|
Junior Member
(10-11-2010, 04:43 AM)
|
#52
indeed, friends lists being cross compatible is a key component.
what i was talking to that press guy in london about was the hope that things would just go towards an open standard (not likely) cant say i've ever been accused of not knowing how the pc gaming industry works... pretty entertaining to be on the other side of this stuff haha. |
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 04:51 AM)
|
#53
Originally Posted by Steve Gibson:
|
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 04:51 AM)
|
#54
Hey Steve, when you said this:
"[We] want people to be able to play together and right now if a guy buys a game on Games for Windows and a guy buys a game on Steam - they can't play together," Gearbox's head of marketing Steve Gibson said at London Games Festival. "If another guy bought it in a retail store, he can't play with the first two guys." What game(s) were you referencing, for example? Also when is the Borderlands level patch coming (I know you know!)? |
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 04:59 AM)
|
#57
Thanks for clearing that up Steve.
Yeah it would be nice in a perfect world, but we all know that's not going to happen. I'm sure Valve wouldnt have a problem with it but there is no way MS would consider connecting their live members with PC gamers who are not paying for thier service. Not to mention that they would be exposing live gamers to people who enjoy all of the same features for free on PC. Neither Sony or MS want to have their services connected to each other either. The problem has nothing to do with the PC or Valve. This is the nature of consoles. And actually connecting PC gamers and console gamers in-game with each other just wont work. Even for a game like Borderlands that is focused on co-op instead of .vs. And a multiplayer game featuring keyboard/mouse users .vs controller users is a bloodbath waiting to happen. Also, just in case you didn't pick up on it in this thread, Gamespy has always sucked and will always suck. Could you please pass that on to whoever needs to hear that at Gearbox. Thanks. |
|
Junior Member
(10-11-2010, 05:04 AM)
|
#59
Zzoram,
i'd appreciate the benefit of the doubt given my history in pc gaming. i've been to a couple rodeos. i would agree that if i was not aware of DoW2 and how they managed things that would be pretty surprising. you're right. yes there are ways around the whole thing but it's all hackery trying to get around things and guys who arent as tech savvy can end up having a hard time. i didnt think when i was talking to the guy that my mentioning that was even worth a news item. of course all gamers want the easiest and simplest method to find their friends online and play together. a unified protocol would make that easier. |
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 05:10 AM)
|
#62
Originally Posted by Steve Gibson:
In case Steve or anyone else lurking from Gearbox didn't get the message...
Originally Posted by I <3 Memes:
|
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 05:11 AM)
|
#63
Originally Posted by Steve Gibson:
|
|
is too reasonable
for this forum (10-11-2010, 05:14 AM)
|
#64
Originally Posted by Gully State:
1) Valve is going to release, let's say, Half-Left 4 Dead: Portal to the Team Fortress Strike, in 2010. 2) Gearbox is going to release Borderlands 2: Even More Boring, six months before that. Since it has a PC port, Take Two has decided to put Even More Boring on Steam. 3) So EMB sells gangbusters on Steam, netting a good profit for Take Two, and Valve takes a cut. 4) Pitchford argues that the money from Borderlands 2 is going to go in to the development or marketing budgets for their next ultra-game six months down the line. So when Gearbox releases Borderlands 2 DLC, probably about chimps flinging shit at each other, around the same time Valve is releasing their game, Valve gets a leg up off Pitchford's work with Borderlands 2. |
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 05:14 AM)
|
#65
Originally Posted by Steve Gibson:
|
|
Hello friend! Have you heard the good news about
(10-11-2010, 05:15 AM)
|
#66
There's nothing to get around though. Neither system has any sort of block in place that prevents either from working with the other system and there's literally dozens of games on the market that use both in tandem just fine.
Of course you're not going to be able to share a friends list between the two systems but that's an absurd request and akin to expecting your PS3 and 360 friends list to be integrated. One thing that certainly doesn't help the segregation is using a third rate system like Gamespy that is structurally broken and has been all but abandoned by everyone else (because its so awful) so you need to create a completely new friends list. If you ahve a desire to create greater unficiation on the platform then why is your company going to much greater efforts than most to further segretate gamers on the platform? Sorry, but I'm not buying your excuses, you've got this all wrong, the systems simply don't work anything like you're suggesting and what's worse your own company is personally sabotaging any attempts at unification as well. Want to show your commitment to the PC platform and making hooking up with your friends easier? Then confirm Steamworks support for Duke, don't create further segregation by using a shitty separate system no one wants. People don't take kindly to being lied to. |
|
Banned
(10-11-2010, 05:17 AM)
|
#68
Originally Posted by ShockingAlberto:
|
|
Worships the porcelain goddess
(10-11-2010, 05:17 AM)
|
#69
Originally Posted by Boonoo:
I know Randy didn't say all this crap, but until PC gamers get an apology for being lied to with developer double speak...
Quote:
|
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 05:19 AM)
|
#71
Originally Posted by ShockingAlberto:
Your tag is wildly inappropriate. I'm sorry if you didnt like Borderlands but most people who played it loved it. A flawed game yes, but it got more than enough right to be called a AAA game. And while the game itself may be a port I appreciate that Gearbox didn't just paste console controls onto a mouse like far too many games have lately. Borderlands has some damn satisfying shooting going for it. |
|
is too reasonable
for this forum (10-11-2010, 05:21 AM)
|
#72
Originally Posted by I <3 Memes:
Are you saying I'm unreasonable because I did not like Borderlands and was poking a bit of fun at it? Or that I misrepresented Pitchford's argument somehow? |
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 05:21 AM)
|
#73
Originally Posted by I <3 Memes:
|
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 05:27 AM)
|
#74
Originally Posted by Steve Gibson:
With that said let me ask you this...what will gearbox do down the line with its PC games to help with this issue? I mean you can complain all you want about Valve and MS not doing enough to integrate PC gaming but like many have stated in this thread, your own company is using an antiquated online gaming solution that forces PC gamers to create a new friendlist, has unintuitive UI that was straight ripped off from consoles, and touted features such as benchmarking and gun stat cards requiring the very same "hackery" that you are pointing out as a flaw in PC gaming in general. |
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 05:29 AM)
|
#75
Originally Posted by Kintaro:
Quote:
|
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 05:31 AM)
|
#76
Originally Posted by ShockingAlberto:
That you were too harsh on Borderlands the game. I can understand people being upset about the game being a port, gamespy, as well as the comments from Gearbox people. I'm just saying that for the majority of people who played it BL was a great game. Maybe I'm just over reacting to you poking a bit of fun at the game. I'm just saying that for most of us who played it the game was a blast and far from boring. Just a few dumb design decisions, and with the exception of Dr. Ned, really bad endings. |
|
thanks for the laugh
(10-11-2010, 05:34 AM)
|
#78
while i appreciate the effort from some developers to keep the libertarian banner of pc gaming flying high, i can barely think of a rational reason why anyone (who doesn't already have in a dog in the fight) publishing a pc game with any clout wouldn't just implement steamworks on a whim.
i mean, pros: free. no day 0 piracy. integrated community. multiplayer backend. single unified, instantly updatable version. bunch of shit off your mind. cons: might piss off brad wardell and joseph merrick. doesn't give you asperger points. selling out to the man.
Last edited by ghst; 10-11-2010 at 05:39 AM.
|
|
Hello friend! Have you heard the good news about
(10-11-2010, 05:35 AM)
|
#81
Originally Posted by Steve Gibson:
There's no hackery because there's no restrictions there at all. There's dozens of GFWL titles sold on Steam and they all work just fine. You can play with guys who bought the retail copy and guys who bought it on the GFWL marketplace. Similarly all Steamworks titles offer the exact same functionality to boxed products, Steam copies and copies sold on other DD platforms. There's no restrictions, all copies can play online with all copies with both systems.
Originally Posted by Steve Gibson:
We've got two protocols that have very wide reaching support now. I don't think having two friendslists is such a big deal expecially when one is shared with your Xbox as well. Console gamers cope just fine with seperate PSN and Xbox Live logins. You can't begrudge Valve creating their own protocol when Microsoft's offering was so poor and included some pretty damn severe restrictions on developers (like having to pay for patches!!) Steamworks was needed so Valve filled that gap. The current situation isn't ideal but it wouldn't be all that bad either if third party developers supported one of these two recognised solutions. They absolute worst thing anyone could do though and the one thing that's going to provide more headaches and issues for end users than anything else is to use some alternate third rate solution that integrates with neither and doesn't even work as advertised. This is precisely what Gearbox did with Borderlands and after such a shitty move designed to create greater segmentation on the platform well I'm sorry but I think you're the last person I want to hear complaining about others not working towards greater integration on the platform. Actions speak louder than words, and recent the actions from the company you're representing are in direct conflict with the message you're sending out here. I think our position is quite easy to understand and completely reasonable. You're spreading clear misinformation about how these systems work, if that's a misunderstanding on your part then fine but I'm sorry someone in your position shouldn't be making these basic errors. You're also pleading others to take a stance towards something that very recently your company actively tried to destroy. I appreciate you taking the time to respond directly and yeah, when I don't expect someone to be listening in then I'm going to come off as a bit of an asshole but the complaints raised are genuine. |
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 05:36 AM)
|
#82
Originally Posted by Sinatar:
|
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 05:38 AM)
|
#84
Originally Posted by Fredescu:
Seems like more game than not give us the garbage mouse controls like the games I listed above. I guess that is what it has come to, appreciating the rare times PC gamers get actual honest to goodness mouse look. |
|
Junior Member
(10-11-2010, 05:39 AM)
|
#85
Originally Posted by JWong:
|
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 05:44 AM)
|
#87
Originally Posted by Jintor:
|
|
Hello friend! Have you heard the good news about
(10-11-2010, 05:46 AM)
|
#89
Originally Posted by ghst:
Hey, I think even Merrick would take Steamworks over Gamespy! :lol It isn't suited to everyone, the likes of Blizzard and even DICE have proven they can do a lot of interesting stuff on their own but if you can't and you don't have the budget for it then don't fight it, you're doing nobody any favours by patching together some hobbled system that doesn't work yourself or using some God awful broken POS like Gamespy. Yeah, you might indirectly add to Valve's pools of money but you're also going to be able to offer your customers a significantly better product and generally speaking, having a better product (at a decreased outlay, no less) tends do the sale of your game no harm at all.
Last edited by brain_stew; 10-11-2010 at 05:52 AM.
|
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 05:47 AM)
|
#90
Originally Posted by ShockingAlberto:
|
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 05:48 AM)
|
#92
Originally Posted by I <3 Memes:
|
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 05:54 AM)
|
#94
Valve has done nothing to hurt the competitiveness of 3rd party FPS games on the Steam platform, in fact just the opposite. They have offered those 3rd parties every advertising tool on Steam that they use for their own games (pre-order beta, 4-pack, big splash page ad on launch day, free trial weekends) in addition to offering a ton of useful integrated free services that consumers want. Launching a new game on the front page of Steam probably helps to sell more copies than all the banner ads on all the game news websites combined. They don't even require patch validation like Microsoft does, so they are way friendlier for developers.
But that's not enough for Gearbox. They are fighting for consumers (even though consumers overwhelmingly voted with their wallets for Steamworks over all other solutions) by providing PC ports with such excellent interfaces that make you use PgUp and PgDn instead of a scrollwheel. |
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 05:55 AM)
|
#95
Originally Posted by Zzoram:
Quote:
|
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 05:58 AM)
|
#96
His comment about a lot of the industry not trusting Valve is also baseless. Every major publisher of PC games in the world except Microsoft and Blizzard (although Activision is on board) have signed on to Steam and are integrating Steamworks into all their flagship products while also dropping the GFW LIVE garbage. They wouldn't do that if they had antagonistic feelings towards Valve. They're all jumping aboard the Steam train because Steamworks is great for developers and consumers want it. Steamworks is the unified system that will bring PC gaming together as a platform.
I wonder how long it will be until PC vendors start pre-installing Steam onto video card containing PCs and stores start selling Steam gift cards. |
|
Hello friend! Have you heard the good news about
(10-11-2010, 06:01 AM)
|
#98
Originally Posted by Zzoram:
|
|
Member
(10-11-2010, 06:02 AM)
|
#100
Originally Posted by markot:
|
