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Hylian7
Member
(11-23-2011, 11:04 PM)
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Originally Posted by DaFish

Im in woot!

where do I start?

http://steamcommunity.com/groups/Dota2-Gaf

Join that Steam group! Add a lot of people you see playing Dota 2 in it to your Steam friends. Join the GAF mumble and head to the HoN room. Lots of us are playing GAF inhouse matches right now if you want to hop in.

Add me on Steam too, it's "Hylian7", just like my GAF name.
bzm
Member
(11-23-2011, 11:05 PM)
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Originally Posted by kagete

I am a fan as long as there is near-complete visibility. HON is great because while it keeps your lifetime totals and averages, it also immediately shows to everyone you're playing with the results of your last 10 games. Additionally, every single match can be watched easily by anyone and you can look up individual win rates for each specific hero, so a 0.6 KDR player like me can actually show a stranger i'm arguing with that I have 80% win rate and 2+ KDR when playing certain carry heroes. It gets even sexier after almost 2 years of data collection, with more and more BI possible and the matchmaking at the hardcore tier guaranteeing some pretty evenly matched and exciting games.

80% win, 2KD, 160gpm. Awwww yeaaaaaa come@me

Originally Posted by Drkirby

An over all K:D would be useless ...

no. if i see a Brown Player in hon with .1 kd and 22% win, i know hes garbage, no way around it brolio.
Also take kapura for example, his KD in hon is a prime example of why he shouldnt be playing anything but armadon pce nerd
DaFish
Member
(11-23-2011, 11:06 PM)
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Originally Posted by Hylian7

http://steamcommunity.com/groups/Dota2-Gaf

Join that Steam group! Add a lot of people you see playing Dota 2 in it to your Steam friends. Join the GAF mumble and head to the HoN room. Lots of us are playing GAF inhouse matches right now if you want to hop in.

Add me on Steam too, it's "Hylian7", just like my GAF name.

Sweet, I'm currently in the mumble chat
Togglesworlh
Banned
(11-23-2011, 11:20 PM)
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Originally Posted by x3r0123

well not really, you could reskin the units in wc3. See dbz tribute

I'm not talking about graphics!

Originally Posted by kagete

10 seconds is just an example. I really don't see how it's ridiculous. Under 10 seconds your healing skill would have already cooled down and you could have another chance to heal/damage. Assists also grant gold, so they can't just be handed out. Bottle sharing, health/mana freebies, and stuff like Chen global heals would qualify under your ideal assist rule. How about passive regen auras? Should any allied hero that gets a kill under your aura credit you with an assist? At least mekansm is activated. I guess we have a different notion of assists. I really think DOTA's assists are closer to how sports like basketball would classify them (kill=goal made). It might seem primitive to rely on just damage, applied effects on the enemy hero, and general proximity to be the only indicators for an assist but opening up the criteria might really just raise more questions than provide answers. DOTA's been like this for years, with some slight tweaks every now and then to accomodate slows and global ults. Maybe it will change, and if your opinion is shared by a large enough player population then perhaps Valve will take notice. As it is, with the current game design and metagame, I (just me) believe assists are handled well enough.

It's ridiculous because you're making ridiculous assumptions.

This is something that can happen in the span of two or three seconds, and would be impossible without the healer healing. And it happens often. It's not like this is a rare occurrence. Dota is full of close calls. It's stupid for them not to be "handed out" when they're actually earned.

Originally Posted by x3r0123

if terms of ability then thats almost not an issue. If you know programming then you can most likely figure it out

DOTA is very clearly limited by the WC3 engine. Just because there are some work-arounds doesn't mean they're optimal. An engine built specifically with this game type in mind is naturally going to open up a lot more options.
Last edited by Togglesworlh; 11-23-2011 at 11:22 PM.
kagete
Member
(11-23-2011, 11:26 PM)
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then you get gold for being in AOE? WHY IS IT A BIG DEAL???
Togglesworlh
Banned
(11-23-2011, 11:29 PM)
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Originally Posted by kagete

then you get gold for being in AOE? WHY IS IT A BIG DEAL???

It's not. I was only responding to your posts.

Speaking of strange inconsistencies: Lich's consume doesn't count as a deny (according to the counter in the top right), but Enigma's transformation does? Obviously, it doesn't matter, as the enemies still lose XP either way. It just seems odd.
Drkirby
Corporate Apologist
(11-23-2011, 11:31 PM)
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No one said it is a big deal. I just personally don't get many as Omniknight, but it is nothing more then a stat.

Which reminds me, I got an abandoned since I DCed near the start of a game, then got an error saying I couldn't be validated when I tried to Reconnect.
Last edited by Drkirby; 11-23-2011 at 11:36 PM.
kagete
Member
(11-23-2011, 11:37 PM)
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He said I had ridiculous assumptions. I don't think they are. You want to get credited for an assist, have a healing skill, cast it on your ally while he's in range of an enemy. Or autoattack the enemy I guess. 10 seconds is enough for a skill to cooldown so if your first heal doesnt deal damage you get a second chance anyway. It's a "secondary" statistic anyway.
x3r0123
Member
(11-23-2011, 11:40 PM)
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Originally Posted by Togglesworlh

DOTA is very clearly limited by the WC3 engine. Just because there are some work-arounds doesn't mean they're optimal. An engine built specifically with this game type in mind is naturally going to open up a lot more options.

every engine has it's limitations including the source engine. Its up to the developers know it's strength/weakness.
It doesnt change the fact that a lot was accomplished using the WC3 engine. Naturally if you build an engine around a genre then obviously it will shine on that genre.
Drkirby
Corporate Apologist
(11-23-2011, 11:41 PM)
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Originally Posted by kagete

He said I had ridiculous assumptions. I don't think they are. You want to get credited for an assist, have a healing skill, cast it on your ally while he's in range of an enemy. Or autoattack the enemy I guess. 10 seconds is enough for a skill to cooldown so if your first heal doesnt deal damage you get a second chance anyway. It's a "secondary" statistic anyway.


Omniknights Heal has a 12 second cooldown, and there are a lot of Dota spells that are over 10 seconds. Also, being a melee character, once an enemy gets far enough away to not be effected by your slow, it can be hell to catch back up without someone else doing a stun. I think healing an ally in the middle of a battle, or placing any buffs on them, is something that should be counted as an assist. It isn't though, which is fine.


Originally Posted by x3r0123

every engine has it's limitations including the source engine. Its up to the developers know it's strength/weakness.
It doesnt change the fact that a lot was accomplished using the WC3 engine. Naturally if you build an engine around a genre then obviously it will shine on that genre.

Valve can change the source code of the source engine dirrectly. If they need a new feature, they can add it. For the WC3 engine, Icefrog could only mod it within the constants Blizzard s allowed.
Last edited by Drkirby; 11-23-2011 at 11:44 PM.
Avocado
Member
(11-23-2011, 11:43 PM)
Can anyone suggest me a good starting hero to play with? I'm quite new to all things DotA. Usually I like playing support type classes.

If you have a guide that would be cool too.
kagete
Member
(11-23-2011, 11:47 PM)
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Omni has one of the best damaging AOE spells for the mana, if it CDed any faster it would need nerfing. Imba heals like Dazzle's only CDs in 6 seconds too. Yes he's melee but he's been balanced that way. You have to take risks! It's more fun for everyone that way too I believe, rather than everyone hanging back and letting pure initiators always be in the thick of things.

Just because you're a healer doesn't mean you have to focus on assists and be in a support role. Fortunately (or unfortunately for any of Sanjay's teammates) these same heroes can be face-raping one-man killing machines as well. I think giving nearly every Healing spell an almost equivalent damaging effect was a really great idea for encouraging active participation in teamfights by these support heroes.
Drkirby
Corporate Apologist
(11-23-2011, 11:57 PM)
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I am not saying the cool down needs to be changed, I am refuting your point that it would be up in 10 seconds.
kagete
Member
(11-24-2011, 12:13 AM)
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I never said it would be up in 10 :( I had a hypothetical scenario where you had a 10 second window to do something that would give you credit for an assist
x3r0123
Member
(11-24-2011, 12:20 AM)
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Originally Posted by Drkirby

Valve can change the source code of the source engine dirrectly. If they need a new feature, they can add it. For the WC3 engine, Icefrog could only mod it within the constants Blizzard s allowed.

true but that requires time and feasibility
Drkirby
Corporate Apologist
(11-24-2011, 12:22 AM)
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I am pretty sure Valve has both of those.
x3r0123
Member
(11-24-2011, 12:24 AM)
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yep in valve time :)
x3r0123
Member
(11-24-2011, 12:42 AM)
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the update for this week is already here i think

Here is the latest entry about it

Thanksgiving is upon us, so we’re keeping this week’s update small. With so many Dota 2 tournaments cropping up lately we’ve been spending some time expanding our tournament features. Our latest update brings the first of these, adding save/load functionality to private games. Every minute a new save file is automatically created. This happens in the background so you won’t notice it. The lobby leader will be able to load any of the saved games from the Game Setup option when creating a new lobby.

Tomorrow marks the start of Dreamhack, one of the biggest LAN events in the world. Their Dota 2 tournament includes both local and international teams, and should make for some exciting games to watch. You can find more information and coverage over at Dreamhack’s website or Gosugamers.net.

Togglesworlh
Banned
(11-24-2011, 12:45 AM)
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Originally Posted by kagete

He said I had ridiculous assumptions.

It's because you did. You're the one who tossed out the ten second number, when we were talking in terms of two or three, which in Dota combat, is quite a big difference.

It seems like you're having trouble understanding this, for some reason. I dunno what to tell you. I feel like the point we were making was pretty clear, and you start discussing unrelated situations to prove your point? It doesn't make any sense. Sorry.

Originally Posted by x3r0123

Naturally if you build an engine around a genre then obviously it will shine on that genre.

Right, that's what I'm saying. A lot may have been accomplished with the WC3 engine. A lot more can, and will, be accomplished with the engine being built for the genre.

Not to mention that the WC3 engine is ancient by today's standards, and simply having a more modern engine does wonders in and of itself.
Last edited by Togglesworlh; 11-24-2011 at 12:48 AM.
bzm
Member
(11-24-2011, 12:52 AM)
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Originally Posted by Togglesworlh

It's not. I was only responding to your posts.

Speaking of strange inconsistencies: Lich's consume doesn't count as a deny (according to the counter in the top right), but Enigma's transformation does? Obviously, it doesn't matter, as the enemies still lose XP either way. It just seems odd.

no expert on dota mechanics, but the way it was in hon back in beta was that lich's consume completely removed the creep from play (no xp at all for enemies) whereas enigma would register as a normal deny (1/3xp or 2/3 xp for melee) for enemies. Could be the same idea for dota?

edit: incoming kag apology
Togglesworlh
Banned
(11-24-2011, 01:04 AM)
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Originally Posted by bzm

no expert on dota mechanics, but the way it was in hon back in beta was that lich's consume completely removed the creep from play (no xp at all for enemies) whereas enigma would register as a normal deny (1/3xp or 2/3 xp for melee) for enemies.

Huh. I did not know that. That makes a little more sense, then.
Bo
shoot bullets from her arse
(11-24-2011, 01:08 AM)
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Anyone come across a really low-end dota 2 config on playdota, one with an example screenshot? Trying to locate it for Conceptor, and for the life of me I can't locate it.
Drkirby
Corporate Apologist
(11-24-2011, 01:13 AM)
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I think someone posted something like that on the dota dev site recently.
Bo
shoot bullets from her arse
(11-24-2011, 01:15 AM)
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Originally Posted by Drkirby

I think someone posted something like that on the dota dev site recently.

Ah, that may be where I saw it, thanks.
x3r0123
Member
(11-24-2011, 01:20 AM)
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Originally Posted by Togglesworlh

Right, that's what I'm saying. A lot may have been accomplished with the WC3 engine. A lot more can, and will, be accomplished with the engine being built for the genre.

but because of limitations, it doesnt mean some things cant be done. It also doesn't mean the workaround is optimal or not. The bottom line is could this (feature) be done or not.
It's like saying I will take unreal engine and make a 6v6 fast-paced fighting game with no framerate drops and no spectator's lag.
Can this be done? sure it is possible
Is it feasible? Not as much as i could imagine

Not to mention that the WC3 engine is ancient by today's standards, and simply having a more modern engine does wonders in and of itself.

i utterly agree
close to the edge
Member
(11-24-2011, 01:22 AM)
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I just got into the beta today \o/

I played 3 games against the AI and the bots are surprisingly good. I'm pretty rusty on my DotA because I played LoL for the last half year and I lost the first game. (I've been playing DotA on and off for almost five years) It feels quite different from LoL in the way a lot of the stuff handles. Feels good to be able to play my favorite heroes again though. Anti-Mage, Storm Spirit, Dazzle, Witch Doctor.. To have a healing spell that actually heals more than 0.5% of the health of the average hero is pretty nice. Also, AM's Blink is awesome.
Hylian7
Member
(11-24-2011, 01:26 AM)
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Originally Posted by x3r0123

the update for this week is already here i think

Here is the latest entry about it

Awww, those 2 heroes we found images for aren't in this week. Oh well.
Bo
shoot bullets from her arse
(11-24-2011, 01:50 AM)
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Okay, found one low-end config. This noticeably degrades the loading screen, and there's no dynamic sun.

Code:

r_fastzreject 1
mat_disable_bloom 1
mat_specular 0
r_3dsky 0
r_dynamic 0
r_shadows 0
mat_dxlevel 81
muzzleflash_light 0
cl_ejectbrass 0
cl_show_splashes 0
r_decals 0
mp_decals 0
r_drawmodeldecals 0
r_waterforceexpensive 0
r_waterforcereflectentities 0
r_drawdetailprops 0
cl_phys_props_enable 0
cl_ragdoll_collide 0
cl_ragdoll_fade_time 0
cl_ragdoll_physics_enable 0
cl_forcepreload 1
mat_picmip 10
mat_showlowresimage 1
mat_bumpmaps 0
Still not the "nuclear option" config I saw a bit ago, where the game was so horrifyingly ugly that it began to rival WC3 in terms of ugliness (was worse in some respects, such as sprites having no transparencies, iirc).

My revised version, should be a little bit faster than the one above:

Code:

r_fastzreject 1
mat_disable_bloom 1
mat_specular 0
r_3dsky 0
r_dynamic 0
r_shadows 0
mat_dxlevel 81
muzzleflash_light 0
cl_ejectbrass 0
cl_show_splashes 0
r_decals 0
mp_decals 0
r_drawmodeldecals 0
r_waterforceexpensive 0
r_waterforcereflectentities 0
r_drawdetailprops 0
cl_phys_props_enable 0
cl_ragdoll_collide 0
cl_ragdoll_fade_time 0
cl_ragdoll_physics_enable 0
cl_forcepreload 1
mat_showlowresimage 1
mat_bumpmaps 0
"lower_body" "0"
"r_shadow_half_update_rate" "1"
"r_rainparticledensity" "0"
"cl_particle_fallback_base" "4"
"cl_particle_fallback_multiplier" "0"
"r_flashlightdepthtexture" "0"
"r_shadowrendertotexture" "0"
"r_shadowfromworldlights" "0"
"cl_detaildist" "0"
"cl_detailfade" "0"
"r_drawmodeldecals" "0"
"r_decalstaticprops" "0"
"cl_ragdoll_maxcount" "0"
"ragdoll_sleepaftertime" "1"
"cl_phys_maxticks" "3"
"r_worldlightmin" "0.005"
"props_break_max_pieces" "0"
"z_mob_simple_shadows" "2"
"cl_ragdoll_maxcount_gib" "0"
"cl_ragdoll_maxcount_generic" "0"
"cl_ragdoll_maxcount_special" "0"
"sv_ragdoll_maxcount" "0"
"sv_ragdoll_maxcount_gib" "0"
"sv_ragdoll_maxcount_generic" "0"
"sv_ragdoll_maxcount_special" "0"
"z_infected_decals" "0"
"cl_impacteffects_limit_general" "0"
"cl_impacteffects_limit_exit" "0"
"cl_impacteffects_limit_water" "0"
"cl_ragdoll_self_collision" "0"
"cl_player_max_decal_count" "0"
"cl_footstep_fx" "0"
"r_flashlightinfectedfov" "0"
"r_flashlightinfectedfar" "0"
"r_flashlightinfectedlinear" "0"
	"r_shadow_half_update_rate" "1"
	"cl_detaildist" "0"
	"cl_detailfade" "0"
	"cl_particle_fallback_base" "4"
	"cl_particle_fallback_multiplier" "0"
	"r_worldlights" "0"
	"r_decals" "0"
	"r_decal_overlap_count" "0"
	"r_rainparticledensity" "0"
	"mat_bumpmap" "0"
	"mat_specular" "0"
	"mat_phong" "0"
	"r_flashlightdepthtexture" "0"
	"mat_grain_enable" "0"
	"mat_local_contrast_enable" "0"
	"mat_motion_blur_enabled" "0"
	"mat_disablehwmorph" "1"
	"r_overlayfademin" "1750"
	"r_overlayfademax" "2000"
	"mp_usehwmvcds" "-1"
	"cl_footstep_fx" "0"
	"cl_impacteffects_limit_general" "0"
	"cl_impacteffects_limit_exit" "0"
	"cl_impacteffects_limit_water" "0"
	"z_mob_simple_shadows" "2"
	"mp_usehwmmodels" "-1"
	"mat_depthfeather_enable" "0"
	"mat_force_vertexfog" "1"

	"r_rootlod" "2"
	"mat_picmip" "4"
mat_reducefillrate 1
r_waterdrawreflection "0"
r_waterforcereflectentities "0"
r_propsmaxdist "0"
mat_hdr_level "0"
r_drawflecks "0"
r_drawparticles 0
"mat_wateroverlaysize" = "16"
"mat_dof_enabled" = "0"
"mat_envmapsize" = "16"
Last edited by Bo; 11-24-2011 at 03:06 AM.
Archie
Second-rate Anihawk
(11-24-2011, 02:07 AM)
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N'aix:



New Witch Doctor model:

Artanisix
Member
(11-24-2011, 02:15 AM)
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wd looks like he's part of icp
Togglesworlh
Banned
(11-24-2011, 02:22 AM)
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Originally Posted by x3r0123

but because of limitations, it doesnt mean some things cant be done. It also doesn't mean the workaround is optimal or not. The bottom line is could this (feature) be done or not.
It's like saying I will take unreal engine and make a 6v6 fast-paced fighting game with no framerate drops and no spectator's lag.
Can this be done? sure it is possible
Is it feasible? Not as much as i could imagine

I don't really know what you're trying to say. There are some things that are inherently impossible with limited technology, and if an engine is built a certain way, then sometimes certain things can't be done in a way that is at all desirable - i.e., it isn't worth the hassle because the end result is not good.

It is a fact that Dota 2 has more potential than DOTA ever did, because the engine is built for it.

Originally Posted by Artanisix

wd looks like he's part of icp

Haha.

):
Archie
Second-rate Anihawk
(11-24-2011, 02:26 AM)
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Fuckin' Maledect, how does it work?
Drkirby
Corporate Apologist
(11-24-2011, 02:27 AM)
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Originally Posted by Archie

I hate it.
Gez
Member
(11-24-2011, 02:31 AM)
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Originally Posted by Archie


New Witch Doctor model:

New witcher doctor change was unnecessary. It's not bad but there was nothing wrong with old one.

Last edited by Gez; 11-24-2011 at 02:34 AM.
Archie
Second-rate Anihawk
(11-24-2011, 02:35 AM)
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Maybe it's a microtransaction skin.
Drkirby
Corporate Apologist
(11-24-2011, 02:51 AM)
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I'm hoping it is actually and old skin, since I don't see anything recent about that image on the site it has 'watermarked'
Sanjay
Member
(11-24-2011, 02:53 AM)
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I like this new model, very grim dark.
x3r0123
Member
(11-24-2011, 03:00 AM)
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Originally Posted by Togglesworlh

I don't really know what you're trying to say. There are some things that are inherently impossible with limited technology, and if an engine is built a certain way, then sometimes certain things can't be done in a way that is at all desirable - i.e., it isn't worth the hassle because the end result is not good.

what i am trying to say is implementing features into a game can either be done or not. If it can be done then it depends how troublesome it can be. You are basically rephrasing what i typed
Last edited by x3r0123; 11-24-2011 at 03:03 AM.
Conceptor
Member
(11-24-2011, 03:35 AM)
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Originally Posted by Botolf

My revised version, should be a little bit faster than the one above:

Will give it a shot - Thanks Bo. Yeah it's really odd how it's only the Dire side of the map that produces them. Dire vs Radiant
Archie
Second-rate Anihawk
(11-24-2011, 03:43 AM)
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Generic "I'm so good at this game please give me attention" post
Blackface
Banned
(11-24-2011, 03:53 AM)
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Getting dc'd nonstop.
Archie
Second-rate Anihawk
(11-24-2011, 03:53 AM)
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Valve reset the servers. I was beasting on a Bloodseeker too. :(
Milabrega
Member
(11-24-2011, 03:59 AM)
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UI Glitch I get every so often. Mostly from AoE spells you have to position click, but in this game one of Witch Doctor or Profit's abilties was causing it.
Lirlond
Member
(11-24-2011, 04:03 AM)
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Pudge is super easy
x3r0123
Member
(11-24-2011, 04:15 AM)
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Originally Posted by Lirlond

Pudge is super easy

lol not really
Blackface
Banned
(11-24-2011, 04:19 AM)
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So what is the consensus on Juggernaut?

I find myself playing him alot. Not because he is super easy, but because I feel he has the best movement of any champion right now. Some champions feel like they are trudging through mud. They turn around very slow, and their models get stuck on tree's that they visually are not touching.
Drkirby
Corporate Apologist
(11-24-2011, 04:21 AM)
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Looking at old Dota Hero's, Morphling once had a TF2 Spy like Disguise ability. Maybe my hopes of the TF2 Spy being introduce as a hero will come true. Maybe.
Togglesworlh
Banned
(11-24-2011, 04:22 AM)
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Originally Posted by x3r0123

what i am trying to say is implementing features into a game can either be done or not. If it can be done then it depends how troublesome it can be. You are basically rephrasing what i typed

Then I guess I don't know why you disagreed with me in the first place because I haven't changed my stance even once. U:
x3r0123
Member
(11-24-2011, 04:31 AM)
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Originally Posted by Togglesworlh

Then I guess I don't know why you disagreed with me in the first place because I haven't changed my stance even once. U:

i thought you said that the engine couldnt do some stuffs regardless if it's feasible or impossible
Swag
Member
(11-24-2011, 05:24 AM)
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Originally Posted by Blackface

So what is the consensus on Juggernaut?

I find myself playing him alot. Not because he is super easy, but because I feel he has the best movement of any champion right now. Some champions feel like they are trudging through mud. They turn around very slow, and their models get stuck on tree's that they visually are not touching.

The size of the model somewhat determines collision, bigger models are better at blocking creeps etc. As for Juggernaut, he's pretty good, easily countered by a slow heavy team or Skadi or Drow Ranger, very good early game presence with his ult, I think there are better melee carries, but he's fun to play I guess.

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