[Lost Fragment]

Eh, it'll be a story only until the next round of gaming-related layoffs or some major release. Gaming news sites have the attention span of a gnat.

They'll remember it the next time they're reminded of the FGC, though. Instead of the tens of thousands of dollars the FGC raised for Japanese tsunami victims. Or the thousands of bucks people donated to Chris Hu when his family's appt complex burned down. Or the many other awesome things that the FGC has done.

[GeoNeo]

They'll remember it the next time they're reminded of the FGC, though. Instead of the tens of thousands of dollars the FGC raised for Japanese tsunami victims. Or the thousands of bucks people donated to Chris Hu when his family's appt complex burned down. Or the many other awesome things that the FGC has done.

I think Chris Hu thing ended up raising tens of thousands too.

And, I agree it sucks the community I love so much will need to hold this shit to their chest for a long time. Because, no bullshit it is one of the best communities to be a part of.

Aris done fucked up big time. And, he is complete moron for being such a bull headed dick who thought he was in some way living up to the heritage of Arcade fighter culture by being a pervert and not accepting and saying sorry for crossing the line when SuperYan pulled him aside.

The only thing I truly think he feels sorry about at all. Is being caught and called out on his behavior. Though if he is truly sorry it will take a while for him to show it and somehow turn a new leaf.

[Neato_Jinkins]

Lol, look what article Kotaku just posted up: http://kotaku.com/5889637/fighting-g...nt-controversy Apparently they're criticizing Level UP's WNF stream now

i didn't know it was possible to just not get it as hard as these jokers just don't get it

[Makoto]

Eh, it'll be a story only until the next round of gaming-related layoffs or some major release. Gaming news sites have the attention span of a gnat.

More like, the internet has the attention span of a gnat. People will forget about this as soon as Street Fighter x Tekken is released.

[CountAntonius]

Very stupid of the commentators to be idiots when the world is watching. But whatever.

[Judderman]

Lol, look what article Kotaku just posted up: http://kotaku.com/5889637/fighting-g...nt-controversy Apparently they're criticizing Level UP's WNF stream now

Can someone just paste the text? I'm not giving them hits.

[2&2]

Lol, look what article Kotaku just posted up: http://kotaku.com/5889637/fighting-g...nt-controversy Apparently they're criticizing Level UP's WNF stream now

What a bunch of idiots. (the commentators) Way to dispell the generalized poor image people have. You'd think they'd be smart enough not to even touch on it in jest like that. Well, maybe that's giving them too much credit.

[Doomshine]

saying sorry for crossing the line when SuperYan pulled him aside.

...he did, that much is clear. Anything else that was going is only known by him and Miranda.

[MarshMellow96]

That.... doesn't look good at all.

[PsychoSoldier]

And just when I thought I was done.

Even if the gaming press at large is not tuned into this kind of thing all the time, if the scene does manage to grow it means more eyeballs on things.

And presumably, the reason the gaming press found out about the incident listed in the OP is that someone interested enough in watching a reality show about a fighting game saw what happened and felt it was bad enough that they needed to tell someone in the gaming press about it.

So, unless we constantly want this kind of press, either people need to stop being like this or they need to be smart enough to say this kind of thing off-camera. Or, I guess if they want the scene to shrink so someone is less likely to see something like this and report it, then I guess that option is open.

[GeoNeo]

...he did, that much is clear. Anything else that was going is only known by him and Miranda.

She said this was done pretty early on and the shit kept going on days after that.

Pretty clear Aris did not give a flying fuck.

I think it's pretty disgusting he was allowed to rep the FGC by Capcom in stream of this nature after such things came to light. Even if he said sorry. He should have been asked to leave the show, out of respect for her and to the people that ended up witnessing the crap he was saying to her.

Thing that sucks about this is that Aris honestly is one of the better contributors of info and stuff to the community. (His podcasts are some of the best) However, that should not give him a free pass when it came to this. He fucked up and should have been put in his place.

I know in the arcades I went to during early days of fighters were pretty raw and I seen a lot of funny and fucked up shit. But, I never seen a women harassed in a manner such as we saw on this stupid as fuck show. Aris was not staying true to his arcade roots. He was just using such a thing as cover so he could be a full on pervert who in his own mind was somehow doing what the stream monsters wanted.

[Gentleman Jack]

Can someone just paste the text? I'm not giving them hits.

Basically a commentary on this vid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=an_dIZQDOGU

Not terribly classy by the casters.

[Mechanized]

Professionalism is golden in a time like this. It's not like they're just talking to a group of their friends or something, now more than ever they should realize that these streams are going out to a global audience and they are definitely under the microscope.

[Brandon F]

What a bunch of idiots. (the commentators) Way to dispell the generalized poor image people have. You'd think they'd be smart enough not to even touch on it in jest like that. Well, maybe that's giving them too much credit.

Wow. Just listened myself and I agree wholeheartedly. It's an awkward bubble they seem to be living in, one that has no real shot at survival outside their core little group. Which is fine, if that is all that community cares to aspire being.

Common sense eludes their grasp, and if decency and passion is synonymous with acting like dickbags, then there really is no future for these competitions on a public scale. Trash talk has its place in the spectrum of competition, but it amazes me that some of these talented players and coordinators cannot distinguish where and when it is appropriate.

[obonicus]

They'll remember it the next time they're reminded of the FGC, though. Instead of the tens of thousands of dollars the FGC raised for Japanese tsunami victims. Or the thousands of bucks people donated to Chris Hu when his family's appt complex burned down. Or the many other awesome things that the FGC has done.

Why is this a talking point among the FGC? Is it surprising that bad news draws more attention? Isn't it patently obvious that people behaving like decent human beings is not particularly newsworthy, while people acting like assholes is?

As for notworksafe's idea that this will blow over, he's been saying this since the story first emerged. It's another talking point, this time from within the community, where they very intelligently let everyone else spin the story of what happened, rather than come out and let people know their side of it. It hasn't worked well. And if the FGC continues to demonstrate shitty behavior, like in that last video, guess what? People will call them out on it.

I've said it before: if the FGC wants to say "oh, but you're painting with too broad a brush", then they have to prove it and show that this sort of behavior is unacceptable. And none of this "the FGC is too decentralized", because that's bullshit. Each major event has an organizer. Evo has organizers. They can speak to each other. (And instead, we get videos like the ones above that establish that hey, yeah, there are other people with shitty attitudes hosting streams.)

Instead what we're getting is an attempt to bury this story, to make it just go away, because no one really wants to put in an effort to change the community. At best we get platitudes like "oh, we just have to work harder", without every clarifying what exactly people have to work harder at.

Which isn't even to mention that we have people who don't even think anything should be done, because anything short of a strict meritocracy would be unacceptable. We certainly don't want to prevent utterly despicable assholes[1] from becoming evo champions.

[1] And to be clear, I'm not saying that Aris is any of these things. At this point I think we're beyond Aris. There are real issues in the community that even the FGC acknowledges.

[Anth0ny]

Lol, look what article Kotaku just posted up: http://kotaku.com/5889637/fighting-g...nt-controversy Apparently they're criticizing Level UP's WNF stream now

Jesus Christ.

I mean, considering how sensitive the subject is right now, you know all the gaming media outlets were going to look to follow up on the Aris story. Commentary really should have just laid off the subject.

Final Round this weekend better just be UltraChen for AE and Chris Matrix/Yipes for Marvel. Cause you know Kotaku and whoever-the-fuck are gonna be looking for some more juicy highlights of the god awful fighting game community!

[PsychoSoldier]

What's shocking about this is that Level|Up is probably the "cleanest" of the streaming groups around.

If there's stuff that people find objectionable there, if people start mining the archives of other livestreams, they will certainly find some stuff.

[Gentleman Jack]

What's shocking about this is that Level|Up is probably the "cleanest" of the streaming groups around. If there's stuff that people find objectionable there, if people start mining the archives of other livestreams, they will certainly find some stuff.

Let's hope they don't find Filipino Champ's stream archives.

[Lost Fragment]

Why is this a talking point among the FGC? Is it surprising that bad news draws more attention? Isn't it patently obvious that people behaving like decent human beings is not particularly newsworthy, while people acting like assholes is?

Is it not also patently obvious that when discussing a negative aspect of the community with non-members of that community who might not know any better, that we might want to be like "yeah that sucks, but we're awesome in some ways too"?

[enzo_gt]

That Kotaku article fucking infuriates me.

Than you for perpetuating the elitism in our community, gaming media, for proving the majority of you are incapable of understanding the reality without a sensationalist edge.

[Brandon F]

What's shocking about this is that Level|Up is probably the "cleanest" of the streaming groups around.

So why did they lower their standards so suddenly?

[Neato_Jinkins]

That Kotaku article fucking infuriates me. Than you for perpetuating the elitism in our community, gaming media, for proving the majority of you are incapable of understanding the reality without a sensationalist edge.

funny that one of the points of the article is that people in this particular community can't handle even a modicum of criticism without flipping out

[obonicus]

Is it not also patently obvious that when discussing a negative aspect of the community with non-members of that community who might not know any better, that we might want to be like "yeah that sucks, but we're awesome in some ways too"?

Don't you already know that? Will you stop being good guys if people don't give you kudos?

On the other hand, there are issues with the FGC that are being brought to light, and it gives the FGC a chance to try and clean up. And this is something that probably does need a push, because, again, you do have outspoken members who think this isn't a problem, or who think sexual harassment is a joke.

And to note, I won't say that the FGC is any worse than any other gamer community. But that's a really low bar in the first place. They should in fact strive to be much better.

[Makoto]

funny that one of the points of the article is that people in this particular community can't handle even a modicum of criticism without flipping out

The persecution complex is strong in the FGC.

[Neato_Jinkins]

And to note, I won't say that the FGC is any worse than any other gamer community. But that's a really low bar in the first place.

interestingly, in reading more about this aris incident i found out that there's something of a misogyny crisis ongoing in the magic the gathering community as well. this is a problem endemic to nerd culture.

[PsychoSoldier]

That Kotaku article fucking infuriates me. Than you for perpetuating the elitism in our community, gaming media, for proving the majority of you are incapable of understanding the reality without a sensationalist edge.

This has been my issue with a great deal of the responses about these things from the outset of all this.

To get angry at people reporting the behavior and not at the behavior itself.

Maybe what he says afterwards is a bit overblown, but it's not surprising he thinks that way given what's happened over the last week.

[Gentleman Jack]

That Kotaku article fucking infuriates me. Than you for perpetuating the elitism in our community, gaming media, for proving the majority of you are incapable of understanding the reality without a sensationalist edge.

I thought the lessons being brought to light here was to not paint with broad strokes based on the actions of an individual?

[enzo_gt]

funny that one of the points of the article is that people in this particular community can't handle even a modicum of criticism without flipping out

If the article had any valid points of criticism, maybe that point would be valid too.

Unfortunately that's not even a realistic assumption, and just more nonsense from people who keep wanting to paint with the same broad brush while persisting that they're presenting something fair and balanced in the form of journalism.

[obonicus]

Than you for perpetuating the elitism in our community, gaming media, for proving the majority of you are incapable of understanding the reality without a sensationalist edge.

We have a video excerpt containing the jokes. What part of reality aren't they understanding this time?

[offcast]

Somebody hold me. T_T

[Masaki_]

Lol, look what article Kotaku just posted up: http://kotaku.com/5889637/fighting-g...nt-controversy Apparently they're criticizing Level UP's WNF stream now

I see Totilo couldn't save Kotaku.

[Lost Fragment]

Don't you already know that? Will you stop being good guys if people don't give you kudos?

Yes, but people who are dumb enough to paint the FGC with a broad brush do not. Though I probably shouldn't be wasting my time trying to argue with them, anyway.

interestingly, in reading more about this aris incident i found out that there's something of a misogyny crisis ongoing in the magic the gathering community as well. this is a problem endemic to nerd culture.

I am completely shocked.

[2&2]

If the article had any valid points of criticism, maybe that point would be valid too.

It had plenty of valid points of criticism. Keep in mind that site is pretty much a blog w/ some video games news mixed in. Still, seemed pretty dead-on to me.

[enzo_gt]

We have a video excerpt containing the jokes. What part of reality aren't they understanding this time?

Making a joke about the massive amount of attention the FGC is getting because of a scandal =/= Sexual harassment is a joke and they haven't learned to take criticism.

Kotaku doesn't understand how logical attribution works.

[obonicus]

Making a joke about the massive amount of attention the FGC is getting because of a scandal =/= Sexual harassment is a joke and they haven't learned to take criticism.

There were two moments in the video. The first was about sexual harassment.

The second was more about the attention, but that in itself is exactly what the article is talking about. It's about how they can't take criticism. Instead of going 'Well, shit, maybe we did fuck up', everyone's just getting upset that they got caught!

[Makoto]

Making a joke about the massive amount of attention the FGC is getting because of a scandal =/= Sexual harassment is a joke and they haven't learned to take criticism. Kotaku doesn't understand how logical attribution works.

Kotaku understands bad taste though. Herp derp, takes some to know some.

Complain about the sensationalist title all you want but that video is bad taste and tries to draw humor from an incident they shouldn't be trying to draw crass humor from.

[Neato_Jinkins]

Making a joke about the massive amount of attention the FGC is getting because of a scandal =/= Sexual harassment is a joke and they haven't learned to take criticism. Kotaku doesn't understand how logical attribution works.

oh look, another intentionally dense poster with a fighting game avatar baghdad bob-ing childish behavior. it wasn't "a joke," singular. it was a long string of snide, self-pitying nonsense from giggling dipshits intent on delegitimizing the concerns people have over sexism in the community.

this is like talking to an alcoholic that can't even admit they might have a problem.

[FartOfWar]

If the article had any valid points of criticism, maybe that point would be valid too. Unfortunately that's not even a realistic assumption, and just more nonsense from people who keep wanting to paint with the same broad brush while persisting that they're presenting something fair and balanced in the form of journalism.

The video contained in the story doesn't even need allegedly sensationalist reporting.
To recap:
1. Coach is caught engaging in persistent textbook sexual harassment.
2. media reports on the incident.
3. Some community members argue that it's unfair to generalize from a specific example of one member's idiotic behavior.
4. Another well-known subset within that community is now on tape trivializing the first goon's grossness, and effectively arguing that all reaction to his offensiveness has been knee-jerk and unwarranted, while demonstrating an absolute ignorance to the dynamics of pointed sexual harassment and its difference from typical trash talk.
5. media reports on this.
6. You hilariously whine and blubber that the media's coverage of this new tape is more generalizing from a specific example of two more member's idiotic behavior.

The trouble is that the credible sites haven't been generalizing. But if these incidents keep occurring they'll certainly have reason to start doing so.

[kirblar]

oh look, another intentionally dense poster with a fighting game avatar baghdad bob-ing childish behavior. it wasn't "a joke," singular. it was a long string of snide, self-pitying nonsense from giggling dipshits intent on delegitimizing the concerns people have over sexism in the community. this is like talking to an alcoholic that can't even admit they might have a problem.

Yes, of course that was their intention. What else could be on the mind of someone baked out of their mind?

[QisTopTier]

Sure can't wait to see people write an article about Floe's boshy rant or floe playing it in general. FGC is so terrible T.T sarcasm

[Neato_Jinkins]

Yes, of course that was their intention. What else could be on the mind of someone baked out of their mind?

oh, well that excuses everything, doesn't it?

[enzo_gt]

There were two moments in the video. The first was about sexual harassment. The second was more about the attention, but that in itself is exactly what the article is talking about. It's about how they can't take criticism. Instead of going 'Well, shit, maybe we did fuck up', everyone's just getting upset that they got caught!

Video doesn't load on my phone. Maybe they should have actually devled into the rest instead of only referencing the GB joke as "defensiveness on display" and then extrapolating the rest of the article based on that single quote, making it seem ridiculously attributed.

[FartOfWar]

Video doesn't load on my phone. Maybe they should have actually devled into the rest instead of only referencing the GB joke as "defensiveness on display" and then extrapolating the rest of the article based on that single quote, making it seem ridiculously attributed.

Hahahah fool here hasn't even watched the video and sprang to its defense. You're way to close to this but you're cracking us all up so keep at it.

[QisTopTier]

Video doesn't load on my phone. Maybe they should have actually devled into the rest instead of only referencing the GB joke and then extrapolating the rest of the article based on that single quote, making it seem ridiculously attributed.

If you watched WNF last night it was when Floe was playing Guy vs Gen and they were talking about getting it in his Ass.... err dude you said ass. OH I MEAN BUTT HE'S GETTING IT IN HIS BUTT. In terms of locking and rushing him down. Followed by the NOS girls and claiming a girl they want...

You know typical guy talk these days.

[Stabby McSter]

Jesus Christ. I mean, considering how sensitive the subject is right now, you know all the gaming media outlets were going to look to follow up on the Aris story. Commentary really should have just laid off the subject. Final Round this weekend better just be UltraChen for AE and Chris Matrix/Yipes for Marvel. Cause you know Kotaku and whoever-the-fuck are gonna be looking for some more juicy highlights of the god awful fighting game community!

Too bad if and when they do a good job on commentary, you will never see any articles about it. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. I kinda feel like there's no real good way out of this situation.

Also, according to Art's Twitter:

I remember when @kotaku posted a article about myself seth and sirlin at NYU. we answered a question abt misogyny at the end of the panel.

It ended up becoming the topic of the whole @kotaku article. Overlooked the entire panel on game theory in relation to SF. -_-

Can we just finally ban Kotaku again? I feel like every hundred posts I make, I plea for this. :(

[Neato_Jinkins]

Video doesn't load on my phone.

that's a welp

[enzo_gt]

Hahahah fool here hasn't even watched the video and sprang to its defense. You're way to close to this but you're cracking us all up so keep at it.

Apologies for forming an opinion about an article that decides to only reference half of what it is arguing about in supplementary media in text form. The half that isn't the crux of its argument.

[PsychoSoldier]

Apologies for forming an opinion about an article that decides to only reference half of what it is arguing about in supplementary media in text form.

I wonder how many people haven't watched the videos about the original incident and decided to proclaim the attention overblown anyways.

[Mael]

Apologies for forming an opinion about an article that decides to only reference half of what it is arguing about in supplementary media in text form.

So instead of waiting to see what the vid was about and what the article was about you decided to jump at Kotaku's throat for commenting on something you don't even know about?
I don't particularly like Kotaku here but between you and them, you're the one looking foolish here.

[N4Us]

Damnit, Marn.