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sonikokaruto
Posting on the wrong forum
(02-23-2012, 05:42 PM)
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This threads are a good indicative of the userbase:

This ps vita butthurt thread: 3 pages.
Another 3DS butthurt thread: 11 and advancing 3 or 4 pages per hour.


Sorry, even on butthurt people, the 3DS wins
thehypocrite
Member
(02-23-2012, 05:43 PM)
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Terrible thread. Nonexistent Device Vs Existing Device. Waste of time, I was reading but all I got was a bunch of conjecture and extrapolation to serve some stupid bias. You suck OP.
DaBuddaDa
Member
(02-23-2012, 05:43 PM)
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Originally Posted by Treefingers

Cause PS Vita games are the prime example of originality

http://t.co//gMElVOJk
gofreak
GAF's Bob Woodward
(02-23-2012, 05:43 PM)
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Originally Posted by DaBuddaDa

It does pose an interesting (but not unique) question: Will the yearly iterations of tablets and phones made the Vita in comparison feel outdated faster than in the past? An iPad 4 could be out in 2013, only 2 years after Vita, and conceivably exceed it in power.

I'm not sure this matters. Or to whom does it matter?

I assume it doesn't matter to iOS gamers, otherwise I guess they'd be a lot more interested in dedicated handhelds in the meantime.

I assume it doesn't matter to handheld gamers either - it'll take a lot of other more fundamental evolutions than better graphics for tablet/phone gaming to become a superset of handheld gaming (and I'm not even just talking controls here either), something that handheld gamers could replace their handhelds with.
WonkersTHEWatilla
Member
(02-23-2012, 05:44 PM)
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Originally Posted by DaBuddaDa

It does pose an interesting (but not unique) question: Will the yearly iterations of tablets and phones made the Vita in comparison feel outdated faster than in the past? An iPad 4 could be out in 2013, only 2 years after Vita, and conceivably exceed it in power.

Well, because a new iteration of iPad hardware is released every year, it constrains game development, doesn't it? If only each new generation of iPad can be guaranteed to run the newest games, that locks out a lot of owners of previous iPads out in the cold, no?

I think that's the inherent limitation of the platform. That, and budget, of course. If games on ios will eventually look like console games, the budget will reflect that, and thusly the price to consumers will transition as well. Otherwise, PSV games will always look about as good.
jaxpunk
Member
(02-23-2012, 05:44 PM)

Originally Posted by WonkersTHEWatilla

The point is that the iPad will allow you to do a lot more. Don't say that non-gaming functions are unimportant, they are. Otherwise, people wouldn't care about apps like Flickr, Facebook, Netflix, Youtube coming to Vita, right?

So it started as productivity and now it's slid all the way to netflix and facebook huh? What if i wanted to do pivot tables on my tv? I'm going home and taking a hammer to anything that can't open a pdf.
Kadey
Mrs. Harvey
(02-23-2012, 05:45 PM)
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I really hate articles like this because you're going to have people who actually believe the crap.

Both products will exist and do well. End of story.
DrWong
Member
(02-23-2012, 05:46 PM)
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given the PS Vita's slow beginning in Japan, hitting 5 million units in one year would seem to be an optimistic goal, but possibly achievable.

Gnii!?
WonkersTHEWatilla
Member
(02-23-2012, 05:47 PM)
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Originally Posted by jaxpunk

So it started as productivity and now it's slid all the way to netflix and facebook huh? What if i wanted to do pivot tables on my tv? I'm going home and taking a hammer to anything that can't open a pdf.

Well, that's why I put Flickr in there as well. It's true either way, productivity or non-gaming entertainment apps. I should've said that to begin with, you're right in that regard.
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
(02-23-2012, 05:47 PM)
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Originally Posted by Kadey

I really hate articles like this because you're going to have people who actually believe the crap.

Both products will exist and do well. End of story.

Depends on how you define 'well'. Will the 3DS do well if it doesn't sell 100 million devices even though the DS will possibly sell 150 million in the end? Will the Vita be considered a success if it doesn't sell as much as the PSP?
Huff
Member
(02-23-2012, 05:47 PM)
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I don't have a ipad 3 or a vita yet.

wat side of fanboiz am i on?
Fixed1979
Member
(02-23-2012, 05:48 PM)
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Originally Posted by Treefingers

Cause PS Vita games are the prime example of originality

Are you saying that there's no original games on the Vita because there's a couple titles that I would think are somewhat original. This is while trying to keep in mind that the system was released yesterday.
WonkersTHEWatilla
Member
(02-23-2012, 05:49 PM)
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Originally Posted by BroHuffman

I don't have a ipad 3 or a vita yet.

wat side of fanboiz am i on?

You're probably an Android fanboi. :D
thehypocrite
Member
(02-23-2012, 05:49 PM)
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Originally Posted by BroHuffman

I don't have a ipad 3 or a vita yet.

wat side of fanboiz am i on?

Both.
Treefingers
Member
(02-23-2012, 05:50 PM)
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Originally Posted by Fixed1979

Are you saying that there's no original games on the Vita because there's a couple titles that I would think are somewhat original. This is while trying to keep in mind that the system was released yesterday.

There are quite a few original games on iOS too. Just saying there's plenty of derivative shit on any videogame platform.
Ramblin
Member
(02-23-2012, 05:51 PM)

Originally Posted by BroHuffman

I don't have a ipad 3 or a vita yet.

wat side of fanboiz am i on?

The right side.
Skilletor
Member
(02-23-2012, 05:51 PM)
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Originally Posted by ClovingSteam

iPad 2 has 16 gigs of space while the Vita doesn't come with any.
Most games on the iPad don't cost $35-40
The iPad will do much more than play games and the browser is fully capable unlike the Vita, which while improved from the PSP isn't anything to write home about
iPad 2 does much more than the Vita

I don't give a crap. iPad3 won't play Hotshots, Uncharted, Ninja Gaiden, UMvC3, Shinobido or any of the other games I've bought.

It's so stupid to compare the two since I buy an iPad because it does a ton of different stuff and I buy a Vita because I want to play games. On the Vita, the extra stuff like browser/music is extra. On the iPad, the games are extra.

Also, I've bought plenty of games on my Vita that weren't 35-40 bucks.

/eagerly awaits iPad 3 announcement.
sockman
Junior Member
(02-23-2012, 05:51 PM)
What's the source for this whole wireless controller for Ipad joint. Is this really a thing? Also, if it is, I can't see that taking off... it really cuts down the portability. Imagine trying to play your ipad 3 on a bus with a sepate controller. No thanks.
Fixed1979
Member
(02-23-2012, 05:52 PM)
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Originally Posted by Treefingers

There are quite a few original games on iOS too. Just saying there's plenty of derivative shit on any videogame platform.

No disagreement there...
herod
Member
(02-23-2012, 05:56 PM)
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I hear in some countries you're allowed to buy both.
AranhaHunter
Banned
(02-23-2012, 05:57 PM)

Battery life for the iPad 3 will probably be around 12 hours, while the PS Vita will be looking for an outlet after about 3 hours or so of gaming.

I sincerely doubt the iPad3 battery will be 12 hours if all you're doing is gaming. Author is not comparing apples to apples here.

For a PS Vita title, assuming it's sold at $40 retail (some will be more, some less) a publisher might clear as much as $15 per unit, maybe up to $20. For an iPad title, assuming a retail price of $6.99 (and some are more, some less), the publisher gets about $5.

That also depends on whether or not the game is sold through retail or DD on PSN. I reckon the publishers also get 70% on PSN. As far as retail goes, I would guess retail gets 20%, console owner gets 11.5%, distributor etc gets about 5%, and the rest goes to the publisher and the publisher distributes that accordingly. I don't think pubs get ~38-50% on retail games like the author suggested.
djplaeskool
Banned
(02-23-2012, 05:57 PM)
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Originally Posted by herod

I hear in some countries you're allowed to buy both.

This sort of heresy is bound to get you drawn and quartered.
Huff
Member
(02-23-2012, 06:00 PM)
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Originally Posted by herod

I hear in some countries you're allowed to buy both.

I'm going to get both. Maybe I should keep this on the dl
Fantastical
Death Prophet
(02-23-2012, 06:01 PM)
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If I write an article about how the PS Vita and handheld gaming in general is doomed will you guys promise to give me some clicks and talk about it for 5 pages minimum?

Originally Posted by herod

I hear in some countries you're allowed to buy both.

Someone ban this man and his radical ideas.
djplaeskool
Banned
(02-23-2012, 06:02 PM)
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Originally Posted by Fantastical

If I write an article about how the PS Vita and handheld gaming in general is doomed will you guys promise to give me some clicks and talk about it for 5 pages minimum?

I Guarantee It.
/Men's Warehouse Guy
LevelNth
Most insipid, shallow RPG player. Ever.
(02-23-2012, 06:03 PM)
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The reality is, the Vita doesn't need to be compared to anything. It's a fantastic device, with an insane screen and the best processing power in the market, improved and diverse control schemes, and it brings a one-of-a-kind gaming experience. It's not perfect, but it's damn fantastic.

The true problem is it enters into a market that is currently working against it's very existence and success. If this trend continues over the next two years, the Vita has little hope of any level of survival beyond mere marginal.

Thus, the only question that remains is, will the market trend continue on in the next two years as it has in the last two?
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
(02-23-2012, 06:05 PM)
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Originally Posted by Skilletor

I don't give a crap. iPad3 won't play Hotshots, Uncharted, Ninja Gaiden, UMvC3, Shinobido or any of the other games I've bought.

It's so stupid to compare the two since I buy an iPad because it does a ton of different stuff and I buy a Vita because I want to play games. On the Vita, the extra stuff like browser/music is extra. On the iPad, the games are extra.

Also, I've bought plenty of games on my Vita that weren't 35-40 bucks.

/eagerly awaits iPad 3 announcement.

I have an iPad 2, am enjoying the Vita, have a 3DS, etc. I enjoy the wide variety of games on all platforms too. But the problem isn't people like you and I. The problem is that millions and millions of people are interested in iPhones and Android devices. They've become trojan horses if you will for Apple and Google. Developers and publishers see the potential there. The easy and quick buck to make.

The Vita is in a precarious position that Nintendo is a bit more immune from. The Vita doesn't have the iconic cast of characters that will not only keep the Vita alive but will help it flourish. Nintendo has that. The Vita is in the middle between the two categories and that is why I think Sony is going to find it very difficult to make this a success.
Huff
Member
(02-23-2012, 06:07 PM)
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Originally Posted by LevelNth

The reality is, the Vita doesn't need to be compared to anything. It's a fantastic device, with an insane screen and the best processing power in the market, improved and diverse control schemes, and it brings a one-of-a-kind gaming experience. It's not perfect, but it's damn fantastic.

The true problem is it enters into a market that is currently working against it's very existence and success. If this trend continues over the next two years, the Vita has little hope of any level of survival beyond mere marginal.

Thus, the only question that remains is, will the market trend continue on in the next two years as it has in the last two?

Like games saved and will continue to increase the desirability of the 3DS, unique game experiences will decide what happens to the vita.

Looking forward to GDC and E3
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
(02-23-2012, 06:07 PM)
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Originally Posted by LevelNth

The reality is, the Vita doesn't need to be compared to anything. It's a fantastic device, with an insane screen and the best processing power in the market, improved and diverse control schemes, and it brings a one-of-a-kind gaming experience. It's not perfect, but it's damn fantastic.

The true problem is it enters into a market that is currently working against it's very existence and success. If this trend continues over the next two years, the Vita has little hope of any level of survival beyond mere marginal.

Thus, the only question that remains is, will the market trend continue on in the next two years as it has in the last two?

Yep. That is what I was trying to say. Thank you. Nobody is claiming the Vita isn't an amazing device or that Sony isn't trying to appease its dedicated crowd. The problem is the market which is different than it was 5-6 years ago.
ScreenSplitter
Banned
(02-23-2012, 06:08 PM)
Yay, lets compare two completely different devices, the latter of which is completely shit to play games on depending on how much of a compromise you like to make.

I don't give a rats ass if it can run the Unreal Engine, it still controls like shit.
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
(02-23-2012, 06:12 PM)
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Originally Posted by ScreenSplitter

Yay, lets compare two completely different devices, the latter of which is completely shit to play games on depending on how much of a compromise you like to make.

I don't give a rats ass if it can run the Unreal Engine, it still controls like shit.

It's not about the devices, do you not understand that. It's about the market.
kinggroin
Member
(02-23-2012, 06:12 PM)
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:-/


I used to like new console launches, before the internet
boingball
Member
(02-23-2012, 06:15 PM)
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Well, I think it is certainly valid to compare iPad and Vita.

The Vita is more of a classic gaming device and will appeal to classic gamers. The iPad on the other hand has definitely cornered the casual market and there is even a leakage of classic gamers to it (it does help that a lot of retro games are available on iOS).

In two years the iPad will most certainly be more powerful than the Vita (Sony is already saying 5-10 years lifespan instead of their usual 10 year cycle, so if they think the Vita will live only 5 years, that means they publish a successor in about 4 years?).

But as the article points out it is not entirely about consumers, it is also about publishers.

The entry level on iOS is much lower than on Vita (even though Sony is trying to make life easier for developers), so there will be practically no indie development on it. Indie development will be on iOS or Steam.

The only chance for the Vita is that either the iOS market crashes (because of the oversupply of free games and no one is paying anymore) or that some publishers choose the Vita because of the increased visibility on the platform to establish a game first (and then perhaps port it to iOS).

Of course Vita might also get ports from the iOS market which in turn might help the Vita ecosystem.


Using Bluetooth controllers with the iPAD is of course bullshit. There might be people doing that, but it will be like fighting sticks or racing wheels on console, a tiny fraction.
fluffydelusions
Member
(02-23-2012, 06:16 PM)
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Originally Posted by ClovingSteam

Yep. That is what I was trying to say. Thank you. Nobody is claiming the Vita isn't an amazing device or that Sony isn't trying to appease its dedicated crowd. The problem is the market which is different than it was 5-6 years ago.

If that was the case then how do you explain that the 3DS is the fastest selling handheld of all time?
NervousXtian
I'm an idiot
(02-23-2012, 06:16 PM)
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I know the general GAF consensus is to laugh in the face of this articles, but they are there for a reason.

People make choices all the time, and when it comes to a device like the iPad vs Vita, the iPad does a lot of things that make it more attractive to the general population than the Vita.

This is a fact, sales prove it. Wasn't Apple projected almost 50 million sold by the end of the year? The Vita will be lucky to have 10% of that total.

Developers can look at the units sold, see the market, understand what potential sales can be, and make choices for profitability that lead directly to Apple.

I want a Vita in the worst way, but the launch line-up and what's on deck scare the shit out of me. Devs are playing it ultra-safe with the Vita so far, it's reboots and rehashes galore. Best case scenario in my eyes is that it sees some of the niche genres that ultimately made my PSP purchase worthwhile.

It won't be long until we see even bigger games come to the iPad, as the market has shown that there can be successful games that cost more than 99c. If Apple ever re-worked the App store, tossed some money on exclusive big releases, and tried to corner the market.. they could.

I guarantee that no matter what Sony or Nintendo would say outside, inside they are scared of Apple.
Manmademan
Member
(02-23-2012, 06:17 PM)
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Originally Posted by ClovingSteam

I have an iPad 2, am enjoying the Vita, have a 3DS, etc. I enjoy the wide variety of games on all platforms too. But the problem isn't people like you and I. The problem is that millions and millions of people are interested in iPhones and Android devices. They've become trojan horses if you will for Apple and Google. Developers and publishers see the potential there. The easy and quick buck to make.

The Vita is in a precarious position that Nintendo is a bit more immune from. The Vita doesn't have the iconic cast of characters that will not only keep the Vita alive but will help it flourish. Nintendo has that. The Vita is in the middle between the two categories and that is why I think Sony is going to find it very difficult to make this a success.

I don't know if I'd call the vita's position "precarious", or even worse than nintendo.

Sony has spent a lot of time building up PSN, and while it doesn't have nintendo's "iconic cast of characters" (which didn't help the N64 or GC sell any units), sony DOES have a well developed game distribution platform that works across smartphones, (Sony's "playstation certified" Xperia handsets, as well as HTC's) the vita, and the PS3.

This means that a casual gamer who has a PS-certified smartphone or tablet might easily "graduate" to a vita if they want a fuller experience than a touchscreen only device can offer...and MAY even be able to take their purchased titles cross platform.

So there may not be mario or zelda, but potentially every PS1, PS2, and PSP title can be had for $5-$10, as well as minis, psn exclusives, and even "full" gaming experiences that go up into the $40-50 range. It's a diverse collection of on demand gaming that even the apple store can't really compete with, and nintendo can't offer.
Rhod
Junior Member
(02-23-2012, 06:17 PM)
Buttons.
Vano
Member
(02-23-2012, 06:19 PM)
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I like how the ""expert"" analysts are time travelers and Walter Mercados.
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
(02-23-2012, 06:19 PM)
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Originally Posted by fluffydelusions

If that was the case then how do you explain that the 3DS is the fastest selling handheld of all time?

1) Started selling after the price was cut
2) It doesn't muddy the waters between smart phone/dedicated handheld as much as Vita
3) Mario, Zelda, Pokemon, Monster Hunter

It's why many including myself have said that Nintendo will be fine no matter what but Sony is in trouble.

Vita

1) $250-300 (I think the price is fantastic for what you get but I don't just game on my iPhone)
2) Muddy's the water between smart phone and handheld.
3) What big hitters does Sony have to count on?
MarshMellow96
Member
(02-23-2012, 06:19 PM)
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I know most people have a PC nowadays, but how come nobody ever mentions the fact that an iPad has to be tethered to a PC/Mac? Is it because everyone has a PC nowadays?

I realise I'm going around in circles but that seems about as worthwhile as this article.
AranhaHunter
Banned
(02-23-2012, 06:19 PM)

Originally Posted by ClovingSteam

It's not about the devices, do you not understand that. It's about the market.

I think people understand that, but the article's author is comparing the devices directly, so the conversation people are having is fair.
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
(02-23-2012, 06:22 PM)
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Originally Posted by MarshMellow96

I know most people have a PC nowadays, but how come nobody ever mentions the fact that an iPad has to be tethered to a PC/Mac? Is it because everyone has a PC nowadays?

I realise I'm going around in circles but that seems about as worthwhile as this article.

It doesn't have to be tethered as much with iCloud.
dark10x
60 fps 60 fps 60 fps 60 fps 30 fps 60 fps 60 fps 30 fps
(02-23-2012, 06:22 PM)
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I own and love both. I don't think either one could replace the other for me.

Obviously a lot of people are going to be happy with just owning an iPad, however.

Regarding games, I actually think that stepping up to such a high resolution is going to severely limit the performance of iPad games. If they start targeting that resolution we're going to see some serious dips in performance or reduction in visual quality. The Vita is already stronger, GPU wise, than the iPhone 4S or iPad 2 and pushes a slightly lower resolution (960x544 vs 960x640 of the iPhone). Even if the iPad 3 had a graphics chip equal to Vita, being forced to drive a 2560x1600 screen is going to destroy performance.

Even my GTX580 takes a dive when moving up to resolutions that high.

I know most people have a PC nowadays, but how come nobody ever mentions the fact that an iPad has to be tethered to a PC/Mac? Is it because everyone has a PC nowadays?

That is no longer the case. It can operate completely on its own.
MarshMellow96
Member
(02-23-2012, 06:24 PM)
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Originally Posted by ClovingSteam

It doesn't have to be tethered as much with iCloud.

Interesting. What can't be done with iCloud, then?
commish
Jason Kidd murdered my dog in cold blood!
(02-23-2012, 06:25 PM)
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I haven't plugged my ipad into my laptop in forever.
weekend_warrior
Junior Member
(02-23-2012, 06:26 PM)
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Well that was just about the single dumbest thing I've ever read. Wild speculation, flagrant misinformation, and lack of any insightful analysis sums that up.
dark10x
60 fps 60 fps 60 fps 60 fps 30 fps 60 fps 60 fps 30 fps
(02-23-2012, 06:27 PM)
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Originally Posted by MarshMellow96

Interesting. What can't be done with iCloud, then?

Good question. I can do everything I want to do without connecting it to a PC, so I don't even know at this point. I have absolutely no reason to ever connect it to my PC.
Huff
Member
(02-23-2012, 06:27 PM)
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Originally Posted by dark10x

I own and love both.

Are you from the future?
Darko
What the hell are you talking about?
Who are you talking to???
(02-23-2012, 06:28 PM)
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Originally Posted by Skilletor

I don't give a crap. iPad3 won't play Hotshots, Uncharted, Ninja Gaiden, UMvC3, Shinobido or any of the other games I've bought.

It's so stupid to compare the two since I buy an iPad because it does a ton of different stuff and I buy a Vita because I want to play games. On the Vita, the extra stuff like browser/music is extra. On the iPad, the games are extra.

Also, I've bought plenty of games on my Vita that weren't 35-40 bucks.

/eagerly awaits iPad 3 announcement.

and the ipad doesnt fit in your pocket...
MarshMellow96
Member
(02-23-2012, 06:29 PM)
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Originally Posted by dark10x

Good question. I can do everything I want to do without connecting it to a PC, so I don't even know at this point. I have absolutely no reason to ever connect it to my PC.

Sounds pretty cool. That was one of the aspects of the iPad that I didn't like.

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