[Archer]

am going to drop some vossen 20s on the zdx to make it a blue version of this...

[paskowitz]

No one can fucking touch Acura interiors in terms of design imo. No fucking one

This statement is factually incorrect. You have obviously not been inside an Audi A8 or Jaguar XJ. Acura's interiors are quite derivative from Honda.

In terms of interior design and quality, Audis are untouchable lately.

Yep. It is their strongest trait.

Agreed. Their downfall is maintenance.

Had a B4 Audi A4... maintenance almost cost more than the car itself. Never again.

Have you sat in a German car before?

Again, Audi takes the cake. But Mercs can be really nice once you go up in price.

[ameratsu]

Ugh crossovers. I mean, buy what you want, but don't delude yourself into thinking it looks good.

[N-Bomb]

Ugh crossovers. I mean, buy what you want, but don't delude yourself into thinking it looks good.

It's one of the less-nasty looking crossovers I've seen, but it's still kind of humpy like all of them.

Congrats on the purchase though.

[Smokey]

An orange Aventador was at this club I was at last night. As I'm leaving and sitting in the car line there it is sitting in the parking garage (how do you not valet an Aventador the fuck?). The guy who 'owns' it happens to come to the car. He starts it up and DAT EXHAUST. I was literally right behind it when he turned it on.

So then he pulls out and he gets in line behind me and all I can do is keep looking in the rear view mirror as I try not to hit anybody in front of me. Then I spend the rest of the night trying to figure out how I can get that car lol

[Waaghals]

Again, Audi takes the cake. But Mercs can be really nice once you go up in price.

The entry level Mercs has received a substantial upgrade. The C-class facelift is a massive improvement over it´s predecessor.

[TylerD]

am going to drop some vossen 20s on the zdx to make it a blue version of this... [IMG]http://www.vossenwheels.com/Gallery/FileUpload/Gallery/l_All%20Other%20Makes_Acura%20ZDX_VVSCV1_9f0.jpg [IMG]http://www.vossenwheels.com/Gallery/FileUpload/Gallery/l_All%20Other%20Makes_Acura%20ZDX_VVSCV1_d7c.jpg [IMG]http://www.vossenwheels.com/Gallery/FileUpload/Gallery/l_All%20Other%20Makes_Acura%20ZDX_VVSCV1_1b1.jpg

That is a good looking vehicle crossover or not.

Ugh crossovers. I mean, buy what you want, but don't delude yourself into thinking it looks good.

Ugh crossovers? lol

[BrokenEchelon]

The entry level Mercs has received a substantial upgrade. The C-class facelift is a massive improvement over it´s predecessor.

Totally agree. The C-Class facelift is sexy as all hell. The W212 E-Class is also so so very sexy.

[ascii42]

Ugh crossovers. I mean, buy what you want, but don't delude yourself into thinking it looks good.

Some look better than others. There are some serious compromises made with crossovers, but I would be lying if I said I haven't enjoyed driving one.

[kevo_huevo]

hey. i'll probably be dropping in on this thread more frequently. the gf and i are in the market for a new car, a 2013 subaru outback. we're still saving at the moment, so we won't be getting the car in the immediate future. i currently have an 08 volvo c30, but i just felt like it's time to "size up" and have a bit more comfort for long road trips.

[dark10x]

This statement is factually incorrect. You have obviously not been inside an Audi A8 or Jaguar XJ. Acura's interiors are quite derivative from Honda. Yep. It is their strongest trait. Had a B4 Audi A4... maintenance almost cost more than the car itself. Never again. Again, Audi takes the cake. But Mercs can be really nice once you go up in price.

Yeah, the German interiors can be quite wonderful, but I really can't say I'm fond of what Mercedes has been doing. When you say you need to go up in price you REALLY need to go up as just about everything in the C and E class level is, in my opinion, rather ugly. With the right materials it can work, but man, I just hate the center stack.

I don't mind large numbers of buttons, but the placement and look of the buttons are pretty ugly, the nav screen is small, and the way everything comes together just look off to me.

Audi is tops on this front and I'm actually pretty fond of the latest generation of BMW interiors as well. Honestly, a top end VW interior beats out Mercedes for me as well.

As for Acura, well, I actually kind of like their interiors in a different way. They have a nice flow and some nice design flourishes. Very Japanese, of course, but a nice step up from Honda. I'd take an Acura interior over Mercedes just about any day at this point despite the generally lower quality materials.

[golem]

An orange Aventador was at this club I was at last night. As I'm leaving and sitting in the car line there it is sitting in the parking garage (how do you not valet an Aventador the fuck?).

You would really give a $8/hr valet the keys to your $400k car?

[ascii42]

Yeah, the German interiors can be quite wonderful, but I really can't say I'm fond of what Mercedes has been doing. When you say you need to go up in price you REALLY need to go up as just about everything in the C and E class level is, in my opinion, rather ugly. With the right materials it can work, but man, I just hate the center stack. I don't mind large numbers of buttons, but the placement and look of the buttons are pretty ugly, the nav screen is small, and the way everything comes together just look off to me. Audi is tops on this front and I'm actually pretty fond of the latest generation of BMW interiors as well. Honestly, a top end VW interior beats out Mercedes for me as well. As for Acura, well, I actually kind of like their interiors in a different way. They have a nice flow and some nice design flourishes. Very Japanese, of course, but a nice step up from Honda. I'd take an Acura interior over Mercedes just about any day at this point despite the generally lower quality materials.

I'd have to sit in one, but yeah, that doesn't look so hot. Honestly, if it's not something I touch, I care less about what it's made out of than how it looks. Granted, in this class, you're paying enough money that you should get quality materials and looks.

[matmanx1]

I'd have to sit in one, but yeah, that doesn't look so hot. Honestly, if it's not something I touch, I care less about what it's made out of than how it looks. Granted, in this class, you're paying enough money that you should get quality materials and looks.

I have this complaint about more than one "premium" automobile company's interiors. Not only should the materials and build quality be up to snuff but it needs to have the proper look as well. I don't need or require art or flawless sculpture from my auto interior but I do want something that doesn't look ugly or overly busy. And note here I'm talking most about the dash, radio, center console and primary instruments like the steering wheel.

Of the cars I've looked at lately I liked the 1 series interior (without the iDrive) the most as it's not fancy but it has a nice functional look and doesn't contain any weird planes or angles or a plethora of tiny buttons. The center console armrest and passenger cupholder aren't great but other than that I don't have anything to complain about and the overall look is pleasing.
http://www.bmwblog.com/wp-content/up...e-interior.jpg

The Porsche Boxster/Cayman interior doesn't look quite as good as the BMW but I don't hate it either. I dig the instrument cluster in the Porsche's and the center console armrest doesn't interfere with shifts like it can in the BMW but the rather flat looking dashboard with the round air vents looks a little odd to me. http://porschecaymanbellevue.com/wp-...n_interior.jpg

I also concur with dark10x about the VW interiors. Or at least I used to. I find the newer models to be very well finished but be pretty boring in actual appearance. I prefer the look of the BMW's at this point, I think.

[DasRaven]

I just won a $500 gift certificate to the Bob Bondurant School of High Performance Driving. Has anyone here done one of their programs? If you have please tell me about your experience and what program you did.

I've done several.

$500 will cover the costs of the Performance Driving Experience half-day package, so that's what I'll describe here. All of these components have longer multi-day packages available.
Here, you'll get a sampler of the school's amateur classes. I actually recommend this class to all my friends who buy sports cars.

You'll start the day in an instruction class, covering the basics that anyone into cars probably already knows(weight transfer, apexes, slow-in/fast-out), but it gets everyone to a baseline.

Then you'll do most of the day in the Camaro learning active mitigation for accidents and other out-of-control daily driving events (read: how to correct a tailslide, rapid lane change, and threshold braking). I did this in CTS's back in the day.

After that, you'll do on track pace lapping with an instructor in a Corvette, good speeds and fun if you've never driven in anger before.

The day ends with what is a very eye-opening experience for many, 125cc karts to lock in those newly honed skills in a very raw environment. People don't realize how fast those things accelerate since they look like toys to the uninformed.

Then, once you're juiced on speed, they'll advise you to take the next level Challenge course (same as above, but more track time, and the events are timed, including an autocross) and/or the High Performance Driving course (3-days(tons of track time), firesuits & helmets).

Book WAY ahead of time for these less expensive courses, they fill quickly, but are so fun!

[AlphaSnake]

Acura's interiors are 80% there...but a big giant knob poking out from the center console like an old artifact from the 1990s absolutely ruins the look of the console. Otherwise, they have great looking gauges, seats/leather, and layouts if you ask me. But nowhere near the top 10. Audi is the supreme king there. And Mercedes is a catastrophe no matter what car you step foot into.

BMW's interiors are quite stunning, though, very close to Audi's offerings this generation with a few drawbacks here and there.

[dark10x]

Acura's interiors are 80% there...but a big giant knob poking out from the center console like an old artifact from the 1990s absolutely ruins the look of the console. Otherwise, they have great looking gauges, seats/leather, and layouts if you ask me. But nowhere near the top 10. Audi is the supreme king there. And Mercedes is a catastrophe no matter what car you step foot into. BMW's interiors are quite stunning, though, very close to Audi's offerings this generation with a few drawbacks here and there.

Yeah, I don't understand the knob either. Considering its function, they should move it to a position similar to the iDrive wheel or Audi control knob. It works in almost exactly the same fashion so why force people to reach up for it? A strange design decision for sure.

[kathode]

Thinking about a new ride (I'm rocking the '05 Corolla at the moment, u jelly?). I really like the look of the BMW 1-series. What's the general feeling on them? Quality for the price? Is the 135 worth the extra few thousand?

And any good alternatives? I'm looking for a 2-door that's fun to drive and comfortable. My budget probably caps around 35k but I don't mind going 2-3 years used.

[BrokenEchelon]

Thinking about a new ride (I'm rocking the '05 Corolla at the moment, u jelly?). I really like the look of the BMW 1-series. What's the general feeling on them? Quality for the price? Is the 135 worth the extra few thousand? And any good alternatives? I'm looking for a 2-door that's fun to drive and comfortable. My budget probably caps around 35k but I don't mind going 2-3 years used.

The 1-Series is a horrible choice.

If you're ok with going 2-3 years used and have $35k to spend, then you've got a a plethora of options.

3-Series Coupe (if you still want a BMW), Miata, S2000, just to name a few.

[paskowitz]

Thinking about a new ride (I'm rocking the '05 Corolla at the moment, u jelly?). I really like the look of the BMW 1-series. What's the general feeling on them? Quality for the price? Is the 135 worth the extra few thousand? And any good alternatives? I'm looking for a 2-door that's fun to drive and comfortable. My budget probably caps around 35k but I don't mind going 2-3 years used.

AVOID the 1 series. It is slow, handles poorly (especially for a BMW), and is impractical. I drove one at the BMW plant in SC and absolutely hated it. I would never recommend it to anyone. Plus I think it is ugly.

If you want a BMW... $35k will get you a good condition medium millage E46 M3. It does not get much more fun to drive than that. You may even be able to find a certified pre-owned one at a BMW dealership.

I would also look at a used Evo X MR. I personally love the car. I have never owned one, but I have driven it many times and have not heard any horror stories. The only thing to consider is that Mitsubishi is on the way out as an automotive company.

You could get a Subaru BRZ fully loaded, with some nice tires, and aftermarket upgrades. I drove one, loved it.

[matmanx1]

Thinking about a new ride (I'm rocking the '05 Corolla at the moment, u jelly?). I really like the look of the BMW 1-series. What's the general feeling on them? Quality for the price? Is the 135 worth the extra few thousand? And any good alternatives? I'm looking for a 2-door that's fun to drive and comfortable. My budget probably caps around 35k but I don't mind going 2-3 years used.

I liked the 1 series alot. I'm not sure what the last few posters have against them. The 128i is 6.2 seconds to 60 and the 135i is 5 seconds flat. That's not slow. Build quality is good and with the Sport or M-Sport package the handling feels great even if there's too much understeer programmed in. For an everyday car that can hold 4 adults the performance is quite good, actually. Also, the 135i is actually the highest rated car Consumer Reports has ever tested scoring a 97 out of 100. My only negative with it is the price.

And looks are subjective. I think the 1 series is fine in the looks department, especially with the M-Sport package. Best advice for kathode is to go test drive one and read as much as he can from what others have said about the car. In that respect I think the 1 series comes out pretty well.

[AlphaSnake]

AVOID the 1 series. It is slow, handles poorly (especially for a BMW), and is impractical. I drove one at the BMW plant in SC and absolutely hated it. I would never recommend it to anyone. Plus I think it is ugly. If you want a BMW... $35k will get you a good condition medium millage E46 M3. It does not get much more fun to drive than that. You may even be able to find a certified pre-owned one at a BMW dealership. I would also look at a used Evo X MR. I personally love the car. I have never owned one, but I have driven it many times and have not heard any horror stories. The only thing to consider is that Mitsubishi is on the way out as an automotive company. You could get a Subaru BRZ fully loaded, with some nice tires, and aftermarket upgrades. I drove one, loved it.

You can't find a certified BMW that is older than 5 years. All E46 M3s at this point are older than 5 years and are not sold certified.

[paskowitz]

@Alpha: Good point I forgot about that. Scratch that statement.

I liked the 1 series alot. I'm not sure what the last few posters have against them. The 128i is 6.2 seconds to 60 and the 135i is 5 seconds flat. That's not slow. Build quality is good and with the Sport or M-Sport package the handling feels great even if there's too much understeer programmed in. For an everyday car that can hold 4 adults the performance is quite good, actually. Also, the 135i is actually the highest rated car Consumer Reports has ever tested scoring a 97 out of 100. My only negative with it is the price. And looks are subjective. I think the 1 series is fine in the looks department, especially with the M-Sport package. Best advice for kathode is to go test drive one and read as much as he can from what others have said about the car. In that respect I think the 1 series comes out pretty well.

To be specific I found the 135i I drove to be much slower than advertised. I would say 0-60 was more like 5.5-6 seconds. I also found it did not respond well under heavy braking. Turn in was ok but mid corner stability was lacking. I never felt confident driving the car. The 3 series has far better characteristics.

Oh did I mention you can get a used Acura NSX, Porsche Cayman and Lotus Elise for less than $35k. In fact you could get them for $25k and save the $10k for eventual repairs. To me that is a MUCH better deal. Again, if your primary goal is to own a fun to drive car.

[ascii42]

I feel like it just makes sense to step up to the 3 series. I'd go 335d personally, but I'm not sure how easy those are to find used.

[GuessWho]

Jaguar have the best interiors.

[ascii42]

Jaguar have the best interiors.

But their exteriors just aren't the same without the leaping cat hood ornament.

Jaaaaag

[paskowitz]

Jaguar have the best interiors.

The Jaguar XJ has the best interior but the XF and XK are merely good... not great:

[AlphaSnake]

Yeah, the XF's interior is decent - but can't quite hold a candle to the A6.

The XJ and the A8 though, that might as well be a fight to the death. They're pretty even in looks.

[coldfoot]

Mk7 Golf:






Looks good except for the C pillar, interior looks amazing for that price range.

[OnkelC]

I won't buy another Golf.

[reilo]

I thought VW and Audi stopped sharing platforms?

[BrokenEchelon]

Jaguar have the best interiors.

I'll see your Jag and raise you the A8.

[ascii42]

I thought VW and Audi stopped sharing platforms?

For their smaller cars, they are actually getting more similar.

[kharma45]

The Jaguar XJ has the best interior but the XF and XK are merely good... not great:

Yeah I wasn't that keen on the design of the XF interior when we tried it out. It was nice (and heaps better than the E-Class) but the A6 trumped it.

Mk7 Golf: Looks good except for the C pillar, interior looks amazing for that price range.

Very Polo looking front end. That top-spec interior looks great.

I thought VW and Audi stopped sharing platforms?

For smaller cars no, the A1 is a Polo and the new MK7 Golf is based on the same MQB platform as the A3.

[Piggus]

Audi interiors are clean looking, but pretty boring. It's German afterall. That Jaguar XJ interior on the other hand is beautiful.

[matmanx1]

The A8 interior is gorgeous. I also like the tan leather seats with the dark dash combo in the Golf. Very classy, especially for a car in that price range.

In my quest for a fun car I'm definitely leaning towards the Cayman. I don't especially need the back seat. I don't think you can find a Cayman for $35k that's only 2-3 years old though. Most of the 09's are still going for upwards of $40k and that's probably because 09 was the year that the Boxster and Cayman got a mild refresh which included a new, larger engine.

If you don't mind stepping back to the 06-08 models then there are plenty out there for 30-35k and that's probably where I will land depending on what's available in a few months. The Cayman is the sweetest driving car I've ever been in, that's for sure. I've heard the Cayman was the benchmark for the FRS/BRZ engineers and if true, I can see why.

[paskowitz]

The A8 interior is gorgeous. I also like the tan leather seats with the dark dash combo in the Golf. Very classy, especially for a car in that price range. In my quest for a fun car I'm definitely leaning towards the Cayman. I don't especially need the back seat. I don't think you can find a Cayman for $35k that's only 2-3 years old though. Most of the 09's are still going for upwards of $40k and that's probably because 09 was the year that the Boxster and Cayman got a mild refresh which included a new, larger engine. If you don't mind stepping back to the 06-08 models then there are plenty out there for 30-35k and that's probably where I will land depending on what's available in a few months. The Cayman is the sweetest driving car I've ever been in, that's for sure. I've heard the Cayman was the benchmark for the FRS/BRZ engineers and if true, I can see why.

All gens of Cayman were pretty well built. Obviously, if radio knob breaks that will be a $100 please (slight exaggeration)... but at least your trans won't tank at 100k miles like a used S4.

[mescalineeyes]

oh look, VW has managed to build the most boring car in the world!

[soundscream]

I got a question to ask to see if I'm not thinking rationally.

I want my next car to be a manual transmission. I have never driven a manual car outside of video games. I don't know anyone with a manual car.

I was thinking of buying a cheap manual car ~$2000 to get it down because I wouldn't want to screw up my new car.

Am I crazy for thinking of doing this?

[BrokenEchelon]

The A8 interior is gorgeous. I also like the tan leather seats with the dark dash combo in the Golf. Very classy, especially for a car in that price range. In my quest for a fun car I'm definitely leaning towards the Cayman. I don't especially need the back seat. I don't think you can find a Cayman for $35k that's only 2-3 years old though. Most of the 09's are still going for upwards of $40k and that's probably because 09 was the year that the Boxster and Cayman got a mild refresh which included a new, larger engine. If you don't mind stepping back to the 06-08 models then there are plenty out there for 30-35k and that's probably where I will land depending on what's available in a few months. The Cayman is the sweetest driving car I've ever been in, that's for sure. I've heard the Cayman was the benchmark for the FRS/BRZ engineers and if true, I can see why.

I've been tossing and turning over whether to buy a second gen 997 or Cayman S in the next few years. I really need to go test drive both of them. #fwp

[mescalineeyes]

I'll see your Jag and raise you the A8.

sweet mother of god. does that come in black?

[Mattlikewhoa]

I got a question to ask to see if I'm not thinking rationally. I want my next car to be a manual transmission. I have never driven a manual car outside of video games. I don't know anyone with a manual car. I was thinking of buying a cheap manual car ~$2000 to get it down because I wouldn't want to screw up my new car. Am I crazy for thinking of doing this?

Buy the new stick car and have fun. Seriously, my first car was manual and I didn't know how drive stick before that. After it took a few minutes to get it in reverse without stalling, I was able to make my way home.

If there are driving schools in your area, see if they have manual lessons that you can take (I had a friend who did this). It's a lot cheaper then buying a $2K beater.

[BrokenEchelon]

Buy the new stick car and have fun. Seriously, my first car was manual and I didn't know how drive stick before that. After it took a few minutes to get it in reverse without stalling, I was able to make my way home. If there are driving schools in your area, see if they have manual lessons that you can take (I had a friend who did this). It's a lot cheaper then buying a $2K beater.

Agreed. It takes an afternoon to learn how to drive a manual well enough not to stall the thing. You won't fuck up your tranny/clutch that quickly. You shouldn't worry about it.

[Halvie]

oh look, VW has managed to build the most boring car in the world!

You think that is more boring than the current golf? Looks strangely aggressive for a golf. Engine news has been pretty disappointing though :(

[Souldriver]

Nothing touches the Golf IV.




It is just an absolute classic, and doesn't seem to age at all. It looks more modern than the V for example, imo. If I was old enough at the time (and had money off course), I would've bought the "rabbit" edition of the Golf IV. It was the last edition before the new Golf V was introduced. It had nice wheels, many options, beautiful colors and slightly altered rear lights (white turn signals instead of yellow/blackish).

With the Golf V the design took an absolute nosedive. What a shitty looking, "van-like" car, with the ugly rear lights and the big plastic rear bumpers. They even managed to make it look worse after its release, as at first the front lights of the car were slightly darkened giving it a more sporty look, but after a year or so they went with clear head lights. Ironically though, the GTI version of the V was a return to form imo and looked very good, compared to the previous GTI's.

The VI was an improvement on the V, and this new VII seems to be an improvement on the VI as well. It's all just going very gradually and slowly. I find the profile and back of the new Golf nice, the front looks pretty meh... And while I see the interior is classy and good looking, I've always been more of a fan of perfectly symmetrical interiors, and VW was the last bastion in that regard as every other car maker is moving into the "cockpit interior" direction ...until now, since the new Golf also has an asymetrical interior. :(


So, all in all, mixed feelings about the new Golf. But one thing remains. You can always configure a Golf that looks good. It's because the base design of Golfs is so neutral (some say: boring) looking.

[ascii42]

I got a question to ask to see if I'm not thinking rationally. I want my next car to be a manual transmission. I have never driven a manual car outside of video games. I don't know anyone with a manual car. I was thinking of buying a cheap manual car ~$2000 to get it down because I wouldn't want to screw up my new car. Am I crazy for thinking of doing this?

I don't think that's too crazy, but probably unnecessary. You aren't too likely to cause any permanent damage to the new car, but I would share your concern with doing something stupid during what is supposed to be the vehicle's break in period.

[LazyLoki]

sweet mother of god. does that come in black?

With the individual options of "Audi exclusive", it comes in pretty much every colour you could want.

[mescalineeyes]

You think that is more boring than the current golf? Looks strangely aggressive for a golf. Engine news has been pretty disappointing though :(

well the color sure took the edge off of any aggressiveness left over in that very, very bland design.

don't get me wrong, it's nice. Very nice infact. Just bland as hell.

[GamePnoy74]

New Mk7 Golf looks very nice...let's see how it is in GTI trim, yo.

Golf Rs, while great in general, just aren't as compelling to me due to their high pricetag for a compact.

[Halvie]

well the color sure took the edge off of any aggressiveness left over in that very, very bland design. don't get me wrong, it's nice. Very nice infact. Just bland as hell.

Just turned out way nicer than any of the renders I saw. Wasn't expecting much going from those. Next gti / r should look great. Now if they would just offer a more exciting engine...

New Mk7 Golf looks very nice...let's see how it is in GTI trim, yo. Golf Rs, while great in general, just aren't not as compelling to me due to their high pricetag for a compact.

Isn't so much the price as it is the ehhh performance. 2.5t R would easily justify its price or a bit higher.