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VictimOfGrief
Banned
(12-18-2008, 10:00 PM)
[IMG]http://i39.************/r1kbk6.jpg[/IMG]

Being an avid PC gamer, I felt like contributing this to the site. :D

Below will be additions from the 2008 thread as well as new additions.

Major thanks to Kosma, Hazaro, Cheeto, godhandiscen, SRG01, Chespace, Davidion, Chiggs, Zzoram, JSnake and of course Borys who has to still be lurking on here for their PC gaming contributions to the previous years thread.

The 2008 "I need a new PC!" thread can be found here.

*Updates*
12.18.08 @1147 hours - First post with links to vendors for PC's, parts and discussions of upcoming CPU/GPU's to be released in CY09.
12.22.08 @ 0954 hours - Posted up Monitor specifications for PC gamers. Also added Tom's Hardware's guide for SSD on a PC build for reference. Also added reference for overclocking to thread in the [H] forums with detailed information on how to overclock the C2D/C2Q chipsets.
2.1.09 @ 0957 hours - Updated links for Core i7 overclocking, updated list for Canada PC parts, added NeoGAF Benchmarking thread added to Utilities section
2.27.09 @ 0911 hours - Updated first post with the Tech Report February Builders guide. *Thanks Hazaro!!*
3.30.09 @ 1141 hours - Reboot of the thread along with new title graphic, PC Gamer Avatars and more content coming in the next couple of weeks. :D
4.3.09 @ 1053 hours - Added and Updated Overclocking to include Core i7 overclocking PDF guide thanks to XtremeSystems.org. This is for the Intel Core i7 chips only.

PC Gamers GAF Avatars
You wanted them, you got'em. Right now I've done a Fallout 3 Avatar and a plain jane template for those wishing to make your own. If you want me to do you one up, shoot me a PM and time permitting I will get it done.
[img]http://i42.************/b49tz6.jpg[/img] [img]http://i42.************/2d9e8pk.jpg[/img]

Where to buy a PC and/or Parts?: (Three Regions, NOW LIVE!!)
[IMG]http://i44.************/2mq21rt.gif[/IMG]
USA:
Newegg.com (Buy parts)
NCIXUS.com (Buy parts, will assemble for fee)
TigerDirect.com (Buy parts)
Performance PC's.com (Buy parts)
Zip-Zoom-Fly (Buy parts)
Chief Value (Buy parts)
MicroCenter.com (Buy parts)
Avadirect.com (Custom Built)
MainGear.com (Custom Built High End)
FalconNW (Custom Built High End)


[IMG]http://i40.************/33jh8wo.jpg[/IMG]
Canada:
Newegg.ca (Buy parts)
DirectCanada (Buy Parts)
NCIX.com (Buy parts will assemble for fee)
Canadacomputers.com
Infonec.ca
Pricecanada.com
Shopbot.ca

[IMG]http://i41.************/213kjo5.jpg[/IMG]
UK:
EBuyer.com
Aria.co.uk
NovaTech.co.uk
Scan.co.uk
Misco.co.uk
Microdirect.co.uk


[IMG]http://i40.************/121bq0p.jpg[/IMG]
News sites for the latest in PC Computing and Gaming:
TechReport (Fantastic site, guy really knows his stuff)
Anandtech.com
HardOCP.com (Reviews by the max settings a game can be played at reasonably)
ExtremeTech.com
Tom's Hardware.com
Guru3D.com
X-Bit Labs.com
Ars Technica

[IMG]http://i42.************/c81i0.jpg[/IMG]
Utilities for any PC gamer:
Prime95 - Stress test the stability of your system on stock settings or your latest Overclock.
CPU-Z - Gathers system CPU, FSB, Vcore Voltage and memory timings presents it in a clean and tidy way.
Memtest - Having weird Blue screens or system errors? Download and run a full memory scan using Memtest.
GPU-Z - Gathers information on your Graphics card chipset, similar to that of CPU-Z but for your GPU.
HWmonitor - A must if you OC your equipment! Gives you a full range of temperatures, Voltage settings, fan speeds and more!
RealTemp - A utility to monitor the temperature of your CPU core(s).
RivaTuner - A Utility to manage GPU overclock, fan speed, and monitor about 25 other things all in 1 customizable screen.
NeoGAF's own PC Benchmarking thread - Have questions about your Futuremark score or want to show off your new overclock on your CPU/GPU? This thread is for you!

Getting started building your PC:
[img]http://i41.************/et5ikn.png[/img]
TR's February 2009 system guide
Recommendations for building the right enthusiast's PCs

- A guide that will help those who have a fist full of cash but may not know what will best suit their gaming needs. The Tech Report gives a great overview of systems for those looking to get the most bang for their buck. Check it out!


NeoGaf FAQ's on PC Gaming:

Build it yourself or buy a premade?

There are numerous advantages to building your own PC. For starters it's much cheaper then buying a premade, plus you can have exactly what you want/need (customizing the looks, the noise level etc.) Building isn't very hard, even I succeeded on my first try. This thread in general will focus on building your own PC, but you can always ask questions about which parts to use for your prefab.

Some suggested sites for premades are Dell and HP, be aware that with some searching on the internet you can find awesome rebate's for the PC's you can purchase here. Especially Dell is known for having these which could save you up to 10% of the original price. Coupons can be found on sites like here or here but if you don't find any I suggest using google.

What's your budget and what do you expect?

Really think about it, the sky is the limit with PC's and if you don't make a budget for yourself you will never be able to make a "definitive" build. If you want the PC to last for 5 years you will need to aim at the best of the best hardware now and accordingly spend a lot of money. If you aim to keep this rig for less time you can easily spend much less money while staying competitive with the top rigs now, and by the time you build a new one in a few years your PC will outshine those guys that build 5 year future proof monster rigs. If you have all the cash in the world this obviously doesn't apply and you should get the best of the best, but for average joe this is an important question.

Choosing a Case

Choose something you think looks decent, and has room for a fan or two. But unless you're planning on doing extreme overclocking or something don't be bothered or seduced by cases that have millions of fans. In most cases you really don't need that much airflow. If you choose a cheap thin aliminium casing chances are it will be vibrating and a bit noisy.
The more expensive casing are pretty heavy so if you're planning on going to many LAN parties they may not be the best choice ;)

Board members personal pick's:
Hazaro's:
- CoolerMaster Centurion 5
- CoolerMaster 690
- Antec 300/900
- Antec Case+PSU combo (Saves money, good PSU)

VictimofGrief's
- CoolMaster 690
- LIAN LI PC-A05B
- Antec 900
- LIAN LI PC-65


Choosing a Motherboard

Couple of things. Make sure the Mobo supports the CPU you choose, and at least DDR2 800 RAM. If you want a future proof Mobo, choose one which supports DDR3 memory which should come down in price this or next year. Be sure to check all features as they will vary from e-SATA, wifi, firewire, amount of USB ports, etc.

Socket types:
LGA1366: 45nm Core i7 Quad-Core chips
LGA775: 65nm Core 2's, 45nm Penryn chips
AM2+: Phenom
AM2: Anthlon X2's and FX's.

Quick recommendations on mother boards (Intel)
- Asus P5Q
- Gigabyte DS3
- Gigabyte EP45-UD3R

Choosing a CPU

As mentioned above, the CPU is the second greatest asset to a PC gamer. The eternal debate on whether or not to have a Dual-Core or a Quad-Core I think will rage on until the end of time. What is important to look at is what you're doing with the system you're building/buying. If you building a system purely for gaming/surfing the internet and email, you can't go wrong with a Dual-Core chip. However if you want to be doing more than just that... such as gaming, encoding/decoding multimedia, intensive Photoshop sessions and 30+ things open at once.... Probably should go the Quad-Core route.

Suggestions for which brand to buy.... It all depends. I personally have bought Intel since back in the late 90's simply because I prefer their chips but there people that prefer AMD to Intel. Either way, the prices on the LGA775 chipset for Intel and the AMD Phenom chipset are quite competitively priced.

The best valued CPU (IMO) right now is the E8400 Wolfdale Core 2 Duo chip which clocks in at 3.0GHz can easily be overclocked to 4.0GHz on Air without any problems on multiple manufactures motherboards. Also consider the E7200 as it is slightly cheaper and offers same performance in games.

To help break it down again, here's a CPU listing for what you'd be doing: (thanks to Hazaro)

Web Browser: E2200 (E2140/60/80)
Multi-media Machine: E7200 / Q6600
Gaming: E8400 / Q6600 / Newer Quads

Choosing a GPU (serious business!)
***New cards being introduced this year. (Minor tweaks and upgrades supposedly)***
The GPU is the most necessary item in a PC Gamers arsenal (second of course being a good CPU obviously). Anyways, we've hit a golden era of graphics cards where for around $200 bucks(+/- rebates) you can pick up a ATI 4870 or a Nvidia GTX260 that are among the fastest graphic cards to date.

Either of those paired with a Intel Core 2 Duo(or greater) or an AMD Phenom X3 or higher should put you into a sweet spot for gaming. At 3.0Ghz a Core 2 CPU gains promptly slide down, going over 3.0 doesn't offer much, if any fps gain.

Quick break down on video resolutions paired with the right graphics card for the job:

1280x1024 - HD3850/HD3870 /// 8800GT,9600GT,9800GT for 60+ fps on almost all games
1440x900 - HD4830/HD4850 /// 9800GT/GTX, GT250, GTX Core 216 260 will be 60 fps in most games unless CPU bound with a slower chip. For the lower end cards, stick with the 512MB versions, however if you plan on upgrading to a bigger monitor, get the 1GB versions if possible.
1680x1050 (1600x1200) - [Above choice still valid, but may need to tone down a few settings, still great] For more: HD4830/4850/4870 /// GTX 260
1920x1080 (1920x1200) - 48701GB/4870x2 /// GTX 260/GTX 280
2560x1600 - 4870x2/GTX280 / Cross-Fire and SLi are really the best options at this resolution.

Choosing the right memory:
Right now DDR2 is dirt cheap. You can pick up some DDR2 800 2x2GB for about $40 bucks. Most of the LGA775/AM2+ boards support DDR2 FSB up to 1333Mhz. Obviously those that are budget minded, you can pick up some cheaper DDR2 800 and overclock it over that fairly easily. Right now I've overclocked my FSB to 1500Mhz without even really trying. Now the next big thing is DDR3 memory which is finally starting to come down in price. Some of the system boards do support a couple of channels of DDR2 AND DDR3. Make sure you check that out before placing your order and get the correct memory. The new Core i7 processors ONLY use DDR3 memory which will in turn speed up the adoption rate of DDR3 of course.


Choosing a HDD
Right now the latest Sata Standard is 3.0Gpbs throughput to the motherboard which is pretty decent. Also as hard drive sizes go up, prices come down. At the time of this writing, you can get a 1TB Seagate hard drive for about $109 bucks shipped.

Make sure to look for speed (Shouldn't be less than 7200RPM) and size to fit your budget.

Quick hits:
-WD6400AAKS
-Seagate 750GB/1TB

Choosing a PSU

Many people will say that you shouldn't cheap out on the PSU because if it fries you're whole PC could, plus it helps with the stability of your system. I have a cheap ass PSU but I still agree with those people, spending $30 more here for a decent one isn't a bad idea. But how much juice do you need? Don't go overboard! Some would suggest you need 750 Watt PSU's , don't be fooled, you don't. An overclocked quad core + GTX 260/HD4870 + the rest of a computer will only draw 400w max load. A stock dual core + GTX 260/HD4870 will only draw 280w. However, PSU's are more efficient when not loaded too high or too low. 500w is just right.

The efficiency rating of a power supply determines how much energy is waste or lost when it converts the wall outlet power to the internal power components. A 75% efficiency power supply that generates 300W of internal power draws roughly 400W of power from the wall and thus 15% of this power is lost as heat. A good number to shoot for is 80% efficiency. A power supply only draws as much power as the computer takes.

One more thing to look at when looking into buying a power supply is cable managements. Many new power supplies are modular and will allow you to yank out extra cables that are not plugged into any other components. This can free up clutter and allow for better air flow in your PC.

Quick picks:
- Antec EarthWatts
- Corsair
- Seasonic
- OCZ
- Rosewill (500w + units) (Cheaper)

Power supply calculator

Choosing a Monitor
TFT Technology Breakdown and Model/Panel Index

LCD Panel Technology Type and Characteristics

TN film (Twisted Nematic)
- low manufacturing/retail costs
- restrictive viewing angles
- fast pixel response times
- dead pixels display white. Stuck pixels display RGB colors
- lower contrast levels means blacks are not as dark as VA based panels
- lower color reproduction

IPS (In Plane Switching)
- improved viewing angles over TN
- very good color reproduction
- slower pixel response times than TN
- dead pixels display black
- lower contrast levels means blacks are not as dark as VA based panels

Super-IPS (S-IPS)
- same as IPS except ...
- likely best color reproduction of all TFT
- less expensive to produce than IPS
- improved pixel response

VA (Vertical Alignment) Technologies

MVA (Multidomain Vertical Alignment)
- compromise between TN and IPS technologies
- superior color reproduction over TN but not as good as IPS
- very good viewing angles but less than IPS
- higher contrast than TN or S-IPS means very good blacks
- dead pixels are black
- slower pixel response than TN or IPS
- details can be lost when directly viewing dark areas
Premium-MVA (P-MVA)
- same as MVA except ...
- "overdrive" technology increases pixel response but still slower than TN
- may have slightly degraded color reproduction due to "overdrive" process

PVA (Patterned VA)
- same as MVA except ...
- larger viewing angles
- higher contrast levels means darkest blacks

Super-PVA (S-PVA)
- same as PVA except ...
- “Magic Speed” (the Samsung equivalent to Overdrive) improves pixel response
- slightly improved color reproduction
- slightly improved viewing angles

Purchasing Considerations ( really, which one is right for you?)

TN Gamers
Considered a "gamers" panel due to it's fast pixel response times which reduces trailing images know as "ghosting". However, this advantage has been reduced by new technologies to accelerate pixel response times in other panel types. Colors and contrast tend to be weak and blacks are not truly dark. Viewing angles are significantly limited. However, monitors based on this technology tend to be inexpensive.

IPS / S-IPS Graphics Work or Web Browsing
Considered to have the best color reproduction of all panel types, these panels are well suited for graphics work or web browsing. Pixel response time is also good but slower than the TN "gamers" panel. Contast and blacks are also less dark than VA panels but viewing angles are excellent.

MVA / P-MVA / PVA / S-PVA Compromise for All-Around Use
These panels are a compromise between the fast pixel response times of the TN panel and the excellent color reproduction of the IPS panels. Contrast and blacks are best of all the panel types. Viewing angles are similar but slightly inferior to IPS.

For more information, check out : TFT Central.co.uk/ for more information.


Choosing a SSD for your Build
Tom's Hardware quick look at SSD for your PC

Choosing a 32-bit vs. 64-bit Operating System (Coming soon!!)

Choosing SLi/Cross-Fire vs. a single graphics card. (Coming soon!!)

Overclocking your Rig
PDF Guide thanks to XtremeSystems.org on overclocking your Intel Core i7. Download link here
Quick look courtesy of the [H] forums on how to overclock your Core 2 Duo and Core 2 Quad chipsets!
How to OC your new Core i7 CPU @ X-bit Labs

More updates as always coming! :D
VictimOfGrief
Banned
(12-18-2008, 10:01 PM)
Roadmap:
djkimothy
Member
(12-18-2008, 10:02 PM)
Wicked thread, thanks. I'll probably have some questions later spring early summer.
madmook
Admire my girth. Mmm.
(12-18-2008, 10:03 PM)
madmook's Avatar
I hope the Penryn quads (Q9550, Q9650) get pricedrops soon because the Core i7's are out and I have a Gateway with a Q6600 that I can't overclock from the bios.
VictimOfGrief
Banned
(12-18-2008, 10:05 PM)
^ yeah I just checked and the 9550 is still $329.00 buck @the Egg which is stupid considering the i7 920 is only $299. It will be maddening if the i7's drop in price faster than the current quads. :/
Cday
Banned
(12-18-2008, 10:07 PM)
Cday's Avatar
What's the difference in game performance between 2 and 4gb RAM?
I already have 2gb dual channel ddr3. Was wondering if it would be worth it to get another 2gb.

Vista 64 bit
buttmagic
Banned
(12-18-2008, 10:07 PM)
In before "<hyped-up, unoptimized FPS> PC for <moderate price> (Without operating system, monitor, mouse, keyboard, speakers, optical drive, or hard drive. Everyone just has them laying around, right?)".

Please for the love of god, include monitors, optical drives, etc. in your builds!
An OS license I can understand leaving out (free OSs, trashing the old PC and reusing the license, cheap/free copies through school/work etc.), even though it often implies yarrr.


If you want to go cheap, now's a good time to pick up a Phenom / Core 2 system.

If you want expandability, wait until Phenom II / Core i7 boards are more mature and the roadmaps are more fleshed out.
iDoubleSpy
Member
(12-18-2008, 10:08 PM)
- AMD X2 6000+ Dual Core 3.0GHZ
- 4GB Mushkin Memory
- 600GB HDD
- Geforce 9600 GT (1GB)

Not sure if I should just buy another 9600 for 160, possibly cheaper, or just pick up a super awesome GPU when they come out, ideas??
Stalyn
Junior Member
(12-18-2008, 10:09 PM)
Stalyn's Avatar
Great info.
anonymousAversa
Member
(12-18-2008, 10:10 PM)
anonymousAversa's Avatar
Great thread. I'm waiting to buy a nice Core i7/DDR3 setup, just have to wait till those prices come down.

You might want to put in a section about operating systems and ram - specifically that you need a 64bit operating system to take advantage of more than 3gb for Windows.

Also that the new Core i7/DDR3 motherboards have ram slots in multiples of THREE, not two. So get used to buying ram in triplets now. (Think 6 slots, 2gb per slot, 12gb ram very cheaply =)


Oh and USB 3.0 would be nice =) but I don't believe it will come out for another 9-12 months.
Treo360
Member
(12-18-2008, 10:10 PM)
Okay, so I have a Mac pro dual xenon 2.8 overclocked to 3.2 (at times when I need it) with 4gb of ram, but I'm looking to use the case of my dual 1.8 PPC Mac Pro as a new computer.

What does the i7 intel provide me with in terms of power? I'm a student in animation so my program of choice is Maya. In terms of rendering will I see a huge jump in performance going to the i7?
iam220
Member
(12-18-2008, 10:14 PM)

Originally Posted by iDoubleSpy

- AMD X2 6000+ Dual Core 3.0GHZ
- 4GB Mushkin Memory
- 600GB HDD
- Geforce 9600 GT (1GB)

Not sure if I should just buy another 9600 for 160, possibly cheaper, or just pick up a super awesome GPU when they come out, ideas??

Sell your 9600 and pick up a 4850.

That set up should last you a 1-2 years, at which point you should probably go with a new system.
Fragamemnon
The Man. The Myth.
The Legend.
(12-18-2008, 10:16 PM)
Fragamemnon's Avatar

Originally Posted by iDoubleSpy

- AMD X2 6000+ Dual Core 3.0GHZ
- 4GB Mushkin Memory
- 600GB HDD
- Geforce 9600 GT (1GB)

Not sure if I should just buy another 9600 for 160, possibly cheaper, or just pick up a super awesome GPU when they come out, ideas??

I'd say a GTX260 or a similarly priced ATi offering would be a better, more substantial upgrade if you want something now.
VictimOfGrief
Banned
(12-18-2008, 10:17 PM)

Originally Posted by anonymousAversa

Great thread. I'm waiting to buy a nice Core i7/DDR3 setup, just have to wait till those prices come down.

You might want to put in a section about operating systems and ram - specifically that you need a 64bit operating system to take advantage of more than 3gb for Windows.

Also that the new Core i7/DDR3 motherboards have ram slots in multiples of THREE, not two. So get used to buying ram in triplets now. (Think 6 slots, 2gb per slot, 12gb ram very cheaply =)


Oh and USB 3.0 would be nice =) but I don't believe it will come out for another 9-12 months.

Yeah--- I'm currently reading up on some of the monitor stuff and want to make sure I get that info right before posting that up. :)
Baloonatic
Member
(12-18-2008, 10:19 PM)
Baloonatic's Avatar
Great info, I'll be deciding whether to get a new PC or a PS3 early next year so I'll probably have some questions around March.
primemover21
Banned
(12-18-2008, 10:21 PM)
Just came to say that I think PC's are so much sexier than consoles
Like the hat?
Member
(12-18-2008, 10:26 PM)
Like the hat?'s Avatar
just coming to say that this laptop is fucking awesome

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage....=1218012519873

been playing Oblivion and Fallout 3 on High settings, and Crysis in a mix of High and Medium settings.

laptop is ugly as sin, and the resolution is low, but for the price it is amazing.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage....=1218012519873
iDoubleSpy
Member
(12-18-2008, 10:28 PM)

Originally Posted by iam220

Sell your 9600 and pick up a 4850.

That set up should last you a 1-2 years, at which point you should probably go with a new system.

Selling it will be harder then it sounds. I could try craigslist or something i suppose. Is the 4850 going to be replaced anytime soon?
zoku88
Member
(12-18-2008, 10:30 PM)
zoku88's Avatar
Lol, screw you for not mentioning me in this one >.>

I kid, I only did something small last time :P
ph15h
Junior Member
(12-18-2008, 10:32 PM)
Wow, this thread is useful. I just spilled half a bottle of Lipton Citrus Green tea on my laptop and now its running slow and the touchpad is messing up. :P Building a new PC can be my January prject
zoku88
Member
(12-18-2008, 10:34 PM)
zoku88's Avatar
We should prolly say something more about teh DDR3 kits, now that ppl have the choice to go between triple channel and dual channel.

Something about how going to triple channel usually increases latency a bit (by like one or two ns) and doesn't really bring increase of performance. And how if you can get a higher amount of memory with dual channel, you should just do that instead of going with less memory with triple channel.

Originally Posted by iDoubleSpy

Can I suggest never putting liquids near your computer? Looks like you learned already, so please take the advice :D

Or just get a spill-proof one like I did ^^
iDoubleSpy
Member
(12-18-2008, 10:34 PM)

Originally Posted by ph15h

Wow, this thread is useful. I just spilled half a bottle of Lipton Citrus Green tea on my laptop and now its running slow and the touchpad is messing up. :P Building a new PC can be my January prject

Can I suggest never putting liquids near your computer? Looks like you learned already, so please take the advice :D
iam220
Member
(12-18-2008, 10:45 PM)

Originally Posted by iDoubleSpy

Selling it will be harder then it sounds. I could try craigslist or something i suppose. Is the 4850 going to be replaced anytime soon?

I never have problems selling old hardware. Online classifieds is the way to go, or ebay. If the 9600 is going for 160 at retail you can probably offload it for 70 or so.

I haven't heard of any replacement for the 4850 but even if there was one your CPU will be the bottleneck. A 4850 will compliment your cpu quite nicely.
Great thread. However, I'd recommend having a section dedicated to sites like AVADirect and Maingear which allow you to have them build a gaming PC and have them send it to you. That's the route I went for my latest gaming PC and it's an option I think more people should be aware of.
iDoubleSpy
Member
(12-18-2008, 10:51 PM)

Originally Posted by iam220

I never have problems selling old hardware. Online classifieds is the way to go, or ebay. If the 9600 is going for 160 at retail you can probably offload it for 70 or so.

I haven't heard of any replacement for the 4850 but even if there was one your CPU will be the bottleneck. A 4850 will compliment your cpu quite nicely.

I'm not sure if it was a bad idea to go with AMD this time around. My Motherboard supports the AMD Quads, so if in the worse case, I can just upgrade the CPU
BobsRevenge
I do not avoid women, GAF, but I do deny them my essence.
(12-18-2008, 10:53 PM)
BobsRevenge's Avatar

Originally Posted by ph15h

Wow, this thread is useful. I just spilled half a bottle of Lipton Citrus Green tea on my laptop and now its running slow and the touchpad is messing up. :P Building a new PC can be my January prject

:lol :lol

Nice.

Yeah... gotta be careful with that tea man. Gotta be real careful. :D

Have fun building the PC. Such a great process.
VictimOfGrief
Banned
(12-18-2008, 10:54 PM)

Originally Posted by JSnake

Great thread. However, I'd recommend having a section dedicated to sites like AVADirect and Maingear which allow you to have them build a gaming PC and have them send it to you. That's the route I went for my latest gaming PC and it's an option I think more people should be aware of.

+ Added. :D
Cheeto
Member
(12-18-2008, 10:58 PM)
Cheeto's Avatar
I want to build a monster sometime in early 2009. Generally, I've been pretty frugal and happy with that in the past. But I feel like I really want to go all out on the next build.
desertdroog
Member
(12-18-2008, 11:01 PM)
desertdroog's Avatar
Much appreciated. I am about to retire my old AMD 450 mhz K6 2 powered Win 2K OS computer, which has been limped along and frankensteined to death. I need to upgrade and since I have been out of the "game" as it were, I need all the help and info I can get.
iam220
Member
(12-18-2008, 11:02 PM)

Originally Posted by iDoubleSpy

I'm not sure if it was a bad idea to go with AMD this time around. My Motherboard supports the AMD Quads, so if in the worse case, I can just upgrade the CPU

Yeah, the amd quads (phenoms) are relatively weak, but amd is coming up with a new line of phenoms scheduled throughout 2009. Those might be quite decent and supposedly they can be put in current am2+ motherboard.

If I were you, i'd get that 4850, play it out for the next year or two and then get a new system, with core i7 or something. Those should be well priced come then.

Originally Posted by Cheeto

I want to build a monster sometime in early 2009. Generally, I've been pretty frugal and happy with that in the past. But I feel like I really want to go all out on the next build.

Hold your purchase until the next generation of GPU's roll out.



VVVVV : if ati is not your thing, go with the 9800GTX+ , it's about on par with the 4850 in both price and performance.
iDoubleSpy
Member
(12-18-2008, 11:04 PM)

Originally Posted by iam220

Yeah, the amd quads (phenoms) are relatively weak, but amd is coming up with a new line of phenoms scheduled throughout 2009. Those might be quite decent and supposedly they can be put in current am2+ motherboard.

If I were you, i'd get that 4850, play it out for the next year or two and then get a new system, with core i7 or something. Those should be well priced come then.

I don't know why I am so hesitant to go back to ATi. I've heard nothing but rave reviews for the 4850, So I might just take your advice.

I of course already need to pick up a new PSU which is old and dying. My computer is pretty damn fast as is, so I will be picking up i7 in the future. thanks for the tips :D
godhandiscen
There are millions of whiny 5-year olds on Earth, and I AM THEIR KING.
(12-18-2008, 11:05 PM)
godhandiscen's Avatar
NOICE. My new home.

Can I suggest some benchmark graphics for the OP?
Visualante
Member
(12-18-2008, 11:05 PM)
Visualante's Avatar
2008 thread was invaluable for helping me build my PC and troubleshoot an issue with construction. May this one be of use to some new PC gamers in the year to come. Thanks to everyone who kept it alive.
Caj814
Member
(12-18-2008, 11:14 PM)
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Need help building a new PC specifically to handle my 3d workload.Need some advice on which specific parts to choose since this will be my first PC I will actually put together.

Copy paste from other thread.

I just wanted to know what everyones opinions were on PCs built specifically to get the most out of programs like Maya,3DSMax,Zbrush,Mudbox etc.The reason I ask is because I'm a game major who lacks a decent workstation at home and NEED a new PC when I'm unable to work at my school lab.

I was able to get by on a Dell that was made for the family around 2002 for a couple years but with the newer versions of programs being implemented I end up falling behind whenever I'm at home due to my computer not being fast enough to support it or being so slow that my progress comes to a crawl.Compatibility issues also come into play whenever I try saving something in an old version and bring it into a newer version(broken meshes missing data,and other bs that made working at home pointless -_- )

Like many others I'm on a college budget (aka I'm broke and have loans out but have some family support) so I'm looking to spend money on the things I NEED.I don't need a burner,HDD or other stuff that can easily be transfered from computer to computer.

Heres a general list. . . .

* flexible enough so it's easy to work with for future upgrades
* fast and stable enough for multitasking
Ex.Having photoshop up for tweaking textures while keeping Maya up to see how it looks and then going into Torque or Source to check on collisions etc.
* decent for rendering.It doesn't have to be the end all be all,just good enough for general clips and stills for demo reel purposes
* anything else that may be beneficial that I don't know about or didn't mention


This will also be the first time I will be putting a computer together.I've seen video tutorials and a friend put his together so I shouldn't have too much trouble in that department when the time comes.

godhandiscen
There are millions of whiny 5-year olds on Earth, and I AM THEIR KING.
(12-18-2008, 11:15 PM)
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Originally Posted by Caj814

Need help building a new PC specifically to handle my 3d workload.Need some advice on which specific parts to choose since this will be my first PC I will actually put together.

Copy paste from other thread.

I would recommend 4GB as a minimum. Do you have a monitor already, what is the resolution? Also, what is your budget? Also, if you are using Adobe CS4 heavily, Nvidia provides acceleration for it right now, ATI will in the near future, so I would recommend Nvidia for such an application.
Jinfash
needs 2 extra inches
(12-18-2008, 11:17 PM)
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Kosma is banned until summer 2009, but he sent me an email saying he approves of this thread and that you did a great job!

Borys is def lurking and I am in contact with him too :)

Keep PC gamin alive!
UltimaPooh
Member
(12-18-2008, 11:17 PM)
Okay so I am looking into making a new PC next semester GAF. It depends on my cash flow next semester.

What I'm looking for is something in the 600-700 dollar range (this can be after rebates.)

What I want it to be able to do is run AVID without any hiccups and be a medium range gaming PC.

So what parts, pieces, etc. would I need?
godhandiscen
There are millions of whiny 5-year olds on Earth, and I AM THEIR KING.
(12-18-2008, 11:24 PM)
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Originally Posted by UltimaPooh

Okay so I am looking into making a new PC next semester GAF. It depends on my cash flow next semester.

What I'm looking for is something in the 600-700 dollar range (this can be after rebates.)

What I want it to be able to do is run AVID without any hiccups and be a medium range gaming PC.

So what parts, pieces, etc. would I need?

I would suggest you wait to look at prices until you have the money. Component prices always go down. Wait for the GPU refreshes to arrive during the first quarter of 09 and then the current videocards will have gone down in price. That way you can maximize your performance/budget. ATM just think about what you really want to get out of it.

Originally Posted by Cday

What's the difference in game performance between 2 and 4gb RAM?
I already have 2gb dual channel ddr3. Was wondering if it would be worth it to get another 2gb.

Vista 64 bit

HUGE. More ram avoid hiccups, which I assume you are getting every now and then.
iDoubleSpy
Member
(12-18-2008, 11:26 PM)

Originally Posted by UltimaPooh

Okay so I am looking into making a new PC next semester GAF. It depends on my cash flow next semester.

What I'm looking for is something in the 600-700 dollar range (this can be after rebates.)

What I want it to be able to do is run AVID without any hiccups and be a medium range gaming PC.

So what parts, pieces, etc. would I need?

Im not the best at it, but I would suggest picking up:

4GB - Memory ($80-100)
GPU - (I could sell you my 9600 GT 1GB for a decent ass price)

I'm not a CPU guy so thats the best I can help you. My 9600 runs basically everything without a hitch. It was a 160 dollar card and am willing to part with it at for like 70-80 bucks :D
Nemo
Will Eat Your Children
(12-18-2008, 11:32 PM)
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Nice! Will probably come back later this year when my 4850 needs an upgrade. Hell, maybe even next year! Just hope Empire Total War will perform well
zoku88
Member
(12-18-2008, 11:34 PM)
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More RAM helps you have page faults. Well, more specifically, hard page faults.

Basically, a hard page faults is when your computer needs to hit the HDD in order to get something out of virtual memory that is not actually paged.

In a 32-bit OS, the vitrual memory should be about 4GB, but obviously, most systems don't even have 4GB of physical memory, so some of the virtual memory is stored on the HDD. Unfortunately, reading from the HDD is much much slower than RAM (which is much much slower than cache.)

Id say, reading from the HDD is about 4K times slower than cache, off the top of my head.
Cday
Banned
(12-18-2008, 11:34 PM)
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Originally Posted by godhandiscen

HUGE. More ram avoids hiccups, which I assume you are getting every now and then.

Thank you. Also you are correct about the occasional hiccups.
Visualante
Member
(12-18-2008, 11:38 PM)
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Originally Posted by Caj814

Need help building a new PC specifically to handle my 3d workload.Need some advice on which specific parts to choose since this will be my first PC I will actually put together.

Heya, my advice would be to run a similar setup to whatever you have in your studio because you really don't want to waste a day's work because your files won't open. This includes operating system. Maya 64 doesn't play well with Maya 32 in my experience though some people will tell you it does. Max just doesn't work and I never want to work with it again (why are you learning both by the way? one is hard enough)

ZBrush likes ram, but 3gb really does suffice most users needs. With regard to Photoshop, yeah you'll use it but you're not a power user if you're just painting maps. So don't really put that as a priority.

Steer clear of prosumer equipment like Quadro and FireGL cards. They're not worth it and you would be rise to invest in a better CPU, graphics tablet or second monitor. (or a comfy desk chair because you'll be in it a lot)
Caj814
Member
(12-18-2008, 11:42 PM)
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Originally Posted by godhandiscen

I would recommend 4GB as a minimum. Do you have a monitor already, what is the resolution? Also, what is your budget? Also, if you are using Adobe CS4 heavily, Nvidia provides acceleration for it right now, ATI will in the near future, so I would recommend Nvidia for such an application.

Budget $500-$800 depending on how everything turns out.I also don't need a monitor since I got a Samsung Syncmaster as a birthday present this year.

To mention it again here are the things I DON'T need:

Monitor
HDD
DVD/CD Burner

I just need help with gathering a list of parts so I can plan my budget around it and get some second opinions on before I make my final decisions.I'll also mention again that I want something that will last for a good few years before another major upgrade needs to be done.Also yeah I use the Adobe Suite quite frequently for images and video editing.
pizzaguysrevenge
Banned
(12-18-2008, 11:48 PM)
I was gonna buy a GTX 260 and a Zune. But my car's transmission just died and it's gonna take $1000 to fix it.

:(
M3d10n
Member
(12-18-2008, 11:53 PM)
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Amazing thread.

Question: I have an AM2 Gigabyte mobo, an Athlon64 X2 4000+ and a 4850. I'd like to upgrade the CPU, but I don't want to buy a new mobo yet, so what's the best processor it can manage? I heard Phenons run gimped in AM2 slot, should I get an Athlon X2 6000+ instead?
brain_stew
Hello friend! Have you heard the good news about Jesus PC gaming?
(12-18-2008, 11:59 PM)
www.ebuyer.com is probably the best site around for UK guys so add that to the first post.

Other than them there's:

www.aria.co.uk
www.novatech.co.uk
www.scan.co.uk
www.misco.co.uk
www.microdirect.co.uk

which I could all recommend quite happily.
Caj814
Member
(12-18-2008, 11:59 PM)
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Originally Posted by Visualante

Heya, my advice would be to run a similar setup to whatever you have in your studio because you really don't want to waste a day's work because your files won't open. This includes operating system. Maya 64 doesn't play well with Maya 32 in my experience though some people will tell you it does. Max just doesn't work and I never want to work with it again (why are you learning both by the way? one is hard enough)

ZBrush likes ram, but 3gb really does suffice most users needs. With regard to Photoshop, yeah you'll use it but you're not a power user if you're just painting maps. So don't really put that as a priority.

Steer clear of prosumer equipment like Quadro and FireGL cards. They're not worth it and you would be rise to invest in a better CPU, graphics tablet or second monitor. (or a comfy desk chair because you'll be in it a lot)

Maya was the first program I was "taught" and I really don't like it at all for putting characters together,props and other stuff I'm okay with though.3dmax on the other hand(learning on my own) is something that I'm slowly getting more comfortable with since it provides a bit more flexibility,especially when trying to prep characters for animation.The reason I put Photoshop down was because I'm not sure how much memory CS4 currently takes up when multitasking.
godhandiscen
There are millions of whiny 5-year olds on Earth, and I AM THEIR KING.
(12-19-2008, 12:02 AM)
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Originally Posted by Caj814

Budget $500-$800 depending on how everything turns out.I also don't need a monitor since I got a Samsung Syncmaster as a birthday present this year.

To mention it again here are the things I DON'T need:

Monitor
HDD
DVD/CD Burner

I just need help with gathering a list of parts so I can plan my budget around it and get some second opinions on before I make my final decisions.I'll also mention again that I want something that will last for a good few years before another major upgrade needs to be done.Also yeah I use the Adobe Suite quite frequently for images and video editing.

Do you want to use the 64 bit version of Maya? I am no expert, but if you haven;t found incompatibilities, then I would suggest going for Vista 64 and Maya 2008 64 that way you dont have to dual boot in order to use maya because you seriously need 4GB and a 32 bit OS will not see all of it. Let me put together a built, and then we can start from there.

edit: I am having problems building something for that budget. I am a noob when it comes to intel. Would you want AMD?
zoku88
Member
(12-19-2008, 12:07 AM)
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I think you should add Ars Technica to the PC Computing links. While not really notable for gaming, they have good articles about computer technology in general.

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