MMV: 3/4 of our Wii games lost money, 4/5 of our PSP games made money

[Jonnyram]

But apparently what was gained from the PSP games was not enough to offset what was lost from the Wii titles.

First time a company has been this frank in their earnings reports! The PDF of their Q&A is here:
http://www.magicalir.net/7844/stream...0091113faq.pdf

Video and slides of their conference here:
http://www.magicalir.net/7844/stream...113/index.html

Sorry it's all in Japanese. Perhaps I or someone else can translate in a short while.

[grandjedi6]

Is the one Wii game that made money No More Heroes' western release?

[Jocchan]

Is the one Wii game that made money No More Heroes' western release?

Probably
:(

[Amir0x]

But if only third parties tried surely they'd...?

[ram]

it would be a shame, if MMV must close it doors, but putting most if not all eggs in the wii basket was probably a fatal error. and it shows - wii doesnt print money - at least not for MMV.

[Hero of Legend]

They shouldn't write off Muramasa and Arc Rise yet, Muramasa did 35,000 in two weeks in NA (came out mid-September, the number was from the September NPD) so it didn't do that bad at all at to start with, and Arc Rise isn't even out in NA yet.

Perhaps they just mean in Japanese sales for all Wii games? Or do they say worldwide?

it would be a shame, if MMV must close it doors, but putting most if not all eggs in the wii basket was probably a fatal error. and it shows - wii doesnt print money - at least not for MMV.

They blame their name being poor, not the console itself, I don't think they ever really blamed the Wii at all.

And the portable market is where Japan is at right now, so it's not surprising they made more with their PSP (and DS?) titles.

[timetokill]

it would be a shame, if MMV must close it doors, but putting most if not all eggs in the wii basket was probably a fatal error.

5 eggs in PSP basket, 4 eggs in Wii basket = most if not all eggs in Wii basket?

[Nirolak]

Well, I don't claim to be a business genius by any means, but it seems making more PSP games might be prudent.

They shouldn't write off Muramasa and Arc Rise yet, Muramasa did 35,000 in two weeks (came out mid-September, the number was from the September NPD) so it didn't do that bad at all at to start with, and Arc Rise isn't even out in NA yet. Perhaps they just mean in Japanese sales for all Wii games? Or do they say worldwide?

...I'm pretty sure they know how the games sold if they know whether or not they lost money.

[Buggy Loop]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...tainment_games

Well i did my part, i have no more heroes, baroque and muramasa. I hope they didnt expect baroque to sell well though, even im not quite sure why i bought it or why i have not returned it yet.

[ram]

5 eggs in PSP basket, 4 eggs in Wii basket = most if not all eggs in Wii basket?

production values? marketing? you know, thats were the money is. and most MMV psp games have a fraction of these.

[AniHawk]

But if only third parties tried surely they'd...?

Just think of how much more money they would have lost if they didn't even try.

[Hero of Legend]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...tainment_games Well i did my part, i have no more heroes, baroque and muramasa. I hope they didnt expect baroque to sell well though, even im not quite sure why i bought it or why i have not returned it yet.

Baroque is from Atlus and Sting.

[markot]

1. Games targeted for Japans shrinking market with limited international appeal
2. .....
3. Profit.

[GrotesqueBeauty]

Which games though?

[dani_dc]

I was hoping MMV would be rewarded by the good games they had been releasing on the Wii.

Unfortunately games need more than quality to sell, they need appeal and marketing behind them, both of which, I would say, the great majority of MMV Wii games lacked.

[El-Suave]

Had the bigger publishers cultivated the Wii as a good RPG platform, smaller publishers would have it easier.
Two years ago I thought the Wii would become the home to the Suikoden's of the gaming world, known brands where a HD version might be too risky, but it didn't happen.

[sprsk]

But if only third parties tried surely they'd...?

You can't sell what no one knows about.

[SmokyDave]

Yeah! Woo! Go PSP you little software monster!

Oh come on, let me have this one, please, I need this.

[Amir0x]

Just think of how much more money they would have lost if they didn't even try.

Shoulda stuck to DS/PSP.

You can't sell what no one knows about.

Yeah. Maybe they should go to Nintendo and ask them politely to throw a few bucks their way for supporting the platform so heavily. I'm sure there's a few breadcrumbs falling off the table that Wii Sports built to give one of MMV game a 5 million marketing budget!

However, I'm not sure how that works since I don't even know what PSP games they've made off the top of my head but that looks like it's working out well for them.

[Nirolak]

Had the bigger publishers cultivated the Wii as a good RPG platform, smaller publishers would have it easier. Two years ago I thought the Wii would become the home to the Suikoden's of the gaming world where a HD version might be too risky, but it didn't happen.

The issue is, it's already far cheaper and there's a far larger audience for JRPGs on the DS and PSP already.

The Wii probably would have gotten this market if portables didn't exist, but right now it's the platform with higher costs, less third party sales, and a much smaller audience compared to the handhelds, so as a whole there's essentially no reason to really put your JRPG there unless Nintendo is paying you for it.

Yeah! Woo! Go PSP you little software monster! Oh come on, let me have this one, please, I need this.

In Japan it actually is a software monster. Not as much as the DS, but still very respectable.

[Amir0x]

I still don't know what people who buy a PSP in America actually do with it. I mean, piracy doesn't even begin to explain what the fuck is going on there

[Nirolak]

I still don't know what people who buy a PSP in America actually do with it. I mean, piracy doesn't even begin to explain what the fuck is going on there

The ones with unhackable PSPs seem to buy one or two games and seem to let the system either rot or play media on it otherwise. The same behavior seems to apply to people with hackable PSPs who buy all their games also.

This year for example, Dissidia actually sold 340,000 copies, and Monster Hunter apparently got over 150k. I imagine a lot of them are still buying Crisis Core as well since every time I see its total it's goes up. It's over 2 million worldwide at this point.

[obonicus]

You can't sell what no one knows about.

But they got the word out for the PSP games?

[SmokyDave]

I still don't know what people who buy a PSP in America actually do with it. I mean, piracy doesn't even begin to explain what the fuck is going on there

Isn't it obvious? 82% of all PSPs sold are sold for the purpose of playing Lego Batman over Remote Play.

Actually, I can totally see someone buying a PSP just to use remote play with their PS3.

[sprsk]

PSP had some Valhalla knights games hero 30 and an anime title (reborn).

Lol iPhone autocorrects psp as pap.

[Hero of Legend]

Hang on, I'm reading the pdf on top with Google Translator, and if I'm understanding these numbers correctly (they're pretty clear), the numbers are as follows for Wii:

Muramasa: The Demon Blade JP = 47,000

Arc Rise Fantasia JP = 45,000

Valhalla Knights: Eldar Saga NA = 16,000

Harvest Moon: Tree of Tranquility EU = 57,000

Little King's Story:
JP = 26,000
EU = 67,000
NA = 37,000
Total = 130,000

Please wait until someone who can translate properly clairify this, but that is what I can make out.

[ItsInMyVeins]

Muramasa is released tomorrow in EU by the way, although it seems like a bunch of the larger chains won't stock it (?).

[AniHawk]

I guess LKS's European sales make sense when you consider their love for tyrannical monarchs.

[Nirolak]

Hang on, I'm reading the pdf on top with Google Translator, and if I'm understanding these numbers correctly (they're pretty clear), the numbers are as follows for Wii: Muramasa: The Demon Blade JP = 47,000 Arc Rise Fantasia JP = 45,000 Valhalla Knights: Eldar Saga NA = 16,000 Harvest Moon: Tree of Tranquility EU = 57,000 Little King's Story: JP = 26,000 EU = 67,000 NA = 37,000 Total = 130,000 Please wait until someone who can translate properly clairify this, but that is what I can make out.

Assuming these are correct, I wonder what average price points they sold at. Marvelous was mentioning they were losing a lot of money due to charge backs at European retail, which would explain why most of these titles didn't make money even with sales that don't seem too horrible relative to their budget.

[Amir0x]

PSP had some Valhalla knights games hero 30 and an anime title (reborn).

no wonder why I haven't heard of the PSP games, terrible lineup :<

[voodoopanda]

Games that don't sell well and don't make money are my favorite kinds of games to play. I generally don't like sequels or games copying another's style because it's popular.

[ItsInMyVeins]

I guess Europe's love for tyrannical monarchs makes sense when it comes to those LKS sales.

How many of those other games have even been released in yurop?

[Hero of Legend]

Assuming these are correct, I wonder what average price points they sold at. Marvelous was mentioning they were losing a lot of money due to charge backs at European retail, which would explain why most of these titles didn't make money even with sales that don't seem too horrible relative to their budget.

I still say they claim to be losing money is because they are either only out in one region, or are just fresh released in another. They're counting their chickens before they're all hatched. :P

[AndriaSang]

I haven't been able to figure out how they came up with four games. Going by just the games listed in the Q&A, worldwide, the figure comes to five. Japan alone, the figure comes to three.

Any help?

[timetokill]

How many of those other games have even been released in yurop?

All of the ones where you play as a tyrannical monarch, that's for sure.

[grandjedi6]

[Cosmonaut X]

...I count 5 Wii games there. I can imagine Valhalla Knights, Harvest Moon and Arc Rise all underperformed. Not sure about LKS and Muramasa.

[grandjedi6]

...I count 5 Wii games there. I can imagine Valhalla Knights, Harvest Moon and Arc Rise all underperformed. Not sure about LKS and Muramasa.

Yeah, I'm not sure why they said 3/4 Wii and 4/5 PSP considering they seem to have released 5 Wii and 4 PSP (perhaps he accidently switched the two fractions?). They also don't seem to count games that were published by someone else (like Muramasa in NA by Ignition).

I'm going to take a wild guess and say Little Kings' Story was the sole profitable game they're refering to but I'm honestly not sure. The European release of Valhalla Knights 2 is obviously the underperforming PSP game though.

[Hero of Legend]

...I count 5 Wii games there. I can imagine Valhalla Knights, Harvest Moon and Arc Rise all underperformed. Not sure about LKS and Muramasa.

HM more than surely profited by now, it was released in 2007 in JP and last year in NA, I'm not sure the exact numbers, but I'm quite sure they were a lot.

It shouldn't count was they seem to count new releases for this year with those four games otherwise.

And luckily, LKS looks to be that title that profitted, 130,000 is really impressive!

I was just about to say that Muramasa's number looks unchanged from back in June, but it was actually at 45,000:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost...0&postcount=11

Pitiful amount since. :'(

But as I said, it did 35,000 in September when it released in NA says the NPD from that month, hopefully the NA total is a bit higher now and actually does decently in EU despite the likely low store space it'll have. :'(

[grandjedi6]

[CrushDance]

We wouldn't be here if developers actually gave the Wii a chance. Such an immature industry sometimes.

[thestopsign]

The ones with unhackable PSPs seem to buy one or two games and seem to let the system either rot or play media on it otherwise. The same behavior seems to apply to people with hackable PSPs who buy all their games also. This year for example, Dissidia actually sold 340,000 copies, and Monster Hunter apparently got over 150k. I imagine a lot of them are still buying God of War and Crisis Core as well since every time I see their totals they keep going up as both are well above 2 million now.

Don't pull numbers out of your ass. They are both just over 800,000.

[SecretBonusPoint]

And thus, PS3/X360 NMH happened.

[Hero of Legend]

This is the forcast chart right for the next quarter?

Does this mean that MMV actually has 4 more Wii games yet to be unveiled and XSEED will bring over two of them?

Why no mention of the PS3 or 360?

Edit: Or is that their chart from the past quarter?

[AniHawk]

It's the chart for last quarter, but in Japan Time it's the forecast for next quarter. Hope that helps.

[Tenbatsu]

I think they need to hire more marketing people.

[Taurus]

I have a Wii but I can't name even one game from this company for any platform. Are they a publisher or a developer? *feels ignorant*

[timetokill]

I have a Wii but I can't name even one game from this company for any platform. Are they a publisher or a developer? *feels ignorant*

I think they need to hire more marketing people.

... welp, that about does it.

[farnham]

the 4 marvelous games that were released this year were

valhalla knights
oboro muramasa
little king story
arc rise fantasia


i bet oboro was the only one that did make any money

[ethelred]

I still say they claim to be losing money is because they are either only out in one region, or are just fresh released in another. They're counting their chickens before they're all hatched. :P

Oh, I wonder why they haven't thought of that. Have you emailed Ken to ask him to pass that on to Marvelous? I'm sure they'll be pretty relieved to know they actually aren't losing money on their Wii games after all.