans on it. I guess it would seem all the same if you did nothing but hammer on sword button with no clue how to play a DMC game properly.

I agree with you man I just can't stop thinking of the possibilities of real time not only weapon switching but freaking style switching the more I think about it the more my head almost implodes!

karasu · Jan 4, 2008

I don't even have 4GB left on my 60GB. I don't care about the lack of loading times if it means I have to delete shit for it.

xaosslug · Jan 4, 2008

Defuser said:
Real time style switching an improvement but not innovation. Can't say for the Devil Bringer though.

you just said yourself that it is an innovation, so pls. stop. ;p Also, what about Nero's Devil Trigger? That shit's pretty innovative as far as the series goes... I mean, are we talking innovation as far as the DMC series goes, or the genre as a whole?

Metalmurphy · Jan 4, 2008

andrewfee said:
So now the cost of Devil May Cry 4 is $120 if you have a 20GB PS3? Or $200 if you want rumble too. (DMC4/DS3 prices from videogamesplus)

This is just pure trolling atm...
/me leaves thread.

Doc Evils · Jan 4, 2008

professor_t said:
This is the worst thread ever.

It's neogaf dude.

Livin_Lovin · Jan 4, 2008

andrewfee said:
If I remember correctly, in Devil May Cry 3 the only time it loaded (with a proper loading screen) was in-between levels, which were fairly large.

5 second load screens are not annoying, a 25 minute install before I can play my game is.

This is console gaming, not PC gaming. You shouldn't have to have a required spec / amount of free space to play the game.

My point was that any system that can run the latest PC games that have massive 12GB installs is going to have plenty of hard drive space for that. No system that can run those games is going to only have a 40GB drive.

There are plenty of PS3s out there with a 20GB drive, so if games start having required 5GB installs, that's a big problem.

So now the cost of Devil May Cry 4 is $120 if you have a 20GB PS3? Or $200 if you want rumble too.

Think of it this way. You can do it now as more games will do it in the future as well, or you can just deal with the fact that 5 GBs will be lost until you beat DMC4. It's the same argument people had with the 360 core. At least in this case, 20 GB PS3 owners aren't crippled, they just have to manage some HDD space. You make it sound like they can't play the game. All they have to do is delete their pirated episodes of Bleach and they can come up with 5 GBs of space easy.

And how did you get $80 for a DS3? Arguing import prices is pretty...bleh. You know going into importing that you're paying a premium.

Edit: Wait a minute. Even importing, a Dual Shock 3 isn't $80. Jesus Christ, hibernate back into your cave or under a bridge.

The Faceless Master · Jan 4, 2008

RavenFox said:
Wondering when you were going to show. lol

i always show up to champion the one true cause... the end user.

what's wrong with choice?

spoon! · Jan 4, 2008

oh god this thread again :lol :lol :lol

xaosslug · Jan 4, 2008

andrewfee said:
If I remember correctly, in Devil May Cry 3 the only time it loaded (with a proper loading screen) was in-between levels, which were fairly large.

5 second load screens are not annoying, a 25 minute install before I can play my game is.

This is console gaming, not PC gaming. You shouldn't have to have a required spec / amount of free space to play the game.

My point was that any system that can run the latest PC games that have massive 12GB installs is going to have plenty of hard drive space for that. No system that can run those games is going to only have a 40GB drive.

There are plenty of PS3s out there with a 20GB drive, so if games start having required 5GB installs, that's a big problem.

So now the cost of Devil May Cry 4 is $120 if you have a 20GB PS3? Or $200 if you want rumble too. (DMC4/DS3 prices from videogamesplus)

:lol

go take a nap, dude.

Prince8 · Jan 4, 2008

SolidSnakex said:
DMC3SE was the best third person melee action game of last gen bar none

Dear God, go play Ninja Gaiden Black (or Sigma if you have a PS3) right now please. Even though I like the gameplay of DMC3, I absolutely hated the environment/setting (damn that stupid depressing shitty castle). That's why I'm really happy with the setting of this fourth game (+ no more teenage Dante = win)

xaosslug said:
oh, OK. So then, you want MORE innovation then? :lol

Well yes. The problem is that in this genre there is never much change/innovation (NG2 has also taken the safe way).

C- Warrior · Jan 4, 2008

_ Check leaderboard stats internationally, or locally and by difficulty.
_ View your own game history
_ View your own friends history and rankings
_ View your "acheivements"
_ View your friends "achievements"
_ View the details of your friends gameplay stats

Leaderboards isn't anything special, but checking out how your friends play (achievement count, difficulty chosen, game overs etc. etc.) is pretty tits. Very xbox 360-ish.

Dragon · Jan 4, 2008

For those bitching about the PS3 version and advocating the 360 version. Buy the 360 version. Seriously.

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